Low Carb Struggles

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  • Dani_Cali_Carolina
    Dani_Cali_Carolina Posts: 31 Member
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    psuLemon wrote: »
    [quote="
    How much protein, carbs and fiber are you eating (i might have missed that) and how many calories? Being that you have IR and have PCOS, low carb or Keto is going to be the more optimal diets for you. The specific carb range might need some tapering to see what is ideal for you.

    I usually get around 20 carbs a day, that's what my doctor suggested. Not sure about the rest - I'm not always able to log for super accurate results so I focus on carb count on the days I can't get to a computer.
  • kgeyser
    kgeyser Posts: 22,505 Member
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    Dani_Cali_Carolina wrote: »
    Okay, I haven't read all of the comments but the general theme seems to be eat more carbs. To answer some questions...I have PCOS and carbs are not my friend (weight wise and for medical reasons). I do have insulin resistance and high blood pressure but all of my other numbers (obviously excluding weight) are near perfect. I've tried eating within a calorie deficit while still eating carbs, glycemic index based diet, and weight watchers - all with limited to no success. This is the first diet change that actually works.

    Thanks for the advice, encouragement, and sharing your experiences! You've all been so kind and empathetic. I'll definitely finish reading the comments and make adjustments until my body acclimates. I hadn't really thought of the PCOS and low-carb lifestyle conflicting with each other - I'll do some research. This will be easier to handle now that I don't feel as if I've hit a dead end.

    PCOS and low-carbing do not necessarily conflict with each other, there are many women with PCOS who find it beneficial. Also people with insulin resistance. My recommendation would be to first examine how much you are eating (you never mentioned a calorie intake, which could cause some of the issues you mentioned), and to make sure you are getting enough sodium, which is needed for a low carb diet (and also could be causing some of those issues), if you are still considering a low carb diet. Also, remember there is a large range to a low carb diet (I believe up to 150g per day), and you might just need to find out what works for you as far as the ideal number.
  • GottaBurnEmAll
    GottaBurnEmAll Posts: 7,722 Member
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    Dani_Cali_Carolina wrote: »
    Okay, I haven't read all of the comments but the general theme seems to be eat more carbs. To answer some questions...I have PCOS and carbs are not my friend (weight wise and for medical reasons). I do have insulin resistance and high blood pressure but all of my other numbers (obviously excluding weight) are near perfect. I've tried eating within a calorie deficit while still eating carbs, glycemic index based diet, and weight watchers - all with limited to no success. This is the first diet change that actually works.

    Thanks for the advice, encouragement, and sharing your experiences! You've all been so kind and empathetic. I'll definitely finish reading the comments and make adjustments until my body acclimates. I hadn't really thought of the PCOS and low-carb lifestyle conflicting with each other - I'll do some research. This will be easier to handle now that I don't feel as if I've hit a dead end.

    How aggressive is your deficit?

    And to what degree are you cutting carbohydrates?

    There are women out there with PCOS who benefit without drastically cutting carbs.

    You might do well merely limiting the more starchy ones and loading up on vegetables and keeping your carbs to around 125-150 grams a day. This will allow for somewhat more substantial veggies like winter squashes, turnips, carrots and things like that while maybe giving you some more energy while still being considered low carb.

    There's also room in that amount for fruits like berries.
  • janejellyroll
    janejellyroll Posts: 25,763 Member
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    tammyd_white wrote: »
    janejellyroll wrote: »
    tammyd_white wrote: »
    Nony_Mouse wrote: »
    tammyd_white wrote: »
    quiksylver296 wrote: »
    tammyd_white wrote: »
    mph323 wrote: »
    Wynterbourne wrote: »
    tammyd_white wrote: »
    Dani_Cali_Carolina wrote: »
    I started a low-carb diet nearly 3 weeks ago. Weight loss has been steady but I'm struggling on several points. I'm early 30s, 5'6", 279 lbs, female.

    1. I never feel full or satisfied - always hungry no matter what/how often I eat.
    2. At what point will my digestive track acclimate? Every other day seems to bring a different gastrointestinal challenge.
    3. This has my lady organs all confused. My TOM nearly coincided with the start of this diet change and I've yet to stop spotting (both bright and dark colors). What is the deal?

    I've read that these results are normal for 3 or 4 days but I'm well pass that point.

    I drink plenty of water, 1 cup of herbal tea or decaf coffee per day, no alcohol, limited fruits/nuts/dairy/seeds. I'm hard core into the green leafies, eggs, and baked/broiled/grilled meats, shrimp, and fish. I cook with either butter or olive oil. I haven't added cardio though I have been doing small bouts of body weight exercises throughout the day.

    Has anyone else had similar issues? Any advice to help ease these effects? Maybe I'm doing something wrong...

    It looks like you've gotten tons of anti-low carb advice, and if you think abandoning that is appropriate for you, then so be it. But what I'm guessing it that you've tried many methods, Low Cal, Low Fat, etc. So here's another perspective. The calorie hypothesis was just that, a hypothesis (the whole 3500 cals per pound thing). It has actually been proven many times over that there is no correlation to the number of calories to weight loss. Look up Zoe Harcombe. She has run several studies on this and has amazing insight. Also, low fat has been proven many times over as harmful. Every one of our cells are coated in myelin which is primarily made of fats and our brains are over half fat. You have to add ESSENTIAL fat to your diet in order to have healthy cells and a healthy brain. (There are plenty of studies on PubMed about it, here's one to get you started.)

    So all that said, what is right then? Well, like anything else there is no one size fits all for anyone. You need to play with your diet until you are feeling satisfied AND getting the results you want. My first attempt at correcting persistent hunger would be to decrease protein and increase fat. Try starting your day with a bullet proof style coffee. Lots of good fats can really go a long way. There's a granola I like from Julian's Bakery that is Keto and Paleo friendly. Lots of fiber, but not lots of artificial ingredients. It's called ProGranola. I have it with unsweetened almond milk. It keeps me full for hours.

    And don't forget, too much protein will get converted into glucose through a process known as gluconeogenesis. So don't go overboard with meat. Eat lots of non-starchy veggies like salad greens, broccoli, asparagus, green beans, brussels sprouts, etc. They are filling, with lots of nutrients and not many digestible carbs. Eat them with a fat source in order to benefit from their fat soluble vitamins (A,D,E and K).

    Avoid processed foods, and those 'low carb' versions of foods like pastas and breads. Those are still wheat and usually cause people to have cravings and are left feeling unsatisfied. And lots of the low carb candies and shakes are also sometimes triggering for people and end up just causing more guts issues than they are worth.

    Hope that helps. Good luck with your journey.

    Umm. No, a calorie deficit absolutely has not been proven many times over to be incorrect for weight loss. Please give us links to a couple of these many many peer-reviewed studies proving weight loss is not related to a specific reduction in calories.

    By the way. I lost 130lbs just counting calories. And if I look back at my numbers they average between 50-60% carbs. Granted, that high a carb percentage doesn't work for everyone, but it can work for some. And the calorie counting absolutely positively did work the way it should have.

    Unicorn sighting! :D

    Really, this is the ground truth. There are no repeatable, peer-reviewed studies that show that a calorie deficit doesn't result in fat loss. When people refer to studies that "prove" things that contradict solid scientific conclusions, they are following links in articles and blogs that lead to sites that are either web pages for "Doctors" selling diet woo, or one-off poorly designed experiments that prove only that the people involved have no idea what they're doing.

    As a side note, it's unfortunate that an advanced degree doesn't automatically result in even a minimum of ethical integrity. "Doctors" who use their title to scam the public to make themselves rich are despicable. Not only do they suck money from desperate people, they cause many who can't afford the price of the woo to live in fear of what they may be doing to their bodies by not "detoxing" or drinking the expensive teas and shakes.

    No, there's no study showing the the 3500 calories per pound is accurate. In fact, every study ever done based on that hypothesis, has proved themselves to be inaccurate. Look for even one. One that shows the correct correlation to X calorie deficit to pounds. Yes, reducing your intake will cause weight loss, but the 3500 calorie per pound is not true.

    So what? What if it's 3167? CICO still applies.

    The problem is, if it's off, then the whole thing is wrong. Meaning if it was 3167 and removed 500/day- you should lose faster. But that's not what happens. I personally used to have a 1,000+ calorie deficit between diet and exercise EVERY day. I ate only 1200 calories, which is the minimum I should be eating. I felt fine, not tired or run down, so it wasn't over doing it with the deficit/working out. But on a GOOD week, I lost maybe 2 pounds. And most of the time it was more like 1, maybe. But I ran 3 miles 4 days per week, ran 6 miles 1 day per week, and weight trained 4 days per week (the 3 mile days were two a days) and only ate 1200 calories per day. How does that formula work? Even if it's 4,000 per pound? 5,000 per pound? Would have to be more than 7,000 per pound to work for me, but I also know plenty of people who give up 1 soda a day (~300 calories), change nothing else, and lose several pounds a week....How does that work?

    https://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat-loss/why-big-caloric-deficits-and-lots-of-activity-can-hurt-fat-loss.html/

    I definitely know you can stall your metabolism, but the reason I got to where I was, was due to lack of results. I started with a much smaller deficit and over time increased it to see even the 1 pound per week. Now that I'm fat adapted, I eat at least twice the calories, exercise half as much and lost 20 pounds in just a few weeks. And now I'm smaller than I was when I counted calories and I'm never deprived. So I didn't wreck my metabolism.

    But as I've stated, there is no one size fits all approach. Low carb feels better for some, Low cal feels better for others, and others like Keto. Honestly, I think the worst thing we do to ourselves is eating a ton of processed foods. There are plenty of people that eat Paleo (real paleo, not bacon at every meal paleo) - fresh fruits and veggies and moderate, grass fed meats- no dairy, grains or processed foods, and they naturally lose and maintain. They don't keep track of any of this.

    If people on Paleo naturally lose and maintain, does this mean the diet isn't appropriate for young people (who need to grow) and those who wish to add body mass (like muscle)?

    By "naturally lose and maintain," it sounds like you're saying the number of calories on this diet are irrelevant. If this is the case, how does your body know when to stop losing and start maintaining?

    If I'm misunderstanding you, I apologize.

    The idea behind eating 'Paleo' is about eating whole, real, minimally processed foods. So yes, I think anyone could safely eat that way. As far as growing kids, they eat more when they are hungry and growing. They eat less when they are not. If they are equipped with eating a real food diet. It's the sugary, processed junk that throws kids off.

    Our bodies are awesome if we listen to them. When you are eating in a way that is appropriate for your body, you naturally eat what you need. There is no need for your body to know when to stop losing and when to start maintaining. Your body will find its equilibrium if you let it.

    So children will just naturally eat more when they're hungry, but what about adults who want to add weight? If the Paleo diet just automatically puts your body at an equilibrium, are you arguing that the diet itself knows when an adult wants to lose or add weight and adjusts your appetite accordingly?

    Is the argument that everyone who is doing Paleo has somehow obtained the ideal weight for their body and if they haven't, it's a sign they aren't doing it right?
  • lemurcat12
    lemurcat12 Posts: 30,886 Member
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    Dani_Cali_Carolina wrote: »
    psuLemon wrote: »
    [quote="
    How much protein, carbs and fiber are you eating (i might have missed that) and how many calories? Being that you have IR and have PCOS, low carb or Keto is going to be the more optimal diets for you. The specific carb range might need some tapering to see what is ideal for you.

    I usually get around 20 carbs a day, that's what my doctor suggested. Not sure about the rest - I'm not always able to log for super accurate results so I focus on carb count on the days I can't get to a computer.

    You might find that low carbing is beneficial but you don't need to be so low. I did around 100 g for a while and then 100-120 g and found that really comfortable. When I dropped it to around 35 net g (which is ketosis for me), it was fine, I never had any problems with it, but there were no noticeable benefits justifying the (for me) restriction on things like fruit.

    Disclaimer, I am not IR, but lots of people here who are IR, T2D, and/or PCOS do well on diets other than keto.

    Since you do feel hungry and are having some issues, and since 20 g is really super, duper low (I could not get in the vegetables I feel are important on that, if I included also some nuts (which are healthy), dairy, so on -- I almost always eat more than 20 g carbs in just veg), I'd suggest maybe trying somewhat more carbs (NOT dumping low carb entirely), making sure they are nutrient and/or fiber rich carbs (more of a variety of veg, fruit, legumes, nuts, whole grains, whole foods like tubers in moderate servings -- of course you will still be limited in amounts to some degree), and -- important -- watching calories a bit more strictly.

    It's common to dump water when switching to super low carb (or any low carb or calorie deficit diet, but especially a super low carb diet), and that can both explain a significant immediate weight loss and some of the bad feelings, as you also lose electrolytes and can get out of whack. Adding back in some salt and making sure veg are included in good amounts (potassium) can help, but that would not explain the hunger.

    Another thing, not knowing your prior diet, it's possible you have increased veg and fiber (which always seems weird since veg are carbs, but many weren't eating adequate veg BEFORE going low carb so increase them). That can be a stomach issue at first until you adjust (if this could be part of it I would not immediately increase foods with fiber).

    Just some thoughts. You could also ask for a referral to a registered dietitian.

    The low carb group is good too (it was linked above), but there you won't have the experiences like amusedmonkey's, from those who have tried other things and been successful. I'd read there, but here too.
  • Nony_Mouse
    Nony_Mouse Posts: 5,646 Member
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    GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »
    Dani_Cali_Carolina wrote: »
    Okay, I haven't read all of the comments but the general theme seems to be eat more carbs. To answer some questions...I have PCOS and carbs are not my friend (weight wise and for medical reasons). I do have insulin resistance and high blood pressure but all of my other numbers (obviously excluding weight) are near perfect. I've tried eating within a calorie deficit while still eating carbs, glycemic index based diet, and weight watchers - all with limited to no success. This is the first diet change that actually works.

    Thanks for the advice, encouragement, and sharing your experiences! You've all been so kind and empathetic. I'll definitely finish reading the comments and make adjustments until my body acclimates. I hadn't really thought of the PCOS and low-carb lifestyle conflicting with each other - I'll do some research. This will be easier to handle now that I don't feel as if I've hit a dead end.

    How aggressive is your deficit?

    And to what degree are you cutting carbohydrates?

    There are women out there with PCOS who benefit without drastically cutting carbs.

    You might do well merely limiting the more starchy ones and loading up on vegetables and keeping your carbs to around 125-150 grams a day. This will allow for somewhat more substantial veggies like winter squashes, turnips, carrots and things like that while maybe giving you some more energy while still being considered low carb.

    There's also room in that amount for fruits like berries.

    This resembles me, although I'm still highly dubious about that PCOS diagnosis of mine (other than when an exploding cyst tries to kill me). Anyhoo, when I am overweight, even mildly, I definitely have some IR going on. I was fine losing on around ~100g of carbs a day. Now that I'm at a healthy weight, I can eat all the carbs with glee and abandon (within my calorie goal :tongue: ). When I'm at a deficit, particularly if not very active, I will still tend towards lower carb, but that's purely because I place more importance on protein and fats, so carbs is just what's left over once those goals are met. At maintenance, lots more room for carbs, so carbs are consequently higher.
  • ryansmama04
    ryansmama04 Posts: 15 Member
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    Look into Keto not just low carb! I've steadily lost weight and I'm at 13 pounds lost at 4 weeks. I feel like I eat quite a bit. I do miss the super sweet food and need to start experimenting with recipes. Good luck
  • psuLemon
    psuLemon Posts: 38,395 MFP Moderator
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    ryansmama04 wrote: »
    Look into Keto not just low carb! I've steadily lost weight and I'm at 13 pounds lost at 4 weeks. I feel like I eat quite a bit. I do miss the super sweet food and need to start experimenting with recipes. Good luck

    The OP is keto (~20g of carbs) and is starving. It's quite possible that is too aggressive for her and would do much better on a lower carb diet as opposed to keto.

    OP, how many calories are you eating anyways?

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