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Do diets work?

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Replies

  • CharlieBeansmomTracey
    CharlieBeansmomTracey Posts: 7,682 Member
    ugofatcat wrote: »
    WinoGelato wrote: »
    lemurcat12 wrote: »

    are you asking me to provide with peer reviewed dietary analysis that a bacon western cheeseburger is less healthy than a chicken breast with balsamic salad?

    No, people are asking specifically about the context of the overall diet. We are not asking you to compare two specific meals.

    We're asking why the person who meets their nutritional needs with a variety of foods including a bacon cheeseburger is better off than the person who is meeting their nutritional needs while excluding bacon cheeseburgers (and, presumably, their components -- beef, bacon, cheese, and bread).

    Foods don't exist in a vacuum, they exist in the context of an overall diet. That is what people are asking you about.

    Although, a bacon cheeseburger is probably more balanced than a balsamic vinegar salad with chicken breast.

    nah
    2 meats and nitrates - lettuce onion ring and BBq sauce (sugar) vs. Chicken breast peppers - still lettuce - tomatos - cucumbers - hard boiled eggs vinegar AND 1/2 the calories

    Why are two meats worse than one meat?

    What on earth is wrong with lettuce and onion rings?

    I was combining them as there is not real nutritional benefit difference between the 2 - What on earth is wrong with lettuce and onion rings? - nothing - I just like my onion sauteed not breaded

    Breaded?? That's also a crime against humanity. Onions should be raw. especially on a bacon cheeseburger.

    I'll gladly take up to 1/3 of a large onion on my Cheeseburger.

    I think this conversation is giving us insight into the kind of burger Irishman1970 likes (BBQ sauce, breaded onion rings on it). Interesting that he assumes that's the kind of burger everyone else wants.

    Not, of course, that it couldn't fit into a reasonable diet on occasion if it was what someone enjoyed.

    Eating tons of chicken breast daily seems to me more of an issue (lack of variety) than occasionally having a bacon cheeseburger.

    I also don't get how someone who seems to think fat and carbs are bad gets to 4000+ calories. It can't all be lemon chicken breast and salad with vinegar.

    I can't imagine trying to hit 4000 calories on salad and lean meat. I'd feel like a stuffed pig the entire time so working out would be impossible, I'd barf.

    But also I learned something. Fitness is about what you eat. So step away from the equipment people, what you need is salad and grilled chicken. Quick, let the Olympics committee know everyone is wasting their time, they just need to step away from the pizza!

    "So step away from the equipment people" you go ahead and do that - I will keep training 2 a days

    Only 2 a days? Why not 3? Why not 4? Wouldn’t working out more be better?

    You mentioned going out with friends, why? Shouldn’t you be working out? Optimizing your lean mean fuel burning machine?

    Do you have a financial budget? Save, spend on essentials, spend on discretionary items? Why the discretionary items? Why not just save everything that isn’t needed for your basic life requirements? Wouldn’t that be better? More financially “fit”?

    And yes I realize I still have about 10 pages to go and this thread has likely taken many turns since this post but this always strikes me when posters say we should always be striving for optimal nutrition... but doesn’t that apply to other parts of our lives? I could work more, make more money, save more money, but then I would have less time to hang out with my kids. I could volunteer more, but then I would have less time to visit a friend going through a rough patch with her husband. Life isn’t about striving for optimal or perfection with every decision we make - it’s about balance.

    MyFitness Pal is primarily for nutrition, which is why many people will talk optimizing nutrition.

    I am not sure where you live, but in my country, we have an epidemic of diabetes, heart disease, and cancer, among other chronic diseases. Many of these diseases could be prevented and possibly reversed if people began striving for optimal nutrition.

    Improvements in diet have a "step wise" improvement in health. The more you put it into it, the more you get out of it.

    Personally, striving for optimal nutrition and health gives me far more joy then eating a poor diet or being inactive.

    what prevents someone from getting cancer? I would like to know. reversing it? sure if chemo or radiation or other types of treatments put it into remission sure but it can still come back at any time.Ive know healthy people who ate healthy all their lives,were active and still got cancer,ive known many who had throat cancer and never smoked a day in their life. the other things yes its very possible to prevent, but some heart diseases cannot be reversed,some are genetic.

    Yeah, I was diagnosed with (thank G-d, highly-treatable, highly-survivable, caught-it-early, non-aggressive) bladder cancer. I was going down the checklist of risk factors and don't have a single one on that list. The lesions have been removed and I just finished BCG treatment to (hopefully!) keep it from coming back, but I don't know a thing I should have done differently to prevent it.

    Note: I also don't fall into any of the non-preventable risk categories like being male, over 55, of a certain racial/ethnic background, etc.

    I am glad you caught it early.
  • estherdragonbat
    estherdragonbat Posts: 5,285 Member
    Strawberry-pink urine was my panic button...
  • L1zardQueen
    L1zardQueen Posts: 8,755 Member
    Strawberry-pink urine was my panic button...

    Good thing you were not colorblind :)
  • mph323
    mph323 Posts: 3,566 Member
    edited February 2018
    Wrong thread
  • WinoGelato
    WinoGelato Posts: 13,456 Member
    ugofatcat wrote: »
    WinoGelato wrote: »
    lemurcat12 wrote: »

    are you asking me to provide with peer reviewed dietary analysis that a bacon western cheeseburger is less healthy than a chicken breast with balsamic salad?

    No, people are asking specifically about the context of the overall diet. We are not asking you to compare two specific meals.

    We're asking why the person who meets their nutritional needs with a variety of foods including a bacon cheeseburger is better off than the person who is meeting their nutritional needs while excluding bacon cheeseburgers (and, presumably, their components -- beef, bacon, cheese, and bread).

    Foods don't exist in a vacuum, they exist in the context of an overall diet. That is what people are asking you about.

    Although, a bacon cheeseburger is probably more balanced than a balsamic vinegar salad with chicken breast.

    nah
    2 meats and nitrates - lettuce onion ring and BBq sauce (sugar) vs. Chicken breast peppers - still lettuce - tomatos - cucumbers - hard boiled eggs vinegar AND 1/2 the calories

    Why are two meats worse than one meat?

    What on earth is wrong with lettuce and onion rings?

    I was combining them as there is not real nutritional benefit difference between the 2 - What on earth is wrong with lettuce and onion rings? - nothing - I just like my onion sauteed not breaded

    Breaded?? That's also a crime against humanity. Onions should be raw. especially on a bacon cheeseburger.

    I'll gladly take up to 1/3 of a large onion on my Cheeseburger.

    I think this conversation is giving us insight into the kind of burger Irishman1970 likes (BBQ sauce, breaded onion rings on it). Interesting that he assumes that's the kind of burger everyone else wants.

    Not, of course, that it couldn't fit into a reasonable diet on occasion if it was what someone enjoyed.

    Eating tons of chicken breast daily seems to me more of an issue (lack of variety) than occasionally having a bacon cheeseburger.

    I also don't get how someone who seems to think fat and carbs are bad gets to 4000+ calories. It can't all be lemon chicken breast and salad with vinegar.

    I can't imagine trying to hit 4000 calories on salad and lean meat. I'd feel like a stuffed pig the entire time so working out would be impossible, I'd barf.

    But also I learned something. Fitness is about what you eat. So step away from the equipment people, what you need is salad and grilled chicken. Quick, let the Olympics committee know everyone is wasting their time, they just need to step away from the pizza!

    "So step away from the equipment people" you go ahead and do that - I will keep training 2 a days

    Only 2 a days? Why not 3? Why not 4? Wouldn’t working out more be better?

    You mentioned going out with friends, why? Shouldn’t you be working out? Optimizing your lean mean fuel burning machine?

    Do you have a financial budget? Save, spend on essentials, spend on discretionary items? Why the discretionary items? Why not just save everything that isn’t needed for your basic life requirements? Wouldn’t that be better? More financially “fit”?

    And yes I realize I still have about 10 pages to go and this thread has likely taken many turns since this post but this always strikes me when posters say we should always be striving for optimal nutrition... but doesn’t that apply to other parts of our lives? I could work more, make more money, save more money, but then I would have less time to hang out with my kids. I could volunteer more, but then I would have less time to visit a friend going through a rough patch with her husband. Life isn’t about striving for optimal or perfection with every decision we make - it’s about balance.

    MyFitness Pal is primarily for nutrition, which is why many people will talk optimizing nutrition.

    I am not sure where you live, but in my country, we have an epidemic of diabetes, heart disease, and cancer, among other chronic diseases. Many of these diseases could be prevented and possibly reversed if people began striving for optimal nutrition.

    Improvements in diet have a "step wise" improvement in health. The more you put it into it, the more you get out of it.

    Personally, striving for optimal nutrition and health gives me far more joy then eating a poor diet or being inactive.

    I’m not sure how you got “eat a poor diet and be inactive” or “don’t make any strides toward health improvements” from my post. The point was, directed to the since departed poster who kept creating ridiculous straw man examples and suggesting that everyone should always choose the (in his opinion) objectively healthier choice when faced with a decision; that there are myriad of opportunities in life to make decisions and sometimes we go for optimal or perfection, and sometimes we go for personal satisfaction and enjoyment. That people who apply that logic to food (always choosing lean chicken and salad instead of a burger and fries) don’t seem to have the same philosophy about finances, or work life balance, or their education.... they understand there is a balance and trade off needed in those areas so why not the same approach when it comes to diet?
  • jeanona
    jeanona Posts: 155 Member
    brittyn3 wrote: »
    Looks like we're never going to find out if it was a bot or a real life person.

    Exactly the same behavior as last time... as soon as his/it's humanity was questioned... BAM! no more posts

    Except they didn't deactivate, they were, uhm, shown the door.

    This is going to sound completely stupid, but how do you know it's a bot? Or rather how would a non human even be able to post like that?

    You guys can all loudly laugh at me if that question is seriously as stupid as it sounds...

    In the previous thread, it was a combination of things,

    Holding to mutually exclusive concepts and arguing them(with sourcing)
    Presenting ideas in a context apparently devoid of experience

    were the two at the forefront that twigged me to make the guess.

    The kicker was that as soon as I made the guess(in a manner that would be entirely ignored by a person who was as confused as the poster appeared)... I asked "Are you turing complete" which is an industry phrase. The poster stopped and deactivated immediately.

    I didn’t read the entire thread but this caught my eye.

    I didn’t think any bots were turing complete and skimming through the answers, it sounded quite on point and gave seemingly intelligent answers. More than that, no one knew whether it was or wasn’t a human (I wasn’t able to read all its posts. I think some were deleted).
  • mph323
    mph323 Posts: 3,566 Member
    jeanona wrote: »
    brittyn3 wrote: »
    Looks like we're never going to find out if it was a bot or a real life person.

    Exactly the same behavior as last time... as soon as his/it's humanity was questioned... BAM! no more posts

    Except they didn't deactivate, they were, uhm, shown the door.

    This is going to sound completely stupid, but how do you know it's a bot? Or rather how would a non human even be able to post like that?

    You guys can all loudly laugh at me if that question is seriously as stupid as it sounds...

    In the previous thread, it was a combination of things,

    Holding to mutually exclusive concepts and arguing them(with sourcing)
    Presenting ideas in a context apparently devoid of experience

    were the two at the forefront that twigged me to make the guess.

    The kicker was that as soon as I made the guess(in a manner that would be entirely ignored by a person who was as confused as the poster appeared)... I asked "Are you turing complete" which is an industry phrase. The poster stopped and deactivated immediately.

    I didn’t read the entire thread but this caught my eye.

    I didn’t think any bots were turing complete and skimming through the answers, it sounded quite on point and gave seemingly intelligent answers. More than that, no one knew whether it was or wasn’t a human (I wasn’t able to read all its posts. I think some were deleted).

    I read an article a couple of days ago (sorry didn't think to save it) that talked about the proliferation of AI bots on twitter and other social media, and how disrupting it is. Along with the repetitive banging on a limited number of responses with increasing contextual vagueness as @stanmann571 pointed out, the article noted that the continuous responses were out of sync with natural human rhythms, meaning the bot didn't take credible sleep breaks or other breaks that would suggest a life outside of the forum. It was an interesting article, I'm really sorry I didn't save it!