Calorie in Calorie out
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I put "a little 1% milk" in my coffee. Turns out its about 3 oz. 3/8 of a cup. 40 calories. Its the same for 2 TBSP of half and half, which has the same effect. So, 3 cups per day, 120 calories there, 30 days....that's either a pound gained or a pound not lost. IF you're not tracking it.
Track and enter EVERYTHING!
How BIG of a cup of coffee are you drinking if you're adding 3 oz. of 1% milk and don't realize it? Most coffee cups are 6 oz or 8 oz..your coffee would be almost 50% coffee and 50% milk or 64/36?1 -
Not sure where you're from, but most US folks I know don't actually use coffee cups, they use coffee *mugs* which are more like 12oz minimum, or even bigger. Travel mugs are more like 16-18 ounces.1
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Estimates & inaccuracies are the culprit here. Not to mention errors in judgement! If you are not losing weight, then you are eating too much.1
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There seems a very strong correlation between having a private food diary and complaining of not getting the expected results.11
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So are you saying that the scenario you described in the original post was either hypothetical, or not your specific situation?
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Okay, whoever it is who is having this issue, I strongly recommend they get their metabolism checked and build a food plan with the help of a nutritionist or dietitian. You *have* to know what you're working from in order to build a plan that works, unless you're willing to spend a long, long time experimenting with trial and error.0
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It's nice to have numbers written down, to be able to see the math, but those are just numbers on a screen and your body will actually show whether your math is correct or not. If you are not losing weight, your numbers are not correct.
Even if your diary shows extremely accurate numbers and you're weighing every minuscule crumb that goes into your mouth, if you are not losing weight, then the numbers you are using to calculate your daily caloric needs are not accurate for your body and you'll have to make some adjustments. Online calculators are rough estimates, as well as calories on packages and in the database. Weight (fat) loss is all boiled down to calories in/calories out but sometimes finding the exact equation for you can take a lot of trial and error. Keep trying.
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So were are trying to provide assistance to a phantom weight looser? Anywho, you are asking for something else that can be described as a scientific proven alternative to assist in weight loss that is NOT calorie in and calories out?
Well, there is not one, unless you just want to tell phantom weight looser, to just eat less food than what they are now and I can still guarantee they will loose weight!!! No counting really needed... BUT you are on a calorie counting site... so of course we are gonna say we count, measure and weigh everything (an too the gram) and eat back some of the calorie burns through exercise to loose weight.. That has been 100% proven by me for over two years now.. and the calculators are fairly close unless you need to throw in medical conditions, a metabolic test can be easily done to help with dialing down the numbers better if trial and error not working or lost patience with the process...etc..1 -
battyfitch wrote: »battyfitch wrote: »I'd double and triple check the food entries you're using are accurate. I think a lot of people use the lowest one they can find - like, I'll see people logging 2 tbsp butter at 37 calories or whatever when in reality 2 tablespoons of butter would be over 200 calories. Do that a few times a week, plus a few other inaccurate entries and it can add up to enough to stall losses, especially if you're aiming to 0.5-1lbs a week.
Other than that, I dunno. Scientific marvel? Alien?
actually butter should be logged by Grams.
2tbsp of butter or appx 30grams.
Ok?
You shouldn't log butter anyway. Gary Taubes said you can eat all the butter you want and not gain weight.
again 9_9...seriously it has significant calories in it...CasperNaegle wrote: »battyfitch wrote: »battyfitch wrote: »I'd double and triple check the food entries you're using are accurate. I think a lot of people use the lowest one they can find - like, I'll see people logging 2 tbsp butter at 37 calories or whatever when in reality 2 tablespoons of butter would be over 200 calories. Do that a few times a week, plus a few other inaccurate entries and it can add up to enough to stall losses, especially if you're aiming to 0.5-1lbs a week.
Other than that, I dunno. Scientific marvel? Alien?
actually butter should be logged by Grams.
2tbsp of butter or appx 30grams.
Ok?
You shouldn't log butter anyway. Gary Taubes said you can eat all the butter you want and not gain weight.
This is ridiculous, not sure who Gary Taubes is but that is bad advice that will drastically affect your weight.
Pretty sure he/she was being sarcastic.
no not sure he was..I google Gary whats his face and he has books on dieting
http://www.dietdoctor.com/diet-advice-that-ignores-hunger
http://garytaubes.com/2010/12/calories-fat-or-carbohydrates/
Oh, yes, Taubes is a real guy with lots of "scientific evidence." I HAVE to believe that that poster was being sarcastic. I just HAVE to!0 -
Okay, whoever it is who is having this issue, I strongly recommend they get their metabolism checked and build a food plan with the help of a nutritionist or dietitian. You *have* to know what you're working from in order to build a plan that works, unless you're willing to spend a long, long time experimenting with trial and error.
Even if you know your RMR, that still doesn't account for the other parts of the energy balance equation.0 -
Ever notice that the bare-chested muscle guys are the extreme calorie in/calorie out people?1
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gonetothedogs19 wrote: »Ever notice that the bare-chested muscle guys are the extreme calorie in/calorie out people?
By extreme, do you mean most successful? If so, i would agree and people should try to learn from their experiences. It takes a lot of dedication to get to low levels of body fat.8 -
gonetothedogs19 wrote: »Ever notice that the bare-chested muscle guys are the extreme calorie in/calorie out people?
Interesting. What's your opinion on posters that have no profile pic?12 -
Bodies are very good at holding on to weight. They can adjust their metabolic rate to compensate for caloric deficits. CICO does not account for this. Below a certain caloric intake, your body has no choice but to burn fat and muscle for energy, but there's a lot of leeway.0
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Alluminati wrote: »gonetothedogs19 wrote: »Ever notice that the bare-chested muscle guys are the extreme calorie in/calorie out people?
Interesting. What's your opinion on posters that have no profile pic?
Mine is that it's not easy being green.5 -
Espressocycle wrote: »Bodies are very good at holding on to weight. They can adjust their metabolic rate to compensate for caloric deficits. CICO does not account for this. Below a certain caloric intake, your body has no choice but to burn fat and muscle for energy, but there's a lot of leeway.
CICO accounts for all metabolic rate adjustments. Literally the first part of the equation. Slowed metabolism = lower TDEE. More efficient metabolism, lower NEAT/TEA. That is why there is a feedback loop one must use as they continue to lose weight.6 -
What MFP estimates to be your metabolism may not actually be accurate for you.
Exactly this. Aside from under estimating for intake and over estimating for calories burned, using the MFP caloric guide is just that, a guide that will vary by user. So with the intake and output corrected you start setting caloric goals and adjust them as needed over a few weeks to a month's time. I found that even being extremely active and having a TDEE estimate over 3000, the 2 pound a week 2000 calories a day wasn't really yielding 2 pounds of loss. So I kicked down a few hundred to 1800 and started to lose more in line with what I wanted. Then I kicked down to 1600, and while I did lose a little more, I started feeling like I wasn't getting enough to eat. So I settled back to 1800. That is far above what MFP actually has for me and much less than what more TDEE calcs come up with. But over a few months time I was able to figure out my own numbers, again based on guidelines.
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I have been reading multiple posts. And most of them seem to indicate that nothing else could possibly scientifically assist in weight loss except for the fact of "Calorie in/Calorie out". For those who feel that this is the "only" way weight is loss please explain to me if you are weighing your food, logging everything you put in your mouth, not eating back all of your exercise calories, and have researched and know what your macros should be, how can you not lose weight for 3 months? Oh, and have been to the doctors and not diagnosed with anything. Also, if the answer is plateau, then please explain how this is possible if the only factor that counts is Calorie in/Calorie out. Thank you for your help with this.
Plateaus happen because the energy equation is dynamic, not static. The less you weigh the less calories you burn doing pretty much anything. Your BMR is lowered, your "burn rate" lowers doing any activity. Over the course of weight loss you have to account for all changes on both sides of the equation right down to the TEF of lower caloric intakes if you want to get that in depth. These changes don't invalidate the CICO equation. They just affect either the Calories in part or the calories out part.
If a person has plateaued and they are 100% accurate with their tracking of their calories in and out, they need to either eat less or exercise more, ie change the equation factors and weight loss will again begin. 95% of the time though it is inaccurate tracking of either in or out.
Here is a good in depth read on CICO and the 3500 calorie rule.
http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat-loss/3500-calorie-rule.html/
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If you want a general debate then the debate forum would be a good forum to post in.
If someone plateaus for 3 months then either:
1/ They aren't in a calorie deficit - for all sorts of reasons from inaccurate estimating to reduced activity levels.
2/ They have a mysterious medical condition which makes them retain a whole load of water or poop.3 -
WinoGelato wrote: »
So are you saying that the scenario you described in the original post was either hypothetical, or not your specific situation?
Yes, it was for a friend0 -
WinoGelato wrote: »
So are you saying that the scenario you described in the original post was either hypothetical, or not your specific situation?
Yes, it was for a friend
You should recommend coming here, logging their calories and see what they are really eating.5 -
If you want a general debate then the debate forum would be a good forum to post in.
If someone plateaus for 3 months then either:
1/ They aren't in a calorie deficit - for all sorts of reasons from inaccurate estimating to reduced activity levels.
2/ They have a mysterious medical condition which makes them retain a whole load of water or poop.
It wasn't a debate. It was a serious question for a friend. I just do not agree that because someone has a private diary that they're trying to hide something. That's what I got from your post it look like that's what you were insinuating. So I just wanted to get that correct. I do appreciate everyone else's help and I did give all of your responses well most of them to my friend. But I don't like the insinuation about me having a private diary having something to do with the fact that someone can not lose weight. Some people just like to leave things private to themselves. I definitely do not want to debate I am not a debater and I rarely post at all. And I think this is the reason why. Thank you very much for your help1 -
If you want a general debate then the debate forum would be a good forum to post in.
If someone plateaus for 3 months then either:
1/ They aren't in a calorie deficit - for all sorts of reasons from inaccurate estimating to reduced activity levels.
2/ They have a mysterious medical condition which makes them retain a whole load of water or poop.
It wasn't a debate. It was a serious question for a friend. I just do not agree that because someone has a private diary that they're trying to hide something. That's what I got from your post it look like that's what you were insinuating. So I just wanted to get that correct. I do appreciate everyone else's help and I did give all of your responses well most of them to my friend. But I don't like the insinuation about me having a private diary having something to do with the fact that someone can not lose weight. Some people just like to leave things private to themselves. I definitely do not want to debate I am not a debater and I rarely post at all. And I think this is the reason why. Thank you very much for your help
You're welcome.
When you have been here a while longer you will see numerous threads where people "are doing all the right things but not losing".
The vast majority have closed diaries - when opened they normally reveal the truth is that people are extremely poor at food and exercise logging. Those that don't log are even worse! There was a news story this week that appears to show people underestimate their calorie intake by up to 1000 calories a day.
Wonder how many of those people think they are special, have a medical condition, or that other people lose weight easier than them?
In the end the person that is putting the food in their mouth has to take responsibility and not rely on a friend's help. Your friend should try logging their intake, weighing and measuring as accurately as possible and then see what their results are after a couple of months.
Maybe the best thing a friend can do is to give some tough love? Wish someone had with me then I wouldn't have stayed fat so long.
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If you want a general debate then the debate forum would be a good forum to post in.
If someone plateaus for 3 months then either:
1/ They aren't in a calorie deficit - for all sorts of reasons from inaccurate estimating to reduced activity levels.
2/ They have a mysterious medical condition which makes them retain a whole load of water or poop.
It wasn't a debate. It was a serious question for a friend. I just do not agree that because someone has a private diary that they're trying to hide something. That's what I got from your post it look like that's what you were insinuating. So I just wanted to get that correct. I do appreciate everyone else's help and I did give all of your responses well most of them to my friend. But I don't like the insinuation about me having a private diary having something to do with the fact that someone can not lose weight. Some people just like to leave things private to themselves. I definitely do not want to debate I am not a debater and I rarely post at all. And I think this is the reason why. Thank you very much for your help
You're welcome.
When you have been here a while longer you will see numerous threads where people "are doing all the right things but not losing".
The vast majority have closed diaries - when opened they normally reveal the truth is that people are extremely poor at food and exercise logging. Those that don't log are even worse! There was a news story this week that appears to show people underestimate their calorie intake by up to 1000 calories a day.
Wonder how many of those people think they are special, have a medical condition, or that other people lose weight easier than them?
In the end the person that is putting the food in their mouth has to take responsibility and not rely on a friend's help. Your friend should try logging their intake, weighing and measuring as accurately as possible and then see what their results are after a couple of months.
Maybe the best thing a friend can do is to give some tough love? Wish someone had with me then I wouldn't have stayed fat so long.
Thanks you. I truly appreciate your help.0 -
Not sure where you're from, but most US folks I know don't actually use coffee cups, they use coffee *mugs* which are more like 12oz minimum, or even bigger. Travel mugs are more like 16-18 ounces.
I live in Wisc and folks use mugs heading to work maybe..otherwise everyone I know drinks out of coffee cups at home..and usually at work..and if you have a 12 oz cup of coffee with 3 oz. of milk..that's 9 ounces of coffee and 3 ounces of milk?
Still a crappy cup of coffee that I fail to see, anyone couldn't see how much milk they were adding?
BTW ..It was a little tongue in cheek..as I am a coffee snob..love coffee..good coffee..and 75/25 coffee/milk would or should ..still be easily detectable?
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Espressocycle wrote: »Bodies are very good at holding on to weight. They can adjust their metabolic rate to compensate for caloric deficits. CICO does not account for this. Below a certain caloric intake, your body has no choice but to burn fat and muscle for energy, but there's a lot of leeway.
CICO does take into account changing TDEE's... It's just one variable in the equation.
And, FWIW, our bodies are very good at losing weight. In fact, that is the reason for fat stores: Easy access to energy during famines. The biggest problem for most is a lack of famine.1
This discussion has been closed.
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