Metabolic Suppression, Global Warming, and Sasquatch,.....Which one is real?
sidcorsini
Posts: 44 Member
It is claimed that neuroscience creates a 'set-pointe' in our brain that locks in a weight our body fights to retain. Can a force of will overcome this potential incarceration, or should we just go looking for Bigfoot?
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Replies
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I've never heard of a neurological-based set point...4
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Why do people get fat then? Why does this only kick in when people try to lose weight?24
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quiksylver296 wrote: »Why do people get fat then? Why does this only kick in when people try to lose weight?
This is a question I still have yet to see anyone even attempt to answer. If our body "prefers" a certain weight, why does it only keep us from going under it, not over it?
And to add, one would assume that the only reason this comes up is because some people are looking for a reason why they can't lose weight. Meaning the idea is their body is keeping them fat. Why would our body prefer to be overweight? I could understand I guess the high side of the healthy weight range, but how is keeping someone at greater risk for diabetes, heart disease, stroke, and cancer evolutionarily advantageous?
Oh, and the answer to the thread title question is Global Warming. I'm not familiar with the term "Metabolic Suppression", but if it means set point, then Global Warming is the answer.
OP, since you started the thread, can you provide some sources that "claimed that neuroscience creates a 'set-pointe' in our brain that locks in a weight our body fights to retain." please?12 -
To answer the question, one must first define "real."3
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Global warming is real.28
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Is this the real life?3
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Is this the real life?
Some of the threads lately make it clear it's just fantasy...
To be clear, set point theories are just woo, but I can see the train of thought going on in people's minds, especially when they've been in a fairly steady obese/overweight state for a while.
Since I'm not losing/ gaining weight I must be at my set point
I'm having a hard time losing weight, my body must be hanging on to fat because it wants to stay this weight
People who are losing weight must either not be at their set point yet or are outliers who don't have a set point
Some people just have lucky genetics. I'm stuck at this weight.
Seriously flawed logic but very appealing.
Edited for stoopid autocorrect12 -
I dunno, my husband has some pretty large feet...5
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I think set point just has to do with ones habits and the amounts of food they are used to eating. That's why people never seem to have a set point that keeps them from gaining, only losing. I think there is a little something to the hunger hormones that are released when someone is in a caloric deficit. For example if someone was to cut back the calories they were consuming pre-weight loss, their hunger signals will demand more food until that person is used to eating the lesser amount. I did read something a while back about the body having a natural want to re-fill the fat cells that were emptied through weight loss. So it sends hunger hormones to the brain telling the person they need to eat. The more fat cells you have, the higher the "Set point". Before I get woo'd though, I think it was one of those Reader's Digest articles they post on MSN... So not very reputable... But while I think there is a little bit of science to this, it's not as big as people make it out to be. It's more about a set point of habits and lifestyle, and less about the body trying to trick you into holding onto the fat you've gained. I think it too often becomes an excuse. Instead of someone looking into why they are not losing weight- be it logging errors, not giving it enough time, too many indulgences, etc. They just throw in the towel, shrug and assume it must be set their set point. Or they just get caught in the landslide with no escape from reality. *cough*7
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I read a recent article in the NYT, I think in January.quiksylver296 wrote: »Why do people get fat then? Why does this only kick in when people try to lose weight?
This is a question I still have yet to see anyone even attempt to answer. If our body "prefers" a certain weight, why does it only keep us from going under it, not over it?
And to add, one would assume that the only reason this comes up is because some people are looking for a reason why they can't lose weight. Meaning the idea is their body is keeping them fat. Why would our body prefer to be overweight? I could understand I guess the high side of the healthy weight range, but how is keeping someone at greater risk for diabetes, heart disease, stroke, and cancer evolutionarily advantageous?
Oh, and the answer to the thread title question is Global Warming. I'm not familiar with the term "Metabolic Suppression", but if it means set point, then Global Warming is the answer.
OP, since you started the thread, can you provide some sources that "claimed that neuroscience creates a 'set-pointe' in our brain that locks in a weight our body fights to retain." please?
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Mainstream media is rarely a good source for accurate, technically correct information. They often twist or outright misrepresent the referenced studies in the best way possible to draw clicks (because clicks = ad revenue).sidcorsini wrote: »I read a recent article in the NYT, I think in January.9 -
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they're all real!
the 'squatch ended up so huge because years of crash diets 'ruined' his metabolism and caused him to get stuck at his 'set point'. Out of frustration, he resorted to his most extreme diet yet: the Egg Diet. This has given him a major case of the Egg Farts for the last 20 years. Egg Farts contain methane. Methane contributes to- you guessed it- global warming.
it's all connected. wake up, sheeple.
You. I like you.
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quiksylver296 wrote: »Why do people get fat then? Why does this only kick in when people try to lose weight?
I have only gained very large amounts of weight in my adult life because of medications that totally altered my appetite, metabolism, cravings and satiety levels. I only gained about 20 or so lbs during pregnancy but certain psych meds, antipsychotics, contributed to my gaining over 120 lbs in a few months.9 -
WillingtoLose1001984 wrote: »quiksylver296 wrote: »Why do people get fat then? Why does this only kick in when people try to lose weight?
I have only gained very large amounts of weight in my adult life because of medications that totally altered my appetite, metabolism, cravings and satiety levels. I only gained about 20 or so lbs during pregnancy but certain psych meds, antipsychotics, contributed to my gaining over 120 lbs in a few months.
But if "set point" is a thing, why didn't your body fight against gaining that weight? Why would it only fight someone trying to lose weight?16 -
set point isn't really a thing other than to say, you hit certain points where you have to address your habits, and what you're ultimately willing to do. My happy place is around 180-183 and that's about 15% BF for me. I could certainly get leaner and lose more, however, I'm not willing to do what that takes from a dietary or exercise standpoint to do it because I don't think visible abs are particularly important.8
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Pretty sure Sasquatch farts cause global warming, and the smell causes metabolic suppression. Just my .02 hah.8
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quiksylver296 wrote: »
Now I have to go watch it on YouTube. Damn you
If there was a set point mine would be 7st 7lbs (105 lbs). Just where all the stars tend to align.
I always think my short term weight gain was the anomaly. The thing I have to watch at the moment is not dropping weight as my CO (that dang lifting heavy things) tends to be greater than what I am happy eating.
Don't know about Sasquatch, but there is definitely a Loch Ness Monster. His Brussels sprout farts are warming the oceans.
Cheers, h.3 -
WillingtoLose1001984 wrote: »quiksylver296 wrote: »Why do people get fat then? Why does this only kick in when people try to lose weight?
I have only gained very large amounts of weight in my adult life because of medications that totally altered my appetite, metabolism, cravings and satiety levels. I only gained about 20 or so lbs during pregnancy but certain psych meds, antipsychotics, contributed to my gaining over 120 lbs in a few months.
But if "set point" is a thing, why didn't your body fight against gaining that weight? Why would it only fight someone trying to lose weight?
I have mentioned a number of times on this thread that I personally had the experience of maintaining the same weight for over ten years with no tracking and plenty of times where I must have been going over tdee, but I wasn't doing it extremely or consistently so it simply wasn't affecting my weight. I'm a mere 5-6 lbs more (gained during pregnancy) yet I haven't been able to lose them for two years in spite of tracking and eating less than I did then. If I haven't gotten pregnant, I would have most likely still been maintaining the same weight as before. Likewise I know a number of people who are thin and remain that way in spite of never tracking, not exercising, and eating whatever they want in whatever amounts they want and never gaining. So the body does fight against gaining as well. We're just evolutionary more predisposed towards preserving energy rather than spending. People who do gain large amounts of weight with no medical issues are generally those who overeat in large amounts, ignoring natural hunger and satiety signals; if you watch shows like 600 Lb life, most of them have severe emotional issues they self-medicate with food. If you give the body a consistent large surplus or large deficit, weight will of course move. Yet for the majority of people, it stays stable for years without tracking at all, which says something for the body wanting to maintain a weight (notice I said 'a weight' - not any specific weight, but the given weight the body is at right now). And for those who have lost a large amount of weight, there are mechanisms such as increased hunger and decreased metabolic rate which work to try and regain, as they've said about Biggest Loser participants. I've also heard the theory mentioned above that fat cells can be formed but can't be removed, only shrunk, and fat cells produce hormones such as leptin that influence hunger.
Most obese people didn't get there by eating 100-200 calories a day over maintenance. Nor are you likely to lose weight on that much of a deficit (measurement issues aside, let's assume we can measure perfectly). The body makes subtle adjustments to make up for the minor fluctuations in intake that pretty much all of us have daily.23 -
nettiklive wrote: »WillingtoLose1001984 wrote: »quiksylver296 wrote: »Why do people get fat then? Why does this only kick in when people try to lose weight?
I have only gained very large amounts of weight in my adult life because of medications that totally altered my appetite, metabolism, cravings and satiety levels. I only gained about 20 or so lbs during pregnancy but certain psych meds, antipsychotics, contributed to my gaining over 120 lbs in a few months.
But if "set point" is a thing, why didn't your body fight against gaining that weight? Why would it only fight someone trying to lose weight?
I have mentioned a number of times on this thread that I personally had the experience of maintaining the same weight for over ten years with no tracking and plenty of times where I must have been going over tdee, but I wasn't doing it extremely or consistently so it simply wasn't affecting my weight. I'm a mere 5-6 lbs more (gained during pregnancy) yet I haven't been able to lose them for two years in spite of tracking and eating less than I did then. If I haven't gotten pregnant, I would have most likely still been maintaining the same weight as before. Likewise I know a number of people who are thin and remain that way in spite of never tracking, not exercising, and eating whatever they want in whatever amounts they want and never gaining. So the body does fight against gaining as well. We're just evolutionary more predisposed towards preserving energy rather than spending. People who do gain large amounts of weight with no medical issues are generally those who overeat in large amounts, ignoring natural hunger and satiety signals; if you watch shows like 600 Lb life, most of them have severe emotional issues they self-medicate with food. If you give the body a consistent large surplus or large deficit, weight will of course move. Yet for the majority of people, it stays stable for years without tracking at all, which says something for the body wanting to maintain a weight (notice I said 'a weight' - not any specific weight, but the given weight the body is at right now). And for those who have lost a large amount of weight, there are mechanisms such as increased hunger and decreased metabolic rate which work to try and regain, as they've said about Biggest Loser participants. I've also heard the theory mentioned above that fat cells can be formed but can't be removed, only shrunk, and fat cells produce hormones such as leptin that influence hunger.
Most obese people didn't get there by eating 100-200 calories a day over maintenance. Nor are you likely to lose weight on that much of a deficit (measurement issues aside, let's assume we can measure perfectly). The body makes subtle adjustments to make up for the minor fluctuations in intake that pretty much all of us have daily.
I'm sorry, but I simply don't agree with, nor have I seen the things you are assuming are true.
It is very well known that people tend to gain small amounts of weight year after year as they progress through middle age, because they are eating a little bit more than they need to and moving less and less. This is so common, it has it's own pop culture reference - middle age spread. I would not hesitate to say that most people are heavier at 55 than they were at 25, rather than being kept in homeostasis by their bodies.
Just because you don't visually see a weight change in a coworker from January to December doesn't mean they didn't gain 3 lbs. Over 10 years, that person could slowly gain 30 lbs. I personally gained 20 lbs over 10 years and didn't notice until seeing a bad picture of myself because I rarely stepped on the scale. I was shocked when I finally did, otherwise I would have thought I was around the same weight, because it came on so slowly.
The fact that people aren't tracking does not mean that they aren't eating the right amount of calories. They eat 200 cals over one day, they eat 200 cals under the next day and over time they are generally matching their calorie needs. You keep making the assumption that if people aren't trying to gain or lose weight, they are eating the wrong amount of calories and therefore their bodies must be adjusting to maintain their current weight. I don't understand why you assume this. I would be far more likely to assume these people simply have accurate hunger cues and lifestyles that keep them from mindlessly snacking.14 -
@nettiklive I think you explained the set point theory pretty well here. The only thing I'm not sure about is the fat cells. I have heard that fat cells will reduce if they are empty for long enough... This is how someone can lose weight, and how their body achieves a new state of homeostasis. Someone correct me if I'm wrong here, but this part does make sense to me. Wouldn't this be how one's hunger hormones would adjust after weight loss? After so many months, the person is used to their new calorie intake, the body absorbs those old fat cells, and the hunger hormones act accordingly. Then, they could theoretically eat and have activities at their new lifestyle without tracking and maintain whatever weight they ended up at. They have created a new set point for their body. Still though, whether or not our emptied fat cells are angrily demanding we feed them, or if it's just all a mental game, set point can be overridden. If it couldn't no one could maintain their new weight long term.3
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they're all real!
the 'squatch ended up so huge because years of crash diets 'ruined' his metabolism and caused him to get stuck at his 'set point'. Out of frustration, he resorted to his most extreme diet yet: the Egg Diet. This has given him a major case of the Egg Farts for the last 20 years. Egg Farts contain methane. Methane contributes to- you guessed it- global warming.
it's all connected. wake up, sheeple.
You win the internet!!
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nettiklive wrote: »WillingtoLose1001984 wrote: »quiksylver296 wrote: »Why do people get fat then? Why does this only kick in when people try to lose weight?
I have only gained very large amounts of weight in my adult life because of medications that totally altered my appetite, metabolism, cravings and satiety levels. I only gained about 20 or so lbs during pregnancy but certain psych meds, antipsychotics, contributed to my gaining over 120 lbs in a few months.
But if "set point" is a thing, why didn't your body fight against gaining that weight? Why would it only fight someone trying to lose weight?
I have mentioned a number of times on this thread that I personally had the experience of maintaining the same weight for over ten years with no tracking and plenty of times where I must have been going over tdee, but I wasn't doing it extremely or consistently so it simply wasn't affecting my weight. I'm a mere 5-6 lbs more (gained during pregnancy) yet I haven't been able to lose them for two years in spite of tracking and eating less than I did then. If I haven't gotten pregnant, I would have most likely still been maintaining the same weight as before. Likewise I know a number of people who are thin and remain that way in spite of never tracking, not exercising, and eating whatever they want in whatever amounts they want and never gaining. So the body does fight against gaining as well. We're just evolutionary more predisposed towards preserving energy rather than spending. People who do gain large amounts of weight with no medical issues are generally those who overeat in large amounts, ignoring natural hunger and satiety signals; if you watch shows like 600 Lb life, most of them have severe emotional issues they self-medicate with food. If you give the body a consistent large surplus or large deficit, weight will of course move. Yet for the majority of people, it stays stable for years without tracking at all, which says something for the body wanting to maintain a weight (notice I said 'a weight' - not any specific weight, but the given weight the body is at right now). And for those who have lost a large amount of weight, there are mechanisms such as increased hunger and decreased metabolic rate which work to try and regain, as they've said about Biggest Loser participants. I've also heard the theory mentioned above that fat cells can be formed but can't be removed, only shrunk, and fat cells produce hormones such as leptin that influence hunger.
Most obese people didn't get there by eating 100-200 calories a day over maintenance. Nor are you likely to lose weight on that much of a deficit (measurement issues aside, let's assume we can measure perfectly). The body makes subtle adjustments to make up for the minor fluctuations in intake that pretty much all of us have daily.
https://bodyrecomposition.com/fat-loss/set-points-settling-points-and-bodyweight-regulation-part-1.html/
Read both part 1 and part 2 before you start screaming "See????? I was right!!!!!"7 -
@kimny72 I was going to challenge that as well, but couldn't put it into words very well. A small 100-200 calorie daily average surplus is exactly what landed me here. I do think the body does try to maintain whatever weight it's at, but many people aren't very in tune with their bodies. I got overweight because I would overeat (because food is tasty), and ignore those "okay stop" signals my stomach was sending me. That small 100-200 calorie difference is why as you put it "middle age spread" happens. Set point in the sense that one's body tries to maintain the weight it is at currently when put in a deficit is probably 20% science, and 80% mental & habits.4
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Crafty_camper123 wrote: »@kimny72 I was going to challenge that as well, but couldn't put it into words very well. A small 100-200 calorie daily average surplus is exactly what landed me here. I do think the body does try to maintain whatever weight it's at, but many people aren't very in tune with their bodies. I got overweight because I would overeat (because food is tasty), and ignore those "okay stop" signals my stomach was sending me. That small 100-200 calorie difference is why as you put it "middle age spread" happens. Set point in the sense that one's body tries to maintain the weight it is at currently when put in a deficit is probably 20% science, and 80% mental & habits.
Subsequently, the body can respond the same way on the down escalator. I have seen, and truth be told, I have felt the same way in the past, that once one realizes they have too much body fat and are overweight, they want it all gone as soon as possible. Lot's of impatience. We see it here every day. There are hormonal regulation things that will interfere with that. It just doesn't work that way.
That is why a conservative deficit and lots of patience works best. It is almost a trite axiom by now, but that weight went on very slowly and, if you are going to do it in a sustainable and healthy way, it will come off the same way.5 -
Crafty_camper123 wrote: »@kimny72 I was going to challenge that as well, but couldn't put it into words very well. A small 100-200 calorie daily average surplus is exactly what landed me here. I do think the body does try to maintain whatever weight it's at, but many people aren't very in tune with their bodies. I got overweight because I would overeat (because food is tasty), and ignore those "okay stop" signals my stomach was sending me. That small 100-200 calorie difference is why as you put it "middle age spread" happens. Set point in the sense that one's body tries to maintain the weight it is at currently when put in a deficit is probably 20% science, and 80% mental & habits.
Subsequently, the body can respond the same way on the down escalator. I have seen, and truth be told, I have felt the same way in the past, that once one realizes they have too much body fat and are overweight, they want it all gone as soon as possible. Lot's of impatience. We see it here every day. There are hormonal regulation things that will interfere with that. It just doesn't work that way.
That is why a conservative deficit and lots of patience works best. It is almost a trite axiom by now, but that weight went on very slowly and, if you are going to do it in a sustainable and healthy way, it will come off the same way.
Too many people believe that TV crap like The Biggest Loser bears some resemblance to real life. Or that Jillian Michaels is really serious about "melting/blasting/zapping/shredding" that fat off your body. That ain't how any of this works. It took you a lot of time to get fat, it'll take you a lot of time to get un-fat. The sooner you come to that realization and buckle in for the ride, the better off you are. As the saying goes, "weight loss isn't easy, but it is simple".9 -
They see me eggin
They hatin
Patrolling they tryin to catch me squatchin gassy
Tryin to catch me squatchin gassy
Tryin to catch me squatchin gassy
Tryin to catch me squatchin gassy
Tryin to catch me squatchin gassy12 -
nettiklive wrote: »WillingtoLose1001984 wrote: »quiksylver296 wrote: »Why do people get fat then? Why does this only kick in when people try to lose weight?
I have only gained very large amounts of weight in my adult life because of medications that totally altered my appetite, metabolism, cravings and satiety levels. I only gained about 20 or so lbs during pregnancy but certain psych meds, antipsychotics, contributed to my gaining over 120 lbs in a few months.
But if "set point" is a thing, why didn't your body fight against gaining that weight? Why would it only fight someone trying to lose weight?
I have mentioned a number of times on this thread that I personally had the experience of maintaining the same weight for over ten years with no tracking and plenty of times where I must have been going over tdee, but I wasn't doing it extremely or consistently so it simply wasn't affecting my weight. I'm a mere 5-6 lbs more (gained during pregnancy) yet I haven't been able to lose them for two years in spite of tracking and eating less than I did then. If I haven't gotten pregnant, I would have most likely still been maintaining the same weight as before. Likewise I know a number of people who are thin and remain that way in spite of never tracking, not exercising, and eating whatever they want in whatever amounts they want and never gaining. So the body does fight against gaining as well. We're just evolutionary more predisposed towards preserving energy rather than spending. People who do gain large amounts of weight with no medical issues are generally those who overeat in large amounts, ignoring natural hunger and satiety signals; if you watch shows like 600 Lb life, most of them have severe emotional issues they self-medicate with food. If you give the body a consistent large surplus or large deficit, weight will of course move. Yet for the majority of people, it stays stable for years without tracking at all, which says something for the body wanting to maintain a weight (notice I said 'a weight' - not any specific weight, but the given weight the body is at right now). And for those who have lost a large amount of weight, there are mechanisms such as increased hunger and decreased metabolic rate which work to try and regain, as they've said about Biggest Loser participants. I've also heard the theory mentioned above that fat cells can be formed but can't be removed, only shrunk, and fat cells produce hormones such as leptin that influence hunger.
Most obese people didn't get there by eating 100-200 calories a day over maintenance. Nor are you likely to lose weight on that much of a deficit (measurement issues aside, let's assume we can measure perfectly). The body makes subtle adjustments to make up for the minor fluctuations in intake that pretty much all of us have daily.
Actually, yes, most obese people DID get there by eating 100-200 calories a day over maintenance. It doesn't take that much for slow but steady weight creep.
Then, at some point, their weight stabilizes at the obese weight where their intake and activity normalizes.
A poster on here calculated her weight gain at one point, and realized that she had only been eating 75 extra calories a day.10
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