Weird symptoms / Calorie Deficit
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It sounds a bit like what I'm experiencing when I'm crashing. With crashing I mean I get dizzy, tunnel vision, shivering, lightheaded, no concentration at all, look very pale according to others (well, I'm always pale, thus no idea if I am), huge appetite for anything sweet. And yes, this can lead to headaches, nausea and other unpleasantness. This usually happens if my second breakfast or lunch, or any other meal is a bit later than usual, and especially if I have to walk a few steps or a staircase to get to my meal. Even when eating right away, I keep on feeling like this for hours. Blood sugars have been tested endlessly, I even checked my levels every 15 minutes before and during a crash. Nothing. All normal. The thing is though: if I do strength training I get no more crashes. Without, there are days where I cannot walk for an hour after a meal and not crash, with I can walk for 4.5 hours without eating and drinking anything. Running does nothing to improve things, but I am able to run longer when adding strength. My GP is puzzled but thinks it's might be a mitochondrial issue as those apparently spawn more siblings when doing strength training and based on how long it takes to be stable again, and how long the effect lasts after stopping training. Not sure what to think about this.
But anyway, I also think the TO is eating far too little. Basically, it's possible to feel the same if one undereats severely. And he still has not answered the question properly. Sounds almost like he might benefit from talking to a therapist on eating disordes, based on how evasive he is.3 -
1). Thank you everyone for your responses, and your desire to help- ( and to have more info!!) I explained previously within this thread, that I had consumed 1200 calories yesterday when I created the post. (And for those of you curious- I weigh and measure my food. I know how many calories I consumed yesterday, and any other time that I have monitor my caloric intake). I consumed just under 1900 calories by end-of-day yesterday.
2). But the problem didn't appear yesterday!!!!
I have had this problem for over five years. I have been to the MD about it multiple times. My question wasn't about calories- it was about specific symptoms.
Yes, I understand that some of these symptoms that I listed on my original post- as mentioned in others' comments- are, indeed, extreme stress responses ( particularly the tension within my neck/jaw/throat/scalp).
3). Basically- I can eat within an intensely narrow caloric range, which changes from day to day without notice. If I step outside of that range I am either gaining weight- or "crashing". ANY kind of caloric deficit will cause the symptoms outlined in my original post. ANY time that I push my body to out of it's comfort zone. This happens even when I'm not hungry ( so I can't rely upon indicators from my body about when to eat)...potentially ON A DAILY BASIS. My system is intolerant and behaves erratically, and exercise only makes it worse! ( particularly intense exercise).
So, I think what I need to do is to take some of the ainsights that I have received, and: (1 ) Get really transparent about exactly what I am eating (2) and eat closer to my "maintenance" calories ( like maybe -500 kcal) (3) and stick with relatively low to medium intensity exercise.( ugh- boring)
And, THANK YOU everyone for your advise and comments - and personal stories!! This has been tremendously cool !
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amusedmonkey wrote: »Have you ever had a panic attack or anxiety attack before? If it's not hypoglycemia or blood pressure issues the symptoms remind me of an anxiety attack or stress response. Anxiety attacks can manifest in physical ways without the feeling of "panic" and have a tendency of gradually ramping up. The kind of headache you described is a dead giveaway and is usually caused by stress induced tension in the neck muscles, and the I get that kind of pressure in the lungs and the feeling like I can't take in enough oxygen when I have anxiety attacks because I unconsciously tense my diaphragm when working on a stressful project. You are restricting too much, both calorie and food-wise. Eating so low, eating too much of the things that make you feel bloated and uncomfortable...etc. Why are you deliberately torturing yourself when you can just... eat food. Your normal food with some tweaks at a reasonable deficit and no crazy stressful restrictions.
I'm quite sure that stress in general might have something to do with it...
And you're absolutely right in your last two sentences.... I just find it really boring, like drudgery. I too, am a "project" focused person. I really get into the cycles of starting a project, conquering the challenge, and then feeling rewarded at the end- and being independent. However it's not something that lends its self to consistency. I also work for myself. I'm not into showing up at someone else's office at at the same time every day, having the routine obligatory conversations, conforming to their work patterns, etc.
BUT- what's good about this forum is that people here concentrate upon results: What was your behavior, and what was the result? And that's good for me right now.0 -
1200 calories is extremely low.
I'm 175 pounds at 6 feet tall, and i'm eating roughly 1900 calories in a cut. And I exercise moderately (heavy lifting and soft cardio).0 -
jugsosa2333 wrote: »1200 calories is extremely low.
I'm 175 pounds at 6 feet tall, and i'm eating roughly 1900 calories in a cut. And I exercise moderately (heavy lifting and soft cardio).
He is eating 1900 calories. But that's still a little low for him.0 -
For reference, I'm 6'1" 200 pounds and my maintenance calories before exercise are about 2600-2700. Your maintenance calories should be similar if not higher at a weight of 280 pounds. You're eating way too little. Safe weight loss for you (2 pounds per week) would probably be closer to 2000 calories a day.
The fact that you're eating clean doesn't matter, you're simply eating too few calories per day and your body is running short on fuel. In fact, you're probably doing yourself a disservice by eating clean because your body isn't getting all of the different materials it actually needs in the few calories you're consuming (including fats and oils).
Eat clean or don't eat clean. Doesn't matter. Just up your calories and the feeling will go away. Also, think about seeing a nutritionist to give you a healthy weight loss plan since it seems that you're having trouble figuring this out on your own.
The fact that you're not losing on what you think to be 2200 calories a day tells me that you are not logging completely and/or accurately. You're either not logging everything you eat every day and/or aren't calculating the caloric value of the food you are eating accurately.
As requested above, one thing that might help to point us in the right direction is to show us a sample of your daily eating. When you say 1200 calories, what foods (and how much) did you actually eat?
I'm curious, how do you know that your maintenance calories - "before exercise"- are exactly 2600-2700? Is that something that you have calculated from experience ( measuring your caloric intake / body mass over time), or is that something I could get from a generic "calculator".0 -
Ready2Getcut wrote: »amusedmonkey wrote: »Have you ever had a panic attack or anxiety attack before? If it's not hypoglycemia or blood pressure issues the symptoms remind me of an anxiety attack or stress response. Anxiety attacks can manifest in physical ways without the feeling of "panic" and have a tendency of gradually ramping up. The kind of headache you described is a dead giveaway and is usually caused by stress induced tension in the neck muscles, and the I get that kind of pressure in the lungs and the feeling like I can't take in enough oxygen when I have anxiety attacks because I unconsciously tense my diaphragm when working on a stressful project. You are restricting too much, both calorie and food-wise. Eating so low, eating too much of the things that make you feel bloated and uncomfortable...etc. Why are you deliberately torturing yourself when you can just... eat food. Your normal food with some tweaks at a reasonable deficit and no crazy stressful restrictions.
I'm quite sure that stress in general might have something to do with it...
And you're absolutely right in your last two sentences.... I just find it really boring, like drudgery. I too, am a "project" focused person. I really get into the cycles of starting a project, conquering the challenge, and then feeling rewarded at the end- and being independent. However it's not something that lends its self to consistency. I also work for myself. I'm not into showing up at someone else's office at at the same time every day, having the routine obligatory conversations, conforming to their work patterns, etc.
BUT- what's good about this forum is that people here concentrate upon results: What was your behavior, and what was the result? And that's good for me right now.
I get being project oriented. I work for myself too. But what you need to realize is that the way you eat is not a project, it's life. If it's boring to do it sustainably now, would it also be boring to maintain once you hit your goal weight? It's highly possible that it would be the case if you keep the same mindset and all of your work will go down the drain (or worse, you will wear yourself out sick jumping from one restrictive diet to another). A workaround would be to set habit building projects instead of specific diet related projects, while watching your weight and calories on the side. Discovered a new way of eating socially while still being within your calories? SCORE! Was able to have just one piece of cake with the least amount of stress more than once? SCORE! Discovered an activity you enjoy doing? SCORE! Was able to consistently manage your stress? SCORE!...and so on. Let the eating part be just that, eating. An activity that is enjoyable and nourishing. We all have our quirks, but when they stand in the way of our success something needs to be done about them.5 -
Have you tried googling 'gluten sensitivity'? I have a coworker with a similar story.8
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Here is a calculator. Just enter your info and it will tell you what you need to maintain, lose or gain based upon level of activity:
http://www.calculator.net/calorie-calculator.html0 -
amusedmonkey wrote: »
I get being project oriented. I work for myself too. But what you need to realize is that the way you eat is not a project, it's life. If it's boring to do it sustainably now, would it also be boring to maintain once you hit your goal weight? It's highly possible that it would be the case if you keep the same mindset and all of your work will go down the drain (or worse, you will wear yourself out sick jumping from one restrictive diet to another). A workaround would be to set habit building projects instead of specific diet related projects, while watching your weight and calories on the side. Discovered a new way of eating socially while still being within your calories? SCORE! Was able to have just one piece of cake with the least amount of stress more than once? SCORE! Discovered an activity you enjoy doing? SCORE! Was able to consistently manage your stress? SCORE!...and so on. Let the eating part be just that, eating. An activity that is enjoyable and nourishing. We all have our quirks, but when they stand in the way of our success something needs to be done about them.
I'm really trying to understand what you're saying. I know that there is some wisdom in what you've written, simply because I keep injuring myself at the gym- over and over. And then I lose all of my progress...
I don't know how to manage the "boredom" tho- I think that I need to connect with doing something I really, really like. The problem is that when you've had a relatively pragmatic lifestyle for numerous years, and maybe you've had some stress in your life, etc - it is really tough to connect with "what nourishes you".
I'll think more about what "habit building" could mean. Thanks for your comments0 -
Ready2Getcut wrote: »
So, you are never really answering the plain question. How many calories are you eating per day and how long have you been eating that much? It's been asked multiple times but you keep talking about what you did in the past and that you are eating whole foods. That is not the question. How many calorie per day over the last 2 weeks? Plain and simple. Or open your diary so people can look for themselves.
How do I "open my food diary"?0 -
Ready2Getcut wrote: »amusedmonkey wrote: »
I get being project oriented. I work for myself too. But what you need to realize is that the way you eat is not a project, it's life. If it's boring to do it sustainably now, would it also be boring to maintain once you hit your goal weight? It's highly possible that it would be the case if you keep the same mindset and all of your work will go down the drain (or worse, you will wear yourself out sick jumping from one restrictive diet to another). A workaround would be to set habit building projects instead of specific diet related projects, while watching your weight and calories on the side. Discovered a new way of eating socially while still being within your calories? SCORE! Was able to have just one piece of cake with the least amount of stress more than once? SCORE! Discovered an activity you enjoy doing? SCORE! Was able to consistently manage your stress? SCORE!...and so on. Let the eating part be just that, eating. An activity that is enjoyable and nourishing. We all have our quirks, but when they stand in the way of our success something needs to be done about them.
I'm really trying to understand what you're saying. I know that there is some wisdom in what you've written, simply because I keep injuring myself at the gym- over and over. And then I lose all of my progress...
I don't know how to manage the "boredom" tho- I think that I need to connect with doing something I really, really like. The problem is that when you've had a relatively pragmatic lifestyle for numerous years, and maybe you've had some stress in your life, etc - it is really tough to connect with "what nourishes you".
I'll think more about what "habit building" could mean. Thanks for your comments
Ask yourself - during your 2200 paleo diet where you went overboard during weekends, what did you eat then? Was it pizza, hotdogs, burgers, chips, cinnamon buns, brownies, steak and cheese sub...? Then take that food, make it homemade or buy it already made and add it to your weekly meals. The difference is not eating a full pizza and huge bag of chips. It's having 2 slices for dinner Wednesday and Friday with 2 cups of chips on each of those meals. If you do that every week, you will stop wanting to binge on crappy food because it will be a part of your daily life and still allow you to be within your calories.
I've done the strict veggy protein diet before and have a strong will so I've always been successful... but I also lived with my mom - a women who also ate clean food. I moved in with my fiancé, had a baby and need to lose weight... but they don't!!.. So do I make my life a living hell trying to avoid everything, including pasta that they both love, while still cooking that stuff for them and then binging when I can't deal anymore?... Nope. We have pizza night every week, I make burgers and fries one in a while and I eat a cookie every day with my 1 year old who also has a cookie for desert. And I am so satisfied and within my 1600 calories.
For activities... you will have to find that out yourself. Will it be hiking, or will you end up enjoying the gym. I know soooo many men injuring themselves because they try too hard, and get back to weight gain. Doesn't seem sustainable AT ALL.1 -
Ready2Getcut wrote: »Ready2Getcut wrote: »
So, you are never really answering the plain question. How many calories are you eating per day and how long have you been eating that much? It's been asked multiple times but you keep talking about what you did in the past and that you are eating whole foods. That is not the question. How many calorie per day over the last 2 weeks? Plain and simple. Or open your diary so people can look for themselves.
How do I "open my food diary"?
Somewhere in the privacy settings I think.0 -
Ready2Getcut wrote: »amusedmonkey wrote: »
I get being project oriented. I work for myself too. But what you need to realize is that the way you eat is not a project, it's life. If it's boring to do it sustainably now, would it also be boring to maintain once you hit your goal weight? It's highly possible that it would be the case if you keep the same mindset and all of your work will go down the drain (or worse, you will wear yourself out sick jumping from one restrictive diet to another). A workaround would be to set habit building projects instead of specific diet related projects, while watching your weight and calories on the side. Discovered a new way of eating socially while still being within your calories? SCORE! Was able to have just one piece of cake with the least amount of stress more than once? SCORE! Discovered an activity you enjoy doing? SCORE! Was able to consistently manage your stress? SCORE!...and so on. Let the eating part be just that, eating. An activity that is enjoyable and nourishing. We all have our quirks, but when they stand in the way of our success something needs to be done about them.
I'm really trying to understand what you're saying. I know that there is some wisdom in what you've written, simply because I keep injuring myself at the gym- over and over. And then I lose all of my progress...
I don't know how to manage the "boredom" tho- I think that I need to connect with doing something I really, really like. The problem is that when you've had a relatively pragmatic lifestyle for numerous years, and maybe you've had some stress in your life, etc - it is really tough to connect with "what nourishes you".
I'll think more about what "habit building" could mean. Thanks for your comments
Ask yourself - during your 2200 paleo diet where you went overboard during weekends, what did you eat then? Was it pizza, hotdogs, burgers, chips, cinnamon buns, brownies, steak and cheese sub...? Then take that food, make it homemade or buy it already made and add it to your weekly meals. The difference is not eating a full pizza and huge bag of chips. It's having 2 slices for dinner Wednesday and Friday with 2 cups of chips on each of those meals. If you do that every week, you will stop wanting to binge on crappy food because it will be a part of your daily life and still allow you to be within your calories.
I've done the strict veggy protein diet before and have a strong will so I've always been successful... but I also lived with my mom - a women who also ate clean food. I moved in with my fiancé, had a baby and need to lose weight... but they don't!!.. So do I make my life a living hell trying to avoid everything, including pasta that they both love, while still cooking that stuff for them and then binging when I can't deal anymore?... Nope. We have pizza night every week, I make burgers and fries one in a while and I eat a cookie every day with my 1 year old who also has a cookie for desert. And I am so satisfied and within my 1600 calories.
For activities... you will have to find that out yourself. Will it be hiking, or will you end up enjoying the gym. I know soooo many men injuring themselves because they try too hard, and get back to weight gain. Doesn't seem sustainable AT ALL.
Excellent points! And thank you. I do hike! It's one of my favorite things, but I don't do it enough. I live very close to a large lake and also walk next to the water regularly- it's grassy/uneven and I try to keep a strong pace. I end up sweating pretty good. You're right about injuries....when you're in your 40's and you feel pain, STOP. lol
I hear what you're saying. I have often wondered what Mom's do- how they handle it. Kids need constant attention and they aren't eating quinoa, asparagus, and walnuts. A fair number of husbands eat like kids....My last GF's diet was wine, cigarettes, and lattes, so I got a little taste of what that's like.
To answer your question: Usually, it was either Friday or Saturday night- I would have 5-6 Pints of Miller Lite ( cause you know- 94 calories).... and some kind of protein-centric bar food ( like "wings"). Then usually the next day i would have 1-2 donut/pastries with a sweetened coffee drink, and then maybe a huge burrito with cheese/sour cream.. you get the idea.
But you're right. There's has been nothing sustainable about my approach in the past- even though that's what I have tried to focus upon! ( believe it or not). The other thing that adds complexity is that I plan to eventually eliminate animal products from my diet. Just a personal thing.
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fiddletime wrote: »I'm 62, 130# and 5'2". I eat 1200 cal a day to lose. There is just no way that you could be healthy at 1200 calories. Like others have said, you need to count all of your calories accurately every single day to start to get a feel for what your body needs to lose or to maintain. I haven't read yet in any of your posts that your have done that "legwork" of accurate logging for many months at a time.
Thank you for your comments. I actually have previously, for about a 6 month continuous period of time- but not on this site.1 -
Ready2Getcut wrote: »amusedmonkey wrote: »
I get being project oriented. I work for myself too. But what you need to realize is that the way you eat is not a project, it's life. If it's boring to do it sustainably now, would it also be boring to maintain once you hit your goal weight? It's highly possible that it would be the case if you keep the same mindset and all of your work will go down the drain (or worse, you will wear yourself out sick jumping from one restrictive diet to another). A workaround would be to set habit building projects instead of specific diet related projects, while watching your weight and calories on the side. Discovered a new way of eating socially while still being within your calories? SCORE! Was able to have just one piece of cake with the least amount of stress more than once? SCORE! Discovered an activity you enjoy doing? SCORE! Was able to consistently manage your stress? SCORE!...and so on. Let the eating part be just that, eating. An activity that is enjoyable and nourishing. We all have our quirks, but when they stand in the way of our success something needs to be done about them.
I'm really trying to understand what you're saying. I know that there is some wisdom in what you've written, simply because I keep injuring myself at the gym- over and over. And then I lose all of my progress...
I don't know how to manage the "boredom" tho- I think that I need to connect with doing something I really, really like. The problem is that when you've had a relatively pragmatic lifestyle for numerous years, and maybe you've had some stress in your life, etc - it is really tough to connect with "what nourishes you".
I'll think more about what "habit building" could mean. Thanks for your comments
Ask yourself - during your 2200 paleo diet where you went overboard during weekends, what did you eat then? Was it pizza, hotdogs, burgers, chips, cinnamon buns, brownies, steak and cheese sub...? Then take that food, make it homemade or buy it already made and add it to your weekly meals. The difference is not eating a full pizza and huge bag of chips. It's having 2 slices for dinner Wednesday and Friday with 2 cups of chips on each of those meals. If you do that every week, you will stop wanting to binge on crappy food because it will be a part of your daily life and still allow you to be within your calories.
I've done the strict veggy protein diet before and have a strong will so I've always been successful... but I also lived with my mom - a women who also ate clean food. I moved in with my fiancé, had a baby and need to lose weight... but they don't!!.. So do I make my life a living hell trying to avoid everything, including pasta that they both love, while still cooking that stuff for them and then binging when I can't deal anymore?... Nope. We have pizza night every week, I make burgers and fries one in a while and I eat a cookie every day with my 1 year old who also has a cookie for desert. And I am so satisfied and within my 1600 calories.
For activities... you will have to find that out yourself. Will it be hiking, or will you end up enjoying the gym. I know soooo many men injuring themselves because they try too hard, and get back to weight gain. Doesn't seem sustainable AT ALL.
I'm doing a cleanse right now, so I can't eat anything like pizza, etc, but I think you have a point worth implementing later.3 -
That's awesome that you can hike and walk in nature. Not everyone lives close enough to green land. Start making a goal of going once a week. Not just for exercise but psychologically. When you have kids, it's definitely much harder and they have early bedtimes and naps and want to play with toys.
500 calories of beer is still pretty good. If you go out, just keep it to 3 x 94 calories pints and 1 donut for breakfast with an egg (assuming you don't go vegan right away) instead of many pastries with no protein. Plus you can do that 3 times a week with no issues!
Burritos are surprisingly healthy if you like them. Try making some at home with a big 200 calorie tortillas some beans you refry yourself with tomato sauce and spices and no meat if you are going vegetarian (or canned refried beans) and a little bit of rice if you like it that way or replace the rice for stir fried veggies (peppers/onions). Add 1 ounce of cheese on it/in it and pop it in the oven. Have a salad beside it and make enough for 5 meals and place them in separate Tupperware to make sure you only eat 1. I make burritos all the time, my fiancé loves them and they are QUITE filling. And plain 0% greek yogurt is pretty much the same taste as sour cream and adds a bunch of protein
Try non-fried fish tacos if you like fish with light creamy cabbage slaw or replace with lentil patties if you go vegan! (my lunch today haha)
I have to say, I am the daughter of a cook so cooking comes easy to me BUT if you like to cook, simply learn to cook and stop eating boiled veggies and boiled chicken daily.
My sister and her husband are crazy dieters. They go chicken and salads every day for months and then have crazy week binges as they go on vacation and fall of the wagon and gain back their weight constantly. He definitely has a food addiction but hits the gym all the time. They both know they need to focus on eating all sorts of food in proper portions instead but still have not because he is out of control and also not want to be extremely thin since they both do not have small frames. And I feel bad for my sister as yoyo dieting ruins people.
You just have to tell yourself that you will try for 1 month and be true to your calories and cook the stuff yourself to be precise. Then see if you are happier and losing weight. Finding control is difficult if you have cookies in your cupboard but knowing you will have another tomorrow and the next day makes you feel NORMAL lol
BTW I'm currently at maintenance calories on most weekend days. I get to eat more for the million activities we have and still not gain weight but lose some. I log everything and try to stay to maintenance by having brunch then dinner... lunch isn't necessary if I'm not hungry from a big brunch.0 -
Ready2Getcut wrote: »Ready2Getcut wrote: »
So, you are never really answering the plain question. How many calories are you eating per day and how long have you been eating that much? It's been asked multiple times but you keep talking about what you did in the past and that you are eating whole foods. That is not the question. How many calorie per day over the last 2 weeks? Plain and simple. Or open your diary so people can look for themselves.
How do I "open my food diary"?
Click on "Settings" up top, then select "Diary Settings", scroll all the way to the bottom for "Dairy Sharing" and select Public, then Save.0 -
Ready2Getcut wrote: »amusedmonkey wrote: »
I get being project oriented. I work for myself too. But what you need to realize is that the way you eat is not a project, it's life. If it's boring to do it sustainably now, would it also be boring to maintain once you hit your goal weight? It's highly possible that it would be the case if you keep the same mindset and all of your work will go down the drain (or worse, you will wear yourself out sick jumping from one restrictive diet to another). A workaround would be to set habit building projects instead of specific diet related projects, while watching your weight and calories on the side. Discovered a new way of eating socially while still being within your calories? SCORE! Was able to have just one piece of cake with the least amount of stress more than once? SCORE! Discovered an activity you enjoy doing? SCORE! Was able to consistently manage your stress? SCORE!...and so on. Let the eating part be just that, eating. An activity that is enjoyable and nourishing. We all have our quirks, but when they stand in the way of our success something needs to be done about them.
I'm really trying to understand what you're saying. I know that there is some wisdom in what you've written, simply because I keep injuring myself at the gym- over and over. And then I lose all of my progress...
I don't know how to manage the "boredom" tho- I think that I need to connect with doing something I really, really like. The problem is that when you've had a relatively pragmatic lifestyle for numerous years, and maybe you've had some stress in your life, etc - it is really tough to connect with "what nourishes you".
I'll think more about what "habit building" could mean. Thanks for your comments
In short, what I mean is this: if normal eating is boring to you and you have this need to jump from one dieting gimmick to another, from Paleo, to low calorie, to low carb, to cleansing, to whatever else, how do you expect that to be sustainable? Why don't you just eat normally within a reasonable calorie deficit, boring as it may be, and consider it just like any other thing you do daily (like brushing your teeth) without all the dieting gimmicks and focus your energy on something else. Just let eating be eating, and not a life consuming improvement project.7 -
I used to have real problems with feeling nauseous and faint on the train home from work. Like, EVERY day.
Turned out I was just utterly failing to manage my blood sugar well, and the afternoon chocolate bar was NOT helping!
Things I figured out...
- 3 meals plus 2 snacks works for me
- my afternoon snack has to have decent amounts of protein
- I should only have really sugary things in total isolation if I'm being active enough to burn them off quickly, not sitting at my desk
- I should log my cheat days properly too, so I KNOW what the damage is!1
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