KFC/Chemical High

magicpickles

I really like KFC and tend to have it once a week.

I want to quit eating it, because there are things I can eat at home that taste better, and I think I just like it because it gives me some kind of chemical high, like when I need it, it calms some kind of need in me like an addiction that nothing else can satisfy. I can also make food at home that has less calories and doesn't cost me $12 a hit, WITH nutritional value. Like, when I want KFC, nothing else makes me feel better. I am like that with some other foods.

I am thinking about quitting processed foods, but maybe just giving up one thing at a time is better. I wanted to start with KFC because I eat it regularly.

What chemicals from KFC am I getting and what can I replace them with? is it something like dopamine or sugar?

When I go to KFC I usually get the two piece quarter pack which is 2 pieces original skin chicken, pepsi max, a bread roll, potato and gravy and chicken salt chips. I think its the chicken and chips that I crave, although I get sick of them after a modest amount. I don't like eating too much chicken, I think I mostly like the skin, not the middle.

I'm also wondering if the recipe is different for New Zealand KFC as it is internationally.

magicpickles

KFC kills my cravings. When I want KFC, I can't think about any other food, and the cravings don't go away until I have it. I have done some research, and apparently MSG is very addictive and deadly. I don't know if that explains the other things I have been feeling (satisfaction, happiness, a high etc)

ronjsteele1

I'm going to surmise it's the msg. Msg is very addictive to the body. Largely it is salty and salt is a preservative. The fact that you like the chicken skin vs the actual meat makes me think you are actual craving the fat and salt.

I recently figured out that what I thought was a sugar craving was actually a fat and sweet craving. To combat that I found a recipe that filled that need but that I could use as either a meal or a snack just based on how much I serve myself. I happened upon avacado chocolate pudding. I hate avacados but in that pudding i can eat them. If I eat a full serving it ends up being a meal that will hold me full and satisfied for 6hrs at least. So my suggestion would be to find something that you like that has both salt and fat that will satisfy that craving apart from kfc. Msg is pretty addictive so I'm of the opinion you have to avoid it completely or your body will continue to crave it.

We eat a whole foods diet so by its nature is msg free. While I absolutely think that is nutritionally best for everyone, you need to eat in a way that is sustainable for you. So if you want to make changes then I would recommend one at a time. If you're happy with that and decide you want to change more later, you can. But you don't want to derail yourself by trying too many things at once. Most people would find it overwhelming.

So if you just start by cutting msg you'll need to know all of its names. I'll leave you to look most of them up for yourself but to start you off it goes not only by monosodium glutamate but also "natural flavorings" and a lot of other names. What they call it on a package (at least in the US) has to do with how much is in the item. Foods with larger quantities of it have to call it msg. Somewhere there is a list that describes those amounts for the US. I can't remember if it's the fda website or some other nutrition site but a good search should bring it up for you.

You'll get a ton of opinions on msg so I'll just suggest you research it for yourself and decide if removing it from your diet is right for you. A lot of people gave health issues go away from removing it. It's high on the nasty for your health list among alties.

magicpickles

@ronjsteele1 I found a list, it seems like MSG is in everything processed. I really like salt and vinegar rice crackers which are quite salty, and cous cous drenched in lots of lemon and soy sauce... apparently if food is really salty, its likely to have MSG and soy sauce generally has MSG. This explains a lot for me.

What is your avocado chocolate pudding recipe? would you mind sharing it here?

thanks

singingflutelady

magicpickles wrote: »

@ronjsteele1 I found a list, it seems like MSG is in everything processed. I really like salt and vinegar rice crackers which are quite salty, and cous cous drenched in lots of lemon and soy sauce... apparently if food is really salty, its likely to have MSG and soy sauce generally has MSG. This explains a lot for me.

What is your avocado chocolate pudding recipe? would you mind sharing it here?

thanks

There are tons and tons of processed foods without msg

magicpickles

singingflutelady wrote: »

magicpickles wrote: »

@ronjsteele1 I found a list, it seems like MSG is in everything processed. I really like salt and vinegar rice crackers which are quite salty, and cous cous drenched in lots of lemon and soy sauce... apparently if food is really salty, its likely to have MSG and soy sauce generally has MSG. This explains a lot for me.

What is your avocado chocolate pudding recipe? would you mind sharing it here?

thanks

There are tons and tons of processed foods without msg

I wrote ''seems like'' not ''is''

Red_Pill

It's a craving. Like in most high carb/fat/salt and/or sugary foods people crave, it releases an absurd amount of dopamine within the brain causing you to feel extreme pleasure whilst eating it. Like an orgasm through food. Anyway, although KFC isn't exactly just "potatoes & chicken" it's fine if eaten every once in a while. Same with all mainstream fast food joints. How you eat *most of the time is what'll govern your overall health. I'm speaking from experience. And avoiding processed food totally is all good but if eating processed food isn't actually causing you to be sick or causing a chronic addiction I would suggest to simply eat it "sparingly" instead. Focus on whole foods and you'll actually lose interest in processed food naturally. I say this because trying to live up to not eating processed food at all in this day and age is almost impossible. It can be done though but I don't think you need to subject yourself to wasting that much will power. In summary, taper down the KFC and get your dopamine release from home cooked meals. You'll gradually wean off the KFC. And as for general processed food; structure your diet around whole foods and you won't even think about breads, pasta etc and when you do it'll be sparingly. *Note for any one who can't read between the lines. I'm not saying pasta or bread is bad.

ronjsteele1

Yep. It takes some work to avoid (and honestly we don't 100% avoid it). If I error I lean towards "natural flavorings" if I have to. I just do the best we can and move on. I do use the low sodium soy sauce bc of the salt content (I use tamari).

Here's the avacado chocolate pudding recipe:

2 ripe avacados
5 tbls cocoa powder (I use double Dutch organic dark chocolate)
3 tbls. Honey (+ or - to taste)
2-3 tbls coconut milk (you can use any milk really. This just affects fat content)
1/2 tsp vanilla
Pinch of salt (I don't use the salt)

In a food processor blend the avacados. Add the other ingredients and blend until smooth like a pudding. Refrigerate several hours before serving. It's quite thick so if you don't mind it warm you can eat it right away (I like mine cold). I put the recipe into mfp recipe builder to get the nutrition info. It serves two.

I usually make it with 6 avacados at a time and then it lasts me a week in the fridge so it's there whenever I want it or have a fat/sweet craving and I just have to measure it out.

Let me know if you like it or not. The rest of my family won't touch it but it's bc they saw the blended avacados once and it looked too much like a baby's diaper for them. Lol.

Sloth2016

MSG is neither addictive nor deadly.

In the US, MSG must be listed as monosodium glutamate on the label if it is added, however, the US Food and Drug Administration (FDA), the regulatory body tasked with enforcing regulations pertaining to foods and drugs in the US, does not require foods in which it naturally exists (cheese, tomato, certain vegetable proteins, soy, etc.) to be labelled as containing it. It cannot be labelled as simply a spice.

http://www.fda.gov/food/ingredientspackaginglabeling/foodadditivesingredients/ucm328728.htm

Review of multiple studies conducted failed to find conclusive evidence of MSG causes headaches, even at relatively large doses.

http://thejournalofheadacheandpain.springeropen.com/articles/10.1186/s10194-016-0639-4

cbusnightowl

MSG is also naturally occurring... Tomato skins for sure ...hang on

http://www.fda.gov/Food/IngredientsPackagingLabeling/FoodAdditivesIngredients/ucm328728.htm

ETA: Sloth beat me to it

YvetteK2015

"Because of the absence of proper blinding, and the inconsistency of the findings, we conclude that further studies are required to evaluate whether or not a causal relationship exists between MSG ingestion and headache."

Of all the triggers of my migraines (seems almost everything is) MSG is not one of them, but I know a few for whom it is. Good for me, sucks for them.

magicpickles

@Red_Pill

What kind of foods can you get a dopamine release from at home cooked meals?

Unknown

This content has been removed.

magicpickles

@cbusnightowl
@YvetteK2015
@Sloth2016
@Noel_57
Ok, I don't know for sure if MSG is deadly or addictive, but that is not the point of this thread. What I want to know is, what is it about the KFC that creates such a big craving in me that causes me to refuse any other food until I get my fix, or not be able to stop thinking about it, and what chemical is it releasing in my brain that is causing enjoyment? is it something I can recreate without food, or are their other foods that I will want more than KFC that happen to be healthy?

Red_Pill

magicpickles wrote: »

@Red_Pill

What kind of foods can you get a dopamine release from at home cooked meals?

For me jerk/bbq grilled chicken and spicy potato wedges. Rump steak and basmati rice. Singapore fried noodles with pork shreddings. Spicy beef tacos. The list is endless. I'm a foodie, clearly

singingflutelady

magicpickles wrote: »

@Red_Pill

What kind of foods can you get a dopamine release from at home cooked meals?

Basically anything that you really like.

Aaron_K123

Yeah one ounce of KFC chicken has like 28 grams of chemicals in it.

Red_Pill

@magicpickles are you addicted to any other stimulants? Gaming, gambling, sex, validation etc?

daniip_la

Aaron_K123 wrote: »

Yeah one ounce of KFC chicken has like 28 grams of chemicals in it.

Oh no. I'm going to have to find some chemical-free chicken now.

Sloth2016

magicpickles wrote: »

Ok, I don't know for sure if MSG is deadly or addictive, but that is not the point of this thread. What I want to know is, what is it about the KFC that creates such a big craving in me that causes me to refuse any other food until I get my fix, or not be able to stop thinking about it, and what chemical is it releasing in my brain that is causing enjoyment? is it something I can recreate without food, or are their other foods that I will want more than KFC that happen to be healthy?

Simple. Ready....what you described is simply a habit. The habit cycle includes: 1. a stimulus or "trigger" e.g., hunger, 2. a routine behavior e.g., crave chicken, and 3. a reward e.g., tasty food.

According to one author, changing up your routine makes it easier to change your habit. He gives the example of being on vacation making it easier to quit smoking. So, look into when/where you are setting yourself up to crave KFC and see if you can alter the circumstances - have more to eat earlier in the day so you are full at those times, choose a different route so you are far away from KFC, etc. And of course, find something that tastes good that is not KFC to eat instead of it.

http://www.npr.org/2012/03/05/147192599/habits-how-they-form-and-how-to-break-them

Good luck with all your health and fitness goals!
-s

Sloth2016

singingflutelady wrote: »

magicpickles wrote: »

@Red_Pill

What kind of foods can you get a dopamine release from at home cooked meals?

Basically anything that you really like.

So true - even music: http://www.nature.com/neuro/journal/v14/n2/full/nn.2726.html

magicpickles

Red_Pill wrote: »

@magicpickles are you addicted to any other stimulants? Gaming, gambling, sex, validation etc?

I'm addicted to food, gaming and validation. There are addiction issues in my family for drugs and alcohol so I have always avoided those. I only have alcohol a few times a year, and never enough to get drunk.

cmriverside

magicpickles wrote: »

Red_Pill wrote: »

@magicpickles are you addicted to any other stimulants? Gaming, gambling, sex, validation etc?

I'm addicted to food, gaming and validation. There are addiction issues in my family for drugs and alcohol so I have always avoided those. I only have alcohol a few times a year, and never enough to get drunk.

I agree that it is psychological as well as tasty.

You mentioned dopamine earlier...

The dopamine feedback loop is pretty powerful. Have you thought about getting a little therapy? Although I don't think an ocassional trip to KFC requires therapy, these other things combined with it seem to suggest that someone to talk to would be really helpful.

SLLRunner

magicpickles wrote: »

I really like KFC and tend to have it once a week.

I want to quit eating it, because there are things I can eat at home that taste better, and I think I just like it because it gives me some kind of chemical high, like when I need it, it calms some kind of need in me like an addiction that nothing else can satisfy. I can also make food at home that has less calories and doesn't cost me $12 a hit, WITH nutritional value. Like, when I want KFC, nothing else makes me feel better. I am like that with some other foods.

I am thinking about quitting processed foods, but maybe just giving up one thing at a time is better. I wanted to start with KFC because I eat it regularly.

What chemicals from KFC am I getting and what can I replace them with? is it something like dopamine or sugar?

When I go to KFC I usually get the two piece quarter pack which is 2 pieces original skin chicken, pepsi max, a bread roll, potato and gravy and chicken salt chips. I think its the chicken and chips that I crave, although I get sick of them after a modest amount. I don't like eating too much chicken, I think I mostly like the skin, not the middle.

I'm also wondering if the recipe is different for New Zealand KFC as it is internationally.

I really miss the taste of KFC, but no matter what type of KFC chicken I get, and how little, it makes my tummy hurt.

Edited for clarity.

amusedmonkey

It appears you are dependent on it as a habit. Some foods are connected to certain feelings, possibly even memories in our heads. Detaching that feeling from the food itself is hard but doable. Good news is, you're not chemically addicted to it, and there are some great tools out there to control and change your habits. MSG does not cause chemical dependency either. I have it home and I add it to some dishes as a spice for that umami flavor, specifically to fish dishes. If it were addictive I would be putting it in everything every day and going through physical withdrawal when I don't use it.

magicpickles

SLLRunner wrote: »

magicpickles wrote: »

I really like KFC and tend to have it once a week.

I want to quit eating it, because there are things I can eat at home that taste better, and I think I just like it because it gives me some kind of chemical high, like when I need it, it calms some kind of need in me like an addiction that nothing else can satisfy. I can also make food at home that has less calories and doesn't cost me $12 a hit, WITH nutritional value. Like, when I want KFC, nothing else makes me feel better. I am like that with some other foods.

I am thinking about quitting processed foods, but maybe just giving up one thing at a time is better. I wanted to start with KFC because I eat it regularly.

What chemicals from KFC am I getting and what can I replace them with? is it something like dopamine or sugar?

When I go to KFC I usually get the two piece quarter pack which is 2 pieces original skin chicken, pepsi max, a bread roll, potato and gravy and chicken salt chips. I think its the chicken and chips that I crave, although I get sick of them after a modest amount. I don't like eating too much chicken, I think I mostly like the skin, not the middle.

I'm also wondering if the recipe is different for New Zealand KFC as it is internationally.

I really miss the taste of KFC, but no matter what type of chicken I get, and how little, it makes my tummy hurt.

How do you get your protein if you can't eat chicken?

singingflutelady

magicpickles wrote: »

SLLRunner wrote: »

magicpickles wrote: »

I really like KFC and tend to have it once a week.

I want to quit eating it, because there are things I can eat at home that taste better, and I think I just like it because it gives me some kind of chemical high, like when I need it, it calms some kind of need in me like an addiction that nothing else can satisfy. I can also make food at home that has less calories and doesn't cost me $12 a hit, WITH nutritional value. Like, when I want KFC, nothing else makes me feel better. I am like that with some other foods.

I am thinking about quitting processed foods, but maybe just giving up one thing at a time is better. I wanted to start with KFC because I eat it regularly.

What chemicals from KFC am I getting and what can I replace them with? is it something like dopamine or sugar?

When I go to KFC I usually get the two piece quarter pack which is 2 pieces original skin chicken, pepsi max, a bread roll, potato and gravy and chicken salt chips. I think its the chicken and chips that I crave, although I get sick of them after a modest amount. I don't like eating too much chicken, I think I mostly like the skin, not the middle.

I'm also wondering if the recipe is different for New Zealand KFC as it is internationally.

I really miss the taste of KFC, but no matter what type of chicken I get, and how little, it makes my tummy hurt.

How do you get your protein if you can't eat chicken?

There are plenty of foods that contain protein

SLLRunner

magicpickles wrote: »

SLLRunner wrote: »

magicpickles wrote: »

I really like KFC and tend to have it once a week.

I want to quit eating it, because there are things I can eat at home that taste better, and I think I just like it because it gives me some kind of chemical high, like when I need it, it calms some kind of need in me like an addiction that nothing else can satisfy. I can also make food at home that has less calories and doesn't cost me $12 a hit, WITH nutritional value. Like, when I want KFC, nothing else makes me feel better. I am like that with some other foods.

I am thinking about quitting processed foods, but maybe just giving up one thing at a time is better. I wanted to start with KFC because I eat it regularly.

What chemicals from KFC am I getting and what can I replace them with? is it something like dopamine or sugar?

When I go to KFC I usually get the two piece quarter pack which is 2 pieces original skin chicken, pepsi max, a bread roll, potato and gravy and chicken salt chips. I think its the chicken and chips that I crave, although I get sick of them after a modest amount. I don't like eating too much chicken, I think I mostly like the skin, not the middle.

I'm also wondering if the recipe is different for New Zealand KFC as it is internationally.

I really miss the taste of KFC, but no matter what type of chicken I get, and how little, it makes my tummy hurt.

How do you get your protein if you can't eat chicken?

No, it's not the chicken, which I eat plenty of; I think it's something in the KFC batter that makes my stomach hurt.

There are so many wonderful ways to get protein.

Sloth2016

amusedmonkey wrote: »

It appears you are dependent on it as a habit. Some foods are connected to certain feelings, possibly even memories in our heads. Detaching that feeling from the food itself is hard but doable. Good news is, you're not chemically addicted to it, and there are some great tools out there to control and change your habits. MSG does not cause chemical dependency either. I have it home and I add it to some dishes as a spice for that umami flavor, specifically to fish dishes. If it were addictive I would be putting it in everything every day and going through physical withdrawal when I don't use it.

I Love this post. I wish I could give it a double awesome!

Red_Pill

magicpickles wrote: »

Red_Pill wrote: »

@magicpickles are you addicted to any other stimulants? Gaming, gambling, sex, validation etc?

I'm addicted to food, gaming and validation. There are addiction issues in my family for drugs and alcohol so I have always avoided those. I only have alcohol a few times a year, and never enough to get drunk.

Oh right. On a scale of 1 - 10 how positive/happy do you feel while you're gaming and receiving validation vs when you're not engaging in those things?

Red_Pill

magicpickles wrote: »

SLLRunner wrote: »

magicpickles wrote: »

I really like KFC and tend to have it once a week.

I want to quit eating it, because there are things I can eat at home that taste better, and I think I just like it because it gives me some kind of chemical high, like when I need it, it calms some kind of need in me like an addiction that nothing else can satisfy. I can also make food at home that has less calories and doesn't cost me $12 a hit, WITH nutritional value. Like, when I want KFC, nothing else makes me feel better. I am like that with some other foods.

I am thinking about quitting processed foods, but maybe just giving up one thing at a time is better. I wanted to start with KFC because I eat it regularly.

What chemicals from KFC am I getting and what can I replace them with? is it something like dopamine or sugar?

When I go to KFC I usually get the two piece quarter pack which is 2 pieces original skin chicken, pepsi max, a bread roll, potato and gravy and chicken salt chips. I think its the chicken and chips that I crave, although I get sick of them after a modest amount. I don't like eating too much chicken, I think I mostly like the skin, not the middle.

I'm also wondering if the recipe is different for New Zealand KFC as it is internationally.

I really miss the taste of KFC, but no matter what type of chicken I get, and how little, it makes my tummy hurt.

How do you get your protein if you can't eat chicken?

Beef, lamb, fish, eggs, beans, turkey, *protein shakes, dairy. There's loads of other sources of protein.