Losing fat and gaining muscle is possible...

Orphia

jseams1234 wrote: »

sijomial wrote: »

Psychgrrl wrote: »

noirelb wrote: »

giburns5388 wrote: »

For you hardcore guys that are in this for awhile please stop telling people its unlikely. It is highly unlikely for people like you who are near optimum. But for us beginners its really easy with diet and new to weight lifting.

Being overweight myself, I have to agree with you. I've seen the post of "you won't gain muscle mass on a deficit" so many times so I assumed it was right and exercised just for fat loss. Pre-pregnancy I had not biked in over 9 months and weight 210lbs or lower. My son is now 1 and I lost weight while being in quite a deficit and started biking again after stopping for over 2 years and started squats and my pre-pregnancy clothes almost all fit and my thighs are getting really hard. So I'm wondering if the opposite could be true?

You are losing body fat, so the muscles underneath are beginning to show. Building strength (increasing the efficiency of the muscles you have) is not the same as building additional muscle tissue. You can get stronger without building more muscle. And muscles need resistance training and recovery (in addition to adequate nutrition) to build additional lean mass. You're not going to do that on the treadmill.

Outside of minimal newbie gains, often for folks who are overweight, muscle is built with a calorie surplus, not a deficit. You can't build something out of nothing.

But that doesn't mean you won't have good results, and that you shouldn't keep on doing what you're doing that's working for you. Keep at it! It just doesn't mean what you think it means.

Regarding the bold....
In what world does calorie deficit equal nothing?

Someone eating at a small deficit can easily meet all their nutritional needs (including protein).
Which just leaves the small amount of energy to help build muscle - which can come from stored energy, not just from food intake.

...building muscle is the last thing your body uses stored fat for - it has other plans for that energy that typically involve keeping you alive. Building muscle is last on that priority list... which is why in a deficit it usually doesn't happen.

Deficit = not enough. Which is LESS than nothing in this context. Maintenance would be nothing - as in nothing extra but not having to resort to stored resources (fat) to provide fuel for necessary functions. Recomps tend to "work" at maintenance, albeit slowly, because the body can be convinced to use some of that stored energy to build a little bit of muscle because it doesn't need it for other functions higher on its list.

James Fell told me building muscle in a deficit is possible.

His general gist is that basically that you're still eating food, especially protein, which goes towards repairing micro-tears in muscles due to exercise, hence muscle gain.

He wasn't saying this was the way to bulk up like the Hulk. Just that muscles still grow a bit if you work them.

I know this from the size / hardness of my calf muscles while losing 80 lbs and running more and more.

heybales

giburns5388 wrote: »

goldthistime wrote: »

OP are you speaking from personal experience? If so, I can relate to an extent. I have absolutely made good strength gains in the gym in the beginning of starting a diet/exercise routine, and ultimately seen much more definition. But I would also agree that there is a limit while in a deficit.

Perhaps it is that "newbie gains" are underemphasized here. They made me pretty happy. Maybe the big improvements I saw in the mirror would be minor to someone who is doing bulk/cut cycles. Or maybe the changes I saw in the mirror had much more to do with losing the layer of fat on top than increasing muscle size.

At a certain point I plateaued in my strength training and the only times I seemed to make any progress were when I'd put on a little weight.

Yes I am. I went fron 43 to 35 inch waist in 2 months. Abd made significabt strebgth gains in all my lifts. When i plateau also my only course of action will be recomp. But I aint there yet.

Just to confirm - the strength gains on deadlift and squats are well above the loss of body weight?

I only ask because there have been several that have claimed muscle gains (and/or strength gains) while on a steep deficit, that never caught their math examples.

Best example I recall was squat went from 200 to 240 over the course of 3 months (13 weeks) - that's great for already lifting person doing that half time with cardio workouts.

And their steep deficit caused them to lose 50 lbs over that time.

But it never occurred to them that to truly break even on strength - they should have increased to 250.
They actually had lost strength - and likely muscle mass in their extreme deficit.

For someone newish to lifting - there should also be gains on the bar from form improvements, and better CNS involvement for total muscle use - so amount increase on bar should be better than what was lost. Person above was experienced though.

Anyway - just wanted to make sure you increased on those 2 lifts better than weight lost.