WANTED: Opinions on vegetarian/vegan diet

chokhas

kimny72 wrote: »

I've never seen any unbiased evidence that a vegetarian diet is inherently healthier than an omnivore's, though I do think many people would be healthier if they ate more veggies and fiber and less meat and cheese.

this is what I struggle with too. I think its fine if you want to be vegetarian or vegan but I really doubt the health benefits. we have a lot of vegetarians in the family and they are born vegetarians and do not eat egg. most of them have the same issues like diabetes high blood pressure and cholesterol. just looking at my family example I do not believe that eating vegetarian is the cure. I do agree though that we should eat more fruits and vegetables and not only protein and carb.

StealthHealth

janejellyroll wrote: »

dancefit2015 wrote: »

To everyone who has said they don't like these kinds of documentaries, can you please explain? This one it seemed that every statement made either came out of the mouth of a doctor or another highly qualified individual, or from the context of a scientific journal that was written based off of studies. Please don't just say it's wrong because you eat meat everyday and have perfect health... I would never bet my health on a study that involved one person. So what do you think is true about meat and health? Why? What are your sources? Evidence? Give me something real.

Here is what we know is true from broad population evidence: the "blue zones," where people live longest, include populations that eat meat, dairy, and eggs. This makes it unlikely that these foods -- in and of themselves -- are harmful to people instead of it being some other factor. (There is one "blue zone" in Loma Linda, California that includes many vegetarians and vegans, which means that these foods probably aren't *required* for a long and healthy life either).

These documentaries tend to cherry-pick facts or make extrapolations that aren't supported by the studies they are citing.

They hurt veganism when people dig into the claims and find how shallow most of them are. This plants the impression that vegans are deceptive and it also dilutes the message of veganism, which is is about animal exploitation. Many of these documentaries promote additional restrictions on top of veganism (like no oil, no processed food, no sugar, etc), setting people up for failure or potential health problems from over-restriction.

What is true about meat and health? I don't think we know yet. We know that people (not just one person, but big populations of people) can live long and healthy lives while eating meat. I think it's certainly possible that too much meat could be harmful, but that's very different than what these films claim. From looking at general populations, it seems undeniable that there are healthy diet patterns that can include meat (or, if people prefer, healthy diet patterns that can leave it out -- it works both ways).

I often love @janejellyroll 's posts - this is a perfect example of why.

janejellyroll

dancefit2015 wrote: »

janejellyroll wrote: »

orangegato wrote: »

her calories were high. Don't think macros were looked at.....

It could be not getting enough lysine. It's an essential amino acid, a type of protein. Vegans who don't eat legumes often don't get enough of it. Someone could be getting enough protein on paper, but still be short in a specific amino acid and this could cause issues. For vegans who eat a well-rounded diet including sources of lysine, it's not something to worry about (I track all my amino acids because I'm a nerd and I've never had a day where I haven't met the need). But it's possible for other vegans to fall short in it. Lysine is needed to metabolize iron and zinc, so not getting enough can lead to additional issues.

How do you track your amino acids?

Cronometer.com will track them for you if you log your food there. It's also a good way to check up on other nutrients that may be of concern for vegans (iodine, vitamin D, vitamin B12, etc).

janejellyroll

StealthHealth wrote: »

janejellyroll wrote: »

dancefit2015 wrote: »

To everyone who has said they don't like these kinds of documentaries, can you please explain? This one it seemed that every statement made either came out of the mouth of a doctor or another highly qualified individual, or from the context of a scientific journal that was written based off of studies. Please don't just say it's wrong because you eat meat everyday and have perfect health... I would never bet my health on a study that involved one person. So what do you think is true about meat and health? Why? What are your sources? Evidence? Give me something real.

Here is what we know is true from broad population evidence: the "blue zones," where people live longest, include populations that eat meat, dairy, and eggs. This makes it unlikely that these foods -- in and of themselves -- are harmful to people instead of it being some other factor. (There is one "blue zone" in Loma Linda, California that includes many vegetarians and vegans, which means that these foods probably aren't *required* for a long and healthy life either).

These documentaries tend to cherry-pick facts or make extrapolations that aren't supported by the studies they are citing.

They hurt veganism when people dig into the claims and find how shallow most of them are. This plants the impression that vegans are deceptive and it also dilutes the message of veganism, which is is about animal exploitation. Many of these documentaries promote additional restrictions on top of veganism (like no oil, no processed food, no sugar, etc), setting people up for failure or potential health problems from over-restriction.

What is true about meat and health? I don't think we know yet. We know that people (not just one person, but big populations of people) can live long and healthy lives while eating meat. I think it's certainly possible that too much meat could be harmful, but that's very different than what these films claim. From looking at general populations, it seems undeniable that there are healthy diet patterns that can include meat (or, if people prefer, healthy diet patterns that can leave it out -- it works both ways).

I often love @janejellyroll 's posts - this is a perfect example of why.

Thank you, it always means a lot to me when people enjoy what I write.