How to know whether you are loosing fat or muscles?

I was an overweight person, close to 104kg, now with diet and exercise I have bought it down to 85Kg, my diet mainly consists of oats and 6 egg whites daily. In the gym I was not at all doing that much weight training but I was doing mostly cardio. A few days back a personal trainer in the gym told me that I am being stupid and I am just loosing muscles not weight. He suggested that I increase my weight back to my old weight and then take up personal training to properly reduce my weight. Otherwise the skin will start to sagg and a bit of sagging is there only a bit. I don't know what to do. I got demotivated when you work so hard to reduce and then some one comes and tells you that you need to go back to the old weight as what have been done is incorrect. My question is should I do that, what I have been doing is it wrong? Should I gain back my weight? Should I go for personal training. Can any of the experts help me. I don't know what to do.
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Replies

  • PWRLFTR1
    PWRLFTR1 Posts: 324 Member
    Agree with the other comments. You can lose fat without losing muscle, but its a much slower process. I've been following a fat loss program for the past year (won't mention as not to be accused of trying to sell something), its been a frustrating ride, but even though my weight has basically remained the same, I've lost inches and not haven't lost any strength, in fact have increased my lifts. I will say, carbs are your friend, especially around training and protein, make sure you get enough lean protein. Good luck
  • hesn92
    hesn92 Posts: 5,966 Member
    edited August 2018
    There's no need to gain all that weight back... without strength training that would just be gaining mostly fat anyway. just start prioritizing strength training now and continue on, and ignore that trainer.
  • sijomial
    sijomial Posts: 19,809 Member
    edited August 2018
    kimny72 wrote: »
    When you lose weight, you always lose some fat and some muscle. To lose as little muscle as possible, it helps to avoid losing weight too quickly, eat a good amount of protein, and do strength training as you lose.

    You may have lost more muscle than you would want to, but that's no reason to gain all the weight back :noway:

    Start prioritizing strength training and eating a well-balanced diet with at least 0.6-0.8g of protein per pound of body weight. I would avoid that particular PT.
    @kimny72
    "Always" is an absolute term asnd as some people can, and do, add some muscle in a sensible deficit it makes your statement false. It's also unnecessarily alarmist and could be discouraging.
    Muscle loss is certainly a danger - but it's not a certainty.

    Your advice is otherwise good, unlike the OP's personal trainer's advice which is ludicrous and nothing more than a sales pitch.
  • kimny72
    kimny72 Posts: 16,011 Member
    sijomial wrote: »
    kimny72 wrote: »
    When you lose weight, you always lose some fat and some muscle. To lose as little muscle as possible, it helps to avoid losing weight too quickly, eat a good amount of protein, and do strength training as you lose.

    You may have lost more muscle than you would want to, but that's no reason to gain all the weight back :noway:

    Start prioritizing strength training and eating a well-balanced diet with at least 0.6-0.8g of protein per pound of body weight. I would avoid that particular PT.
    @kimny72
    "Always" is an absolute term asnd as some people can, and do, add some muscle in a sensible deficit it makes your statement false. It's also unnecessarily alarmist and could be discouraging.
    Muscle loss is certainly a danger - but it's not a certainty.

    Your advice is otherwise good, unlike the OP's personal trainer's advice which is ludicrous and nothing more than a sales pitch.

    Gotcha, thanks.
  • Zoejohnse91
    Zoejohnse91 Posts: 227 Member
    Sounds like they want you to pay them to bully you some more, the sack of excrement.
  • Aneeshn630
    Aneeshn630 Posts: 27 Member
    No knowing your height, I don't know if you are at goal weight or not. I really hope you eat more than oats and egg whites. That's not a very balanced diet. Being told to gain weight just to start training to take it back off again is stupid. If you wanted to get back up to that weight in muscle, you would start training NOW and slowly gain back. Please ignore that person.

    Thank you soo much for replying to my query, my height is 175 cms and my weight was initially 135kg which I gradually reduced to 85 kg my target weight is 64 Kg. Well that is what the gym people suggested I should be. The gym name is gold's Gym and the trainers are supposed to be certified (atleast I hope they are). Well the weight training part is the issue donno where to start what to do.
  • NoExcusesFromNowOn
    NoExcusesFromNowOn Posts: 76 Member
    The bod pod assessment will tell you exactly how much fat vs muscle you have. My last one showed I lost10 pounds of fat and gained one of muscle. Google where to get it done. It's very quick & painless.
  • Aneeshn630
    Aneeshn630 Posts: 27 Member
    kimny72 wrote: »
    When you lose weight, you always lose some fat and some muscle. To lose as little muscle as possible, it helps to avoid losing weight too quickly, eat a good amount of protein, and do strength training as you lose.

    You may have lost more muscle than you would want to, but that's no reason to gain all the weight back :noway:

    Start prioritizing strength training and eating a well-balanced diet with at least 0.6-0.8g of protein per pound of body weight. I would avoid that particular PT.

    Wow thank you soo much for the reply I didn't know that I should take that much protein, so my weight is around 85kg so 0.8 per pound makes it close to 60 - 65 g of protein, wow that is a lot of protein I never knew I should have that much.
  • Aneeshn630
    Aneeshn630 Posts: 27 Member
    bisky wrote: »
    You are doing great. You lost weight with diet and exercise. It takes a lot of muscle to move and support an overweight body. It is so easy to let one negative know it all get you off track....gain the weight back and then lose it? What are the qualifications for this person? Has any one else in the weight lifting group heard of this? It will not do your body any good to gain the weight back to lose. Your skin will get stretched out again. The great thing about muscle...you can rebuild it and strengthen it and you don't have to gain all your weight back to do this.

    Thank you soo much for the motivation, I understood if I try to go back on my previous weight it will be stupid. The problem is weight training. I don't know what to do where to start, I need to do my homework.
  • kimny72
    kimny72 Posts: 16,011 Member
    Aneeshn630 wrote: »
    kimny72 wrote: »
    When you lose weight, you always lose some fat and some muscle. To lose as little muscle as possible, it helps to avoid losing weight too quickly, eat a good amount of protein, and do strength training as you lose.

    You may have lost more muscle than you would want to, but that's no reason to gain all the weight back :noway:

    Start prioritizing strength training and eating a well-balanced diet with at least 0.6-0.8g of protein per pound of body weight. I would avoid that particular PT.

    Wow thank you soo much for the reply I didn't know that I should take that much protein, so my weight is around 85kg so 0.8 per pound makes it close to 60 - 65 g of protein, wow that is a lot of protein I never knew I should have that much.

    Do you eat meat? If you do, 60g really isn't a lot. Other sources would be fish, eggs, dairy, beans & lentils, soy products, etc. There are smaller amounts in nuts, whole grains, and some veggies.
    Aneeshn630 wrote: »
    bisky wrote: »
    You are doing great. You lost weight with diet and exercise. It takes a lot of muscle to move and support an overweight body. It is so easy to let one negative know it all get you off track....gain the weight back and then lose it? What are the qualifications for this person? Has any one else in the weight lifting group heard of this? It will not do your body any good to gain the weight back to lose. Your skin will get stretched out again. The great thing about muscle...you can rebuild it and strengthen it and you don't have to gain all your weight back to do this.

    Thank you soo much for the motivation, I understood if I try to go back on my previous weight it will be stupid. The problem is weight training. I don't know what to do where to start, I need to do my homework.

    This thread might help you get your homework started:
    https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10332083/which-lifting-program-is-the-best-for-you/p1
  • Aneeshn630
    Aneeshn630 Posts: 27 Member
    [quote="Aneeshn630;d-10691363" A few days back a personal trainer in the gym told me that I am being stupid and I am just loosing muscles not weight. He suggested that I increase my weight back to my old weight and then take up personal training to properly reduce my weight.

    It sounds like the "personal trainer" is a complete idiot and trying to do a sales job on you. Did he offer this as unsolicited advice?

    Having said that, is your diet really that restrictive? For long term weight loss success you should be eating a well balanced diet and maintaining a modest caloric deficit, many of these rapid weight loss plans are not sustainable and end up failing when you go back to your old eating habits. Think in terms of changes that you can live with for the rest of your life (ie not depriving yourself of foods you enjoy but eating reasonable portions and being mindful of what you eat).

    I'd also definitely recommend adding strength to your workouts to help maintain your lean muscle mass but I wouldn't consider hiring that jerk of a trainer. Find a program, like Stronglifts 5 x 5, and follow it.

    [/quote]

    Thank you soo much BrianSharpie for replying, the person is a certified trainer and what exactly happened was the golds gym was providing 2 days of trail personal training to the people who join. Even after 5 months of joining I still didn't get it. So I have asked the front desk about it and they assigned my one personal trainer but what was told to me at the time of joining and what he is telling me now is different. He just told me that the personal training he provide is nothing but telling me how to run on treadmill, how to use the cycling machine and all. He will not give me personal training he will just tell me the way to use the machine so that I can use it myself. So when I have asked him in regards to personal training he told me that my body is sagging and I need to put on weight you know the same thing posted above and if you need to reduce properly then pay for golds trainer and i will definitely train you and reduce it. I need to check in to the weight training part. BTW you have mentioned about stronglifts 5x5 what is the that? Some kind of weight training?
  • mjbnj0001
    mjbnj0001 Posts: 1,258 Member
    lorrpb wrote: »
    Do not use the BIA scale mentioned above. Get a hydrotank, bod pod, or dexa scan every 6 months if you really want to monitor fat vs muscle. These are the only proven reliable methods.
    Being certified means the trainer has studied and passed a test, but certification does not make a person infallible or sensible.

    I had asked about this (BIA) when I began the program. At the time, through my pre-reading/etc., I had thought that only float tests (hydrostatic) were accurate. The gym some years ago was using arm calipers; they're fairly inaccurate as well. The device used now corrects previous flaws in the BIA technology. And is only a professional-level thing, not one of the oldstyle home monitors. Supposedly comparable to DEXA. I think access to the other tests (hydo, bod pod, dexa) is pretty limited; I'm in NJ.
  • Aneeshn630
    Aneeshn630 Posts: 27 Member
    edited August 2018
    PWRLFTR1 wrote: »
    Agree with the other comments. You can lose fat without losing muscle, but its a much slower process. I've been following a fat loss program for the past year (won't mention as not to be accused of trying to sell something), its been a frustrating ride, but even though my weight has basically remained the same, I've lost inches and not haven't lost any strength, in fact have increased my lifts. I will say, carbs are your friend, especially around training and protein, make sure you get enough lean protein. Good luck

    Yeah I know, have been trying hard for the last 2 years, which includes walking 18 kms removing process sugar from my diets, suppressing my craving to eat chocolates and junk food and that definitely reduced my tummy from a good 45 inches to 36 and the amazing thing is I didn't do any exercise for my tummy. But the thing now is the doubt how much protein should I be taking? Am I loosing fat or muscles? Anyways from what I read from the previous comments I need to switch to weight training.
  • AnvilHead
    AnvilHead Posts: 18,343 Member
    Aneeshn630 wrote: »
    But the thing now is the doubt how much protein should I be taking?
    https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/819055/setting-your-calorie-and-macro-targets/p1
  • PWRLFTR1
    PWRLFTR1 Posts: 324 Member
    Aneeshn630 wrote: »
    PWRLFTR1 wrote: »
    Agree with the other comments. You can lose fat without losing muscle, but its a much slower process. I've been following a fat loss program for the past year (won't mention as not to be accused of trying to sell something), its been a frustrating ride, but even though my weight has basically remained the same, I've lost inches and not haven't lost any strength, in fact have increased my lifts. I will say, carbs are your friend, especially around training and protein, make sure you get enough lean protein. Good luck

    Yeah I know u have been trying hard for the last 2 years, which includes walking 18 kms removing process sugar from my diets, suppressing my craving to eat chocolates and junk food and that definitely reduced my tummy from a good 45 inches to 36 and the amazing thing is I didn't do any exercise for my tummy. But the thing now is the doubt how much protein should I be taking? Am I loosing fat or muscles? Anyways from what I read from the previous comments I need to switch to weight training.

    Yes, that is the one thing I failed to mention. I've focused on lifting, not a lot of cardio (unless its walking the dog)
  • kimny72
    kimny72 Posts: 16,011 Member
    Aneeshn630 wrote: »
    PWRLFTR1 wrote: »
    Agree with the other comments. You can lose fat without losing muscle, but its a much slower process. I've been following a fat loss program for the past year (won't mention as not to be accused of trying to sell something), its been a frustrating ride, but even though my weight has basically remained the same, I've lost inches and not haven't lost any strength, in fact have increased my lifts. I will say, carbs are your friend, especially around training and protein, make sure you get enough lean protein. Good luck

    Yeah I know u have been trying hard for the last 2 years, which includes walking 18 kms removing process sugar from my diets, suppressing my craving to eat chocolates and junk food and that definitely reduced my tummy from a good 45 inches to 36 and the amazing thing is I didn't do any exercise for my tummy. But the thing now is the doubt how much protein should I be taking? Am I loosing fat or muscles? Anyways from what I read from the previous comments I need to switch to weight training.

    Don't get too caught up in what might have already happened. As you saw, I was corrected on the losing muscle part anyway :blush: There's no way to know. So just start doing the right stuff now. Eat a more balanced diet. Start to work more protein into your day little by little. Start to focus on strength training. Keep learning and moving forward!
  • mjbnj0001
    mjbnj0001 Posts: 1,258 Member
    mjbnj0001 wrote: »
    lorrpb wrote: »
    Do not use the BIA scale mentioned above. Get a hydrotank, bod pod, or dexa scan every 6 months if you really want to monitor fat vs muscle. These are the only proven reliable methods.
    Being certified means the trainer has studied and passed a test, but certification does not make a person infallible or sensible.

    I had asked about this (BIA) when I began the program. At the time, through my pre-reading/etc., I had thought that only float tests (hydrostatic) were accurate. The gym some years ago was using arm calipers; they're fairly inaccurate as well. The device used now corrects previous flaws in the BIA technology. And is only a professional-level thing, not one of the oldstyle home monitors. Supposedly comparable to DEXA. I think access to the other tests (hydo, bod pod, dexa) is pretty limited; I'm in NJ.

    So, being an older guy, I'm never sure if "woo" is a good thing or not. That is, is "woo" really "whoa!" or "woo-hoo!"
  • kimny72
    kimny72 Posts: 16,011 Member
    mjbnj0001 wrote: »
    mjbnj0001 wrote: »
    lorrpb wrote: »
    Do not use the BIA scale mentioned above. Get a hydrotank, bod pod, or dexa scan every 6 months if you really want to monitor fat vs muscle. These are the only proven reliable methods.
    Being certified means the trainer has studied and passed a test, but certification does not make a person infallible or sensible.

    I had asked about this (BIA) when I began the program. At the time, through my pre-reading/etc., I had thought that only float tests (hydrostatic) were accurate. The gym some years ago was using arm calipers; they're fairly inaccurate as well. The device used now corrects previous flaws in the BIA technology. And is only a professional-level thing, not one of the oldstyle home monitors. Supposedly comparable to DEXA. I think access to the other tests (hydo, bod pod, dexa) is pretty limited; I'm in NJ.

    So, being an older guy, I'm never sure if "woo" is a good thing or not. That is, is "woo" really "whoa!" or "woo-hoo!"

    At first we were told it could be either positive (woo-hoo!) or negative (woo-woo, like an old wives tale or snake oil). Then when they realized that was useless, they said it's negative. But I don't believe most people know that. I've gotten woo's on posts that really didn't seem to merit either one. And if someone's on the phone, it's easy to accidentally hit woo or hug as you're scrolling.

    So ummm yes. Or either. :wink:
  • nutmegoreo
    nutmegoreo Posts: 15,532 Member
    kimny72 wrote: »
    mjbnj0001 wrote: »
    mjbnj0001 wrote: »
    lorrpb wrote: »
    Do not use the BIA scale mentioned above. Get a hydrotank, bod pod, or dexa scan every 6 months if you really want to monitor fat vs muscle. These are the only proven reliable methods.
    Being certified means the trainer has studied and passed a test, but certification does not make a person infallible or sensible.

    I had asked about this (BIA) when I began the program. At the time, through my pre-reading/etc., I had thought that only float tests (hydrostatic) were accurate. The gym some years ago was using arm calipers; they're fairly inaccurate as well. The device used now corrects previous flaws in the BIA technology. And is only a professional-level thing, not one of the oldstyle home monitors. Supposedly comparable to DEXA. I think access to the other tests (hydo, bod pod, dexa) is pretty limited; I'm in NJ.

    So, being an older guy, I'm never sure if "woo" is a good thing or not. That is, is "woo" really "whoa!" or "woo-hoo!"

    At first we were told it could be either positive (woo-hoo!) or negative (woo-woo, like an old wives tale or snake oil). Then when they realized that was useless, they said it's negative. But I don't believe most people know that. I've gotten woo's on posts that really didn't seem to merit either one. And if someone's on the phone, it's easy to accidentally hit woo or hug as you're scrolling.

    So ummm yes. Or either. :wink:

    MFP, where everything is made up, and the "woo"s don't matter.
  • TrishSeren
    TrishSeren Posts: 587 Member
    edited August 2018
    Aneeshn630 wrote: »
    kimny72 wrote: »
    When you lose weight, you always lose some fat and some muscle. To lose as little muscle as possible, it helps to avoid losing weight too quickly, eat a good amount of protein, and do strength training as you lose.

    You may have lost more muscle than you would want to, but that's no reason to gain all the weight back :noway:

    Start prioritizing strength training and eating a well-balanced diet with at least 0.6-0.8g of protein per pound of body weight. I would avoid that particular PT.

    Wow thank you soo much for the reply I didn't know that I should take that much protein, so my weight is around 85kg so 0.8 per pound makes it close to 60 - 65 g of protein, wow that is a lot of protein I never knew I should have that much.

    I eat 70g - 90g of protein a day easily. 1 egg for breakfast, tuna for lunch and some meat for dinner and I only eat 1,300 - 1,500 calories a day (depending on my exercise that day). I don't like protein shakes (I'm fussy) so I get all of it through diet alone.

    My dairy is open if you want to see.
  • pinuplove
    pinuplove Posts: 12,871 Member
    nutmegoreo wrote: »
    kimny72 wrote: »
    mjbnj0001 wrote: »
    mjbnj0001 wrote: »
    lorrpb wrote: »
    Do not use the BIA scale mentioned above. Get a hydrotank, bod pod, or dexa scan every 6 months if you really want to monitor fat vs muscle. These are the only proven reliable methods.
    Being certified means the trainer has studied and passed a test, but certification does not make a person infallible or sensible.

    I had asked about this (BIA) when I began the program. At the time, through my pre-reading/etc., I had thought that only float tests (hydrostatic) were accurate. The gym some years ago was using arm calipers; they're fairly inaccurate as well. The device used now corrects previous flaws in the BIA technology. And is only a professional-level thing, not one of the oldstyle home monitors. Supposedly comparable to DEXA. I think access to the other tests (hydo, bod pod, dexa) is pretty limited; I'm in NJ.

    So, being an older guy, I'm never sure if "woo" is a good thing or not. That is, is "woo" really "whoa!" or "woo-hoo!"

    At first we were told it could be either positive (woo-hoo!) or negative (woo-woo, like an old wives tale or snake oil). Then when they realized that was useless, they said it's negative. But I don't believe most people know that. I've gotten woo's on posts that really didn't seem to merit either one. And if someone's on the phone, it's easy to accidentally hit woo or hug as you're scrolling.

    So ummm yes. Or either. :wink:

    MFP, where everything is made up, and the "woo"s don't matter.

    I love you for this.
  • TrishSeren
    TrishSeren Posts: 587 Member
    Aneeshn630 wrote: »
    PWRLFTR1 wrote: »
    Agree with the other comments. You can lose fat without losing muscle, but its a much slower process. I've been following a fat loss program for the past year (won't mention as not to be accused of trying to sell something), its been a frustrating ride, but even though my weight has basically remained the same, I've lost inches and not haven't lost any strength, in fact have increased my lifts. I will say, carbs are your friend, especially around training and protein, make sure you get enough lean protein. Good luck

    Yeah I know, have been trying hard for the last 2 years, which includes walking 18 kms removing process sugar from my diets, suppressing my craving to eat chocolates and junk food and that definitely reduced my tummy from a good 45 inches to 36 and the amazing thing is I didn't do any exercise for my tummy. But the thing now is the doubt how much protein should I be taking? Am I loosing fat or muscles? Anyways from what I read from the previous comments I need to switch to weight training.

    Keep it simple. Eat more protein and find a weight training program that works for you, you can still supplement it with walking (I do) if you enjoy walking.

    Also, ignore that PT's advice it's terrible advice.

    Don't stress about losing muscle, you use your muscles every day to do all sorts of different things. Your body wouldn't suddenly lose a heap of muscle unless you're literally not using them (as in bedridden for example).
  • AnnPT77
    AnnPT77 Posts: 34,166 Member
    edited August 2018
    Aneeshn630 wrote: »
    kimny72 wrote: »
    When you lose weight, you always lose some fat and some muscle. To lose as little muscle as possible, it helps to avoid losing weight too quickly, eat a good amount of protein, and do strength training as you lose.

    You may have lost more muscle than you would want to, but that's no reason to gain all the weight back :noway:

    Start prioritizing strength training and eating a well-balanced diet with at least 0.6-0.8g of protein per pound of body weight. I would avoid that particular PT.

    Wow thank you soo much for the reply I didn't know that I should take that much protein, so my weight is around 85kg so 0.8 per pound makes it close to 60 - 65 g of protein, wow that is a lot of protein I never knew I should have that much.

    More strictly speaking, since protein is used to maintain our lean mass (and we don't need extra for our fat mass), you can calculate it as 0.6-0.8g per pound of healthy goal weight, which is a rough approximation for 0.8-1g per pound of lean body mass. If you have an accurate estimate of LBM (not from BIA!) you can use the latter instead. Extra protein, within reason, won't hurt a healthy person, as long as it doesn't drive out getting enough fats, and plenty of varied, colorful veggie/fruit servings daily (ideally 5-10+) for micronutrients and fiber, within calorie goal.

    For someone obese (not necessarily you! ;) ), shooting for 0.6-0.8g protein per pound of current weight can be unnecessary, extreme, and well-nigh unachievable on limited calories without compromising balanced nutrition.