Runners: Why so slow?
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MeanderingMammal wrote: »
Just saying it's not worrisome to want to run faster0 -
This post is very helpful. I've trained for a few races in my time with about 60% commitment level, and now I do wonder if that's because I was pushing too hard for every run. My heart rate gets into the max range on every run I go on. I'm going to try to use the guidance provided in this as I add distance toward my 10k. Thanks for this!1
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MeanderingMammal wrote: »
Just saying it's not worrisome to want to run faster
There are better ways to run faster than just trying to run flat out every time though, that's the point of the thread, not OP specific running speed.1 -
MeanderingMammal wrote: »
Just saying it's not worrisome to want to run faster
I'm sure you mean well, but you aren't a runner, aren't you?
OP's pace is not the pace of an advanced runner, but no, you don't become an advanced runner just trying to run faster.
That's a recipe to get injured.
You need instead a structured program that involves building an aerobic base first.3 -
MeanderingMammal wrote: »
Just saying it's not worrisome to want to run faster
Indeed, but where the originator is at the moment, the most effective approach to improving pace is to increase running volume. Going flat out every session is a quick route to injury and burnout.
By working up to a 10K session the 5K pace will probably improve by 3-4 minutes, at minimal risk.
fwiw if I'm designing a standalone plan I'll split it into three stages; build up, speedwork then taper. Speedwork needn't be complex or extensive.
Even for someone who runs regular races, in which case one needs a rolling plan, the periods of speedwork are quite limited. If doing long races a month apart then three or four speedwork sessions in the middle two weeks is all it needs to maintain performance.
That said people who runs HMS, marathons and longer every month are a very small subset. People who run 10Ks every month with the occasional foray up to HM are by far the biggest sub-set.1 -
Yep, adding distance will make you faster without even realizing it. When i reached the 5k mark, i could do it in 45' and i was quite tired by then.I couldn't do it faster, my legs were not willing.Now,after increasing my distance slowly to 15k, i can run the 5k in 33' . And i am still improving that time.What gives out first is not my legs, but my breath actually. It took 5 months of running to get from 46' to 33' but it does work. Slowly increase the disntance,and the speed will come inevitably.1
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Just popping in to add that there is something glorious about having capacity at the end of the race to pump it up and sail over the finish line.4
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So.... did my 14 hour mile with a pack yesterday, just over 5 hours of "lightly winded" count the same as a slow run? Or more basically: if you could power walk and slow jog at the same speed, is that the same thing for miles/eventually getting a faster 5k? Or is there something special about the running gait?0
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Never been a runner, but I am about to start week 4 of C25K. I can tell ya. I'm just trying to get through the program and run when I'm supposed to. Time is not my focus. Good form, good breathing, taking mindful steps... once I get that down and my endurance up (and I'm not sucking wind so much), I'll work on my time. But my goal right now is just get a decent time for a 5k and not be last.
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Following this thread as I've been running myself this last 6-8 months or so and got comfortable and am now pushing myself again a little. My 5k speeds are comparable to OPs but on a treadmill. I've started extending my indoor runs and am taking myself outside which I kinda hate-love and working on increasing intervals. I'm not chasing a speed or a time, rather duration and conditioning.0
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So.... did my 14 hour mile with a pack yesterday, just over 5 hours of "lightly winded" count the same as a slow run? Or more basically: if you could power walk and slow jog at the same speed, is that the same thing for miles/eventually getting a faster 5k? Or is there something special about the running gait?
Walking is 1 foot always on the floor. Running is both feet off the ground so yes the gait and calorie expenditure are different0 -
You have gotten some responses that make me cringe ...
There are two reasons for this advice:
1. If you're a newbie: it takes a LONG time for your joints, bones, tendons, and ligaments to strengthen and be ready for running. Your cardiovascular system responds almost immediately. Your muscles next. But bones, joints, etc -- they lag behind A LOT. And a new runner will probably get hurt if she or he keeps trying to go as fast as possible. IT Band, stress fractures, etc -- they happen slowly and over time. It's not like pulling a muscle -- you know it when you do it. One day you can be fine; the next you'll be in PT for months. Stress fractures take a long time to recover from, and you have to start over when you're done rehab.
2. This is going to sound weird, but how you get faster is by slowly increasing your distance by running long, slow miles. You will automatically get faster as you put in the time and prep your legs / body for the work of running. Really -- it just happens automatically as you put in slow miles. You need to work on "base building."
Go to the running Reddit sub for info and advice about running. Truly, some people writing on here are setting you -- and themselves -- up for injuries: mix it up ... do sprints some days. I know it seems logical, especially for people who are fit from other exercise. Obviously, do what you want but that is not the advice I would give or follow myself. Follow a good program, and you can run for a long, long time.1 -
Slow down is also my advice to new runners or those looking to use running as a part of weight loss strategy. In the former case, I want them to enjoy it and not feel pressured to keep up. It's ok to slow down or walk even. Everyone does. In the latter case, DISTANCE matters more than TIME, so whatever it takes to cover the distance is whatever it takes. When those two cases intersect, well, I still advocate distance.0
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youdoyou2016 wrote: »You have gotten some responses that make me cringe ...
There are two reasons for this advice:
1. If you're a newbie: it takes a LONG time for your joints, bones, tendons, and ligaments to strengthen and be ready for running. Your cardiovascular system responds almost immediately. Your muscles next. But bones, joints, etc -- they lag behind A LOT. And a new runner will probably get hurt if she or he keeps trying to go as fast as possible. IT Band, stress fractures, etc -- they happen slowly and over time. It's not like pulling a muscle -- you know it when you do it. One day you can be fine; the next you'll be in PT for months. Stress fractures take a long time to recover from, and you have to start over when you're done rehab.
2. This is going to sound weird, but how you get faster is by slowly increasing your distance by running long, slow miles. You will automatically get faster as you put in the time and prep your legs / body for the work of running. Really -- it just happens automatically as you put in slow miles. You need to work on "base building."
Go to the running Reddit sub for info and advice about running. Truly, some people writing on here are setting you -- and themselves -- up for injuries: mix it up ... do sprints some days. I know it seems logical, especially for people who are fit from other exercise. Obviously, do what you want but that is not the advice I would give or follow myself. Follow a good program, and you can run for a long, long time.
What is making you cringe? 90% of the advice is pretty much exactly what you said.2 -
StaciMarie1974 wrote: »Personally I'm going slower so I can go longer/further. Once I have the longer/further under control, I'll stress less on slowing down.
I did a 5k each of the last couple weekends. First one I walked @ 1 mile mark then alternated. Finished 37:35. Second my initial run went a little longer, but still ended up alternating running and walking. Finished 36:02.
I know that if I run slower I can run (without walking) for a longer distance. Yesterday at lunch, I went for 3.1 miles in 34 minutes. That was about .15 miles walking to get to my running location (dealing with traffic, crossing a street and such). I kept my time around the 10:30 minutes per mile mark and felt really good.
My current goal is to run a 10k, completely, at or under 1 hour & 10 minutes.
I'm the same. My first 5K was at 30:00 (yes, exactly!) and 2nd was a month later at 28:53. Those were a long time ago, and I just got seriously back into running last Oct. As a newbie runner a few years ago, those times included going out way too fast and then having to walk most of the time. Pacing was terrible. When I picked up running again in Oct., I had the same issue. It is still sometimes a problem, but I've been able to make some real improvements. Now that I'm going slower, my distance is improving at pretty close to the same average pace as some of my shorter runs. That's due to more consistency, where I would have sprinted at first and then walked for awhile afterwards. That might work for shorter races, so if I start out too fast and then walk for most of a 5K, then no big deal. If I start out way too fast and walk for most of a HM, then my average pace suffers so badly I might not even finish before the cut-off.
Spending a lot of time trying to slow down has made a big impact on distance. Yesterday, for example, I did 8.34 miles at an average of 9:53 in heavy wind. It felt like I was going slow, sure, but I can tell I'm building distance. Once I have the stamina to go long enough distances, I'll work on improving pace.0 -
Run long and run hard (however you define that). Beware though, proper warm-up is essential (dynamic). Wear cushioned shoes and socks for the pounding that your joints/muscles/tendons/ligaments will endure. Change shoes as recommended (based on mileage accumulated or wear patterns of the soles). Recovery is important for me as I need at least a day to recuperate. Stay hydrated. Don't overfuel or underfuel before running. Stride naturally and listen to your body. My heart rate would get very high to the 180s to 190s by the end of my run and I am usually spent. It works for me and may or may not for others. I try to run 3 to 4 times a week at least 5 to 6 miles at each run (treadmill and outdoors). With these primitive basics in mind, I was able to go from a 66 minute 10K to a 49 minute 10K without any crazy injuries.0
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One also gets faster by running faster. A tautology if there ever was one. The counterintuitiveness of getting faster by running slower is actually not that counterintuitive; it is but one component of a complete training program. But we're still left with "fast." The mechanics of running fast are different than the mechanics of running slow. All the iterations of speed work-- tempos, fartleks, speed intervals, hill repeats-- are necessary components to learning to run fast.youdoyou2016 wrote: »2. This is going to sound weird, but how you get faster is by slowly increasing your distance by running long, slow miles. You will automatically get faster as you put in the time and prep your legs / body for the work of running. Really -- it just happens automatically as you put in slow miles. You need to work on "base building."
That's all well and good, but I suspect what we're really after is running efficiency. To achieve that we need all of long runs, speed work, active recovery, rest and, yes, strength conditioning.
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jennypapage wrote: »Yep, adding distance will make you faster without even realizing it. When i reached the 5k mark, i could do it in 45' and i was quite tired by then.I couldn't do it faster, my legs were not willing.Now,after increasing my distance slowly to 15k, i can run the 5k in 33' . And i am still improving that time.What gives out first is not my legs, but my breath actually. It took 5 months of running to get from 46' to 33' but it does work. Slowly increase the disntance,and the speed will come inevitably.
Congrats, you've gone from a slow walking pace to a fast walking pace. I thought we were talking about running.0 -
stanmann571 wrote: »jennypapage wrote: »Yep, adding distance will make you faster without even realizing it. When i reached the 5k mark, i could do it in 45' and i was quite tired by then.I couldn't do it faster, my legs were not willing.Now,after increasing my distance slowly to 15k, i can run the 5k in 33' . And i am still improving that time.What gives out first is not my legs, but my breath actually. It took 5 months of running to get from 46' to 33' but it does work. Slowly increase the disntance,and the speed will come inevitably.
Congrats, you've gone from a slow walking pace to a fast walking pace. I thought we were talking about running.
That make you feel better about yourself? :huh:9 -
stanmann571 wrote: »jennypapage wrote: »Yep, adding distance will make you faster without even realizing it. When i reached the 5k mark, i could do it in 45' and i was quite tired by then.I couldn't do it faster, my legs were not willing.Now,after increasing my distance slowly to 15k, i can run the 5k in 33' . And i am still improving that time.What gives out first is not my legs, but my breath actually. It took 5 months of running to get from 46' to 33' but it does work. Slowly increase the disntance,and the speed will come inevitably.
Congrats, you've gone from a slow walking pace to a fast walking pace. I thought we were talking about running.
4.0mph is NOT a slow walking pace and 5.6 isn't a walking pace at all. Not only are you rude, but also completely wrong.9
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