My best friend is on another fad diet. I give up.
25lbsorbust
Posts: 225 Member
Guys, I swear I have tried EVERYTHING to get her to see the CICO light. I gave her a food scale, I showed her the weight I was losing, I told her how easy it was, how you can eat whatever as long as you're under/at your calorie limit for the day. She literally told me that she didn't like counting calories because "[her] food has too many calories in it, and [she] runs out really fast." She didn't see the irony.
She told me yesterday she's doing Dr. Oz's "Pegan" diet now. No weighing, no calorie counting, no definition (that I can find) of what a 'serving' of some of the foods constitutes. I asked her what Dr. Oz meant by a 'cheat day' once a week, or what constituted 'one alcoholic drink'. Mixed drink or single shot? She didn't know. It reminds me of Weight Watchers in all the wrong ways.
Have any of you had any friends taking this route? How did things eventually turn out? Did they ever change? Did the fad diet maybe magically work for them? Should I just let go and let god?
She told me yesterday she's doing Dr. Oz's "Pegan" diet now. No weighing, no calorie counting, no definition (that I can find) of what a 'serving' of some of the foods constitutes. I asked her what Dr. Oz meant by a 'cheat day' once a week, or what constituted 'one alcoholic drink'. Mixed drink or single shot? She didn't know. It reminds me of Weight Watchers in all the wrong ways.
Have any of you had any friends taking this route? How did things eventually turn out? Did they ever change? Did the fad diet maybe magically work for them? Should I just let go and let god?
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Replies
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It isnt your place to change her. She will have to decide for herself that she is ready.
Answer questions if she asks. Otherwise, I would just kinda smile and nod when that crap comes up. You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink
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25lbsorbust wrote: »Guys, I swear I have tried EVERYTHING to get her to see the CICO light. I gave her a food scale, I showed her the weight I was losing, I told her how easy it was, how you can eat whatever as long as you're under/at your calorie limit for the day. She literally told me that she didn't like counting calories because "[her] food has too many calories in it, and [she] runs out really fast." She didn't see the irony.
She told me yesterday she's doing Dr. Oz's "Pegan" diet now. No weighing, no calorie counting, no definition (that I can find) of what a 'serving' of something is. I asked her if by a "serving" of meat they meant the recommended amount (4oz), what's on the bag, etc. What Dr. Oz meant by a 'cheat day' once a week. She didn't know. It reminds me of Weight Watchers in all the wrong ways.
Have any of you had any friends taking this route? How did things eventually turn out? Did they ever change? Did the fad diet maybe magically work for them? Should I just let go and let god?
Any diet works if it creates a calorie deficit and is sustainable over time (the latter is where most fad diets usually fizzle out). Whether it's beneficial for overall health may be a completely different discussion.
You tried and she isn't willing to listen. At this point your best strategy is probably just "you do you". Keep doing what you're doing and serve as a good example. Maybe when she's tried fad diet after fad diet and is still fat while you're busy succeeding, she'll eventually see the light. Or maybe not and she'll Just Stay Fat. Some people you just can't reach.24 -
My friends do all sorts of oddball things and I love them anyways. Only enlighten those who ask for it. And then don't apologize for it.25
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4legsRbetterthan2 wrote: »It isnt your place to change her. She will have to decide for herself that she is ready.
Answer questions if she asks. Otherwise, I would just kinda smile and nod when that crap comes up. You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink
That's what I've been doing most of the time. It's just so range inducing to see this keep happening!You tried and she isn't willing to listen. At this point your best strategy is probably just "you do you". Keep doing what you're doing and serve as a good example. Maybe when she's tried fad diet after fad diet and is still fat while you're busy succeeding, she'll eventually see the light. Or maybe not and she'll Just Stay Fat. Some people you just can't reach.
I dunno about the 'seeing the light' part, she's been at this for years. She tried keto, a grapefruit diet, etc.. anything to avoid counting calories. Maybe one day...
And yeah, I tried to bring up that that was the issue. It's like WW with all their 'zero point' items. It'll work if you've got A LOT of weight to lose, but once that number drops you're gonna stall out. It's inevitable.
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I have spent four years thinking it was my duty as an enlightened CICO'er to educate the masses - and I don't just mean unsolicited advice, but helping desperate people who have "tried everything", cry and pray for help, and are "willing to do anything". I imagined "you can lose/maintain weight eating what you want every day as long as you don't eat too much over time" would be a gift that everybody should be grateful for. But no. Most people don't get it, they don't believe it, they misunderstand deliberately, ridicule, and are sometimes even outright hostile. It took me so long, and intense research before the penny dropped:
Some people prefer clear cut rules, but clear cut rules is a bad match for complex areas like nutrition, let alone modern food environment and eating norms.
Some people struggle with concepts like, well, concepts, cause/effect, time, percentages, statistics, process vs method, maximum/minimum, etc.
Some people are very easily taken in by things that sound sciency.
Some people are very easy to scare, and act on fear.
People are - to various degree, under various circumstances - impatient, vain, greedy, lazy, envious.
Depending on circumstances, almost everybody wants to be scammed.
Calories in/out is common knowledge, but sounds very boring compared to fad diets.
Those who want to lose weight, just eat less (and move more), they often feel ashamed of their weight too, so they don't announce it.
Most people want exciting things.
Many people don't like changes. Changes can bring forth new challenges, and new things are scary.
Most people are social.
Most people don't want to feel excluded.
Being fat is a very concrete evidence of having overindulged.
Overindulgence, and even the slightest experience of pleasure, can be regarded as a sin.
Sins should be confessed and thoroughly made up for.
Suffering can feel really good.
Shared suffering is even better.
Others need to see the effort you're making.
So, it makes sense, in its backwards and perverted way: Effective weightloss strategies must be avoided at all costs.65 -
@kommodevaran
So true. Also, you may have too much time on your hands. And, there are not enough Likes in the world.
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My thoughts...let it go.
In all honesty...she is an adult and can decide for herself how she wants to live her life. If she asks how you are dieting then tell her. After that it is up to her to do her own research and make decisions based on what she believes is best for her.
I have often said...I wish my children would learn through my mistakes instead of making their own. That rarely happens. I also believe sometimes the best way to learn is through making mistakes and then try something else until you find what works.
In the end the only way that she will know for sure that this Dr. Oz diet isn't for her is to...try it.10 -
25lbsorbust wrote: »Guys, I swear I have tried EVERYTHING to get her to see the CICO light. I gave her a food scale, I showed her the weight I was losing, I told her how easy it was, how you can eat whatever as long as you're under/at your calorie limit for the day. She literally told me that she didn't like counting calories because "[her] food has too many calories in it, and [she] runs out really fast." She didn't see the irony.
She told me yesterday she's doing Dr. Oz's "Pegan" diet now. No weighing, no calorie counting, no definition (that I can find) of what a 'serving' of some of the foods constitutes. I asked her what Dr. Oz meant by a 'cheat day' once a week, or what constituted 'one alcoholic drink'. Mixed drink or single shot? She didn't know. It reminds me of Weight Watchers in all the wrong ways.
Have any of you had any friends taking this route? How did things eventually turn out? Did they ever change? Did the fad diet maybe magically work for them? Should I just let go and let god?
Deep breaths, Judgy Judgy.53 -
A good and close coworker of mine is like this too. So many fad diets over the years and yet another one. I have lost 70 lbs and still losing more using MFP and CICO, but she just won't do it. All her diets are unsustainable. So I've given up and just bite my tongue.5
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FWIW, the Pegan Diet was NOT created by Dr. Oz.
"Pegan" was a term fashioned by Dr. Mark Hyman who touts this way of eating in his book: "Food: what the heck should I eat?"
I watched his infomercial on PBS and took notes on it. It's basically a modified paleo, heart healthy diet (that I generally followed b4 I ever heard of it) w/a few recommendations that certain people on MFP would quickly woo.
Will be happy to post my notes on it, if anyone is interested.
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It's a bummer, but all you can really do is hope they see the light eventually on their own. Fad diets are like crack to the human brain. Just like "Get Rich Quick" schemes. If she fails enough times, hopefully she'll give calorie counting another shot. But trying to get her there yourself is an exercise in futility.4
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FWIW, the Pegan Diet was NOT created by Dr. Oz.
It was a term fashioned by Dr. Mark Hyman who touts this diet in his book: "Food: what the heck should I eat?"
I watched his infomercial on PBS and took notes on it. It's basically a modified paleo, heart healthy diet (that I generally follow) w/a few recommendations that certain people on MFP would woo.
Will be happy to post my notes on it, if anyone is interested.
I believe Dr Oz is currently promoting his "own" version of this diet (if the magazine cover I saw yesterday is any indication).3 -
I went on a tour of 30 Rock 5 years ago. When we got to his stage, the tour guide asked if anyone here was a fan of Doctor Oz... no one raised their hand.16
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By CICO light you mean 'counting calories' in and out. Sorry its a distinction. I personally would hate to weigh everything on a food scale and have a heart monitor for exercise. I don't like prepping all my food either. Would rather the Dr. Oz diet with the modification of adding the MyFitnessPal tracking on top of it. It works with CICO by picking less calories dense foods. Eating your calorie limit is hard with mostly vegetables for example. I've done Herbal Magic with MyfitnessPal tracking. They worked well together because they are both counting/journal diets. I was less likely to fall off the tracking. (ie. not feeling so guilty about blowing a tracking day as to give it up all together). Now if only I didn't quit once I hit my weight goals...40
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Is South Beach a fad diet? I've actually known quite a few people who've done well with SB in both losing and keeping it off. The one's who keep it off more or less eat phase III for maintenance which is actually pretty similar to the way I eat.
Personally, I don't really talk diet or nutrition with anyone who doesn't ask...and I typically couldn't care less what other people do.
I do have a buddy that is trying to put on weight who asked me for some advice...We worked out his TDEE and calories necessary for a surplus and I gave him some pointers on calorie dense, low volume foods to help him along because he's just not a big eater.
He is having a tough time hitting his calorie targets on any kind of remotely consistent basis so I told him to ease off the cardio to make it easier as he does at least an hour per day. He's still having a tough time and hasn't dropped the cardio...meh...what are you gonna do?9 -
By CICO light you mean 'counting calories' in and out. Sorry its a distinction. I personally would hate to weigh everything on a food scale and have a heart monitor for exercise. I don't like prepping all my food either. Would rather the Dr. Oz diet with the modification of adding the MyFitnessPal tracking on top of it. It works with CICO by picking less calories dense foods. Eating your calorie limit is hard with mostly vegetables for example. I've done Herbal Magic with MyfitnessPal tracking. They worked well together because they are both counting/journal diets. I was less likely to fall off the tracking. (ie. not feeling so guilty about blowing a tracking day as to give it up all together). Now if only I didn't quit once I hit my weight goals...
You don't have to weigh or prep food or use a heart monitor in order to use calorie counting to lose weight. While it's true that some people find it easier to log accurately when they use a food scale, there are also many people who met their weight loss goals without ever weighing anything. Same with prepping meals or using a heart monitor. They're just techniques/tools that some people choose to use, they're not required.23 -
Hadn't heard of the "Pegan" diet so I looked it up and it looks like a Mediterranean diet with trendy terms slapped on it. Might want to let her know that there are hundreds of free Mediterranean diet plans online if she's planning to blow money on Dr. Oz materials (I assume he's selling a book), otherwise not much to be done.0
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The 'problem' with MFP is that you have to create your own diet. Nobody tells you what to eat, what to drink, there is just a number that how many calories you can have a day. No rules, no magic pills, you have to do some work if you want to stick to it. Most people are very lazy, they say they 'don't have the time' for this. The truth is that it's not as easy as 'drink only cabbage juice for 20 days'. If you track your calories you have to do it as long as you don't reach your goals and beyond. And some people just like to be told what to do by 'someone smarter'. They think that it's not possible to do something completetly on your own.20
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You do you ; let her do her; be a friend and support without judgement. I understand the frustration very well from my own experience but it's not helpful to a friendship.
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happytree923 wrote: »Hadn't heard of the "Pegan" diet so I looked it up and it looks like a Mediterranean diet with trendy terms slapped on it. Might want to let her know that there are hundreds of free Mediterranean diet plans online if she's planning to blow money on Dr. Oz materials (I assume he's selling a book), otherwise not much to be done.
In an uncharacteristic move, it appears you don't have to pay to learn about it: http://www.doctoroz.com/feature/pegan-365-diet2 -
I have 2 friends who are losing weight by alternative methods. One got an Obera implant, the other is eating some kind of mail order meal plan that cost 400 a month. The obera is essentially a removable balloon that is placed in your stomach for around six months. She lost 50lbs now that it's removed she has maintained for 3 months. The friend using the mail order meals can't stay on track she "cheats" daily she lost a couple of pounds in the first week but she was only eating 800 calories a day. I have tried to get her to eat real food not the processed junk and eat more but she swears that it will work. So I just let her be. When she asks questions about my weight loss I tell her that I log everything and exercise. She says it's too much work and changes the subject.8
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My friends ask me pretty frequently about weight loss or look for my validation about something, and I will tell them what I think. Otherwise I give no unsolicited advice. I was in their shoes once and I know they have to arrive at the decision to do something sustainable on their own. They know what I'm doing and I figure my results speak for themselves. I really don't trouble myself about what they're doing unless they're doing something dangerous (which some of them have unfortunately).8
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I feel your pain. I'm struggling with a sister that works for a chiropractor who is currently offering a weight loss program. It's a well-known fad consisting of a very low calorie intake and hormone injections. She refuses to accept that the way to lose weight is to eat less and/or move more. She wants some doctor somewhere to find out the special reason she "can't" lose weight, tell her it's not her fault and give her a magic potion. When she told me she was doing this diet, I told her I'd heard of it and it's associated drawbacks, and suggested she do some reading from disinterested sources. Instead, she's signed on and, worse, is trying to recruit family and friends. I'm not saying another word about it, but it'd sure be nice if there were a magic potion that could grant critical thinking skills.24
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janejellyroll wrote: »FWIW, the Pegan Diet was NOT created by Dr. Oz.
It was a term fashioned by Dr. Mark Hyman who touts this diet in his book: "Food: what the heck should I eat?"
I watched his infomercial on PBS and took notes on it. It's basically a modified paleo, heart healthy diet (that I generally follow) w/a few recommendations that certain people on MFP would woo.
Will be happy to post my notes on it, if anyone is interested.
I believe Dr Oz is currently promoting his "own" version of this diet (if the magazine cover I saw yesterday is any indication).
Apparrently so.
Don't think Hyman trademarked the term but, if Oz is stealing the ideas from his book and infomercial, Hyman may have grounds for a lawsuit.
I don't watch or pay much attn to Oz but, from what l've I've seen/heard, I don't think it would be the 1st time Oz took credit for someone else's ideas.11 -
janejellyroll wrote: »FWIW, the Pegan Diet was NOT created by Dr. Oz.
It was a term fashioned by Dr. Mark Hyman who touts this diet in his book: "Food: what the heck should I eat?"
I watched his infomercial on PBS and took notes on it. It's basically a modified paleo, heart healthy diet (that I generally follow) w/a few recommendations that certain people on MFP would woo.
Will be happy to post my notes on it, if anyone is interested.
I believe Dr Oz is currently promoting his "own" version of this diet (if the magazine cover I saw yesterday is any indication).
Apparrently so.
Don't think Hyman trademarked the term but, if Oz is stealing the ideas from his book and infomercisa, Hymanmay has grounds for a lawsuit.
I don't watch or pay much attn to Oz but, from what lite I've seen/heard, I don't think it wod be the 1st time Oz took credit for someone else's ideas.
It looks like he just completely copied Hyman's plan (same limit of 1 cup of day of beans, for example), but I don't see any references or credit to Hyman on the website. Oz truly is slimy.7 -
Most of my friends have tried MFP at some point and quickly stopped. Many of them only have 20 or 30 lb to lose, and I think they don't care quite enough to commit to logging their calories or really changing any of their habits.
It makes me a little sad that a few other friends have more to lose (50-100 and more) but continue to try all of the fads, pills, superfoods, wraps, and so on. They know not to even start a conversation with me about those things though. I was adamant about that when I weighed over 300 lb and I'm the same way now that I'm at a healthy weight...I have no patience for it at all. OF COURSE I've suggested MFP. They didn't even consider it.
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When I started my best friend gave me a LOT of advice, from ww & things she learned on tv etc. She lost 60 lbs 3 times, gained it all back, so she's very knowledgeable she says. It drove me crazy! She said she's happy maintaining her wt-230 lbs (she's tall but still overweight) she knows what I've done to lose but won't try, nothing I can do. She's the one I give all my big clothes to6
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I think some people just want a magic pill...(if there was one I would want it too). When they find out one pill is not magic...they search for another. Hopefully somewhere along the way they get tire of searching and give in and do it just by cutting back on what they eat. Sadly many of them don't. They just keep hoping that the next pill will be the one.
I get it. Losing weight especially a lot of weight can be hard and tiring. There are days that I get tired thinking about it.3 -
"Fad" just means it's popular, not that it won't work. Some of the best diets are "fads." As long as she's not going to do damage to herself or throw money away on something like vitamins or plastic body wraps that literally have no association at all with weight loss, I think all diets are worth trying because different people like different approaches. Some people prefer counting calories and some like to call things "points" and some people prefer to just restrict a type of food to make it easier to stay on track...some people like to do things the way a celebrity from the 1990s does things. It's really personal.16
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