Hyphenated-Americans

vienna_h

ok, well i don't think hyphenating is stupid.

if your white, your prob not getting discriminated against very much, and in the eyes of almost everyone, which part of europe your from doesn't matter.

but america is very racist, race matters. your race and heritage is a huge part of your identity. i think it's very understandable that many visible minorities would want to hyphenate.

And presumably labelling people of Caribbean descent who can go back many generations of ancestors who've never been anywhere near Africa as "African-Americans" because they're black and consequently might be African so we'll just make that assumption is a valid solution against racism?

I don't understand your point. I didn't say it was a "solution" to racism, I said since racism is so pervasive, a person of visible minority may understandably make their heritage part of their ancestry, since they are gonna be judged by it every day anyway. Not that much of a stretch lol.

Also, still not getting why people are making a distinction between being Black and having African ancestors. Do people not realize that all Black people have African ancestors?

UsedToBeHusky

I'd also like to point out that there are LOTS of Americans who weren't born here.

MyChocolateDiet

Honestly, if you have not done any geneaological research on your family, then you can't really claim ANY ethnicity.

What I would like to know is how do other countries define race? The United States is NOT the only county with a diverse population. How is a "black" British person defined by his/her government? Or is this a demographic that is even defined in other countries?

When I've gone to other countries, they have known I was "american" off the bat.

Heck even when I've gone to other states, they have known I was "californian" off the bat.

Even in Mexico, they know I'm, not really a Mexican. That's just a role I play here for the comfort of the people at the parties I go to who notice "one of these things is not like the others".

Colombianmocha

I'm Jamaican born with a Colombian mother and a Jamaican father. I identify with both cultures but if asked I immediately answer that I am Jamaican. This is were I was born and have lived the majority of my life. Have never had reason to identify myself as a Jamaican-Colombian, until now that is:)

tubbyelmo

I am Ginger-American . . . we are a dying breed and I'd like my own official sub group, thank you.

Hiya, I'm Ginger-Scottish, we might be distant cousins?

vienna_h

ok, well i don't think hyphenating is stupid.

if your white, your prob not getting discriminated against very much, and in the eyes of almost everyone, which part of europe your from doesn't matter.

but america is very racist, race matters. your race and heritage is a huge part of your identity. i think it's very understandable that many visible minorities would want to hyphenate.

And presumably labelling people of Caribbean descent who can go back many generations of ancestors who've never been anywhere near Africa as "African-Americans" because they're black and consequently might be African so we'll just make that assumption is a valid solution against racism?

Wait..what?...totally serious here, can you elaborate your point? I think I see what you're getting at but not sure if I've EVER heard another person make this distinction.

My point is that, from my experience there (which granted isn't extensive, but I've certainly witnessed it), there are people in the US who, if they see a black person, will refer to them as African-American. This is with no evidence at all that they have any recent roots in Africa. There are black people native to Caribbean nations, nothern South American nations, Pacific Island nations, anywhere vaguely equatorial. Why is the assumption made that they're of recent African descent?

It happens here, but since Asian (to mean Indian subcontinent, not far east) is the only geographic-specific group to get its own name, that's the only one it's noticeable with. I've heard people from northern Africa (Egypt, Algeria, Morocco etc), Arab nations and Turkey referred to as 'Asian' because people see a skin tone and jump to an assumption.

:noway: How do you think Black people got to the Caribbean and the Americas? They aren't the natives who once live there, they are decedents of AFRICAN SLAVES brought there a long long time ago. Pacific Islanders are not Black either.

BeachIron

Honestly, if you have not done any geneaological research on your family, then you can't really claim ANY ethnicity.

What I would like to know is how do other countries define race? The United States is NOT the only county with a diverse population. How is a "black" British person defined by his/her government? Or is this a demographic that is even defined in other countries?

When I've gone to other countries, they have known I was "american" off the bat.

Heck even when I've gone to other states, they have known I was "californian" off the bat.

Even in Mexico, they know I'm, not really a Mexican. That's just a role I play here for the comfort of the people at the parties I go to who notice "one of these things is not like the others".

One never feels more "American" than when living overseas.

ItsCasey

This sort of thing annoys me, too. My last name is Scottish. There is actually a clan with my name. But I wasn't born in Scotland. I've never been there. I never met any of my ancestors who were from there. I am not Scottish. I am a 6th generation American, which is a little too American to be calling myself anything else.

BeachIron

ok, well i don't think hyphenating is stupid.

if your white, your prob not getting discriminated against very much, and in the eyes of almost everyone, which part of europe your from doesn't matter.

but america is very racist, race matters. your race and heritage is a huge part of your identity. i think it's very understandable that many visible minorities would want to hyphenate.

And presumably labelling people of Caribbean descent who can go back many generations of ancestors who've never been anywhere near Africa as "African-Americans" because they're black and consequently might be African so we'll just make that assumption is a valid solution against racism?

Wait..what?...totally serious here, can you elaborate your point? I think I see what you're getting at but not sure if I've EVER heard another person make this distinction.

My point is that, from my experience there (which granted isn't extensive, but I've certainly witnessed it), there are people in the US who, if they see a black person, will refer to them as African-American. This is with no evidence at all that they have any recent roots in Africa. There are black people native to Caribbean nations, nothern South American nations, Pacific Island nations, anywhere vaguely equatorial. Why is the assumption made that they're of recent African descent?

It happens here, but since Asian (to mean Indian subcontinent, not far east) is the only geographic-specific group to get its own name, that's the only one it's noticeable with. I've heard people from northern Africa (Egypt, Algeria, Morocco etc), Arab nations and Turkey referred to as 'Asian' because people see a skin tone and jump to an assumption.

:noway: How do you think Black people got to the Caribbean and the Americas? They aren't the natives who once live there, they are decedents of AFRICAN SLAVES brought there a long long time ago. Pacific Islanders are not Black either.

While I strongly agree with you to about 90%, then there are the Maori and Aboriginees who are "black" but not of African origin, unless we are speaking in terms of "we are all from Africa" which is quite true. And not all "African-Americans" are descended from slaves. I went to school with several guys who were Nigerian, as in from Nigeria but moved here.

UsedToBeHusky

Ethnicity is really only important to census-takers and policy-makers.

To the world, you're just American.

Zomoniac

ok, well i don't think hyphenating is stupid.

if your white, your prob not getting discriminated against very much, and in the eyes of almost everyone, which part of europe your from doesn't matter.

but america is very racist, race matters. your race and heritage is a huge part of your identity. i think it's very understandable that many visible minorities would want to hyphenate.

And presumably labelling people of Caribbean descent who can go back many generations of ancestors who've never been anywhere near Africa as "African-Americans" because they're black and consequently might be African so we'll just make that assumption is a valid solution against racism?

Wait..what?...totally serious here, can you elaborate your point? I think I see what you're getting at but not sure if I've EVER heard another person make this distinction.

My point is that, from my experience there (which granted isn't extensive, but I've certainly witnessed it), there are people in the US who, if they see a black person, will refer to them as African-American. This is with no evidence at all that they have any recent roots in Africa. There are black people native to Caribbean nations, nothern South American nations, Pacific Island nations, anywhere vaguely equatorial. Why is the assumption made that they're of recent African descent?

It happens here, but since Asian (to mean Indian subcontinent, not far east) is the only geographic-specific group to get its own name, that's the only one it's noticeable with. I've heard people from northern Africa (Egypt, Algeria, Morocco etc), Arab nations and Turkey referred to as 'Asian' because people see a skin tone and jump to an assumption.

:noway: How do you think Black people got to the Caribbean and the Americas? They aren't the natives who once live there, they are decedents of AFRICAN SLAVES brought there a long long time ago. Pacific Islanders are not Black either.

You said it yourself; a long long time ago. At what point does it stop being of relevance? There have been black people in the Caribbean for longer than the word America has existed.

MyChocolateDiet

This sort of thing annoys me, too. My last name is Scottish. There is actually a clan with my name. But I wasn't born in Scotland. I've never been there. I never met any of my ancestors who were from there. I am not Scottish. I am a 6th generation American, which is a little too American to be calling myself anything else.

Inorite? So let's say you put on your Kilt and I'll put on my Poncho and let's belt out some Mariachi music on the bagpipes.

And we can both bring our tiny doggies.

MissTattoo

I'm black. I wish people would stop calling me African American.

Laces_0ut

:noway: How do you think Black people got to the Caribbean and the Americas? They aren't the natives who once live there, they are decedents of AFRICAN SLAVES brought there a long long time ago. Pacific Islanders are not Black either.

if you go back far enough we are all Africans.

ravengal44646

When I 'm forced to call myself anything, I just call myself "black" . I don't call myself African-American. I know nothing about my historical lineage any farther back than the fact that my ancestors came north at the tail end of The Great Migration. I really just want to be human.

jetlag

First, my potted history:

I'm half Canadian, half American and a naturalised Brit. Born in Germany, grew up in America. My mother's maternal grandmother emigrated from England (Gloucestershire), to Canada way back when. My mother was born in Canada, as were both her parents.

I then emigrated to the UK back in the 80s. (Bit of a wasted trip on my GGMa Emily's part, you might argue, but I digress).

To my mum's dying day she called herself Scottish (as her maiden name was Fraser) AND Welsh (because, despite her grandmother being born in England, her birth was registered in Wales, as that was where the nearest registry office was).

My mother was neither Scottish nor Welsh, by any stretch of the imagination, and it infuriated me that she insisted on calling herself that. I've lived in England for more than half my life and, even though I am British, I will never be English in my head. My nephew, who is like 5th or 6th generation, insists on calling himself Irish. HE'S NOT IRISH, HE'S NEVER EVEN BEEN TO IRELAND; EITHER OF THEM!

It drives me mental when people refer to themselves as Irish-American or African-American or whatever. If you have the passport, or even if you were raised heavily in the culture, then call yourself that, but not just because it's where your ancestors were born.

randomtai

I really just want to be human.

:drinker:

ravengal44646

Civil discussions like these give me hope.

jetlag

Honestly, if you have not done any geneaological research on your family, then you can't really claim ANY ethnicity.

What I would like to know is how do other countries define race? The United States is NOT the only county with a diverse population. How is a "black" British person defined by his/her government? Or is this a demographic that is even defined in other countries?

When I've gone to other countries, they have known I was "american" off the bat.

Heck even when I've gone to other states, they have known I was "californian" off the bat.

Even in Mexico, they know I'm, not really a Mexican. That's just a role I play here for the comfort of the people at the parties I go to who notice "one of these things is not like the others".

One never feels more "American" than when living overseas.

Amen to that.

vienna_h

ok, well i don't think hyphenating is stupid.

if your white, your prob not getting discriminated against very much, and in the eyes of almost everyone, which part of europe your from doesn't matter.

but america is very racist, race matters. your race and heritage is a huge part of your identity. i think it's very understandable that many visible minorities would want to hyphenate.

And presumably labelling people of Caribbean descent who can go back many generations of ancestors who've never been anywhere near Africa as "African-Americans" because they're black and consequently might be African so we'll just make that assumption is a valid solution against racism?

Wait..what?...totally serious here, can you elaborate your point? I think I see what you're getting at but not sure if I've EVER heard another person make this distinction.

My point is that, from my experience there (which granted isn't extensive, but I've certainly witnessed it), there are people in the US who, if they see a black person, will refer to them as African-American. This is with no evidence at all that they have any recent roots in Africa. There are black people native to Caribbean nations, nothern South American nations, Pacific Island nations, anywhere vaguely equatorial. Why is the assumption made that they're of recent African descent?

It happens here, but since Asian (to mean Indian subcontinent, not far east) is the only geographic-specific group to get its own name, that's the only one it's noticeable with. I've heard people from northern Africa (Egypt, Algeria, Morocco etc), Arab nations and Turkey referred to as 'Asian' because people see a skin tone and jump to an assumption.

:noway: How do you think Black people got to the Caribbean and the Americas? They aren't the natives who once live there, they are decedents of AFRICAN SLAVES brought there a long long time ago. Pacific Islanders are not Black either.

You said it yourself; a long long time ago. At what point does it stop being of relevance? There have been black people in the Caribbean for longer than the word America has existed.

Africans were brought to the Americas and the Caribean since the begining of European Colonialism, it wasn't that long ago. Colonialism is still very relevant, in fact, it's the reason for this ENTIRE CONVERSATION. We wouldn't be talking about hyphenation at all if it wasn't for our recent colonial experience.

The first modern humans leaving Africa roughly 150,000 years ago, not relevant.