June 2017 Running Challenge
Options
Replies
-
@KatieJane83 the female me...lol...to do that you'd have to to from non-runner to ultra attempt in 19 months.... I'm a very special kind of crazy....
Great race report and pictures. You've got an official sub 2 IN you and you'll do it soon.2 -
I feel like such an imposter on Strava (https://www.strava.com/athletes/21288640) all of my runs are listed at way faster paces, like over a minute per mile faster than I actually ran them.
No idea why Strava can not get it right. RunKeeper has them all correct. 0 -
PastorVincent wrote: »I feel like such an imposter on Strava (https://www.strava.com/athletes/21288640) all of my runs are listed at way faster paces, like over a minute per mile faster than I actually ran them. No idea why Strava can not get it right. RunKeeper has them all correct.
That's really weird. Maybe it's a runkeeper thing..Garmin and Strava match up for me.1 -
MNLittleFinn wrote: »PastorVincent wrote: »I feel like such an imposter on Strava (https://www.strava.com/athletes/21288640) all of my runs are listed at way faster paces, like over a minute per mile faster than I actually ran them. No idea why Strava can not get it right. RunKeeper has them all correct.
That's really weird. Maybe it's a runkeeper thing..Garmin and Strava match up for me.
Yeah, I'm thinking that too. Garmin and Strava match up for me as well.
I have to say, the place where Garmin really sucks is elevation. For the 900ft elevation gain on my race Garmin only gave me 277ft! Strava was right on the money, verified by the actual race website. I know it does something like ignore hills that are below a certain threshold, which is pretty stupid to me, since obviously they add up over the miles.1 -
MNLittleFinn wrote: »@KatieJane83 the female me...lol...to do that you'd have to to from non-runner to ultra attempt in 19 months.... I'm a very special kind of crazy....
Great race report and pictures. You've got an official sub 2 IN you and you'll do it soon.
Welll, I don't know about the ultra thing, lol. But, I think I'm gonna be asking lots of questions, and for lots of advice, and probably way overthinking lots of things
0 -
MNLittleFinn wrote: »PastorVincent wrote: »I feel like such an imposter on Strava (https://www.strava.com/athletes/21288640) all of my runs are listed at way faster paces, like over a minute per mile faster than I actually ran them. No idea why Strava can not get it right. RunKeeper has them all correct.
That's really weird. Maybe it's a runkeeper thing..Garmin and Strava match up for me.
No, the math works out. RunKeeper is correct. Strava likes to keep the DISTANCE I ran, but adjust TIME down by 7-10 minutes. Strava is definitely wrong. So sure IF I ran 7 miles in an hour instead of 1:07 I would have been faster by a minute per mile... but I did not. I ran it in 1:07.
Does Garmin only work with Garmin watches? I assume so. So can not try creating Garmin account to see what it comes up with.
0 -
PastorVincent wrote: »MNLittleFinn wrote: »PastorVincent wrote: »I feel like such an imposter on Strava (https://www.strava.com/athletes/21288640) all of my runs are listed at way faster paces, like over a minute per mile faster than I actually ran them. No idea why Strava can not get it right. RunKeeper has them all correct.
That's really weird. Maybe it's a runkeeper thing..Garmin and Strava match up for me.
No, the math works out. RunKeeper is correct. Strava likes to keep the DISTANCE I ran, but adjust TIME down by 7-10 minutes. Strava is definitely wrong. So sure IF I ran 7 miles in an hour instead of 1:07 I would have been faster by a minute per mile... but I did not. I ran it in 1:07.
Does Garmin only work with Garmin watches? I assume so. So can not try creating Garmin account to see what it comes up with.
Yeah, I wasn't so much thinking that your Runkeeper was wrong, just that something about the way Runkeeper specifically and Strava communicate with each other is broken. That is very strange, maybe you can file some type of tech support ticket or something.0 -
No run for me today. I ran last three days in a row and that's new for me so I'm feeling it with some muscle fatigue. I plan on doing a long (for me) run tomorrow because I won't be able to run the next three days. Or be on here so I'll probably have a bazillion pages to catch up on!
@KatieJane83, congratulations on your PR and thanks for sharing the pics! Sounds like it was a great experience.
@mk2fit, welcome!2 -
PastorVincent wrote: »MNLittleFinn wrote: »PastorVincent wrote: »I feel like such an imposter on Strava (https://www.strava.com/athletes/21288640) all of my runs are listed at way faster paces, like over a minute per mile faster than I actually ran them. No idea why Strava can not get it right. RunKeeper has them all correct.
That's really weird. Maybe it's a runkeeper thing..Garmin and Strava match up for me.
No, the math works out. RunKeeper is correct. Strava likes to keep the DISTANCE I ran, but adjust TIME down by 7-10 minutes. Strava is definitely wrong. So sure IF I ran 7 miles in an hour instead of 1:07 I would have been faster by a minute per mile... but I did not. I ran it in 1:07.
Does Garmin only work with Garmin watches? I assume so. So can not try creating Garmin account to see what it comes up with.
Garmin only works with a garmin. My guess is bad/weird data transfer from runkeeper to Strava... Interesting. I use all 3 and runkeeper gives distances/paces than the other 2 using the same info from my watch.... Garmin and Strava match up more than runkeeper with the other 2.
Here's an interesting thing maybe try running both apps at once to track a run and see what happens? That would give you a better idea of the issue maybe....0 -
@KatieJane83 Great race, love the medal, love the pictures
@Girlinahat @PastorVincent and @MobyCarp I will pick of the 80/20 book and follow this plan for now. I didn't fully understand all the aspects of the speed days in the plan and didn't think I could keep the paces they suggested. Being still somewhat new, I don't have a 10k pace. I ran my half-marathon at close to 8:30 which I think is good enough to say I'm ready to train for the full but I don't have information on what my 5k time or 10k time would be. I like the idea of a plan that doesn't require all the training to be running but I worry if that will work well. As Pastor said most of us don't do enough cross-training and that may be our undoing. I think the interval work is important. There seems to be the constant battle with distance runners of finding the balance of over training and under training. The 80/20 plan is most certainly and attempt at finding that happy medium.1 -
KatieJane83 wrote: »MNLittleFinn wrote: »@KatieJane83 the female me...lol...to do that you'd have to to from non-runner to ultra attempt in 19 months.... I'm a very special kind of crazy....
Great race report and pictures. You've got an official sub 2 IN you and you'll do it soon.
Welll, I don't know about the ultra thing, lol. But, I think I'm gonna be asking lots of questions, and for lots of advice, and probably way overthinking lots of things
Yup that's me. And on the elevation thing, I agree, Strava seems a lot better than Garmin. More consistent too.1 -
cburke8909 wrote: »@KatieJane83 Great race, love the medal, love the pictures
@Girlinahat @PastorVincent and @MobyCarp I will pick of the 80/20 book and follow this plan for now. I didn't fully understand all the aspects of the speed days in the plan and didn't think I could keep the paces they suggested. Being still somewhat new, I don't have a 10k pace. I ran my half-marathon at close to 8:30 which I think is good enough to say I'm ready to train for the full but I don't have information on what my 5k time or 10k time would be. I like the idea of a plan that doesn't require all the training to be running but I worry if that will work well. As Pastor said most of us don't do enough cross-training and that may be our undoing. I think the interval work is important. There seems to be the constant battle with distance runners of finding the balance of over training and under training. The 80/20 plan is most certainly and attempt at finding that happy medium.
If you completed a 1/2, then yes, next step is full, IMO. Really there is not much in between. Marathon is a different world than a half. Things like mid-race fueling matter a lot in the full that you can get away with not doing at all in the 1/2. You will likely both hate it and want more of it
0 -
MNLittleFinn wrote: »Garmin only works with a garmin. My guess is bad/weird data transfer from runkeeper to Strava... Interesting. I use all 3 and runkeeper gives distances/paces than the other 2 using the same info from my watch.... Garmin and Strava match up more than runkeeper with the other 2.
Here's an interesting thing maybe try running both apps at once to track a run and see what happens? That would give you a better idea of the issue maybe....
MY GUESS - So in my case RunKeeper is using the watch to get data. Apple Workout App also has a copy of the data straight from the watch. They both are very close (RunKeeper does a GPS clean up, so distances are often like .1 or .2 apart). I would bet those are accurate. I then sync the data to MFP and Strava. MFP gives wild values for pace based on some list of runs it has internally (not from the actual data), which I ignore, but it takes the calories from Apple Health Kit, which are by far the most accurate of the bunch. Strava gets the data and probably sees gaps in the GPS recording and assumes that was non-running time so subtracts it. It then generates a pace based on that edited data.
As for running them both at the same time, in the past whenever I have run two apps like that at once, it made GPS a lot less accurate.
I am GUESSING your Garmin is getting correct data directly from the watch and thereby yielding good results, but have you checked it? Like starting a stopwatch when you start, then stop it at the end and see if the two times match? It could be whatever algorithm Strava is using, Garmin also is. I never considered that before. Be an interesting test for any app I think.
Maybe today I will run the Strava App and sync to RunKeeper and see what happens. Might start a stopwatch and see if Strava is playing any games with timing. Or RunKeeper - but I am confident of RunKeeper based on comparing it to race finishes that were chip timed.
I really suspect Strava in this case, but, maybe I am prejudice because I have been using RunKeeper for a decade. 0 -
cburke8909 wrote: »@KatieJane83 Great race, love the medal, love the pictures
@Girlinahat @PastorVincent and @MobyCarp I will pick of the 80/20 book and follow this plan for now. I didn't fully understand all the aspects of the speed days in the plan and didn't think I could keep the paces they suggested. Being still somewhat new, I don't have a 10k pace. I ran my half-marathon at close to 8:30 which I think is good enough to say I'm ready to train for the full but I don't have information on what my 5k time or 10k time would be. I like the idea of a plan that doesn't require all the training to be running but I worry if that will work well. As Pastor said most of us don't do enough cross-training and that may be our undoing. I think the interval work is important. There seems to be the constant battle with distance runners of finding the balance of over training and under training. The 80/20 plan is most certainly and attempt at finding that happy medium.
@cburke8909 - I've had some additional thoughts since I wrote my last post on the FIRST plan. Since you say you're still somewhat new, I thought it might be worthwhile to write my recent thoughts out.
Assuming the plan works, I'm thinking that *not running* on the other 4 days a week is an important part of avoiding injury with a plan that's this aggressive on pace. Other cardio for cross training then becomes critically important for cardio development. Walking won't increase the risk of injury, but likely also won't elevate your heart rate enough. So you're looking at cycling, swimming, etc. for 40-45 minutes, two days a week.
The linked description of the plan likely omits some important, but boring, details about the speed work. With intervals that fast, it will be important to run a warm up before. (The author may assume his readers are all experienced runners and know this.) In my club, it is traditional to run a 2 mile warm up. Then before very fast speed work (and all the intervals in the FIRST plan are very fast), sometimes Coach has us run an 800 at T pace (right around mid tempo pace, in the context of the FIRST plan) to warm up before running the faster intervals. It helps. The club also traditionally does a 2 mile cool down run; I'm not so sure that's critically important, but I've noticed my legs appreciate it a lot more after workouts at R than workouts at T and I. Review, "R" is the fastest training pace I use for intervals, and corresponds to the pace the FIRST plan wants me to use for 1200s.
I thought about the paces relative to 10K time, and realized that I know a runner who is faster than me on shorter distances relative to his 10K pace. He's a member of my club, and we have 3 recent races in common: McMullen Mile (5:44.90 for me, 5:15.77 for him, running in the same heat); Medved 5K (19:32 for me, 19:13 for him); and Lilac 10K (40:04 for me, 40:41 for him). He could probably run the paces in the FIRST plan, based on his 10K pace. The interesting thing is, after seeing him leave me behind in training runs, I asked him how the *kitten* did he manage to finish behind me at Lilac? He told me that he is just relatively worse the longer the distance is, and he needs to work on his endurance. So while he *could* do the FIRST plan, I question how much it would help with what he would really need to work on for a marathon.
Pace references for you: You cite 8:30 as what you ran for a half. 7:00 is a reasonable estimate for what I run for a half, some are faster and some are slower. I was using 6:30 for my 10K pace based on real races. If you plug you HM time into a calculator and it generates a predicted 10K result of somewhere around a pace of 8:00, what it generates should be good enough to use as an estimate for training paces.2 -
@PastorVincent - Strava gets my data from Garmin, and usually the paces are close. When they aren't, Strava reports a faster average pace. What's going on is, I don't use autopause on Garmin so the results include stopped time. Strava automatically strips out stopped time. This can be an error when GPS wobble results in a false stop; but it's more likely to be accurate (and significant) if I run a route where I have to stop for several stoplights, or stop to tie my shoe or talk to someone for 20 or 30 seconds, etc.
If that's also what goes on with Strava and the Apple Watch, I think for a difference between 60 and 67 minutes you would have noticed some stopped time on the run.
Edit to add: Just noticed you mentioned Strava seeing "gaps in the GPS data." Is there a reason you should have gaps in the data? Run near tall buildings or something like that? Maybe you could get a cheap used old-model Garmin and use both it and the Apple Watch to check how Apple compares to Garmin with respect to picking up GPS. (My bias against Apple for fitness is showing, isn't it?)0 -
@PastorVincent my Garmin gives me results that are within 10 seconds of chip time from races, and I tend to trust those... yeah, I turn my watch off pretty quick after I'm done. Garmin has never given me any readings that were "off" I used to use runkeeper, and it worked well, I just stopped using it when I got my Garmin, as I was running the app on my phone and didn't need to anymore.
Edit: I just checked and Runkeeper and Strava and Garmin and mapmyrun all gave me the exact same time and pace for Grandma's marathon.... interesting that Strava gives you so much trouble.
Edit2: I checked my 5 mile run from the 22nd on Runkeeper, Strava, Garmin and MapMyRun... 3/4 gave me the same pace, 4/4 gave me the same time... Runkeeper showed me slower by 14sec/mile.... even more interesting
FTR: I like Runkeeper, I'm just always looking at data, more for fun than anything else.0 -
cburke8909 wrote: »@girlinahat
@PastorVincent - it was not you I was referring to. I'm questioning @cburke8909 for his adding more runs without having actually tried it as it is.
wouldn't you want to give the 1969 VW Bug a thorough test drive?
When it comes to any running plan I think in terms of it being a guide not a prescription. If I were a little more serious, I'd probably look for a running coach and we could pick out a plan that was more tailored based on his/her expert opinion. I welcome the advice (even when contrary) that I get here. I think all plans I use at the moment are experiments in what will and won't work for me. When altering a plan or following a plan my biggest concern is injury. The basics that I gather from reading and the MRC are to not have long runs that are to high a percent of your weekly total, have speed work but not too much (once a week) and have recovery runs to build endurance free of excessive stress on the body. This plan is questionable because the long runs are a very high proportion, I can ignore the violation and just do the plan as written or I can add a small alteration by using some easy runs instead of the cross-training. For now I may just do the cross-training as written and see how it feels, if it doesn't feel right then I will change. If Moby, Pastor, Stan or others here were to ,in consensus, think the plan is a total "kitten" then I would alter or find a new plan. Keeping in mind that one must listen to their own body. If today's plan called for an 8 mile run at pace and my knees, or ankle were just killing me I'm altering the plan and listening to my body. If I avoid injury, I can run another day. On that note the alteration of the plan that most concerns me is the 5k for fun. They are part of weekly races put out on by a local running club. I think if I go and find myself racing that could be the wrong thing, and so I am open to suggestions as to run/not run these.
I would personally stick to your original HM training plan where cars randomly drive by throwing eggs at your feet to keep you on your toes. That seemed to work good for you. 5 -
Another n=1, but my chip times have always pretty much matched my Garmin and Garmin-fed Strava numbers.1
-
@mobycarp I was thinking 8:00 as 10k pace. I was thinking bike and elliptical trainer for cross training with swimming on days I can. Yesterday when I did the intervals it did make perfect sense to me to warm up with about 2 miles and cool down with 2 miles. It was a good enough pace yesterday that I was sucking big time by my last interval and less with the first two. The First Plan definitely has a higher goal outcome, if done with the pace they require. I am first and foremost looking to finish my first marathon, I think a sub four hour result is realistic and a 3hour and 30 minute result would mean I trained perfectly and raced perfectly.(Not the likely scenario but it's always good to have a dream.) If I am still thinking about another marathon after October.(I may be cured of that mentality by then but we know that's not going to happen) I will have enough additional input as to who I am and how I run to choose a plan better for me. For now I am taking in all this advice and sticking mainly to this plan. Thanks you are all terrific!!! Having input from all of you gives me confidence in moving forward.0
-
4.2 treadmill miles yesterday, which brings my total to 96. Rest day today, which means tomorrow's run needs to be at least 4 miles. Easy peasy.
Looking forward to the posting of the July challenge!4
Categories
- All Categories
- 1.4M Health, Wellness and Goals
- 391.4K Introduce Yourself
- 43.5K Getting Started
- 259.7K Health and Weight Loss
- 175.6K Food and Nutrition
- 47.3K Recipes
- 232.3K Fitness and Exercise
- 390 Sleep, Mindfulness and Overall Wellness
- 6.4K Goal: Maintaining Weight
- 8.5K Goal: Gaining Weight and Body Building
- 152.7K Motivation and Support
- 7.8K Challenges
- 1.3K Debate Club
- 96.3K Chit-Chat
- 2.5K Fun and Games
- 3.2K MyFitnessPal Information
- 22 News and Announcements
- 922 Feature Suggestions and Ideas
- 2.3K MyFitnessPal Tech Support Questions