Am I doing it wrong
sharke087
Posts: 30 Member
Okay, so I am just getting started the past couple days and my overall goal will be to bulk up (right now I would best describe myself as a scrawny skinny fat type)
The thing I am wondering if I am doing wrong is.....I was told to work on cutting my belly fat down and toning up first, but would it be easier to try and bulk from here?
Some advice on the order I should do this in would be helpful!
Thanks in advance
The thing I am wondering if I am doing wrong is.....I was told to work on cutting my belly fat down and toning up first, but would it be easier to try and bulk from here?
Some advice on the order I should do this in would be helpful!
Thanks in advance
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Replies
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Personally, I would recommend hiring a personal trainer that is suited for your goals. A good one will not only create a workout plan based on your goals, ability, and schedule, but also help you with diet. Shop around as different trainers specialize in different areas. Some are great at distance running training, some for body building, others for weight loss, find the one that's best for you.
1. You cannot spot reduce fat. The human body doesn't work that way. When we eat at a deficit our body will pull fat from wherever it feels like to use as energy.
2. If you want to increase muscle mass, you need to eat at maintenance or higher. Then lift and lift 'heavy' (heavy is different for everyone - my "heavy" on preacher curls is 25lbs), you're going to have to get out of your comfort zone, and this is when a trainer is worth every penny and then some. (Two months ago I couldn't run for 5 minutes without needing to walk, today I just ran for 30 minutes and felt like I could keep going, because I was pushed and shown how to increase my endurance).
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Okay, so I am just getting started the past couple days and my overall goal will be to bulk up (right now I would best describe myself as a scrawny skinny fat type)
The thing I am wondering if I am doing wrong is.....I was told to work on cutting my belly fat down and toning up first, but would it be easier to try and bulk from here?
Some advice on the order I should do this in would be helpful!
Thanks in advance
Your stats will help you get responses - height, weight, what is your current workout, do you know your BF%.0 -
Personally, I would recommend hiring a personal trainer that is suited for your goals. A good one will not only create a workout plan based on your goals, ability, and schedule, but also help you with diet.
A bad trainer will also try to help you with your diet without being remotely qualified to do so. The odds seem to favor that a personal trainer offering diet advice will be in the latter category.4 -
As a rule, building muscle will CAUSE and HELP weight loss. Muscle tissue burns more calories even when not working out (resting metabolism goes up). So o would hit the weights. Using full-body exercises will help, too ... Try to work out on your feet. Press overhead STANDING. Swap out the bicep curls for thrusters. And work the large muscles ... Legs, lats, chest, shoulders...2
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Okay, so I am just getting started the past couple days and my overall goal will be to bulk up (right now I would best describe myself as a scrawny skinny fat type)
The thing I am wondering if I am doing wrong is.....I was told to work on cutting my belly fat down and toning up first, but would it be easier to try and bulk from here?
Some advice on the order I should do this in would be helpful!
Thanks in advance
Your stats will help you get responses - height, weight, what is your current workout, do you know your BF%.
I am 5’9 and just weighed in at 188lbs and 26% body fat according to my new scale. I currently do a full body work out with all compound movements 3 times per week.
Or at least that is the newest way a trainer at my gym told me to start training.0 -
if you have never lifted weight before i would start lifting weight while i reduce body fat. If you have been lifting for a while then i would focus on reducing body fat only. The reason i ask if you are new to lifting is because it is easier for someone who is new to gain muscle quicker then someone who has been doing it for years. If you are new to it then you can do both and make gains in both aspects. but personally if i was in your situation i would just lift weights. But i wouldn't dirty bulk.1
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jls1leather wrote: »As a rule, building muscle will CAUSE and HELP weight loss. Muscle tissue burns more calories even when not working out (resting metabolism goes up). So o would hit the weights. Using full-body exercises will help, too ... Try to work out on your feet. Press overhead STANDING. Swap out the bicep curls for thrusters. And work the large muscles ... Legs, lats, chest, shoulders...
Muscle only burns like 2-4 more calories per pound than fat does, so the effect is very minimal.
OP, you fall into the overweight category so you aren't "skinny fat". Focus on losing weight while lifting...you won't build much, if any, muscle in a calorie deficit, but lifting will help you keep as much as possible as you lose. I think the more experienced lifters don't recommend bulking until you reach a fairly low BF%.7 -
Right. A pound of fat burns around 2 calories per day, a pound of muscle burns around 6 calories per day. So even if you add 20 pounds of muscle (which can take years), you're talking an additional 80 calories burned per day. Not very significant.jls1leather wrote: »As a rule, building muscle will CAUSE and HELP weight loss. Muscle tissue burns more calories even when not working out (resting metabolism goes up). So o would hit the weights. Using full-body exercises will help, too ... Try to work out on your feet. Press overhead STANDING. Swap out the bicep curls for thrusters. And work the large muscles ... Legs, lats, chest, shoulders...
Muscle only burns like 2-4 more calories per pound than fat does, so the effect is very minimal.
Right again. A common guideline is to cut until one is around 10% bodyfat (for males), then bulk to about 15% bodyfat, repeat as necessary. The problem with bulking at a higher bodyfat percentage is that it slants the p-ratio (partitioning ratio) excessively toward fat gain, which pretty much defeats the purpose of bulking in the first place. Good read in (much) further detail here: https://bodyrecomposition.com/muscle-gain/calorie-partitioning-part-1.html/...I think the more experienced lifters don't recommend bulking until you reach a fairly low BF%...
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Okay, so I am just getting started the past couple days and my overall goal will be to bulk up (right now I would best describe myself as a scrawny skinny fat type)
The thing I am wondering if I am doing wrong is.....I was told to work on cutting my belly fat down and toning up first, but would it be easier to try and bulk from here?
Some advice on the order I should do this in would be helpful!
Thanks in advance
Your stats will help you get responses - height, weight, what is your current workout, do you know your BF%.
I am 5’9 and just weighed in at 188lbs and 26% body fat according to my new scale. I currently do a full body work out with all compound movements 3 times per week.
Or at least that is the newest way a trainer at my gym told me to start training.
So you are still in the overweight range for your height. My suggestion would be to eat at a deficit to lose more weight. Strength train to protect the muscle you currently have while you're losing.
Scales are not great at determining BF%, but even if it's off a bit your BF% is still high.
Understand that when you bulk (eat a surplus of calories so you can build muscle mass) by definition you will gain weight. It isn't possible to gain just muscle, so you will gain some fat as well. IMHO that would be counterproductive for you right now. Just my two cents!2 -
Thanks everyone, I will keep doing what I am doing! Pardon the silly question but, if I am not focusing on building muscle does that mean I should not worry about increasing the weight I lift too much since I won’t build any muscle(be getting stronger)0
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Thanks everyone, I will keep doing what I am doing! Pardon the silly question but, if I am not focusing on building muscle does that mean I should not worry about increasing the weight I lift too much since I won’t build any muscle(be getting stronger)
If you're relatively new to lifting, you can get stronger without adding muscle tissue (through neuromuscular adaptation, basically recruiting and using existing muscle tissue more efficiently), and you may even add a small amount of new mass at first. Also, you're trying to preserve muscle tissue, which works best if you challenge it.
I'd suggest continuing to add weight as long as you can without injury or excessive fatigue.3 -
Thanks everyone, I will keep doing what I am doing! Pardon the silly question but, if I am not focusing on building muscle does that mean I should not worry about increasing the weight I lift too much since I won’t build any muscle(be getting stronger)
If you're relatively new to lifting, you can get stronger without adding muscle tissue (through neuromuscular adaptation, basically recruiting and using existing muscle tissue more efficiently), and you may even add a small amount of new mass at first. Also, you're trying to preserve muscle tissue, which works best if you challenge it.
I'd suggest continuing to add weight as long as you can without injury or excessive fatigue.
That makes sense, thanks!
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Okay, so I am just getting started the past couple days and my overall goal will be to bulk up (right now I would best describe myself as a scrawny skinny fat type)
The thing I am wondering if I am doing wrong is.....I was told to work on cutting my belly fat down and toning up first, but would it be easier to try and bulk from here?
Some advice on the order I should do this in would be helpful!
Thanks in advance
Your stats will help you get responses - height, weight, what is your current workout, do you know your BF%.
I am 5’9 and just weighed in at 188lbs and 26% body fat according to my new scale. I currently do a full body work out with all compound movements 3 times per week.
Or at least that is the newest way a trainer at my gym told me to start training.
Sorry to be blunt but with those numbers you aren't skinny fat - you are just fat. Bulking would be a dreadful idea unless you are purely motivated by strength and size with no regard at all to body composition.
I suggest a moderate deficit, adequate to high protein and a good training regime (I agree with your trainer by the way.)
If you keep your deficit sensible you should be able to add some muscle (worst case is you would retain the maximum amount you personally could do).
You will definitely gain strength as you can gain an awful lot of strength without adding much/any actual muscle mass. Some of my lifts went up over 50% when I was dieting down from 196lbs to 170lbs (I'm the same height as you.)4 -
I don’t mind hearing brutal honesty, or being blunt...Skinny fat is just how one of the trainers described me when we spoke because literally all my fat is in my stomach area and I am scrawny everyplace else...We didn’t know my BF% at the time though.1
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I don’t mind hearing brutal honesty, or being blunt...Skinny fat is just how one of the trainers described me when we spoke because literally all my fat is in my stomach area and I am scrawny everyplace else...We didn’t know my BF% at the time though.
Ultimately, the choice is yours. But, as others have suggested, the general suggestion - for men - is to cut down until you are about 10% - 12% body fat and then to bulk.
You are roughly twice that suggested body fat. Because a bulk is associated with a caloric surplus you will, by definition, gain weight. And, some of that will be more body fat. That will add to your 23%. Now, that 23% would likely change if you were to follow a well-planned out training program that features progressive overload. Sure. But the surplus in calories would still add the body fat. The results *MIGHT NOT* be what you want.
Suggestion: find a program with progressive overload....spend some time getting that 23% down to something more manageable (whatever that might mean for you) and then re-assess!
I am currently doing my own program (not something really advisable, generally speaking) but after the next messocycle I am leaning heavily on P.H.A.T. I did Strong Lifts 5x5 several months ago and really enjoyed it. Maybe check that program out? It is all about squat, dead lift, bench, rows and OHP. I responded well (which means absolutely nothing for you....we are all so very different).
The article from http://bodyrecomposition.com is worth a read (and then read it again and then read it again). Lyle MacDonald is one of the smartest people out there and generally what he says you can take to the bank.
Lots of good advice in here. Ball is in your court, man! Don't be afraid to ask "stupid" questions....no such thing.0 -
I don’t mind hearing brutal honesty, or being blunt...Skinny fat is just how one of the trainers described me when we spoke because literally all my fat is in my stomach area and I am scrawny everyplace else...We didn’t know my BF% at the time though.
"Skinny fat" gets thrown around a lot and it's often misused. The more clinical description of it is MONW - "Metabolically Obese, Normal Weight". It describes somebody who is at a normal/healthy weight, but an obese bodyfat percentage. At 5'9" and 188 lbs., your BMI is 27.8, which is smack in the middle of the "overweight" category.
I agree with the advice above that bulking would be a bad idea for you right now. You'd be predisposed to gain more fat than muscle, which wouldn't be helpful toward your goals. Sooner or later you'll have to cut to reduce the bodyfat, and gaining more will just make your cut longer when the time comes.
As sijomial said, set a reasonable (not excessive) deficit, adequate protein intake, a well designed training program - and lots of patience. I also agree with your trainer's advice to do a 3-day full body program (as long as it's well designed and not just some random assortment of exercises thrown together willy-nilly).0 -
I don’t mind hearing brutal honesty, or being blunt...Skinny fat is just how one of the trainers described me when we spoke because literally all my fat is in my stomach area and I am scrawny everyplace else...We didn’t know my BF% at the time though.
"Skinny fat" gets thrown around a lot and it's often misused. The more clinical description of it is MONW - "Metabolically Obese, Normal Weight". It describes somebody who is at a normal/healthy weight, but an obese bodyfat percentage. At 5'9" and 188 lbs., your BMI is 27.8, which is smack in the middle of the "overweight" category.
I agree with the advice above that bulking would be a bad idea for you right now. You'd be predisposed to gain more fat than muscle, which wouldn't be helpful toward your goals. Sooner or later you'll have to cut to reduce the bodyfat, and gaining more will just make your cut longer when the time comes.
As sijomial said, set a reasonable (not excessive) deficit, adequate protein intake, a well designed training program - and lots of patience. I also agree with your trainer's advice to do a 3-day full body program (as long as it's well designed and not just some random assortment of exercises thrown together willy-nilly).
He set me up to do Squats 5x5, Overhead Shoulder Press 5x5, Bench Press 5x5, Dumbbell Curls 3x10 and Tricep Pulldowns 3x10
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Eat less, move more. Reduce carbs and implement cardio into your workout schedule on your off days (1hour) and include pushups, planks, burpees to burn that fat around your gut, first, before anything like heavy lifting. Pyramid: foundation first then worry about the finer points later.7
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I did 2 miles on the treadmill today! My running goal is to be able to do a 5k my friends work is sponsoring in October. I walked more than I ran today, but I will fix that!0
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civlengr88 wrote: »Eat less, move more. Reduce carbs and implement cardio into your workout schedule on your off days (1hour) and include pushups, planks, burpees to burn that fat around your gut, first, before anything like heavy lifting. Pyramid: foundation first then worry about the finer points later.
1) There's no reason to reduce carbs as long as he's in a calorie deficit. Reducing carbs doesn't create fat loss, reducing calories does.
2) You can't spot reduce fat from your midsection (or anywhere else). No diet, supplement or exercise will do that.2 -
I did 2 miles on the treadmill today! My running goal is to be able to do a 5k my friends work is sponsoring in October. I walked more than I ran today, but I will fix that!
October gives you plenty of time to be ready for a 5K. You may want to look into the C25K (Couch to 5K) training programs - they're very popular and have been used by a lot of people as a gateway into running. And it puts you on a good schedule to make improvement while minimizing the chance of injuries from pushing too hard too soon.1 -
I did 2 miles on the treadmill today! My running goal is to be able to do a 5k my friends work is sponsoring in October. I walked more than I ran today, but I will fix that!
October gives you plenty of time to be ready for a 5K. You may want to look into the C25K (Couch to 5K) training programs - they're very popular and have been used by a lot of people as a gateway into running. And it puts you on a good schedule to make improvement while minimizing the chance of injuries from pushing too hard too soon.
Thanks, I favorited a page with a bunch of different programs earlier so I will look into that one! You have been very informative for me so far, would you mind a friend request?
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I did 2 miles on the treadmill today! My running goal is to be able to do a 5k my friends work is sponsoring in October. I walked more than I ran today, but I will fix that!
October gives you plenty of time to be ready for a 5K. You may want to look into the C25K (Couch to 5K) training programs - they're very popular and have been used by a lot of people as a gateway into running. And it puts you on a good schedule to make improvement while minimizing the chance of injuries from pushing too hard too soon.
Thanks, I favorited a page with a bunch of different programs earlier so I will look into that one! You have been very informative for me so far, would you mind a friend request?
Not at all. But please bear in mind that I rarely post/comment anything on my newsfeed here, because MFP's newsfeed interface is so primitive, broken and ad-infested.
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lynn_glenmont wrote: »Personally, I would recommend hiring a personal trainer that is suited for your goals. A good one will not only create a workout plan based on your goals, ability, and schedule, but also help you with diet.
A bad trainer will also try to help you with your diet without being remotely qualified to do so. The odds seem to favor that a personal trainer offering diet advice will be in the latter category.
And that's why it is so important to shop around and talk to multiple trainers, get references, get thier credentials and so forth. There are some bad ones out there, there are also some really good ones. You just got to find the best one for you. My school offers a personal training program for students (you take it as a class), and is generally for the student athletes, but any student can sign up. You get one of the 4 head trainers depending on your goals and one of the two dieticians build a program for you (all 6 have doctorates in various human physiology, nursing, and/or kinesiology fields). A lot of major universities have similar programs, some require you to he a student, others don't (mind you it's not cheap if you're not a student - but you do get experts in thier fields).0
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