Question for others who also have issues with moderation

endlessfall16

ndj1979 wrote: »

endlessfall16 wrote: »

ndj1979 wrote: »

endlessfall16 wrote: »

ndj1979 wrote: »

tlanger251 wrote: »

I've been addicted to food my whole life until I started the Keto diet. Now I don't have cravings for food ever, unless I'm physically hungry. I don't need willpower, the cravings are gone. No bored eating, emotional eating, carb binges.

I am sorry but this makes no sense. How would keto or any way of eating make you not addicted to food? Even with a keto diet you are still consuming food. Food addiction is not a real thing, but behavioral/psychological issues that make one consume food to the point of obesity are real issues.

That's just how the body reacts, for a lot of people. Eating can be addictive because it's unmistakably a pleasure, a reward. Where there's a reward/pleasure, there's possible addiction.

Food items can directly affect the brain chemistry which is biological. Take for example alcohol, which is quite a popular food item. Alcohol acts like a psychotic drug to the body. Lots of people crave that relaxing feeling from it, Not necessarily behavioral/psychological effects. Coffee is another good example.

sorry, food is not addictive.

You are confusing yourself when you are over generalizing food is food. You are (intentionally?) avoiding to look at specific foods. Celery is highly unlikely addictive. Coffee, alcohol are very likely addictive. There are real highs from them that people get.

Btw, I sense that you are kinda lazy with thinking, the way you post. LOL

coffee is a food, really?

if food is not food, then what is it?

Of course coffee is a food item. In what sense is it not?

ndj1979

endlessfall16 wrote: »

ndj1979 wrote: »

endlessfall16 wrote: »

ndj1979 wrote: »

endlessfall16 wrote: »

ndj1979 wrote: »

tlanger251 wrote: »

I've been addicted to food my whole life until I started the Keto diet. Now I don't have cravings for food ever, unless I'm physically hungry. I don't need willpower, the cravings are gone. No bored eating, emotional eating, carb binges.

I am sorry but this makes no sense. How would keto or any way of eating make you not addicted to food? Even with a keto diet you are still consuming food. Food addiction is not a real thing, but behavioral/psychological issues that make one consume food to the point of obesity are real issues.

That's just how the body reacts, for a lot of people. Eating can be addictive because it's unmistakably a pleasure, a reward. Where there's a reward/pleasure, there's possible addiction.

Food items can directly affect the brain chemistry which is biological. Take for example alcohol, which is quite a popular food item. Alcohol acts like a psychotic drug to the body. Lots of people crave that relaxing feeling from it, Not necessarily behavioral/psychological effects. Coffee is another good example.

sorry, food is not addictive.

You are confusing yourself when you are over generalizing food is food. You are (intentionally?) avoiding to look at specific foods. Celery is highly unlikely addictive. Coffee, alcohol are very likely addictive. There are real highs from them that people get.

Btw, I sense that you are kinda lazy with thinking, the way you post. LOL

coffee is a food, really?

if food is not food, then what is it?

Of course coffee is a food item. In what sense is it not?

I don't know anyone that classifies coffee as food.

and alcohol is definitely not food.

and I stand by my assertion that food is not addictive.

But if you want to give something power over you to control your life, by all means do so.

janejellyroll

endlessfall16 wrote: »

ndj1979 wrote: »

endlessfall16 wrote: »

ndj1979 wrote: »

tlanger251 wrote: »

I've been addicted to food my whole life until I started the Keto diet. Now I don't have cravings for food ever, unless I'm physically hungry. I don't need willpower, the cravings are gone. No bored eating, emotional eating, carb binges.

I am sorry but this makes no sense. How would keto or any way of eating make you not addicted to food? Even with a keto diet you are still consuming food. Food addiction is not a real thing, but behavioral/psychological issues that make one consume food to the point of obesity are real issues.

That's just how the body reacts, for a lot of people. Eating can be addictive because it's unmistakably a pleasure, a reward. Where there's a reward/pleasure, there's possible addiction.

Food items can directly affect the brain chemistry which is biological. Take for example alcohol, which is quite a popular food item. Alcohol acts like a psychotic drug to the body. Lots of people crave that relaxing feeling from it, Not necessarily behavioral/psychological effects. Coffee is another good example.

sorry, food is not addictive.

You are confusing yourself when you are over generalizing food is food. You are (intentionally?) avoiding to look at specific foods. Celery is highly unlikely addictive. Coffee, alcohol are very likely addictive. There are real highs from them that people get.

Btw, I sense that you are kinda lazy with thinking, the way you post. LOL

It's possible to understand that humans can be addicted to caffeine and alcohol and be skeptical about the theory of "food addiction." The "lazy thinking" would be ignoring the specific addictive properties of caffeine and alcohol and assuming they apply to other foods.

endlessfall16

janejellyroll wrote: »

endlessfall16 wrote: »

ndj1979 wrote: »

endlessfall16 wrote: »

ndj1979 wrote: »

tlanger251 wrote: »

I've been addicted to food my whole life until I started the Keto diet. Now I don't have cravings for food ever, unless I'm physically hungry. I don't need willpower, the cravings are gone. No bored eating, emotional eating, carb binges.

I am sorry but this makes no sense. How would keto or any way of eating make you not addicted to food? Even with a keto diet you are still consuming food. Food addiction is not a real thing, but behavioral/psychological issues that make one consume food to the point of obesity are real issues.

That's just how the body reacts, for a lot of people. Eating can be addictive because it's unmistakably a pleasure, a reward. Where there's a reward/pleasure, there's possible addiction.

Food items can directly affect the brain chemistry which is biological. Take for example alcohol, which is quite a popular food item. Alcohol acts like a psychotic drug to the body. Lots of people crave that relaxing feeling from it, Not necessarily behavioral/psychological effects. Coffee is another good example.

sorry, food is not addictive.

You are confusing yourself when you are over generalizing food is food. You are (intentionally?) avoiding to look at specific foods. Celery is highly unlikely addictive. Coffee, alcohol are very likely addictive. There are real highs from them that people get.

Btw, I sense that you are kinda lazy with thinking, the way you post. LOL

It's possible to understand that humans can be addicted to caffeine and alcohol and be skeptical about the theory of "food addiction." The "lazy thinking" would be ignoring the specific addictive properties of caffeine and alcohol and assuming they apply to other foods.

I am not assuming anything applying to all, other foods. I am even against such generalization in my post. It's people that are dismissive to addictive properties of (certain) foods that you need to reply to.

lemurcat12

cmriverside wrote: »

Lemur, all that explanation was after the statement that I have issue with. The "most people binge on combination fat/sugar foods."

But that is NOT what I said (and the thing about context was BEFORE the comment about hyperpalatable foods usually being a combination). Significantly (or at least it seems significant to me), I was NOT talking about bingeing with the combinations post, but about wanting to overeat, and it was in response to someone saying it was all about sugar. (For the record, I think bingeing is different and more out of control, less focused on taste.) I also did not limit it to fat/sugar. I said: "What most people seem to have trouble moderating (because so tasty) is combinations" and then went on to talk about how most of the foods brought up (including the one by the poster in question) were not just sugar, but fat/sugar, and it was also common to have trouble moderating various savory foods that we a combination of tastes that many of us find appealing (fat/salt, carbs/fat, so on).

I did not say that no one ever overate things that are just sugary, I even called out soda as one example.

Maybe one reason for the disconnect is that you are seeing the discussion as about binges?

But again, I am not saying that NO ONE overeats or is tempted to overeat plain candy or whatever. I just find that for all the focus on sugar being what causes the overeating it is pretty remarkable that almost always when the person saying that lists the problem foods they are sugar/fat and fruit is fine and sugar in a bowl is fine. It's about taste, not some magical effect of sugar.

Francl27

annacole94 wrote: »

One other thought: the foods I have a very hard time moderating aren't foods I would say I love. If you asked me my favorite foods, I'd say craft beer, great cheese, awesome pizza. I would never say gummy bears or sour patch kids or all dressed chips. And yet the first set I can eat a reasonable serving of and feel satisfied, while the latter set I will eat to oblivion and want more.

That's why I cut them out, vs. trying to learn to moderate them. They're not my actual favorite things, and I don't miss them if they're not around. I just can't deal with them when they are around. They must get in mah belly.

Yeah same here, that's why I have no problem cutting candy, gummy bear, juice etc... I can totally do without.

Bread and cookies? Over my dead body.

lemurcat12

CSARdiver wrote: »

ritzvin wrote: »

I think for most people, what @lemurcat12 is saying is very true. I think very few people will go into the cabinet and binge eat straight sugar (or even fruit). Sugar/starch/fat and/or starch/fat and/or sugar/fat combinations, OTOH, are hard to resist. (as in chocolate bars, ice cream, pastry, cookies, cake, ..., what people refer to as sweet/sugary snacks, but which would be nowhere near as irresistible without the high fat content). Even most of the salty snacks people crave are high fat (potato chips, bacon, ...).

I've been watching several of the 10,000 calories challenges on YouTube and all the participants experience the same. They have tremendous difficulty hitting the 10k mark just with sweets or salty foods, but combine and switch to keep feeding. This is where the science/art of hyperpalatable foods comes in to play.

Part of this (forget where I was reading about it) is palate fatigue. You get tired of even the most appealing food. If you have a variety of tastes you can (and often will) eat more. It is part of why people can be so full they can't eat another bite and then get dessert.

ndj1979

endlessfall16 wrote: »

janejellyroll wrote: »

endlessfall16 wrote: »

ndj1979 wrote: »

endlessfall16 wrote: »

ndj1979 wrote: »

tlanger251 wrote: »

I've been addicted to food my whole life until I started the Keto diet. Now I don't have cravings for food ever, unless I'm physically hungry. I don't need willpower, the cravings are gone. No bored eating, emotional eating, carb binges.

I am sorry but this makes no sense. How would keto or any way of eating make you not addicted to food? Even with a keto diet you are still consuming food. Food addiction is not a real thing, but behavioral/psychological issues that make one consume food to the point of obesity are real issues.

That's just how the body reacts, for a lot of people. Eating can be addictive because it's unmistakably a pleasure, a reward. Where there's a reward/pleasure, there's possible addiction.

Food items can directly affect the brain chemistry which is biological. Take for example alcohol, which is quite a popular food item. Alcohol acts like a psychotic drug to the body. Lots of people crave that relaxing feeling from it, Not necessarily behavioral/psychological effects. Coffee is another good example.

sorry, food is not addictive.

You are confusing yourself when you are over generalizing food is food. You are (intentionally?) avoiding to look at specific foods. Celery is highly unlikely addictive. Coffee, alcohol are very likely addictive. There are real highs from them that people get.

Btw, I sense that you are kinda lazy with thinking, the way you post. LOL

It's possible to understand that humans can be addicted to caffeine and alcohol and be skeptical about the theory of "food addiction." The "lazy thinking" would be ignoring the specific addictive properties of caffeine and alcohol and assuming they apply to other foods.

I am not assuming anything applying to all, other foods. I am even against such generalization in my post. It's people that are dismissive to addictive properties of (certain) foods that you need to reply to.

what exactly are those addictive properties that have been shown by science using human trials via psychical addiction?

lemurcat12

cmriverside wrote: »

I've also eaten 1800 calories of peanut butter right out of the jar.

Was this taste-based, because you were enjoying it so much and wanted to keep eating? Or were you compulsively eating in some way?

That, to me, seems like a difference.

Note: I'm not saying I don't believe you could eat that much peanut butter just because you were enjoying the taste of it so, but asking if that's what you are talking about.

(Also, of course, peanut butter is a combination food -- salt and fat, primarily, not exclusively.)

lemurcat12

cmriverside wrote: »

ndj1979 wrote: »

cmriverside wrote: »

I've been at a healthy weight for 10 years. I don't consider something "a major issue" if it doesn't affect my life.

I'm not arguing for the term "addiction." I am saying there are many reasons and many foods that I can eat compulsively if the conditions are right - not just combo sugar/fat foods.

i don't think anyone is saying otherwise...

lol. This whole thing started because that is exactly what Lemur says repeatedly.

Argh, in the very paragraph you are taking issue with I mentioned lots of foods that are not sugar/fat foods. I mentioned fat/salt specifically.

(I don't mind disagreement, I think it keeps life interesting, and I am genuinely interested in why others see things differently than I do. I get frustrated when I feel like I am being misunderstood.)