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Gullible Naive Society or Just down right Lazy?
Replies
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Yet that is the truth. My wife, with multiple advanced degrees is on some pre-packaged food program now. She's smart enough to use the food scale, that she bought years ago and weight out food and eat it.
But instead, she believes that she much have 5 small meals every day and one lean and green meal, and she cannot exercise...
Meanwhile, all I've done since 14 Feb, well really 15 Feb, since we "blew it out" with a home cook Valentines Day meal is start tracking what I eat and, following the advice of my diabetes coach/dietitian which is stay under 2250 calories/day and under 225g of carbs/day 60g/meal and 45g/day in snacks.
Other than those days where I might ride my bike for two or three hours, I pretty much follow those guidelines and have dropped over 45 pounds, seeing my A1C and BG values return to the normal range.
I was already exercising, so that wasn't the issue. Just what was on my fork.
No heroic measures.
I've spoken with people who have noticed and they ask what I'm doing. Many times it's people at the gym, so they know I was already working out. I tell them I just watch what is on the end of my fork, that you cannot outwork your fork. I've shared my food log with them. Most cannot believe it's just paying attention to what I eat. Yet, really, that's all it is.
They want to believe there is some big, external factor, some lever they can push or pull to get more benefit than effort. That's the impression I get.
It would probably be better for me if I just said I was on the bacon and donuts diet, and suggest they google it....IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »When I lost all my weight, people would ask how I did it, I would say (in the simplest way) ate less, moved more, they would get the most disappointed look. So my vote is Lazy.
That's the answer that makes you feel the best about yourself.
The truth is, they were looking for more than a catch phrase. They weren't looking for a calorie count and exercise program. They were looking for honest, "how did you get past the challenges" answer.
And you gave them: I'm disciplined and you're lazy.
Bravo. Heavy sarcasm.
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IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »When I lost all my weight, people would ask how I did it, I would say (in the simplest way) ate less, moved more, they would get the most disappointed look. So my vote is Lazy.
That's the answer that makes you feel the best about yourself.
The truth is, they were looking for more than a catch phrase. They weren't looking for a calorie count and exercise program. They were looking for honest, "how did you get past the challenges" answer.
And you gave them: I'm disciplined and you're lazy.
Bravo. Heavy sarcasm.
Maybe that's more or less the truth. Eat less, move more isn't a catch phrase. It's simple, just not easy. They were looking for an easy button.
No, they weren't!!!!!!!!
I know, because I WAS THAT PERSON. I was that person with the gym memberships and the tapes and the diets and NO PROGRESS.
I wasn't looking for catch phrases. I was looking for real advice.
You go to business school because business is an entire skill set to learn. A simple profit = income - expenses IS NOT REAL BUSINESS ADVICE.
Losing weight took an enormous amount of new skills and habits I had to learn. It took a lot longer than I expected, but I'm also a lot fitter than I ever thought possible.
I can bench press 205lbs and squat 365. I can do backflips. I can swim laps and run races. I can eat clean.
Is any of that "the easy button?"
We aren't looking for "the easy button." We were looking for the "payroll is due, and the salesmen haven't closed the sales, and the bank is still looking over the loan papers, how do we get through" advice.
Cashflow and Net Worth are two different things, and you have to master both to succeed.
But, go ahead, and keep telling people about your superior discipline and lack of excuses.
27 -
IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »When I lost all my weight, people would ask how I did it, I would say (in the simplest way) ate less, moved more, they would get the most disappointed look. So my vote is Lazy.
That's the answer that makes you feel the best about yourself.
The truth is, they were looking for more than a catch phrase. They weren't looking for a calorie count and exercise program. They were looking for honest, "how did you get past the challenges" answer.
And you gave them: I'm disciplined and you're lazy.
Bravo. Heavy sarcasm.
Maybe that's more or less the truth. Eat less, move more isn't a catch phrase. It's simple, just not easy. They were looking for an easy button.
No, they weren't!!!!!!!!
I know, because I WAS THAT PERSON. I was that person with the gym memberships and the tapes and the diets and NO PROGRESS.
I wasn't looking for catch phrases. I was looking for real advice.
You go to business school because business is an entire skill set to learn. A simple profit = income - expenses IS NOT REAL BUSINESS ADVICE.
Losing weight took an enormous amount of new skills and habits I had to learn. It took a lot longer than I expected, but I'm also a lot fitter than I ever thought possible.
I can bench press 205lbs and squat 365. I can do backflips. I can swim laps and run races. I can eat clean.
Is any of that "the easy button?"
We aren't looking for "the easy button." We were looking for the "payroll is due, and the salesmen haven't closed the sales, and the bank is still looking over the loan papers, how do we get through" advice.
Cashflow and Net Worth are two different things, and you have to master both to succeed.
But, go ahead, and keep telling people about your superior discipline and lack of excuses.
Since you seem to be stating that everything in here should adhere to the highest possible standard of advice for how best to lose weight perhaps you can explain how your opening statement in this thread qualifies?IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »There is such a thing called hyperpalatability. That's why people can eat a whole bag of chips or fries. They figured out the point of natural satiation - the point where you body has figured out it has eaten enough. Then they found out how to make you want to eat past that point. They intentionally make foods that is hard to stop eating, because of it's hyperpalatability, which produces a dopamine response, which is the same chemical that makes it hard to get off your phone or stop playing video games.
Applying the very standard you appear to be applying to everyone else how would you rate this statement in terms of advice on how best to lose weight? How does blaming food manufacturers start you down the road to weight loss? How is this better advice that saying it is important to take personal responsibility and that discipline is a key aspect of any endevour to improve oneself. Sure...that advice might be too trite to be directly useful...but it at least it isn't terrible advice.14 -
IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »When I lost all my weight, people would ask how I did it, I would say (in the simplest way) ate less, moved more, they would get the most disappointed look. So my vote is Lazy.
That's the answer that makes you feel the best about yourself.
The truth is, they were looking for more than a catch phrase. They weren't looking for a calorie count and exercise program. They were looking for honest, "how did you get past the challenges" answer.
And you gave them: I'm disciplined and you're lazy.
Bravo. Heavy sarcasm.
Maybe that's more or less the truth. Eat less, move more isn't a catch phrase. It's simple, just not easy. They were looking for an easy button.
No, they weren't!!!!!!!!
I know, because I WAS THAT PERSON. I was that person with the gym memberships and the tapes and the diets and NO PROGRESS.
I wasn't looking for catch phrases. I was looking for real advice.
You go to business school because business is an entire skill set to learn. A simple profit = income - expenses IS NOT REAL BUSINESS ADVICE.
Losing weight took an enormous amount of new skills and habits I had to learn. It took a lot longer than I expected, but I'm also a lot fitter than I ever thought possible.
I can bench press 205lbs and squat 365. I can do backflips. I can swim laps and run races. I can eat clean.
Is any of that "the easy button?"
We aren't looking for "the easy button." We were looking for the "payroll is due, and the salesmen haven't closed the sales, and the bank is still looking over the loan papers, how do we get through" advice.
Cashflow and Net Worth are two different things, and you have to master both to succeed.
But, go ahead, and keep telling people about your superior discipline and lack of excuses.
You are projecting your motivations and experiences onto others. I was also that person. I suspect many others were as well.
Until I was ready to make the changes, no one could have made that sale on how to do it. No one. Same with finances. Until I was ready, no one could have made me change. I wanted it all, but not enough to do the work. I needed to be ready. Once I was ready, I realized that the information and support had been there all along. Accepting that still didn't make it easy.16 -
Aaron_K123 wrote: »IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »There is such a thing called hyperpalatability. That's why people can eat a whole bag of chips or fries. They figured out the point of natural satiation - the point where you body has figured out it has eaten enough. Then they found out how to make you want to eat past that point. They intentionally make foods that is hard to stop eating, because of it's hyperpalatability, which produces a dopamine response, which is the same chemical that makes it hard to get off your phone or stop playing video games.
Since you seem to be stating that everything in here should adhere to the highest possible standard of advice for how best to lose weight perhaps you can explain how your opening statement in this thread qualifies?
Applying the very standard you appear to be applying to everyone else how would you rate this statement in terms of advice on how best to lose weight?
Sure. All you had to do was not to be a quote miner, and just take the message in context. See bold:IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »
I have lost a lot of weight, and go to the gym nearly every day, for years and I lift heavy. This is my 2 cents on the topic:
I think for many people they are both habituated and addicted to certain foods. When you consider 1) food scientists were tasked by governments with making calorie dense foods to solve malnutrition and 2) by companies to find the combination that pushes past the satiation point, what they call hyperpalatability, you understand that people are going to have a hard time dieting. Because habits are hard to break and addictions are hard to break and so you have both the power of habit and the power of addiction to break all at once. Combine that with cold turkey not being an option, it means you have to live close to and be surrounded by the source of that addiction. You have to live to eat, so the amount of self-regulation required is really big.
There is a ginormous amount of new habits and skill sets one has to learn and practice consistently to be able to successfully lose weight. Going to the gym? What are you going to do with your hair afterward? You are going to eat more vegetables? How do you even cook them? Speaking of cooking, when are you going to find time for that? Most people don't consider what is for dinner until they want to eat it. Healthy eating requires preplanning and organization around food that most Americans don't do, because Americans are not big on cooking.
Then they have to alter their palate, which takes time. Rice cakes and green tea? How gross when going from Doritos and Coke.
It's hard. If it wasn't, more people would be slim.
People are looking for whatever they can grasp to help.
Most of the items you listed are being hawked by fitspiration Instagram people who LOOK like they know what they are talking about, even those who have lost major weight often hawk teas and cleanses.
As for sweat belts, I see many very slim women and even trainers use them, but they are just using them for bloating, not weight loss. People new on their journey are looking for any kind of loss, even if it's just water weight.
Corsets do work in terms of inches, but it doesn't make people lose fat - the fat (and organs) just get pushed and squished to the lower belly area. Gross.
Whatever these things are, it is a step in the process. Just as babies don't just get up and start walking, and most addicts try stopping a few times before being successful, so too are people who look to weight loss fads and diets. If they don't give up, they'll get there eventually.
My2cents.
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IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »
Sure. All you had to do was not to be a quote miner, and just take the message in context. See bold:
I quote mined you? I quoted your entire post. What do you mean I quote mined? Did you not say what I quoted?
And again, hold up that mirror. You are claiming everyone's post boils down to "its easy, I'm perfect, all you need is discipline and personal responsibility" which is a total misrepresentation.
No one in this entire thread has said even once that losing weight is easy but yet you claim that everyone has. You don't even quote mine, you just strawman. When you have actually quoted back something I said in this forum I agreed with what I said, I didn't complain that you were "quote mining" me. So do you stand by your statement or not?
So I ask again, how does your statement equate to good advice about weight loss given you are holding everyone else to that standard?10 -
nutmegoreo wrote: »IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »When I lost all my weight, people would ask how I did it, I would say (in the simplest way) ate less, moved more, they would get the most disappointed look. So my vote is Lazy.
That's the answer that makes you feel the best about yourself.
The truth is, they were looking for more than a catch phrase. They weren't looking for a calorie count and exercise program. They were looking for honest, "how did you get past the challenges" answer.
And you gave them: I'm disciplined and you're lazy.
Bravo. Heavy sarcasm.
Maybe that's more or less the truth. Eat less, move more isn't a catch phrase. It's simple, just not easy. They were looking for an easy button.
No, they weren't!!!!!!!!
I know, because I WAS THAT PERSON. I was that person with the gym memberships and the tapes and the diets and NO PROGRESS.
I wasn't looking for catch phrases. I was looking for real advice.
You go to business school because business is an entire skill set to learn. A simple profit = income - expenses IS NOT REAL BUSINESS ADVICE.
Losing weight took an enormous amount of new skills and habits I had to learn. It took a lot longer than I expected, but I'm also a lot fitter than I ever thought possible.
I can bench press 205lbs and squat 365. I can do backflips. I can swim laps and run races. I can eat clean.
Is any of that "the easy button?"
We aren't looking for "the easy button." We were looking for the "payroll is due, and the salesmen haven't closed the sales, and the bank is still looking over the loan papers, how do we get through" advice.
Cashflow and Net Worth are two different things, and you have to master both to succeed.
But, go ahead, and keep telling people about your superior discipline and lack of excuses.
You are projecting your motivations and experiences onto others. I was also that person. I suspect many others were as well.
Until I was ready to make the changes, no one could have made that sale on how to do it. No one. Same with finances. Until I was ready, no one could have made me change. I wanted it all, but not enough to do the work. I needed to be ready. Once I was ready, I realized that the information and support had been there all along. Accepting that still didn't make it easy.
And I was doing the work. And I wanted the advice. And I got trite *kitten* advice like eat less, move more. Which I was already doing to the best of my ability and all I had to show for it was insulting comments like I was lazy or not drink soda (which I wasn't).
Maybe next time take it down a notch and try actually being helpful to people if they are actually struggling.
Or, just do you and tell the cigarette addict to just not buy any cigarettes.
I hope that maybe the next time someone asks you, you'll remember this conversation and not be so quick to throw out a catch phrase.
They are not looking for the "what." They are looking for the "how."17 -
Aaron_K123 wrote: »IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »
Sure. All you had to do was not to be a quote miner, and just take the message in context. See bold:
I quote mined you? I quoted your entire post. What do you mean I quote mined? Did you not say what I quoted?
And again, hold up that mirror. You are claiming everyone's post boils down to "its easy, I'm perfect, all you need is discipline and personal responsibility" which is a total misrepresentation.
No one in this entire thread has said even once that losing weight is easy but yet you claim that everyone has. You don't even quote mine, you just strawman. When you have actually quoted back something I said in this forum I agreed with what I said, I didn't complain that you were "quote mining" me. So do you stand by your statement or not?
So I ask again, how does your statement equate to good advice about weight loss given you are holding everyone else to that standard?
Now you are using words like "strawman," which indicates to me that you care less about the topic at hand and more about winning a debate.
Using strawmen is a debate strategy. So, next time, apply all that knowledge you have about debate techniques when someone asks you how to lose weight.
Instead of replying, eat less, move more, or, "make the decision" or "do the work," say something like, if you're hungry at night after dinner try xyz to keep your calories at or under your goal.
You know, strategies. Like a compassionate human.
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IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »nutmegoreo wrote: »IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »When I lost all my weight, people would ask how I did it, I would say (in the simplest way) ate less, moved more, they would get the most disappointed look. So my vote is Lazy.
That's the answer that makes you feel the best about yourself.
The truth is, they were looking for more than a catch phrase. They weren't looking for a calorie count and exercise program. They were looking for honest, "how did you get past the challenges" answer.
And you gave them: I'm disciplined and you're lazy.
Bravo. Heavy sarcasm.
Maybe that's more or less the truth. Eat less, move more isn't a catch phrase. It's simple, just not easy. They were looking for an easy button.
No, they weren't!!!!!!!!
I know, because I WAS THAT PERSON. I was that person with the gym memberships and the tapes and the diets and NO PROGRESS.
I wasn't looking for catch phrases. I was looking for real advice.
You go to business school because business is an entire skill set to learn. A simple profit = income - expenses IS NOT REAL BUSINESS ADVICE.
Losing weight took an enormous amount of new skills and habits I had to learn. It took a lot longer than I expected, but I'm also a lot fitter than I ever thought possible.
I can bench press 205lbs and squat 365. I can do backflips. I can swim laps and run races. I can eat clean.
Is any of that "the easy button?"
We aren't looking for "the easy button." We were looking for the "payroll is due, and the salesmen haven't closed the sales, and the bank is still looking over the loan papers, how do we get through" advice.
Cashflow and Net Worth are two different things, and you have to master both to succeed.
But, go ahead, and keep telling people about your superior discipline and lack of excuses.
You are projecting your motivations and experiences onto others. I was also that person. I suspect many others were as well.
Until I was ready to make the changes, no one could have made that sale on how to do it. No one. Same with finances. Until I was ready, no one could have made me change. I wanted it all, but not enough to do the work. I needed to be ready. Once I was ready, I realized that the information and support had been there all along. Accepting that still didn't make it easy.
And I was doing the work. And I wanted the advice. And I got trite *kitten* advice like eat less, move more. Which I was already doing to the best of my ability and all I had to show for it was insulting comments like I was lazy or not drink soda (which I wasn't).
Maybe next time take it down a notch and try actually being helpful to people if they are actually struggling.
Or, just do you and tell the cigarette addict to just not buy any cigarettes.
I hope that maybe the next time someone asks you, you'll remember this conversation and not be so quick to throw out a catch phrase.
They are not looking for the "what." They are looking for the "how."
Simple question. Are you owed advice?8 -
Aaron_K123 wrote: »IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »nutmegoreo wrote: »IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »When I lost all my weight, people would ask how I did it, I would say (in the simplest way) ate less, moved more, they would get the most disappointed look. So my vote is Lazy.
That's the answer that makes you feel the best about yourself.
The truth is, they were looking for more than a catch phrase. They weren't looking for a calorie count and exercise program. They were looking for honest, "how did you get past the challenges" answer.
And you gave them: I'm disciplined and you're lazy.
Bravo. Heavy sarcasm.
Maybe that's more or less the truth. Eat less, move more isn't a catch phrase. It's simple, just not easy. They were looking for an easy button.
No, they weren't!!!!!!!!
I know, because I WAS THAT PERSON. I was that person with the gym memberships and the tapes and the diets and NO PROGRESS.
I wasn't looking for catch phrases. I was looking for real advice.
You go to business school because business is an entire skill set to learn. A simple profit = income - expenses IS NOT REAL BUSINESS ADVICE.
Losing weight took an enormous amount of new skills and habits I had to learn. It took a lot longer than I expected, but I'm also a lot fitter than I ever thought possible.
I can bench press 205lbs and squat 365. I can do backflips. I can swim laps and run races. I can eat clean.
Is any of that "the easy button?"
We aren't looking for "the easy button." We were looking for the "payroll is due, and the salesmen haven't closed the sales, and the bank is still looking over the loan papers, how do we get through" advice.
Cashflow and Net Worth are two different things, and you have to master both to succeed.
But, go ahead, and keep telling people about your superior discipline and lack of excuses.
You are projecting your motivations and experiences onto others. I was also that person. I suspect many others were as well.
Until I was ready to make the changes, no one could have made that sale on how to do it. No one. Same with finances. Until I was ready, no one could have made me change. I wanted it all, but not enough to do the work. I needed to be ready. Once I was ready, I realized that the information and support had been there all along. Accepting that still didn't make it easy.
And I was doing the work. And I wanted the advice. And I got trite *kitten* advice like eat less, move more. Which I was already doing to the best of my ability and all I had to show for it was insulting comments like I was lazy or not drink soda (which I wasn't).
Maybe next time take it down a notch and try actually being helpful to people if they are actually struggling.
Or, just do you and tell the cigarette addict to just not buy any cigarettes.
I hope that maybe the next time someone asks you, you'll remember this conversation and not be so quick to throw out a catch phrase.
They are not looking for the "what." They are looking for the "how."
Simple question. Are you owed advice?
Oh, you are one of those people. Never mind.
-A man convinced against his will is of the same opinion still. - Carnegie
14 -
IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »nutmegoreo wrote: »IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »When I lost all my weight, people would ask how I did it, I would say (in the simplest way) ate less, moved more, they would get the most disappointed look. So my vote is Lazy.
That's the answer that makes you feel the best about yourself.
The truth is, they were looking for more than a catch phrase. They weren't looking for a calorie count and exercise program. They were looking for honest, "how did you get past the challenges" answer.
And you gave them: I'm disciplined and you're lazy.
Bravo. Heavy sarcasm.
Maybe that's more or less the truth. Eat less, move more isn't a catch phrase. It's simple, just not easy. They were looking for an easy button.
No, they weren't!!!!!!!!
I know, because I WAS THAT PERSON. I was that person with the gym memberships and the tapes and the diets and NO PROGRESS.
I wasn't looking for catch phrases. I was looking for real advice.
You go to business school because business is an entire skill set to learn. A simple profit = income - expenses IS NOT REAL BUSINESS ADVICE.
Losing weight took an enormous amount of new skills and habits I had to learn. It took a lot longer than I expected, but I'm also a lot fitter than I ever thought possible.
I can bench press 205lbs and squat 365. I can do backflips. I can swim laps and run races. I can eat clean.
Is any of that "the easy button?"
We aren't looking for "the easy button." We were looking for the "payroll is due, and the salesmen haven't closed the sales, and the bank is still looking over the loan papers, how do we get through" advice.
Cashflow and Net Worth are two different things, and you have to master both to succeed.
But, go ahead, and keep telling people about your superior discipline and lack of excuses.
You are projecting your motivations and experiences onto others. I was also that person. I suspect many others were as well.
Until I was ready to make the changes, no one could have made that sale on how to do it. No one. Same with finances. Until I was ready, no one could have made me change. I wanted it all, but not enough to do the work. I needed to be ready. Once I was ready, I realized that the information and support had been there all along. Accepting that still didn't make it easy.
And I was doing the work. And I wanted the advice. And I got trite *kitten* advice like eat less, move more. Which I was already doing to the best of my ability and all I had to show for it was insulting comments like I was lazy or not drink soda (which I wasn't).
Maybe next time take it down a notch and try actually being helpful to people if they are actually struggling.
Or, just do you and tell the cigarette addict to just not buy any cigarettes.
I hope that maybe the next time someone asks you, you'll remember this conversation and not be so quick to throw out a catch phrase.
They are not looking for the "what." They are looking for the "how."
Was I one of these people who didn't give you the advice you are looking for? How do you know what type of advice I give to people who are new and struggling? Want an example of the advice I give?
https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10687329/new-to-dieting-new-here-need-help-please#latest
Now this doesn't happen in all cases. Some need a kick up the backside, but that's where you learn to read the room and recognize individuality.
You are painting everyone with the same brush and this will have a considerable impact on your experiences.8 -
Per Oxford: Lazy - Unwilling to work or use energy.
I don't think this is a matter of laziness in many cases, but an issue of prioritization. I'm sure there are many root causes at the individual level - the only level of any importance here.
It is human nature to be efficient. Without purpose or necessity all animals will choose expediency. Humans are unique in that we have the ability to sacrifice our present selves for our future selves. We have evolved and survived through thousands of years of scarcity and only since the age of enlightenment suddenly need to face the problems that come with abundance.
Segments of society have embraced rejection of responsibility for several decades and we have yet to reach the bottom of this failed social experiment.
Any society is doomed if it encourages the lazy and the gullible...and that's where we are today.
7 -
IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »When I lost all my weight, people would ask how I did it, I would say (in the simplest way) ate less, moved more, they would get the most disappointed look. So my vote is Lazy.
That's the answer that makes you feel the best about yourself.
The truth is, they were looking for more than a catch phrase. They weren't looking for a calorie count and exercise program. They were looking for honest, "how did you get past the challenges" answer.
And you gave them: I'm disciplined and you're lazy.
Bravo. Heavy sarcasm.
Maybe that's more or less the truth. Eat less, move more isn't a catch phrase. It's simple, just not easy. They were looking for an easy button.
No, they weren't!!!!!!!!
I know, because I WAS THAT PERSON. I was that person with the gym memberships and the tapes and the diets and NO PROGRESS.
I wasn't looking for catch phrases. I was looking for real advice.
You go to business school because business is an entire skill set to learn. A simple profit = income - expenses IS NOT REAL BUSINESS ADVICE.
Losing weight took an enormous amount of new skills and habits I had to learn. It took a lot longer than I expected, but I'm also a lot fitter than I ever thought possible.
I can bench press 205lbs and squat 365. I can do backflips. I can swim laps and run races. I can eat clean.
Is any of that "the easy button?"
We aren't looking for "the easy button." We were looking for the "payroll is due, and the salesmen haven't closed the sales, and the bank is still looking over the loan papers, how do we get through" advice.
Cashflow and Net Worth are two different things, and you have to master both to succeed.
But, go ahead, and keep telling people about your superior discipline and lack of excuses.
You were ready to do the work, so you did it. 99% of the people who ask 'So how'd you lose the weight?' have stars in their eyes hoping for some heretofore unknown mystical method that takes the effort out of it. They don't want to hear that it requires time, dedication, and a healthy dose of self-control.
10 -
I know, for me personally, believing in things like corporations trying to get us with "hyperpalatable" foods or that society was designed for us to be overweight were *demotivating* for me. If it's impossible for me to stop eating potato chips until I've had a family size bag, why even try?
When I realized that I could control my intake of even really delicious things and that my weight was created by the sum of all my day-in-day-out *choices*, everything really clicked for me.
I let go of the idea that being a healthy weight was a matter of luck. I realized it was something that I could make happen if it was something that I supported daily.
I don't know if I would call the previous mindset "lazy," but I certainly had the POV that my weight was something that *happened* to me, not that it was something I made happen. When I flipped that, everything changed.16 -
IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »When I lost all my weight, people would ask how I did it, I would say (in the simplest way) ate less, moved more, they would get the most disappointed look. So my vote is Lazy.
That's the answer that makes you feel the best about yourself.
The truth is, they were looking for more than a catch phrase. They weren't looking for a calorie count and exercise program. They were looking for honest, "how did you get past the challenges" answer.
And you gave them: I'm disciplined and you're lazy.
Bravo. Heavy sarcasm.
Maybe that's more or less the truth. Eat less, move more isn't a catch phrase. It's simple, just not easy. They were looking for an easy button.
No, they weren't!!!!!!!!
I know, because I WAS THAT PERSON. I was that person with the gym memberships and the tapes and the diets and NO PROGRESS.
I wasn't looking for catch phrases. I was looking for real advice.
You go to business school because business is an entire skill set to learn. A simple profit = income - expenses IS NOT REAL BUSINESS ADVICE.
Losing weight took an enormous amount of new skills and habits I had to learn. It took a lot longer than I expected, but I'm also a lot fitter than I ever thought possible.
I can bench press 205lbs and squat 365. I can do backflips. I can swim laps and run races. I can eat clean.
Is any of that "the easy button?"
We aren't looking for "the easy button." We were looking for the "payroll is due, and the salesmen haven't closed the sales, and the bank is still looking over the loan papers, how do we get through" advice.
Cashflow and Net Worth are two different things, and you have to master both to succeed.
But, go ahead, and keep telling people about your superior discipline and lack of excuses.
You seem fixated on the problem, but unwilling or unable to communicate an effective solution.
Rather than fixating on the problem and raging on, what is your solution to effectively communicate this information?
How would your present self communicate what you know now to your former self? Is there not a critical element of personal responsibility or are you going to blame big<insertboogeymanhere>?11 -
IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »Aaron_K123 wrote: »IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »
Sure. All you had to do was not to be a quote miner, and just take the message in context. See bold:
I quote mined you? I quoted your entire post. What do you mean I quote mined? Did you not say what I quoted?
And again, hold up that mirror. You are claiming everyone's post boils down to "its easy, I'm perfect, all you need is discipline and personal responsibility" which is a total misrepresentation.
No one in this entire thread has said even once that losing weight is easy but yet you claim that everyone has. You don't even quote mine, you just strawman. When you have actually quoted back something I said in this forum I agreed with what I said, I didn't complain that you were "quote mining" me. So do you stand by your statement or not?
So I ask again, how does your statement equate to good advice about weight loss given you are holding everyone else to that standard?
Now you are using words like "strawman," which indicates to me that you care less about the topic at hand and more about winning a debate.
Using strawmen is a debate strategy. So, next time, apply all that knowledge you have about debate techniques when someone asks you how to lose weight.
Instead of replying, eat less, move more, or, "make the decision" or "do the work," say something like, if you're hungry at night after dinner try xyz to keep your calories at or under your goal.
You know, strategies. Like a compassionate human.Using strawmen is a debate strategy
...so...what is using "quote mining" then?
I used "strawman" when you used "quote mine". How come it is okay for you to use such terms but not for me?
You have established this pattern of calling people out for things you find offensive and then when it is pointed out that you are also doing that you act like pointing that out is somehow off limits. It is getting tiresome.
Also...are you seriously complaining about someone using a "debate strategy" within the debate forum?16 -
IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »Aaron_K123 wrote: »IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »nutmegoreo wrote: »IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »When I lost all my weight, people would ask how I did it, I would say (in the simplest way) ate less, moved more, they would get the most disappointed look. So my vote is Lazy.
That's the answer that makes you feel the best about yourself.
The truth is, they were looking for more than a catch phrase. They weren't looking for a calorie count and exercise program. They were looking for honest, "how did you get past the challenges" answer.
And you gave them: I'm disciplined and you're lazy.
Bravo. Heavy sarcasm.
Maybe that's more or less the truth. Eat less, move more isn't a catch phrase. It's simple, just not easy. They were looking for an easy button.
No, they weren't!!!!!!!!
I know, because I WAS THAT PERSON. I was that person with the gym memberships and the tapes and the diets and NO PROGRESS.
I wasn't looking for catch phrases. I was looking for real advice.
You go to business school because business is an entire skill set to learn. A simple profit = income - expenses IS NOT REAL BUSINESS ADVICE.
Losing weight took an enormous amount of new skills and habits I had to learn. It took a lot longer than I expected, but I'm also a lot fitter than I ever thought possible.
I can bench press 205lbs and squat 365. I can do backflips. I can swim laps and run races. I can eat clean.
Is any of that "the easy button?"
We aren't looking for "the easy button." We were looking for the "payroll is due, and the salesmen haven't closed the sales, and the bank is still looking over the loan papers, how do we get through" advice.
Cashflow and Net Worth are two different things, and you have to master both to succeed.
But, go ahead, and keep telling people about your superior discipline and lack of excuses.
You are projecting your motivations and experiences onto others. I was also that person. I suspect many others were as well.
Until I was ready to make the changes, no one could have made that sale on how to do it. No one. Same with finances. Until I was ready, no one could have made me change. I wanted it all, but not enough to do the work. I needed to be ready. Once I was ready, I realized that the information and support had been there all along. Accepting that still didn't make it easy.
And I was doing the work. And I wanted the advice. And I got trite *kitten* advice like eat less, move more. Which I was already doing to the best of my ability and all I had to show for it was insulting comments like I was lazy or not drink soda (which I wasn't).
Maybe next time take it down a notch and try actually being helpful to people if they are actually struggling.
Or, just do you and tell the cigarette addict to just not buy any cigarettes.
I hope that maybe the next time someone asks you, you'll remember this conversation and not be so quick to throw out a catch phrase.
They are not looking for the "what." They are looking for the "how."
Simple question. Are you owed advice?
Oh, you are one of those people. Never mind.
-A man convinced against his will is of the same opinion still. - Carnegie
Have you happened to notice that everytime you have asked me a direct question I have answered your question even if it was a clearly loaded question like "So which are you, gullible or lazy?". Have you noticed that everytime I have asked you a direct question you have just chose to ignore it and opt to mock or insult instead? Whether or not you have I am guessing those reading the thread have.
Since you can't be bothered I will go ahead and answer. No, you aren't owed advice...so it makes no sense to demand people give only specific types of advice that you just happen to find more palatable...it isn't all about you believe it or not.20 -
Aaron_K123 wrote: »IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »Aaron_K123 wrote: »IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »nutmegoreo wrote: »IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »When I lost all my weight, people would ask how I did it, I would say (in the simplest way) ate less, moved more, they would get the most disappointed look. So my vote is Lazy.
That's the answer that makes you feel the best about yourself.
The truth is, they were looking for more than a catch phrase. They weren't looking for a calorie count and exercise program. They were looking for honest, "how did you get past the challenges" answer.
And you gave them: I'm disciplined and you're lazy.
Bravo. Heavy sarcasm.
Maybe that's more or less the truth. Eat less, move more isn't a catch phrase. It's simple, just not easy. They were looking for an easy button.
No, they weren't!!!!!!!!
I know, because I WAS THAT PERSON. I was that person with the gym memberships and the tapes and the diets and NO PROGRESS.
I wasn't looking for catch phrases. I was looking for real advice.
You go to business school because business is an entire skill set to learn. A simple profit = income - expenses IS NOT REAL BUSINESS ADVICE.
Losing weight took an enormous amount of new skills and habits I had to learn. It took a lot longer than I expected, but I'm also a lot fitter than I ever thought possible.
I can bench press 205lbs and squat 365. I can do backflips. I can swim laps and run races. I can eat clean.
Is any of that "the easy button?"
We aren't looking for "the easy button." We were looking for the "payroll is due, and the salesmen haven't closed the sales, and the bank is still looking over the loan papers, how do we get through" advice.
Cashflow and Net Worth are two different things, and you have to master both to succeed.
But, go ahead, and keep telling people about your superior discipline and lack of excuses.
You are projecting your motivations and experiences onto others. I was also that person. I suspect many others were as well.
Until I was ready to make the changes, no one could have made that sale on how to do it. No one. Same with finances. Until I was ready, no one could have made me change. I wanted it all, but not enough to do the work. I needed to be ready. Once I was ready, I realized that the information and support had been there all along. Accepting that still didn't make it easy.
And I was doing the work. And I wanted the advice. And I got trite *kitten* advice like eat less, move more. Which I was already doing to the best of my ability and all I had to show for it was insulting comments like I was lazy or not drink soda (which I wasn't).
Maybe next time take it down a notch and try actually being helpful to people if they are actually struggling.
Or, just do you and tell the cigarette addict to just not buy any cigarettes.
I hope that maybe the next time someone asks you, you'll remember this conversation and not be so quick to throw out a catch phrase.
They are not looking for the "what." They are looking for the "how."
Simple question. Are you owed advice?
Oh, you are one of those people. Never mind.
-A man convinced against his will is of the same opinion still. - Carnegie
Have you happened to notice that everytime you have asked me a direct question I have answered your question and everytime I have asked you a direct question you have just chose to ignore it and opt to mock or insult instead?
Since you can't be bothered I will go ahead and answer. No, you aren't owed advice...so it makes no sense to demand people give only specific types of advice that you just happen to find more palatable...it isn't all about you believe it or not.
Thought you were used to that by now......
11 -
IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »When I lost all my weight, people would ask how I did it, I would say (in the simplest way) ate less, moved more, they would get the most disappointed look. So my vote is Lazy.
That's the answer that makes you feel the best about yourself.
The truth is, they were looking for more than a catch phrase. They weren't looking for a calorie count and exercise program. They were looking for honest, "how did you get past the challenges" answer.
And you gave them: I'm disciplined and you're lazy.
Bravo. Heavy sarcasm.
Maybe that's more or less the truth. Eat less, move more isn't a catch phrase. It's simple, just not easy. They were looking for an easy button.
No, they weren't!!!!!!!!
I know, because I WAS THAT PERSON. I was that person with the gym memberships and the tapes and the diets and NO PROGRESS.
I wasn't looking for catch phrases. I was looking for real advice.
You go to business school because business is an entire skill set to learn. A simple profit = income - expenses IS NOT REAL BUSINESS ADVICE.
Losing weight took an enormous amount of new skills and habits I had to learn. It took a lot longer than I expected, but I'm also a lot fitter than I ever thought possible.
I can bench press 205lbs and squat 365. I can do backflips. I can swim laps and run races. I can eat clean.
Is any of that "the easy button?"
We aren't looking for "the easy button." We were looking for the "payroll is due, and the salesmen haven't closed the sales, and the bank is still looking over the loan papers, how do we get through" advice.
Cashflow and Net Worth are two different things, and you have to master both to succeed.
But, go ahead, and keep telling people about your superior discipline and lack of excuses.
You seem fixated on the problem, but unwilling or unable to communicate an effective solution.
Rather than fixating on the problem and raging on, what is your solution to effectively communicate this information?
How would your present self communicate what you know now to your former self? Is there not a critical element of personal responsibility or are you going to blame big<insertboogeymanhere>?
I already said it, over and over. Habituation.
It's how you got fat, it's how you get skinny. It's not about choice. It's about how the human brain functions.
It's how you drive a car, ride a bike, type, give your spouse a kiss, put on deodorant.
In order to get to work, you utilize many thousands of habits. Did you CHOOSE to put on your blinker light when you turned your car? No? Did you CHOOSE to put toothpaste on your toothbrush? Did you CHOOSE which finger to put on each letter to type your condescending opinion on this board? No?
******************************************************************************************************************
If a person out there is fat, and struggling, let me tell you, it GETS EASIER. Learning to lose weight is like learning to drive a car. You might struggle just figuring out what all the buttons do, and it looks hopeless. You might even fail the drivers test a few times. But, know that with practice, it will get so much easier, that you can get on the EXPRESSWAY and drive much faster once it gets easier, even to the point where you can do it without hardly any effort, even though you are still doing the same things - like buckling your seat belt, checking the mirrors, pulling out of the driveway, etc., etc.
You will still be doing those things and you might run into some challenges along with way, but the effort you expend will not be as great as when you are first learning. Don't be discouraged by a lack of progress. Every time you pass by the fast food place or eat that spinach, your brain takes note of it, and stores it for easier access, and will make it faster and more automatic the more times you practice. Keep going, even if months go by and the scale laughs at you. There is a saying, weight loss happens slowly at first, then all at once. Keep going, and the all at once will happen. It took 2yrs to go from busting out of 2XL to L and 2 months to go from L to M.
When you get really good at it, you can get in your car, and arrive at your destination, and not even remember the drive over there, like the people who are telling you how lazy you are.
Be encouraged. And, prayer certainly helped me a lot, if you are so inclined. Don't give up! Go slower if you have to, but DON'T GIVE UP!
10 -
Aaron_K123 wrote: »IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »Aaron_K123 wrote: »IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »nutmegoreo wrote: »IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »IHaveMyActTogether wrote: »When I lost all my weight, people would ask how I did it, I would say (in the simplest way) ate less, moved more, they would get the most disappointed look. So my vote is Lazy.
That's the answer that makes you feel the best about yourself.
The truth is, they were looking for more than a catch phrase. They weren't looking for a calorie count and exercise program. They were looking for honest, "how did you get past the challenges" answer.
And you gave them: I'm disciplined and you're lazy.
Bravo. Heavy sarcasm.
Maybe that's more or less the truth. Eat less, move more isn't a catch phrase. It's simple, just not easy. They were looking for an easy button.
No, they weren't!!!!!!!!
I know, because I WAS THAT PERSON. I was that person with the gym memberships and the tapes and the diets and NO PROGRESS.
I wasn't looking for catch phrases. I was looking for real advice.
You go to business school because business is an entire skill set to learn. A simple profit = income - expenses IS NOT REAL BUSINESS ADVICE.
Losing weight took an enormous amount of new skills and habits I had to learn. It took a lot longer than I expected, but I'm also a lot fitter than I ever thought possible.
I can bench press 205lbs and squat 365. I can do backflips. I can swim laps and run races. I can eat clean.
Is any of that "the easy button?"
We aren't looking for "the easy button." We were looking for the "payroll is due, and the salesmen haven't closed the sales, and the bank is still looking over the loan papers, how do we get through" advice.
Cashflow and Net Worth are two different things, and you have to master both to succeed.
But, go ahead, and keep telling people about your superior discipline and lack of excuses.
You are projecting your motivations and experiences onto others. I was also that person. I suspect many others were as well.
Until I was ready to make the changes, no one could have made that sale on how to do it. No one. Same with finances. Until I was ready, no one could have made me change. I wanted it all, but not enough to do the work. I needed to be ready. Once I was ready, I realized that the information and support had been there all along. Accepting that still didn't make it easy.
And I was doing the work. And I wanted the advice. And I got trite *kitten* advice like eat less, move more. Which I was already doing to the best of my ability and all I had to show for it was insulting comments like I was lazy or not drink soda (which I wasn't).
Maybe next time take it down a notch and try actually being helpful to people if they are actually struggling.
Or, just do you and tell the cigarette addict to just not buy any cigarettes.
I hope that maybe the next time someone asks you, you'll remember this conversation and not be so quick to throw out a catch phrase.
They are not looking for the "what." They are looking for the "how."
Simple question. Are you owed advice?
Oh, you are one of those people. Never mind.
-A man convinced against his will is of the same opinion still. - Carnegie
Have you happened to notice that everytime you have asked me a direct question I have answered your question even if it was a clearly loaded question like "So which are you, gullible or lazy?". Have you noticed that everytime I have asked you a direct question you have just chose to ignore it and opt to mock or insult instead? Whether or not you have I am guessing those reading the thread have.
Since you can't be bothered I will go ahead and answer. No, you aren't owed advice...so it makes no sense to demand people give only specific types of advice that you just happen to find more palatable...it isn't all about you believe it or not.
See the thread title. Those were the options given. But you didn't tell me, if you are gullible or lazy. Which one was it?
How can you consider it an insult to you when applied to your wealth, but not consider it an insult when applied to people's health? You only deemed the question loaded when it was applied to you.
Either way, you have deemed the conversation tiring, which it is, and I need all the rest of my energy to knock it out of the park at the gym today, because, you know, I'm not lazy.
And I have my priorities in order.
Good day!15
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