Aren't you a little tired of the "Obesity Epidemic"?
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BUT, when I see an obese kid going into the doc's office, I HOPE the doctor is counseling that child's parent about the situation. They NEED to hear the truth. And instead of just saying "Your kid needs to drop weight", they need to offer constructive, helpful advice. AND THE PARENT needs to take that advice. The parent buys the food for the kid, they are 100% responsible for that child's success or failure once the doctor has given his/her advice. They just don't want to take the advice and implement the changes, because that's much more effort than taking that child to McD's three times a week.
In my family we have a few people in the medical field, including a doctor. We also have a few obese, very out of shape members, including some children and teens. What amazes me is the amount of silence that comes from doctors and medical personnel on the whole.
For example, my sister is obese. She actually at this point is likely in the "morbidly" so category. She suffers from some anxiety issues so she's been into the ER a handful of times and has regular check ups with her doctor. They'll discuss throwing her on some anti-anxiety meds, finding ways to destress, answer all her medical questions. But do you know that not one single doctor has ever, even once, addressed her obesity? They know we have a family history of type II diabetes and high blood pressure, and yet not one has said "You really need to get your weight down. Would you like some help with that?". And her story is not unique, among the adults AND the parents.
Even when I was a fat kid in the 80's and 90's my mother had to be the one to seek out a nutritionist and try and change the way we ate. She had to ask all the questions. The doctors didn't seem to think our weight issues were a big deal, either that or they're terrified of pissing off parents.
I hope the next generation of doctors come up with a vastly improved understanding of nutrition, and a "devil may care" attitude toward calling out obesity and treating it just like you would have you patient came in with any other chronic ailment.
Doctors refuse to say anything for fear of being called out for "fat shaming". See the Catch-22 here? No fat shaming, ever, so doctors have to keep their mouths shut and try to offer less criticism and more pills or differential diagnoses. Anxiety and depression? Just prescribe a pill, don't address the anxiety and depression that most likely caused the obesity (and continues to cause the obesity that is causing the anxiety and depression).
We need to stop walking on egg shells and remove the UnPC label of "fat shaming". There is a way we can address the issue of morbid obesity in a way that speaks the truth without the person falling to pieces and getting defensive.
There is NOTHING WRONG with a doctor or nutritionist schooled in healthy living telling a patient "You are morbidly obese and need to change your lifestyle NOW before you die. That is the truth." Direct, honest truth and a reality check is what people need. Not some mollycoddling, walking around the issue, give them a pill and a pat on the head and pray they read between the lines crap.0 -
Are you kidding? Like is this a real post about how we need to be sensitive to obesity and how it hurts over weight peoples feelings when we point out they need self control? Yeah well i was fat eithout self control, look at me now. If you really hate it fix it.0
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I feel like everyone just needs to chill out. Obesity is a problem that can be unique to every individual, they may need help in different ways. And I don't feel like the BMI scale is just an "excuse" although it is for some people. I was told by a nurse that I was close to overweight and needed to change my lifestyle ( I'm 5'7" ish and was 150) but when I had my body fat checked it was 19.5. I'd like to get back to that point in my life, even though the BMI scale categorized me as nearing overweight. Why does everyone have to be so judgemental?0
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bump0
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"It's a voluntary epidemic."
"And if we lose control of ourselves and drive headlong into a major obesity crises? We want you to shut the hell up about it because this is "my business". "
"It's a sad truth but often we need to crash and burn before we make any real, lasting changes."
Yes. You could have just said these three things and been done with it. OR you could have added "I'm overweight and p!ssed off at myself about it, therefore everybody else should be too." Cause your problem isn't with the "epidemic" of obesity...your problem is with yourself, and you're insisting that because you have a problem with yourself, everybody that is in a similar situation as you be equally as disgusted with themselves also. Your egotism oozes through every single post you make here.
*Yawn*. Thanks for the dime store psychoanalysis, but in case you failed to notice the obvious, let me spell it out plainly for you:
I am ignoring your posts. They have no relevance to me and I'm not about to have an asinine **** fight with some loose canon interweb warrior. Good day sir/madam.0 -
"It's a voluntary epidemic."
"And if we lose control of ourselves and drive headlong into a major obesity crises? We want you to shut the hell up about it because this is "my business". "
"It's a sad truth but often we need to crash and burn before we make any real, lasting changes."
Yes. You could have just said these three things and been done with it. OR you could have added "I'm overweight and p!ssed off at myself about it, therefore everybody else should be too." Cause your problem isn't with the "epidemic" of obesity...your problem is with yourself, and you're insisting that because you have a problem with yourself, everybody that is in a similar situation as you be equally as disgusted with themselves also. Your egotism oozes through every single post you make here.
*Yawn*. Thanks for the dime store psychoanalysis, but in case you failed to notice the obvious, let me spell it out plainly for you:
I am ignoring your posts. They have no relevance to me and I'm not about to have an asinine **** fight with some loose canon interweb warrior. Good day sir/madam.
Good, thank you. You should be eating healthy and working out anyhow, and not sitting behind a computer.0 -
I blame the food industry -- specifically the restaurant industry -- for changing "acceptable" portion sizes. It used to be that a "regular" serving of pop was 8 oz. Now, the "normal" expectation is 20 ozs. The regular dinner plate used to be 6" in circumference, now it is 9". A fancy restaurant used to give you reasonable portions -- 4 oz, 5 oz steak options, a small side of potatoes and a cup of veggies. Now the expectation is to have copious amounts of all. And they have food challenges to eat 64 oz steaks!
The Cheesecake Factory, Bucco Di Beppo's -- all serve ENORMOUS sized platters. I don't go to those restaurants because of that. What an overkill of food. But it's because the country demands "more more more" value for their money.
I went to lunch yesterday at a buffet restaurant with good ole fashioned Amish cooking. While the food was in abundance, I ate small portions of the following: roasted turkey breast, pot roast, green beans, mashed potatoes and cottage cheese. I had ONE dinner roll, not 4. AND, this was the main meal of the day for me. Plus I burned most of that off exercising last night.
Portion control is out of hand in this country, and the food industry is to blame for that. When they stop serving such large portions, people will stop eating them.
I am totally LOLing at that first paragraph. I think I now have a deeper understanding of the thought process the Mayor of New York has when wanting to ban large sugary drinks in the City.
Anyway......I eat at all of those places and I have steak multiple times a week. Still fits in my macros and still losing weight. YUMM!
While I do agree that the nutritional info is sometimes like pulling teeth from a restaurant, I am really failing to see how if a restaurant puts excessive portions on you plate how that is forcing anyone to stuff their face with everything on that plate. It is now the food industrys fault that a person cant stop stuffing their face with whatever is put in front of them. Are we human beings with free will or are we just a bunch of animals who eat whatever is put in front of them?
So let me get this logic straight, portion control is out of hand and somehow its the food industry's fault that people are over eating. Yet you somehow managed to go to an all you can eat buffet and use portion control. Ma'am you are clearly a 21st century super hero.
While I may not necessarily agree with it being the food industrys fault I do agree with your previous post regarding the education of health and phys ed of our children. I feel its why so many people come here on MFP asking what foods are healthy to eat and what exercises they can do. I remember getting that education back in junior high and wonder why so many people dont know even the most basic fundamentals of health and fitness.0 -
Doctors refuse to say anything for fear of being called out for "fat shaming". See the Catch-22 here? No fat shaming, ever, so doctors have to keep their mouths shut and try to offer less criticism and more pills or differential diagnoses. Anxiety and depression? Just prescribe a pill, don't address the anxiety and depression that most likely caused the obesity (and continues to cause the obesity that is causing the anxiety and depression).
We need to stop walking on egg shells and remove the UnPC label of "fat shaming". There is a way we can address the issue of morbid obesity in a way that speaks the truth without the person falling to pieces and getting defensive.
There is NOTHING WRONG with a doctor or nutritionist schooled in healthy living telling a patient "You are morbidly obese and need to change your lifestyle NOW before you die. That is the truth." Direct, honest truth and a reality check is what people need. Not some mollycoddling, walking around the issue, give them a pill and a pat on the head and pray they read between the lines crap.
It should be routine. Everytime you go to a doctor they should ask you "So how is the treatment for your obesity coming along? Let's check your progress". Doctors must learn to confront this issue without judgment and openly, so that we begin setting a tone in this nation that obesity isn't all that different than any other preventative ailment.
It always comes down to personal responsibility, but a lot of people really do need help. I watched my parents suffer from obesity related diseases and both died early after spending their final years in a sad, tragic decline. I had an an aunt collapse and die at the hospital, in her 40's or early 50's, due to her massive, morbid obesity.
None of their medical doctors treated their obesity as that big of an issue. Sure they addressed their secondary issues, like the high blood pressure and the diabetes, but seldom the root. They tried, and failed, on their own so many times. They hold the responsibility for not getting themselves together, but I sure wish their medical doctors, those entrusted with their health, hadn't enabled them so badly, even in the midst of obvious decline.0 -
I've been overweight for a good 12 years now staying just above 200 lbs for the last year or so (finally hit under 200 yesterday... yay!) I was thin in High school (120-125), worked out, lifted, played sports, and ate everything under the sun lol. Even when I was skinny I never thought this way about over weight people, its unecessary, rude, and self involved. And for a doctor to assume a health problem due to someone's weight is rediculous. I not only do not have high blood pressure, I have very low blood pressure that I have to moderate with sodium intake giving it boosts in extreme lows (especially when working out) I don't have diabetes, nor am I close. I have tons of energy, still play sports... just bigger lol. The other thing I've noticed is the popular phrase "thats what fat people say to make themselves feel better" uhm no. When I was skinny I felt like the real person is inside (and btw I wasn't ugly either) and so many "fit" people think that the outside is really just that important... its a shame... sad really that thats how they feel about people in general.0
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The statement is false, but the sentiment is correct. People did instantly "become obese" when they started using BMI as a gauge, or rather, they found out they were obese. Penn and Teller have a great episode of Bullsh*t that focuses on this. Many things should be taken into account when calculating health. If you can't afford to go to the doctor, BMI is useful I guess. But, it's much more useful (and a more accurate indicator of health) to know your resting heart rate, blood pressure, body fat percentage, good/bad cholesterol, etc.0
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Obesity is a disease. Doctors should treat diseases WITH cooperation of their patients.
WTO Definition of Health
"Health is a state of complete physical, mental and social
well being and not merely the absence of disease or
infirmity."0 -
I am totally LOLing at that first paragraph. I think I now have a deeper understanding of the thought process the Mayor of New York has when wanting to ban large sugary drinks in the City.
Anyway......I eat at all of those places and I have steak multiple times a week. Still fits in my macros and still losing weight. YUMM!
While I do agree that the nutritional info is sometimes like pulling teeth from a restaurant, I am really failing to see how if a restaurant puts excessive portions on you plate how that is forcing anyone to stuff their face with everything on that plate. It is now the food industrys fault that a person cant stop stuffing their face with whatever is put in front of them. Are we human beings with free will or are we just a bunch of animals who eat whatever is put in front of them?
Don't LOL. There's some truth to it. There are studies proving the psychology behind the fact that most people are influenced by the portion sizes they are served.
Center of Disease Control:
http://www.cdc.gov/nccdphp/dnpa/nutrition/pdf/portion_size_research.pdfA study at Rolls et al tested how adults responded to meals on four different portion sizes of macaroni and cheese. They found that the bigger the portion, the more participants ate. Participants consumed 30% more energy (162 cal) when offered the largest portion (1000g) compared to the smallest portion (500g) . They also reported similar ratings of hunger and fullness after each meal despite the intake differences. After the study, only 45% of the subjects reported noticing that there were differences in the size of the portions served.
Another study gave subjects different sized sandwiches on several different occasions to look at the effect on energy intake of increasing portion size of food served as a discrete unit. Men and women who were offered different size sub sandwiches (6, 8, 10, 12) for lunch on different days ate significantly more as the size of the sandwich offered became larger.
A study by Diliberti et al. in a restaurant setting showed that when a pasta entree was served in different portion sizes on different days, people ate larger amounts when given larger portions.
The tendency to eat more when served more was observed nearly 30 years ago when Pudel and Oetting conducted an observational study in which they served people soup from normal bowls to determine their customary intake. On the 4th day, researchers secretly substituted 'trick' bowls that slowly refilled from a hidden resevoir beneath the bowl uunder the table. Both obese and normal weight subjects ate more than their usual portion sizes. {...}
Studies on portions of snacks had similar results. Researchers on 5 different occasions gave men and women packages of potato chips that looked the same except that they progressively increased the portion size (28g to 170g). For both men and women, the snack intake increased significantly as the package content size increased. {...} Notably when dinner was served several hours later, participants did not adjust their intakes to compensate for the differences in snack intake.{...}
In a study by Wansink and Park, people in a movie theater... {...}
In a study by Fisher et al. 30 preschool aged children... {...}
McConahay et al conducted a study that compared data from the Continuing Survey of Food Intake of Individuals (CSFII 1994-1996, 1998) and the Nationwide Food Consumption Survey (1977-1978)... {...}
Another study by the same researchers evaluated the relationship of portion sizes and other food behaviors to total energy intake among children 2-5 years who participated in the CSFII 1994-1996, 1998. Energy intake was positively related... {...} etc.
Humans are visual creatures as well as socially and psychologically motivated. Discrete portion sizing works with all of that.0 -
Obesity is a disease. Doctors should treat diseases WITH cooperation of their patients.
WTO Definition of Health
"Health is a state of complete physical, mental and social
well being and not merely the absence of disease or
infirmity."
Making personal poor lifestyle choices is a disease. Obesity is just one of the side effects. Maybe obesity is a side effect because the person has another medical condition that is causing it. Many people have also stated on the boards that they gained weight as a result of another health related issue. Treat the disease, not the side effect.
Heres whats interesting about labeling Obesity a disease. They now have prescription drugs that your doctor can prescribe for you when you are overweight. Isnt that convenient? Just take a few pills and it begins to treat the 'disease' immediately. Here are some of the side effects of the medications that are used for this purpose:
Increased blood pressure and heart rate, Dizziness, headache, sleeplessness, nervousness
Gastrointestinal issues (cramping, diarrhea, oily spotting), rare cases of severe liver injury reported
Dry mouth, insomnia, Numbness of skin, change in taste (metallic taste), Drowsiness, Weakness
Assuming we are not overweight due to other health related issues, Ive seen many people in the Success Stories threads who were morbidly obese who finally woke up one day and decided to commit to a lifestyle change. Just because everyone else is sucking down 64oz Slurpees and eating the buy 1 hot dog get 7 free deals at food places doesnt mean we all have to follow.0 -
I am totally LOLing at that first paragraph. I think I now have a deeper understanding of the thought process the Mayor of New York has when wanting to ban large sugary drinks in the City.
Anyway......I eat at all of those places and I have steak multiple times a week. Still fits in my macros and still losing weight. YUMM!
While I do agree that the nutritional info is sometimes like pulling teeth from a restaurant, I am really failing to see how if a restaurant puts excessive portions on you plate how that is forcing anyone to stuff their face with everything on that plate. It is now the food industrys fault that a person cant stop stuffing their face with whatever is put in front of them. Are we human beings with free will or are we just a bunch of animals who eat whatever is put in front of them?
Don't LOL. There's some truth to it. There are studies proving the psychology behind the fact that most people are influenced by the portion sizes they are served.
Center of Disease Control:
http://www.cdc.gov/nccdphp/dnpa/nutrition/pdf/portion_size_research.pdfA study at Rolls et al tested how adults responded to meals on four different portion sizes of macaroni and cheese. They found that the bigger the portion, the more participants ate. Participants consumed 30% more energy (162 cal) when offered the largest portion (1000g) compared to the smallest portion (500g) . They also reported similar ratings of hunger and fullness after each meal despite the intake differences. After the study, only 45% of the subjects reported noticing that there were differences in the size of the portions served.
Another study gave subjects different sized sandwiches on a several of occasions to look at the effect on energy intake of increasing portion size of food served as a discrete unit. Men and women who were offered different size sub sandwiches (6, 8, 10, 12) for lunch on different days ate significantly more as the size of the sandwich offered became larger.
A study by Diliberti et al. in a restaurant setting showed that when a pasta entree was served in different portion sizes on different days, people larger amounts when given larger portions.
The tendency to eat more when served more was observed nearly 30 years ago when Pudel and Oetting when they conducted an observational study in which they served people soup from normal bowls to determine their customary intake. On the 4th day, researchers secretly substituted 'trick' bowls that slowly refilled from a hidden resevoir beneath the bowl under the table. Both obese and normal weight subjects ate more than their usual portion. {...}
Studies on portions of snacks had similar results. Researchers on 5 different occasions gave men and women packages of potato chips that looked the same except that they progressively increased portion size (28g to 170g). For both men and women, the snack intake increased significantly as the package size increased. {...} Notably when dinner was served several hours later, participants did not adjust their intakes to compensate for the differences in snack intake.{...}
In a study by Wansink and Park, people in a movie theater... {...}
In a study by Fisher et al. 30 preschool aged children... {...}
McConahay et al conducted a study that compared data from the Continuing Survey of Food Intake of Individuals (CSFII 1994-1996, 1998) and the Nationwide Food Consumption Survey (1977-1978) of children 1-2 years of age... {...}
Another study by the same researchers evaluated the relationship of portion sizes and other food behaviors to total energy intake among children 2-5 years who participated in the CSFII 1994-1996, 1998. Energy intake was positively related... {...} etc.
Humans are visual creatures as well as socially and psychologically motivated. Discrete portion sizing works with all of that.
Key word: Influenced
influenced =/= forced0 -
Key word: Influenced
influenced =/= forced
Thank you brower. The only thing this research confirms is what I said earlier asking if we were human beingss with free will or animals who just eat whatever is put in front of them. Its sad really. Just sad.0 -
This is not self evident apparently. I just mentioned that I have experience with it in my own family, who are by no means uneducated. What do you think people will do when they get the 'your kid is overweight' note from the completely non medical personnel at school? There are 50 thousand diet books out there. There have been people on this very forum saying they didn't want to feed their kids butter even though the doctor told them too because the kids were underweight!!!I'd say this is a bit obvious. Children shouldn't be put on "diets"0 -
The problem with using BMI as a rough calc is that it is not being used as a rough calc for a population, it is increasingly being used on an individual level. Kids get sent home from school with an 'overweight' note, when their doctors say they are fine. That is the start of something. Parents who don't know any better might put perfectly healthy kids on a diet with disastrous results. What happens when your work says you need to weigh 'x' or you have to pay extra. Can you get a doctor's note excusing you? I highly doubt it.Do you really think that there are medical doctors out there who cannot tell the difference between muscular people and fat people? If you legitimately have this concern - you should find a better doctor.
It's not bad as an individual rough calc either (That was the "good specificity" from the other source).
If your kid gets sent home with an 'overweight note' - take them to the doctor. If there is a problem, you can work on it with them. I think the 'harm' you theorize might happen is ridiculous and based on a false premise that parents are stupid and prone to overreaction. In my experience, it's quite hard to convince a parent that there is _anything_ wrong with their kids.
Similarly, why would you highly doubt that your employer would refuse to accept a doctor's note? If you work for irrational people, you should really quit.
Has there ever been a single case of this sort of thing actually happening? (Person who is not actually overfat, being tagged as overfat by BMI, then bringing in a doctor's note/test results showing healthy levels of fat but still being fired?)0 -
Key word: Influenced
influenced =/= forced
Thank you brower.
You guys are quoting me to me?
Glad my word selection was deemed important.0 -
We're at the beginning stages of the obesity epidemic. By 2020, obesity will be the norm.0
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Totally agree. So annoying to me. All fat people are "sick" not really I have low blood pressure and pretty healthy other than the fact that I am over weight. I also hate when people say I don't see how people just let themselves go. Sometimes I just want to bud in and say I have lost over 40 pounds (30 on here) so I really haven't just let myself go.
It really depends how old you are. Many young and overweight people don't have high blood pressure...yet.0
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