Weird weight loss problem
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If her foot hurts, is she still exercising?
But I'm in agreement with most of the recent comments that she doesnt need to lose weight since she is probably still a healthy weight (assuming they weighed her in the middle of the day with clothes on, not naked in the morning thus resulting in a weight a few lbs higher than it would be in the morning).
I dont understand why no other treatment for her foot has been prescribed. And if she has muscle, she should never get to the low end of her BMI, she would be far more unhealthy. Sounds also like she has a negative body image already, and that's not something I would encourage to make worse.10 -
I too find it very difficult to believe that two different doctors are prescribing nothing but "lose 20 lbs" to a teenage girl who is a healthy weight.
OP, your daughter is at a critical time in her life where lots of young women start to develop a bad relationship with food and with their body. This idea to carefully monitor and manipulate her diet to get her to the low end of healthy weight sounds like a recipe for disaster to me. If you aren't careful, not only will she carry negative connotations around food and her weight through the rest of her life, but she will quite possibly associate all of that with you as well.21 -
Why are you guessing at her TDEE and deficit amounts? The pediatrician who recommended weight loss AND told you to count her calories for her should give you some guidance. Or refer you to a registered pediatric dietician. I would also take a close look at logging accuracy since you’re using your own system rather than mfp. Also make sure the formulas in your spreadsheet encompass all your data cells.0
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Given the martial arts, this sounds more like a sports injury than a weight problem. I'd recommend seeing a podiatrist or sports physio doctor, maybe get some orthotics for her. She might need to dial back certain activities for a while to let it rest. I'm sure her coach could give her some lower intensity cross-training things that don't aggravate the foot yet keep her conditioning.
Self-esteem is a big deal too. I was also very active yet overweight as a kid, so I think I can relate to your daughter. And I did stress about my food and my weight a lot. I felt awful and nothing anyone could have said would have changed my opinion of myself. Yet despite all my sports, I never thought of myself as an athlete! If being big had meant feeling "strong" and "athletic" instead of just "fat" I think that would have done wonders. I wonder if her team or her coach have any ideas about this.
As for the food itself, it sounds like she feels hungry a lot, which is totally expected given she's a growing and active young person. There are aspects you could explore besides just calories. As a teen I often chose low-protein breakfasts (milk & cereal), but switching to a different type of food (turkey & eggs) was a game-changer. Less hungry, less snacking. But that's just me so maybe shop around for a dietitian who has experience working with teens. There are lots of different approaches and maybe someone out there can help her while making it fun.7 -
Probably a dumb question, but how old is the battery in your scale?7
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Given that she is already at a healthy weight I would drop it. Completely. Keep healthy foods around the house available for everyone in the family. Let her make her own food decisions from what is available. She was also at the doctor appointment and can decide for herself if losing a little weight is important to her. I would not say another word to her about her weight at all. I would not ask her to step on the scale at all unless you start to see warning signs that she is rapidly losing weight.
It is so easy for teens to develop eating disorders. Your care for her diet could be misconstrued to lead her down a dangerous path.11 -
Mistraal1981 wrote: »I call *kitten*.
A doctor thinks an active fifteen year old needs to lose 10kgs (22lbs) because of a sore foot? 10kgs is just vanity weight and in a fifteen year old is just "puppy fat" needed by the body as it goes through the hormonal roller coaster ride of becoming a woman.
A doctor recommends weight loss for a sore foot as opposed to rest and recovery?
And lastly, a doctor doesn't think a FIFTEEN year old is capable of handling the responsibility of tracking calories.
Honestly, you sound like YOU have a problem with your kid's, perfectly normal, weight.
I apologise if I am wrong. If the situation is really as you say, I recommend giving the control to your kid and you support her. Anything else is just setting her up for body/food issues.
The dr has recommended rest, as in no activity at all outside the pool, not even walking a couple of blocks, for the next weeks, plus a ton of anti-iflammatory meds, and stretching exercises several times per day. Other than this, to prevent this from happening again, he has recommended losing about 10 kilos (which for a 65 kilo person is not just a bit of vanity weight) and wearing special insoles in her shoes, for life.
But thank you very much dor your advice.7 -
kommodevaran wrote: »You attibute your daughter's lack of weightloss to some kind of magic/airborne calories, and believe a meticulously calculated meal plan - and asking strangers - is the solution? I think there is simply a communication/trust/empathy issue here. She doesn't trust you, and you can't pick up that she's lying, and your doctor gives bad advice. Poor girl. And not an easy problem to fix.
Uhm, did I say anywhere anything about magic calories? I am actually asking for ideas on what I might be missing here, or how to deal with such an issue. From people who have struggled to lose weight, or have successfully lost weight, or even better have done so in their teens. I have no personal experience on how to deal with this as a teenager, I was hoping someone else might have.
As for my dr giving bad advice, what can I say? We have seen a top orthopedic surgeon in the local pediatric hospital, have consulted a podiatrist to provide insoles for her shoes, who has also seconded the ortho's advice, and has only altered a bit the stretching routine, we have discussed this with the pediatrician, even before the injury, so while it could be that 3 drs are all ignorant, I will accept their advice and accept that she has to lose the weight. I am not asking opinions on whether the goal is correct, only on how to get there.
I do not want to have exhaustive discussions with my daughter, I do not think that daily dicsussing her weight and diet is healthy, and for the same reason I am reluctant to brainstorm with mum with kids of similar ages, because such a discussion could easily become gossip, even by accident, and I do not want this to affect my daughter's social life. A forum seemed like a safe place to ask for ideas, but I guess I was wrong.
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Evelyn_Gorfram wrote: »Probably a dumb question, but how old is the battery in your scale?
Recently changed, and the dr did use the hospital scale. By his calculations her BMI was 25.5.
She is muscular in back, arms and legs. But she also has a small chest, and definitely fat in her tummy area and hips.5 -
This is probably the strangest thing I have read all day. Children gain and lose weight as they grow, I remember being a little chubby and then shooting up and becoming a string bean many times during my childhood. It seems bizarre to me to put a child on a diet and as a parent to restrict your child... foot problem or not, I'd be getting a second opinion I feel like the weight "issue" is unrelated. If she has a foot problem take her to a podiatrist and see what they can do. Love your child for who she is, if she is happy with her weight quit pressuring her to lose she is her own person.
As already mentioned, the immediate health issue is addressed by medication and exercise, the long term problem is the one for which weight loss has been recommended.
Other than this, she is no longer growing, she has already had her growth spurt, and as verified by an x-ray, she will not gain any more height.4 -
DomesticKat wrote: »DomesticKat wrote: »If she's not complying, what are you going to do then? Tell school administration to watch her? Tell her friends to scold her if she doesn't eat what you designate for her? Seriously. If she is resentful of your current methodology and eating behind your back, that should be a serious warning sign to stop what you're doing before something more serious happens. As a mom of three daughters, I have a really difficult time understanding how a pediatrician would recommend weight loss and not send you to a registered dietitian in this scenario given the likelihood of it encouraging disordered eating in this age group.
She is still growing and going through puberty and barely overweight. The foot needs to be treated so she can be more active, and the "problem" with her weight will address itself if you're modeling healthy behavior and attitudes about weight and food. If you villainize food to her, this is a path you're going to have a really tough time returning from.
This doesn't seem right to me at all and you shouldn't be consulting strangers on the internet about it given your previous history of posting about your preoccupation with her weight. Warning flags all around.
I do not know how this works where you live, where I am dieticians do not have a very good reputation to be honest and drs rarely recommend them. The pediatric hospital does have a nutrition department, but appointments take forever plus they are supposed to address really serious problems, they are not there to help you lose a few kilos. The specialist we consulted works in the hospital and he told us he sees no reason to not just work on this at home by good all fashioned cutting calories, and the pediatrician also told us to take some time until Christmas to see if she will adjust to cutting calories a bit and if we see no change, then make an appointment.
If you hadn't already posted in the past about your preoccupation with your child's looks and weight, I might actually believe this. But I don't. What you're saying just doesn't add up. She needs her injury treated and she needs a parent to model healthy behavior about her body, weight, and food. Telling a child to drop to the bottom of a healthy BMI range without providing any further treatment for her injury or consulting with a dietitian on how to meet her unique nutritional needs as a growing child does not add up. MFP is not intended for use by or for children.
I have been preoccupied with her weight, because she has been preoccupied with her looks for a while. She is by no means thin, it is not some weird obsession she has, she is not really worryign much, just commenting here and there about her back or her hips. Which is not huge and not worth me "putting her on a diet " about. For aesthetic reasons, I would say she might need to lose 4-5 kilos, to make herself feel happier, but it would be up to her if it was aesthetics alone. Which I have never discussed with her so far, I do not criticise her looks. When she asks things like "does this tank top make me look chubby" I also say "no, you look great".
I am also not using MFP for her, exactly because it is not designed for teens.
The pediatrician also feels she needs to lose a few kilos to drop to the middle of BMI. For optimal health. So yes, this part has been something I have been preoccupied with, and have trying to make changes in what I buy and cook, although quality is not the issue, we eat little to no junk food, quantity is the issue.
Now the new dr has only added to all this, it is not out of the blue. I do not see anything weird here, she is a bit chubby, and there are medical concerns about it. I am not American, I understand being overweight or even obese is more normalised in the US, so this might be a problem here in people not understanding why marginally overweight per BMI is an issue?
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I live in Italy where people are thinner, and chubby kids do feel left out. I believe it's better to do something when they're younger. I would not tell her that I think she's overweight, I'd just quietly cut her portions a bit and add more protein. If she's swimming, she's going to be hungry after and needs to fuel those workouts (I swim). You can do your best at home, but when she's on her own she'll have to have her own initiative. I'm an American living in Italy, so understand, that's why you're getting push-back. You're right, the mentality is different. However, you're the mother and know your daughter. I have grown sons, unfortunately, you won't know if you've done the right thing for a long time. That's parenting.2
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My daughter has a problem with her legs and is right at the top of the normal range (our doctors use a wide "normal" area with a bit of red top and bottom of the curve for those with definite weight issues)
She's weighed regularly by her consultants and not once have they ever passed comment on her weight
As her mother I've explained anytime/ sometimes foods as if she had it her way she would live on cake and chocolate
My daughter wears splints to her knees because of her limb problems. The orthotics department make new ones if she out grows the old ones, they don't tell her to go lose weight2 -
I dont understand why no other treatment for her foot has been prescribed. And if she has muscle, she should never get to the low end of her BMI, she would be far more unhealthy. Sounds also like she has a negative body image already, and that's not something I would encourage to make worse.
As someone with foot issues requiring surgery, I'm here. No cortisone, no anti-inflammatories, no walking boot? Her body is still developing at 15, even if she's reached her adult height, and she needs calories to do that.
And even if weight loss is the needed treatment, you're giving her a deficit that is too big, she's hungry, and she's sneaking food.1 -
If she's worried about how the "fat" looks you may want to consider starting her on a weight lifting program. Swimming is a great cardio workout but doesn't help so much with muscle development.8
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So, let's see...
You have a teenager who isn't overweight but who has now been told she is. She also happens to have some concerns with body image, per your report. She exercises fairly vigorously. You are micromanaging her food consumption down to the nth calorie. Perhaps there is a medical issue impacting metabolic rate (odds militate against this).
And you can't figure out what's going on here? Really?
I can't speak for what the specialist may or may not have said. Nor can I speak for what the pediatrician said. I have no doubt that, when asked in front of you, your daughter confirmed she wanted to weigh less.* She would likely tell him/her the same thing in a private discussion as well. And I have no doubt your daughter, if asked by you, would tell you she is not eating anything outside of what's on your spreadsheets. *
Have you considered that your daughter may be interested in weighing less and looking different but not ready to do the actual work involved? Weight management is about delayed gratification and that is not something most teenagers are very good at. I'm just amazed that in this day and age, parents are still complicit in fat-shaming their [normal weight] daughters. Do you stand there while your daughter steps on the scale as well?
*I know this drill. Really well. It's what makes really good liars out of overweight people who then hide their eating. Except that my parents always knew. They just had to open their eyes and take a look.6 -
Not much to add here, but like others have said I would tread very, very carefully. This is an important developmental time for her both mentally and physically. I know things that were said to me almost offhandedly at that age are stuck in my psyche like glue. I understand wanting her to be healthy as possible physically, but don't overlook the long-term mental effects.7
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If she is a healthy weight and exercising, I don't think her foot problems are because of her weight. I'd look into other causes. I think you are pushing her too hard. If she was overweight I would agree with what you are doing. The bottom of the healthy bmi range is very small too unless you have very little muscle and a small frame.
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So I would be patient and wait for the test results. Also if she's eating small meals it may take awhile for her metabolism to kick into high gear. It could be any number of reasons why she isn't losing. Not everyone's metabolism works the same5
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Not much to add here, but like others have said I would tread very, very carefully. This is an important developmental time for her both mentally and physically. I know things that were said to me almost offhandedly at that age are stuck in my psyche like glue. I understand wanting her to be healthy as possible physically, but don't overlook the long-term mental effects.
Heck yes. My mum had a series of strokes before I was 10, by my teen years she would say some awful things about my weight (I went from very underweight to curvy with big boobs in a year)
I can see in pictures I was a totally healthy size but the damage was done
Along with the names I was accused of eating things I hadn't, she had the school watch me saying I was stealing food so I got to the point where I thought *kitten* it if I'm taking the blame anyway then I might as well just go ahead and eat
I still eat in secret so people can't judge me22 -
Evelyn_Gorfram wrote: »Probably a dumb question, but how old is the battery in your scale?
Recently changed, and the dr did use the hospital scale. By his calculations her BMI was 25.5.
She is muscular in back, arms and legs. But she also has a small chest, and definitely fat in her tummy area and hips.
A BMI of 25.5 is barely overweight, let alone "fat." It really does seem like you have issues with your daughter's weight/body type. Could your thoughts be influencing how you heard the doctors' advice?
Losing 10 kilos (22 pounds) really isn't "vanity weight" for a growing child.9 -
going from how you have discribe her figure you relly shouldnt be take any notice of her BMI
thats tellyou you she is the high end of her HEALTHY bmi (so still healthy) but assumes its fat keeping her at the high end when its actuall muscle.
if you are 100% your logging is accurate she is defo eating other things because 1500/1600 is low with the swimming she does, even being "not very active" the rest of the time she is not sat doing nothing, she is not sedantry.
Im just under 5ft 4. 32 with uncontrolled hypo thyroid (docs dont seem to be able to get my dose right) and loose 1-2lbs a week eating 1500. with no exercise
so I find it hard to believe if she is really sticking with that goal that she is not losing anything and infact gaining.
but also as said above its not been that long so give it a few more weeks before you cut her calories again.
she is a teenage girl who does intense exercise 3 times a week.....she needs fuel, for the swimming, for growing, for developing etc
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This is probably the strangest thing I have read all day. Children gain and lose weight as they grow, I remember being a little chubby and then shooting up and becoming a string bean many times during my childhood. It seems bizarre to me to put a child on a diet and as a parent to restrict your child... foot problem or not, I'd be getting a second opinion I feel like the weight "issue" is unrelated. If she has a foot problem take her to a podiatrist and see what they can do. Love your child for who she is, if she is happy with her weight quit pressuring her to lose she is her own person.
As already mentioned, the immediate health issue is addressed by medication and exercise, the long term problem is the one for which weight loss has been recommended.
Other than this, she is no longer growing, she has already had her growth spurt, and as verified by an x-ray, she will not gain any more height.
Women grow till they are 25 years old. She is most definitely still growing. Her hips may still broaden, her breasts might get larger, a lot of growth is not just height. Her muscles will also change.12 -
So, let's see...
You have a teenager who isn't overweight but who has now been told she is. She also happens to have some concerns with body image, per your report. She exercises fairly vigorously. You are micromanaging her food consumption down to the nth calorie. Perhaps there is a medical issue impacting metabolic rate (odds militate against this).
And you can't figure out what's going on here? Really?
I can't speak for what the specialist may or may not have said. Nor can I speak for what the pediatrician said. I have no doubt that, when asked in front of you, your daughter confirmed she wanted to weigh less.* She would likely tell him/her the same thing in a private discussion as well. And I have no doubt your daughter, if asked by you, would tell you she is not eating anything outside of what's on your spreadsheets. *
Have you considered that your daughter may be interested in weighing less and looking different but not ready to do the actual work involved? Weight management is about delayed gratification and that is not something most teenagers are very good at. I'm just amazed that in this day and age, parents are still complicit in fat-shaming their [normal weight] daughters. Do you stand there while your daughter steps on the scale as well?
*I know this drill. Really well. It's what makes really good liars out of overweight people who then hide their eating. Except that my parents always knew. They just had to open their eyes and take a look.
^^^^^^
All of this x10.
If she has a foot injury, take her to a podiatrist or orthopedic specialist. There's a gazillion things to try before making a healthy-weight teen girl who is still growing have to diet.
If YOU don't like how your daughter looks at a healthy weight (eg 'could stand to lose a few kgs), you should probably see a therapist as to why this is such an issue for you rather than projecting these issues on to your daughter. I assure you, you are doing more harm than good.
Keep your home stocked with healthy foods. Tell your daughter you love her. Tell her how strong she is and how proud you are at how hard she works.14 -
Since your dd is not very overweight at all then her calorie deficit should be small (250 calories) and her weight loss slow. It has only been 15 days. If she is under a doctor's care you should probably consult the doctor to help you figure out her issues. Weight loss is going to take time. Healing her foot will take time. Don't stress about this.
If the doctor's advice to lose that much weight seems wrong don't feel you have to push your dd to do that. Seek another medical opinion on her foot and weight.
The calorie goal you figured may be wrong. You might not be getting accurate amounts recorded or your dd is not telling you everything.
Instead of figuring out her tdee from a web site likely intended for adults, it might be better to start with tracking what she normally eats and drinks as accurately as you both can and then change her diet by a couple hundred calories from what she usually consumes. That is what I did first when my dd needed to gain weight. After a few weeks we did not track as strictly unless dd stopped gaining.
If your dd has a foot problem I assume her non-exercise activity has probably reduced along with exercise. Take that into account. She may be retaining water currently.
Also different scales are different so if you are comparing a home scale to weight at the doctor office that might be part of the issue.4 -
There is a disorder that could be causing this problem. I suggest you immediately see a specialist and let him/her know you are concerned about munchausen by proxy. Hopefully they can provide the help you need to overcome this problem and your daughter can go back to being a 15yo kid. Otherwise, I fear for your daughters future mental health and well being.12
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I think this is going to cause an eating disorder, please be careful1
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Just asking the rest of the community, but maybe because she swims competitively, she has more muscle than the average teen, and the BMI isn't really accurate for her? And are BMI stats accurate for children anyways? She may just not have much fat to lose, so it will be slow.3
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