The illusive 6 pack
Replies
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I don't have access to any of those methods. So for the time being I'll stick with the mirror.
I have done my own programme. I programme that I have used before so I know it works. I just started this programme It's basic but effective and I will change the exercises every 8 weeks.
Day 1. Chest and triceps
Day 2. Boxing
Day 3. Rest
Day 4. Back and biceps
Day 5. Legs and shoulders
Day 6. Boxing
Day 7. Rest or core.
3-4 exercises per muscle. 3 sets x 6 reps. 60 second rest between sets.0 -
I don't have access to any of those methods. So for the time being I'll stick with the mirror.
I have done my own programme. I programme that I have used before so I know it works. I just started this programme It's basic but effective and I will change the exercises every 8 weeks.
Day 1. Chest and triceps
Day 2. Boxing
Day 3. Rest
Day 4. Back and biceps
Day 5. Legs and shoulders
Day 6. Boxing
Day 7. Rest or core.
3-4 exercises per muscle. 3 sets x 6 reps. 60 second rest between sets.
Considering you are only training muscles 1x per week, it's going to be largely inefficient compared to other programs. Ideally, you should be training body parts 2 or 3x a week. This will maximize protein synthesis and CNS adaptations. I would highly look at the below list and choose a full body routine that fits your goals.
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10332083/which-lifting-program-is-the-best-for-you/p12 -
I don't have access to any of those methods. So for the time being I'll stick with the mirror.
I have done my own programme. I programme that I have used before so I know it works. I just started this programme It's basic but effective and I will change the exercises every 8 weeks.
Day 1. Chest and triceps
Day 2. Boxing
Day 3. Rest
Day 4. Back and biceps
Day 5. Legs and shoulders
Day 6. Boxing
Day 7. Rest or core.
3-4 exercises per muscle. 3 sets x 6 reps. 60 second rest between sets.
Considering you are only training muscles 1x per week, it's going to be largely inefficient compared to other programs. Ideally, you should be training body parts 2 or 3x a week. This will maximize protein synthesis and CNS adaptations. I would highly look at the below list and choose a full body routine that fits your goals.
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10332083/which-lifting-program-is-the-best-for-you/p1
Although, I would point out that if the goal is strictly aesthetic (abs being visible) this can be achieved through low body fat alone.1 -
rainbowbow wrote: »I don't have access to any of those methods. So for the time being I'll stick with the mirror.
I have done my own programme. I programme that I have used before so I know it works. I just started this programme It's basic but effective and I will change the exercises every 8 weeks.
Day 1. Chest and triceps
Day 2. Boxing
Day 3. Rest
Day 4. Back and biceps
Day 5. Legs and shoulders
Day 6. Boxing
Day 7. Rest or core.
3-4 exercises per muscle. 3 sets x 6 reps. 60 second rest between sets.
Considering you are only training muscles 1x per week, it's going to be largely inefficient compared to other programs. Ideally, you should be training body parts 2 or 3x a week. This will maximize protein synthesis and CNS adaptations. I would highly look at the below list and choose a full body routine that fits your goals.
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10332083/which-lifting-program-is-the-best-for-you/p1
Although, I would point out that if the goal is strictly aesthetic (abs being visible) this can be achieved through low body fat alone.
Fair point. It's why bro-splits still "work"1 -
rainbowbow wrote: »I don't have access to any of those methods. So for the time being I'll stick with the mirror.
I have done my own programme. I programme that I have used before so I know it works. I just started this programme It's basic but effective and I will change the exercises every 8 weeks.
Day 1. Chest and triceps
Day 2. Boxing
Day 3. Rest
Day 4. Back and biceps
Day 5. Legs and shoulders
Day 6. Boxing
Day 7. Rest or core.
3-4 exercises per muscle. 3 sets x 6 reps. 60 second rest between sets.
Considering you are only training muscles 1x per week, it's going to be largely inefficient compared to other programs. Ideally, you should be training body parts 2 or 3x a week. This will maximize protein synthesis and CNS adaptations. I would highly look at the below list and choose a full body routine that fits your goals.
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10332083/which-lifting-program-is-the-best-for-you/p1
Although, I would point out that if the goal is strictly aesthetic (abs being visible) this can be achieved through low body fat alone.
Fair point. It's why bro-splits still "work"
pretty much. Although i agree and personally train lower/upper multiple times a week myself.
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I love how overly simplified the advice for getting abs is. If it was really that easy so many more people would be walking around with 6 packs.
It's not really the process that is hard, it's the implementation of the process that is very difficult. It is just really difficult to get that lean for a lot of people. And when some do, they don't have adequate body composition to achieve the aesthetic they desire.
Having said that, I don't have a six pack yet due to my body fat % is too high.
But see, that's my point. Everyone still gives the standard "caloric deficit and lift weights" answer, but no one tells you about how to handle the meticulous meal prep, balancing hormones & hunger, and the little things that go along. Then people get frustrated because they think the answer is so simple and they beat themselves up because they can't get there. Where as if they had the full understanding of just how difficult it can be from most people to get there and even more so to maintain, they might set a more realistic approach.0 -
rainbowbow wrote: »I don't have access to any of those methods. So for the time being I'll stick with the mirror.
I have done my own programme. I programme that I have used before so I know it works. I just started this programme It's basic but effective and I will change the exercises every 8 weeks.
Day 1. Chest and triceps
Day 2. Boxing
Day 3. Rest
Day 4. Back and biceps
Day 5. Legs and shoulders
Day 6. Boxing
Day 7. Rest or core.
3-4 exercises per muscle. 3 sets x 6 reps. 60 second rest between sets.
Considering you are only training muscles 1x per week, it's going to be largely inefficient compared to other programs. Ideally, you should be training body parts 2 or 3x a week. This will maximize protein synthesis and CNS adaptations. I would highly look at the below list and choose a full body routine that fits your goals.
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10332083/which-lifting-program-is-the-best-for-you/p1
Although, I would point out that if the goal is strictly aesthetic (abs being visible) this can be achieved through low body fat alone.
Fair point. It's why bro-splits still "work"
As bro-splits go, this is fairly poorly designed.0 -
rainbowbow wrote: »For my 6 pack to appear definitively, it took 12-16 weeks of hard dieting. This was usually for competitions. Do I have a 6 pack now? Not even close. A distinguished 2-4 pack if I flex. All a 6 pack denotes is that you have low body fat. And staying that low take A LOT of effort for me. Meaning that I feel pretty miserable for the last 6 weeks of diet prep. Not worth it IMO.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
I have a similar experience. I also have to say that in order to achieve a six pack it requires me to lose the extra oomph from my face. While i appreciate the abs, i don't think the rest of my body looks it's best at that level of body fat. And of course, it is completely unsustainable for me. I actually usually maintain in the low 20's of body fat.
Yep. I got lean enough in the Spring, through deficit & lifting, to have a solid 4 pack. It's was cool but I also lost what little bust I had. Now maintaining about 5 lbs heavier at 21% body fat. Bust is back-yay! And, I like the muscle I've built in my legs. I'm okay with it
I still have some ab definition. Got some solid obliques going on. But, not as ripped as I was when under 20% body fat. Men can cut for abs and build their chest muscles.1 -
But see, that's my point. Everyone still gives the standard "caloric deficit and lift weights" answer, but no one tells you about how to handle the meticulous meal prep, balancing hormones & hunger, and the little things that go along. Then people get frustrated because they think the answer is so simple and they beat themselves up because they can't get there. Where as if they had the full understanding of just how difficult it can be from most people to get there and even more so to maintain, they might set a more realistic approach.
Seems like you have that understanding now.
It's easy to figure out what you need to do and hard for most of us to implement it. You can easily find out what to do and how to do it on the Net. That's where I found the info I use. However, no one can tell you what will work for you. You have to figure it out yourself.
I'm a contrarian by nature and chose a path that most people discourage (mostly because of myth and group think IMO) but it has worked for me - - more by luck than design. However, truth be told, developing abs were the LAST thing on my mind.
My objective was simply to lose weight/fat and gain strength. I achieved that and the bonus prize was the ab definition. So, perhaps, if you don't focus on the abs so much, you might become less frustrated and achieve them in the process as did I
Good luck!
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rainbowbow wrote: »How do you find out my body weight fat %. I used to have a set of scales that told me however I never really believed it was accurate and the ex took them. !!
I'm doing 2 days of boxing training and 3 days weight training which includes front squats and deadlifts.
I'm already lean now it's just harder to get leaner.
It's the Christmas time dinners and business lunches that are weighing me down (pardon the pun).
Time to start taking my own food to the next event......
The most accurate way is DXA scan or Hydostatic. A semi-accurate is get a trained professional to do a multi-point caliper test (I prefer at least 7-9).
IRT your weight training, are you following a self designed program or is it a proven structured program?
In addition to the two accurate methods i'd add in order of accuracy:
Dexa Scan
Hydrostatic Weighing
Bod Pod
(all of these can be done in a physicians office for around $100)
Calipers (done by someone else not yourself, and a 9 point test)
BIA devices (scales, handheld, etc.)
Visual
In any case, depending on your current level of body fat i've heard good things about the stubborn fat loss protocol by lyle mcdonald. I personally can't handle stimulants (caffiene or yohimbine) so I couldn't do it.
I think I'd almost put visual up towards the top of the list. If it's any help I did a little comparison a few months ago of several body composition methods and none of them were too far off, with visual being cheap, easy and fairly accurate.
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10442509/body-composition-method-comparison#latest
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mom23mangos wrote: »rainbowbow wrote: »How do you find out my body weight fat %. I used to have a set of scales that told me however I never really believed it was accurate and the ex took them. !!
I'm doing 2 days of boxing training and 3 days weight training which includes front squats and deadlifts.
I'm already lean now it's just harder to get leaner.
It's the Christmas time dinners and business lunches that are weighing me down (pardon the pun).
Time to start taking my own food to the next event......
The most accurate way is DXA scan or Hydostatic. A semi-accurate is get a trained professional to do a multi-point caliper test (I prefer at least 7-9).
IRT your weight training, are you following a self designed program or is it a proven structured program?
In addition to the two accurate methods i'd add in order of accuracy:
Dexa Scan
Hydrostatic Weighing
Bod Pod
(all of these can be done in a physicians office for around $100)
Calipers (done by someone else not yourself, and a 9 point test)
BIA devices (scales, handheld, etc.)
Visual
In any case, depending on your current level of body fat i've heard good things about the stubborn fat loss protocol by lyle mcdonald. I personally can't handle stimulants (caffiene or yohimbine) so I couldn't do it.
I think I'd almost put visual up towards the top of the list. If it's any help I did a little comparison a few months ago of several body composition methods and none of them were too far off, with visual being cheap, easy and fairly accurate.
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10442509/body-composition-method-comparison#latest
And yet every single person I know (including myself) who has had a dexa has underestimated body fat by atleast 5%. I think it's much easier to be accurate when you have visible muscle separation as you do.
Props to you for being accurate in your estimation though!
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Just throwing out there that some of us that were rather large and are a bit older have to deal with loose skin that can make it harder to achieve. Not sure where the OP falls in that category.2
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Just throwing out there that some of us that were rather large and are a bit older have to deal with loose skin that can make it harder to achieve. Not sure where the OP falls in that category.
Ha, yeah. I'm 47. I have loose skin but it only is apparent if I'm doing a plank and look down at my stomach (shudder). Standing upright, I look good and just pretend it doesn't exist 1 -
But see, that's my point. Everyone still gives the standard "caloric deficit and lift weights" answer, but no one tells you about how to handle the meticulous meal prep, balancing hormones & hunger, and the little things that go along. Then people get frustrated because they think the answer is so simple and they beat themselves up because they can't get there. Where as if they had the full understanding of just how difficult it can be from most people to get there and even more so to maintain, they might set a more realistic approach.
Seems like you have that understanding now.
It's easy to figure out what you need to do and hard for most of us to implement it. You can easily find out what to do and how to do it on the Net. That's where I found the info I use. However, no one can tell you what will work for you. You have to figure it out yourself.
I'm a contrarian by nature and chose a path that most people discourage (mostly because of myth and group think IMO) but it has worked for me - - more by luck than design. However, truth be told, developing abs were the LAST thing on my mind.
My objective was simply to lose weight/fat and gain strength. I achieved that and the bonus prize was the ab definition. So, perhaps, if you don't focus on the abs so much, you might become less frustrated and achieve them in the process as did I
Good luck!
Oh, I've never made my focus ripped abs. Occasionally I'll ponder taking a couple months and buckling down to get there, but I never do. I have visible abs, especially flexed & in good lighting, but I have no desire to put in the effort required to get as lean as I'd need to be to really make them pop.0 -
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Ok so I agree with everything you guys have said and my goal is not just to have abs. It is to be in good shape healthy all round.
But I'm confused.
"Calorie deficit and gain muscle lift weights"
I'm in my early 30s and I have been training on and off for at least 10years. This has always puzzled me however I have never asked till now.
Calorie deficit means your loosing weight and muscle with it. Gaining muscle by lifting weights means you need protein and lots of it which equals high calories.
To me the two contradict themselves.
So what comes first cutting then bulking or bulking then cutting. ??
My abs show slightly And so do my obliques and I reckon I need to loose 4-5kg (8-10pounds) for them to show. The muscles are there you just can't see them.0 -
Ok so I agree with everything you guys have said and my goal is not just to have abs. It is to be in good shape healthy all round.
But I'm confused.
"Calorie deficit and gain muscle lift weights"
I'm in my early 30s and I have been training on and off for at least 10years. This has always puzzled me however I have never asked till now.
Calorie deficit means your loosing weight and muscle with it. Gaining muscle by lifting weights means you need protein and lots of it which equals high calories.
To me the two contradict themselves.
So what comes first cutting then bulking or bulking then cutting. ??
My abs show slightly And so do my obliques and I reckon I need to loose 4-5kg (8-10pounds) for them to show. The muscles are there you just can't see them.
Calorie deficits don't mean muscle loss, especially if you are fairly lean and have adequate nutrition. You have a large opportunity, that with an adequate training stimulus and nutrition (largely protein), that you can maintain the muscle you have and largely lose just fat (probably good for step 1). If you get leaner and would like to add mass, then you can bulk. But as a male, you will probably also gain fat. At the end of your bulk, you cut back down to get rid of fat. Or once you get lean, you move to maintenance, still have a good training program and hope to see some muscle gains in maintenance. While slower, it's more adequate for some people who like to stay lean. @Hornsby is a great example of this.
ETA: Generally those who are more likely to lose muscle during a deficit, are those without good training, poor nutrition or just have a ton to lose. And there are even opportunities to gain muscle while losing weight.1 -
Calorie deficit means your loosing weight and muscle with it. Gaining muscle by lifting weights means you need protein and lots of it which equals high calorie.
Not entirely true.
I am currently 160# & 12% BF (down from 196# & +20% BF) and have lost weight and gained LBM (presumedly including muscle) and strength (as measured by the increasing amount lifted) on 2 separate occasions, most recently in the past 3 months measured by hydrostatic testing, on a high protein (40%) & low (1800) cal diet doing heavy compound lifts 5 to 6 days a week.
I have visible abs, lots of muscular definition and measure 42C-33W-37H by just doing this. It took 6 months of hard work and discipline to achieve it. Haven't looked or felt better in years and I'm 66.
Going into maintenance now but my cals & macros have not yet changed. However, I am going to cut back a little on the heavy lifting for awhile to allow my body to adjust and restore itself while I reassess my physical needs based on where I am now.0
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