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What new or revised public policy/law would make it easier for people to maintain a healthy weight?
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Replies
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GaleHawkins wrote: »The more the USA government has gotten involved on telling people how the eat the fatter people have become it seems to me.
...other way around...
People do not follow government guidelines very well but the for profit manufacturing side will even when guidelines are medically unproven. People eat what is in front of them just like I did as a child eating from the garden and pasture field. There were no leftovers to have to put away after most meals.
We know today obesity is more a factor of what kind of calories we feed the body than how many calories we eat because the total calorie count has on average stayed the same. I still eat 2000-3000 calories daily staying away from processed foods containing added sugars and or any form of any grains.
I just got back from the huge annual insurance claims event PLRB and did not gain or loss a pound of weight unlike when eating my old WOE (Way of Eating) that I left Oct 2014 at the age of 63. In the past I always gained more than just water weight.14 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »The more the USA government has gotten involved on telling people how the eat the fatter people have become it seems to me.
...other way around...
People do not follow government guidelines very well but the for profit manufacturing side will even when guidelines are medically unproven. People eat what is in front of them just like I did as a child eating from the garden and pasture field. There were no leftovers to have to put away after most meals.
We know today obesity is more a factor of what kind of calories we feed the body than how many calories we eat because the total calorie count has on average stayed the same. I still eat 2000-3000 calories daily staying away from processed foods containing added sugars and or any form of any grains.
I just got back from the huge annual insurance claims event PLRB and did not gain or loss a pound of weight unlike when eating my old WOE (Way of Eating) that I left Oct 2014 at the age of 63. In the past I always gained more than just water weight.
Food isn't magically appearing in front of us. Adults either purchase their own food or have it purchased by a spouse or partner. We are responsible for the food we're choosing and it's clear from data that many Americans are *not* following the dietary guidelines provided by the government.
We do not "know" that obesity is more of a factor of the "kind of calories" we're eating.6 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »The more the USA government has gotten involved on telling people how the eat the fatter people have become it seems to me.
...other way around...
People do not follow government guidelines very well but the for profit manufacturing side will even when guidelines are medically unproven. People eat what is in front of them just like I did as a child eating from the garden and pasture field. There were no leftovers to have to put away after most meals.
We know today obesity is more a factor of what kind of calories we feed the body than how many calories we eat because the total calorie count has on average stayed the same. I still eat 2000-3000 calories daily staying away from processed foods containing added sugars and or any form of any grains.
I just got back from the huge annual insurance claims event PLRB and did not gain or loss a pound of weight unlike when eating my old WOE (Way of Eating) that I left Oct 2014 at the age of 63. In the past I always gained more than just water weight.
I would be exceptionally surprised if any part of the bolded sentence were true.8 -
Theoldguy1 wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »The more the USA government has gotten involved on telling people how the eat the fatter people have become it seems to me.
I disagree. If people followed the Dietary Guidelines for Americans the overweight/obesity level would be significantly lower.
https://health.gov/dietaryguidelines/2015/guidelines/
The problem is, 'people' do not follow any reasonable guidelines these days, they follow 'Instagram influencers'.... My question at this point would be, do they lack education on health issues, or do they lack education in general, to take advise from some online sensation...?
I don't know what it is that causes people to follow some online guru. Sadly, I think plenty of educated people who should be able to vet sources do it too.3 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »The more the USA government has gotten involved on telling people how the eat the fatter people have become it seems to me.
...other way around...
People do not follow government guidelines very well but the for profit manufacturing side will even when guidelines are medically unproven.
The guidelines are basically eat more veg and fruit and switch from white to whole grains and consume added sugar and added fat in limited amounts.
The for-profit side puts out stuff that's popular. Tons of paleo and keto things these days and things marketed as "no sugar!", not any more nutritious in many cases than the old "low fat!" snacks (which no one legitimately thought were health food when they were cookies and such).People eat what is in front of them just like I did as a child eating from the garden and pasture field.
Hmm. What's "in front of me" is what I choose to cook or otherwise to put in front of me.There were no leftovers to have to put away after most meals.
We had leftovers eating mostly whole foods when I was a kid. I intentionally create meals where there will be leftovers now, as they are helpful for bringing lunch.We know today obesity is more a factor of what kind of calories we feed the body than how many calories we eat because the total calorie count has on average stayed the same.
No, we do not know this. The credible studies demonstrate that calories have increased a lot (including from fat!). There are NO credible studies that show that calories don't dictate weight loss, maintenance, or gain. All studies controlled for calories demonstrate that calories ARE the factor.
What you choose to eat, in a non controlled environment, probably determines how likely you are to overeat. If someone ate like the guidelines, they'd (on average) be less likely to overeat than if they ate some other ways that are common in the US currently. Indeed, you have frequently explained how you used to eat, and it was nothing like the guidelines.I still eat 2000-3000 calories daily staying away from processed foods containing added sugars and or any form of any grains.
You have frequently mentioned eating processed foods, not that there's anything wrong with that.
You don't track your calories, do you?
Many men eat 2000-3000 cal a day and maintain, as I believe you have said you are doing.I just got back from the huge annual insurance claims event PLRB and did not gain or loss a pound of weight unlike when eating my old WOE (Way of Eating) that I left Oct 2014 at the age of 63. In the past I always gained more than just water weight.
Rather obviously your current dietary restrictions -- which I agree seem to work for you -- made a lot of the foods you typically would have eaten off-limits. The same is true if one is doing W30 or 100% plant-based or logging and decides not to make an exception for the special event. None of that goes to the worth of the guidelines being discussed or to the effect of calories.9 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »The more the USA government has gotten involved on telling people how the eat the fatter people have become it seems to me.
...other way around...
People do not follow government guidelines very well but the for profit manufacturing side will even when guidelines are medically unproven.
The guidelines are basically eat more veg and fruit and switch from white to whole grains and consume added sugar and added fat in limited amounts.
The for-profit side puts out stuff that's popular. Tons of paleo and keto things these days and things marketed as "no sugar!", not any more nutritious in many cases than the old "low fat!" snacks (which no one legitimately thought were health food when they were cookies and such).People eat what is in front of them just like I did as a child eating from the garden and pasture field.
Hmm. What's "in front of me" is what I choose to cook or otherwise to put in front of me.There were no leftovers to have to put away after most meals.
We had leftovers eating mostly whole foods when I was a kid. I intentionally create meals where there will be leftovers now, as they are helpful for bringing lunch.We know today obesity is more a factor of what kind of calories we feed the body than how many calories we eat because the total calorie count has on average stayed the same.
No, we do not know this. The credible studies demonstrate that calories have increased a lot (including from fat!). There are NO credible studies that show that calories don't dictate weight loss, maintenance, or gain. All studies controlled for calories demonstrate that calories ARE the factor.
What you choose to eat, in a non controlled environment, probably determines how likely you are to overeat. If someone ate like the guidelines, they'd (on average) be less likely to overeat than if they ate some other ways that are common in the US currently. Indeed, you have frequently explained how you used to eat, and it was nothing like the guidelines.I still eat 2000-3000 calories daily staying away from processed foods containing added sugars and or any form of any grains.
You have frequently mentioned eating processed foods, not that there's anything wrong with that.
You don't track your calories, do you?
Many men eat 2000-3000 cal a day and maintain, as I believe you have said you are doing.I just got back from the huge annual insurance claims event PLRB and did not gain or loss a pound of weight unlike when eating my old WOE (Way of Eating) that I left Oct 2014 at the age of 63. In the past I always gained more than just water weight.
Rather obviously your current dietary restrictions -- which I agree seem to work for you -- made a lot of the foods you typically would have eaten off-limits. The same is true if one is doing W30 or 100% plant-based or logging and decides not to make an exception for the special event. None of that goes to the worth of the guidelines being discussed or to the effect of calories.
While cause and effects can be hard to define at least we can agree that since the event of government eating guidelines in the USA have been established that obesity, diabetes, cancer, etc have become worse.10 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »The more the USA government has gotten involved on telling people how the eat the fatter people have become it seems to me.
...other way around...
People do not follow government guidelines very well but the for profit manufacturing side will even when guidelines are medically unproven.
The guidelines are basically eat more veg and fruit and switch from white to whole grains and consume added sugar and added fat in limited amounts.
The for-profit side puts out stuff that's popular. Tons of paleo and keto things these days and things marketed as "no sugar!", not any more nutritious in many cases than the old "low fat!" snacks (which no one legitimately thought were health food when they were cookies and such).People eat what is in front of them just like I did as a child eating from the garden and pasture field.
Hmm. What's "in front of me" is what I choose to cook or otherwise to put in front of me.There were no leftovers to have to put away after most meals.
We had leftovers eating mostly whole foods when I was a kid. I intentionally create meals where there will be leftovers now, as they are helpful for bringing lunch.We know today obesity is more a factor of what kind of calories we feed the body than how many calories we eat because the total calorie count has on average stayed the same.
No, we do not know this. The credible studies demonstrate that calories have increased a lot (including from fat!). There are NO credible studies that show that calories don't dictate weight loss, maintenance, or gain. All studies controlled for calories demonstrate that calories ARE the factor.
What you choose to eat, in a non controlled environment, probably determines how likely you are to overeat. If someone ate like the guidelines, they'd (on average) be less likely to overeat than if they ate some other ways that are common in the US currently. Indeed, you have frequently explained how you used to eat, and it was nothing like the guidelines.I still eat 2000-3000 calories daily staying away from processed foods containing added sugars and or any form of any grains.
You have frequently mentioned eating processed foods, not that there's anything wrong with that.
You don't track your calories, do you?
Many men eat 2000-3000 cal a day and maintain, as I believe you have said you are doing.I just got back from the huge annual insurance claims event PLRB and did not gain or loss a pound of weight unlike when eating my old WOE (Way of Eating) that I left Oct 2014 at the age of 63. In the past I always gained more than just water weight.
Rather obviously your current dietary restrictions -- which I agree seem to work for you -- made a lot of the foods you typically would have eaten off-limits. The same is true if one is doing W30 or 100% plant-based or logging and decides not to make an exception for the special event. None of that goes to the worth of the guidelines being discussed or to the effect of calories.
While cause and effects can be hard to define at least we can agree that since the event of government eating guidelines in the USA have been established that obesity, diabetes, cancer, etc have become worse.
All-site cancer incidence and mortality have been declining in the US, generally since some point in the 1990s, depending on what trend you're looking at. Speculated to be related to reduced smoking, I believe. (Perhaps the government had something to do with that decline?
).
https://seer.cancer.gov/csr/1975_2015/browse_csr.php?sectionSEL=2&pageSEL=sect_02_table.01
7 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »The more the USA government has gotten involved on telling people how the eat the fatter people have become it seems to me.
...other way around...
People do not follow government guidelines very well but the for profit manufacturing side will even when guidelines are medically unproven.
The guidelines are basically eat more veg and fruit and switch from white to whole grains and consume added sugar and added fat in limited amounts.
The for-profit side puts out stuff that's popular. Tons of paleo and keto things these days and things marketed as "no sugar!", not any more nutritious in many cases than the old "low fat!" snacks (which no one legitimately thought were health food when they were cookies and such).People eat what is in front of them just like I did as a child eating from the garden and pasture field.
Hmm. What's "in front of me" is what I choose to cook or otherwise to put in front of me.There were no leftovers to have to put away after most meals.
We had leftovers eating mostly whole foods when I was a kid. I intentionally create meals where there will be leftovers now, as they are helpful for bringing lunch.We know today obesity is more a factor of what kind of calories we feed the body than how many calories we eat because the total calorie count has on average stayed the same.
No, we do not know this. The credible studies demonstrate that calories have increased a lot (including from fat!). There are NO credible studies that show that calories don't dictate weight loss, maintenance, or gain. All studies controlled for calories demonstrate that calories ARE the factor.
What you choose to eat, in a non controlled environment, probably determines how likely you are to overeat. If someone ate like the guidelines, they'd (on average) be less likely to overeat than if they ate some other ways that are common in the US currently. Indeed, you have frequently explained how you used to eat, and it was nothing like the guidelines.I still eat 2000-3000 calories daily staying away from processed foods containing added sugars and or any form of any grains.
You have frequently mentioned eating processed foods, not that there's anything wrong with that.
You don't track your calories, do you?
Many men eat 2000-3000 cal a day and maintain, as I believe you have said you are doing.I just got back from the huge annual insurance claims event PLRB and did not gain or loss a pound of weight unlike when eating my old WOE (Way of Eating) that I left Oct 2014 at the age of 63. In the past I always gained more than just water weight.
Rather obviously your current dietary restrictions -- which I agree seem to work for you -- made a lot of the foods you typically would have eaten off-limits. The same is true if one is doing W30 or 100% plant-based or logging and decides not to make an exception for the special event. None of that goes to the worth of the guidelines being discussed or to the effect of calories.
While cause and effects can be hard to define at least we can agree that since the event of government eating guidelines in the USA have been established that obesity, diabetes, cancer, etc have become worse.
No, we cannot.5 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »The more the USA government has gotten involved on telling people how the eat the fatter people have become it seems to me.
...other way around...
People do not follow government guidelines very well but the for profit manufacturing side will even when guidelines are medically unproven.
The guidelines are basically eat more veg and fruit and switch from white to whole grains and consume added sugar and added fat in limited amounts.
The for-profit side puts out stuff that's popular. Tons of paleo and keto things these days and things marketed as "no sugar!", not any more nutritious in many cases than the old "low fat!" snacks (which no one legitimately thought were health food when they were cookies and such).People eat what is in front of them just like I did as a child eating from the garden and pasture field.
Hmm. What's "in front of me" is what I choose to cook or otherwise to put in front of me.There were no leftovers to have to put away after most meals.
We had leftovers eating mostly whole foods when I was a kid. I intentionally create meals where there will be leftovers now, as they are helpful for bringing lunch.We know today obesity is more a factor of what kind of calories we feed the body than how many calories we eat because the total calorie count has on average stayed the same.
No, we do not know this. The credible studies demonstrate that calories have increased a lot (including from fat!). There are NO credible studies that show that calories don't dictate weight loss, maintenance, or gain. All studies controlled for calories demonstrate that calories ARE the factor.
What you choose to eat, in a non controlled environment, probably determines how likely you are to overeat. If someone ate like the guidelines, they'd (on average) be less likely to overeat than if they ate some other ways that are common in the US currently. Indeed, you have frequently explained how you used to eat, and it was nothing like the guidelines.I still eat 2000-3000 calories daily staying away from processed foods containing added sugars and or any form of any grains.
You have frequently mentioned eating processed foods, not that there's anything wrong with that.
You don't track your calories, do you?
Many men eat 2000-3000 cal a day and maintain, as I believe you have said you are doing.I just got back from the huge annual insurance claims event PLRB and did not gain or loss a pound of weight unlike when eating my old WOE (Way of Eating) that I left Oct 2014 at the age of 63. In the past I always gained more than just water weight.
Rather obviously your current dietary restrictions -- which I agree seem to work for you -- made a lot of the foods you typically would have eaten off-limits. The same is true if one is doing W30 or 100% plant-based or logging and decides not to make an exception for the special event. None of that goes to the worth of the guidelines being discussed or to the effect of calories.
While cause and effects can be hard to define at least we can agree that since the event of government eating guidelines in the USA have been established that obesity, diabetes, cancer, etc have become worse.
No, we cannot.
Ok scratch the cancer then we can all agree there are higher rates of obesity and diabetes then 50 years ago in the USA.6 -
People also have more access to food of all kinds and live longer. Trying to pretend it's related to the dietary guidelines is silly. The dietary guidelines say eat more veg and fruit, and the populations that live the least long and get T2D and are obese are indirectly correlated with those who eat the most veg and fruit.9
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GaleHawkins wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »The more the USA government has gotten involved on telling people how the eat the fatter people have become it seems to me.
...other way around...
People do not follow government guidelines very well but the for profit manufacturing side will even when guidelines are medically unproven.
The guidelines are basically eat more veg and fruit and switch from white to whole grains and consume added sugar and added fat in limited amounts.
The for-profit side puts out stuff that's popular. Tons of paleo and keto things these days and things marketed as "no sugar!", not any more nutritious in many cases than the old "low fat!" snacks (which no one legitimately thought were health food when they were cookies and such).People eat what is in front of them just like I did as a child eating from the garden and pasture field.
Hmm. What's "in front of me" is what I choose to cook or otherwise to put in front of me.There were no leftovers to have to put away after most meals.
We had leftovers eating mostly whole foods when I was a kid. I intentionally create meals where there will be leftovers now, as they are helpful for bringing lunch.We know today obesity is more a factor of what kind of calories we feed the body than how many calories we eat because the total calorie count has on average stayed the same.
No, we do not know this. The credible studies demonstrate that calories have increased a lot (including from fat!). There are NO credible studies that show that calories don't dictate weight loss, maintenance, or gain. All studies controlled for calories demonstrate that calories ARE the factor.
What you choose to eat, in a non controlled environment, probably determines how likely you are to overeat. If someone ate like the guidelines, they'd (on average) be less likely to overeat than if they ate some other ways that are common in the US currently. Indeed, you have frequently explained how you used to eat, and it was nothing like the guidelines.I still eat 2000-3000 calories daily staying away from processed foods containing added sugars and or any form of any grains.
You have frequently mentioned eating processed foods, not that there's anything wrong with that.
You don't track your calories, do you?
Many men eat 2000-3000 cal a day and maintain, as I believe you have said you are doing.I just got back from the huge annual insurance claims event PLRB and did not gain or loss a pound of weight unlike when eating my old WOE (Way of Eating) that I left Oct 2014 at the age of 63. In the past I always gained more than just water weight.
Rather obviously your current dietary restrictions -- which I agree seem to work for you -- made a lot of the foods you typically would have eaten off-limits. The same is true if one is doing W30 or 100% plant-based or logging and decides not to make an exception for the special event. None of that goes to the worth of the guidelines being discussed or to the effect of calories.
While cause and effects can be hard to define at least we can agree that since the event of government eating guidelines in the USA have been established that obesity, diabetes, cancer, etc have become worse.
Curious, I looked it up: Better than just asserting stuff, in my book.
The USDA seems to have issued advisories on food and eating as early as 1916, full eating guidance about 1940.
So, "since", maybe yes. Related? That would be one heckuva delayed pernicious effect. 6 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »The more the USA government has gotten involved on telling people how the eat the fatter people have become it seems to me.
...other way around...
People do not follow government guidelines very well but the for profit manufacturing side will even when guidelines are medically unproven.
The guidelines are basically eat more veg and fruit and switch from white to whole grains and consume added sugar and added fat in limited amounts.
The for-profit side puts out stuff that's popular. Tons of paleo and keto things these days and things marketed as "no sugar!", not any more nutritious in many cases than the old "low fat!" snacks (which no one legitimately thought were health food when they were cookies and such).People eat what is in front of them just like I did as a child eating from the garden and pasture field.
Hmm. What's "in front of me" is what I choose to cook or otherwise to put in front of me.There were no leftovers to have to put away after most meals.
We had leftovers eating mostly whole foods when I was a kid. I intentionally create meals where there will be leftovers now, as they are helpful for bringing lunch.We know today obesity is more a factor of what kind of calories we feed the body than how many calories we eat because the total calorie count has on average stayed the same.
No, we do not know this. The credible studies demonstrate that calories have increased a lot (including from fat!). There are NO credible studies that show that calories don't dictate weight loss, maintenance, or gain. All studies controlled for calories demonstrate that calories ARE the factor.
What you choose to eat, in a non controlled environment, probably determines how likely you are to overeat. If someone ate like the guidelines, they'd (on average) be less likely to overeat than if they ate some other ways that are common in the US currently. Indeed, you have frequently explained how you used to eat, and it was nothing like the guidelines.I still eat 2000-3000 calories daily staying away from processed foods containing added sugars and or any form of any grains.
You have frequently mentioned eating processed foods, not that there's anything wrong with that.
You don't track your calories, do you?
Many men eat 2000-3000 cal a day and maintain, as I believe you have said you are doing.I just got back from the huge annual insurance claims event PLRB and did not gain or loss a pound of weight unlike when eating my old WOE (Way of Eating) that I left Oct 2014 at the age of 63. In the past I always gained more than just water weight.
Rather obviously your current dietary restrictions -- which I agree seem to work for you -- made a lot of the foods you typically would have eaten off-limits. The same is true if one is doing W30 or 100% plant-based or logging and decides not to make an exception for the special event. None of that goes to the worth of the guidelines being discussed or to the effect of calories.
While cause and effects can be hard to define at least we can agree that since the event of government eating guidelines in the USA have been established that obesity, diabetes, cancer, etc have become worse.
No, we cannot.
Ok scratch the cancer then we can all agree there are higher rates of obesity and diabetes then 50 years ago in the USA.
Correlation does not imply causation.2 -
Theoldguy1 wrote: »UK based and relevant to me would be elimination of multi-portion snacks, and a complete revision of the working hours of the week for fewer hours . So much of the year is spent going to work in the dark, coming home in the dark so to be able to fit exercise in (naturally active time, not "going to the gym" exercise) you have to either have an active job or use your lunch time. Plenty of people work longer hours than I do, but I find 7.5hours stuck at a desk really frustrating.
Just curious do you expect less pay for less work? If that's the case, at least in the US you can get part time work.
I would happily take a 20% pay cut for a 32 hour work week. Unfortunately, not all positions are available part-time.1 -
Heaven forbid we should think the gubmint saw a problem coming, and tried to mitigate it by providing guidelines!**
Better to assume that the guidelines somehow caused the problems, since obviously the mere fact that Big Food influenced The Deep State to tell us to eat more veggies would be sufficient for us liberty-loving, free-thinking, independent souls to do the exact opposite and head for the soda pop and fast food in righteous rebellion.
** Yeah, the timing is still wrong, at least for the previously-cited health trends; and we certainly could critique the guidelines as ineffective. I haven't really seen any super-brilliant alternative suggestions on this thread, though, and the gubmint is mostly just a bunch of people like us, neither nefarious plotters nor brilliant social-engineering strategists. So we bumble along . . . .6 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »The more the USA government has gotten involved on telling people how the eat the fatter people have become it seems to me.
...other way around...
People do not follow government guidelines very well but the for profit manufacturing side will even when guidelines are medically unproven.
The guidelines are basically eat more veg and fruit and switch from white to whole grains and consume added sugar and added fat in limited amounts.
The for-profit side puts out stuff that's popular. Tons of paleo and keto things these days and things marketed as "no sugar!", not any more nutritious in many cases than the old "low fat!" snacks (which no one legitimately thought were health food when they were cookies and such).People eat what is in front of them just like I did as a child eating from the garden and pasture field.
Hmm. What's "in front of me" is what I choose to cook or otherwise to put in front of me.There were no leftovers to have to put away after most meals.
We had leftovers eating mostly whole foods when I was a kid. I intentionally create meals where there will be leftovers now, as they are helpful for bringing lunch.We know today obesity is more a factor of what kind of calories we feed the body than how many calories we eat because the total calorie count has on average stayed the same.
No, we do not know this. The credible studies demonstrate that calories have increased a lot (including from fat!). There are NO credible studies that show that calories don't dictate weight loss, maintenance, or gain. All studies controlled for calories demonstrate that calories ARE the factor.
What you choose to eat, in a non controlled environment, probably determines how likely you are to overeat. If someone ate like the guidelines, they'd (on average) be less likely to overeat than if they ate some other ways that are common in the US currently. Indeed, you have frequently explained how you used to eat, and it was nothing like the guidelines.I still eat 2000-3000 calories daily staying away from processed foods containing added sugars and or any form of any grains.
You have frequently mentioned eating processed foods, not that there's anything wrong with that.
You don't track your calories, do you?
Many men eat 2000-3000 cal a day and maintain, as I believe you have said you are doing.I just got back from the huge annual insurance claims event PLRB and did not gain or loss a pound of weight unlike when eating my old WOE (Way of Eating) that I left Oct 2014 at the age of 63. In the past I always gained more than just water weight.
Rather obviously your current dietary restrictions -- which I agree seem to work for you -- made a lot of the foods you typically would have eaten off-limits. The same is true if one is doing W30 or 100% plant-based or logging and decides not to make an exception for the special event. None of that goes to the worth of the guidelines being discussed or to the effect of calories.
While cause and effects can be hard to define at least we can agree that since the event of government eating guidelines in the USA have been established that obesity, diabetes, cancer, etc have become worse.
The guidelines aren't being followed by most people, hence the results.5 -
These conditions have also worsened since the Kennedy assassination, the moon landing, Watergate, and the death of Gene Roddenberry...7
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estherdragonbat wrote: »These conditions have also worsened since the Kennedy assassination, the moon landing, Watergate, and the death of Gene Roddenberry...
So clearly the dietary guidelines caused all those things too.3 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »The more the USA government has gotten involved on telling people how the eat the fatter people have become it seems to me.
...other way around...
People do not follow government guidelines very well but the for profit manufacturing side will even when guidelines are medically unproven.
The guidelines are basically eat more veg and fruit and switch from white to whole grains and consume added sugar and added fat in limited amounts.
The for-profit side puts out stuff that's popular. Tons of paleo and keto things these days and things marketed as "no sugar!", not any more nutritious in many cases than the old "low fat!" snacks (which no one legitimately thought were health food when they were cookies and such).People eat what is in front of them just like I did as a child eating from the garden and pasture field.
Hmm. What's "in front of me" is what I choose to cook or otherwise to put in front of me.There were no leftovers to have to put away after most meals.
We had leftovers eating mostly whole foods when I was a kid. I intentionally create meals where there will be leftovers now, as they are helpful for bringing lunch.We know today obesity is more a factor of what kind of calories we feed the body than how many calories we eat because the total calorie count has on average stayed the same.
No, we do not know this. The credible studies demonstrate that calories have increased a lot (including from fat!). There are NO credible studies that show that calories don't dictate weight loss, maintenance, or gain. All studies controlled for calories demonstrate that calories ARE the factor.
What you choose to eat, in a non controlled environment, probably determines how likely you are to overeat. If someone ate like the guidelines, they'd (on average) be less likely to overeat than if they ate some other ways that are common in the US currently. Indeed, you have frequently explained how you used to eat, and it was nothing like the guidelines.I still eat 2000-3000 calories daily staying away from processed foods containing added sugars and or any form of any grains.
You have frequently mentioned eating processed foods, not that there's anything wrong with that.
You don't track your calories, do you?
Many men eat 2000-3000 cal a day and maintain, as I believe you have said you are doing.I just got back from the huge annual insurance claims event PLRB and did not gain or loss a pound of weight unlike when eating my old WOE (Way of Eating) that I left Oct 2014 at the age of 63. In the past I always gained more than just water weight.
Rather obviously your current dietary restrictions -- which I agree seem to work for you -- made a lot of the foods you typically would have eaten off-limits. The same is true if one is doing W30 or 100% plant-based or logging and decides not to make an exception for the special event. None of that goes to the worth of the guidelines being discussed or to the effect of calories.
While cause and effects can be hard to define at least we can agree that since the event of government eating guidelines in the USA have been established that obesity, diabetes, cancer, etc have become worse.
No, we cannot.
Ok scratch the cancer then we can all agree there are higher rates of obesity and diabetes then 50 years ago in the USA.
Correlation does not imply causation.
It never has and never will just like with Round-Up. It takes provable science to prove causation. Emotions and science are not the same thing.3 -
Theoldguy1 wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »The more the USA government has gotten involved on telling people how the eat the fatter people have become it seems to me.
...other way around...
People do not follow government guidelines very well but the for profit manufacturing side will even when guidelines are medically unproven.
The guidelines are basically eat more veg and fruit and switch from white to whole grains and consume added sugar and added fat in limited amounts.
The for-profit side puts out stuff that's popular. Tons of paleo and keto things these days and things marketed as "no sugar!", not any more nutritious in many cases than the old "low fat!" snacks (which no one legitimately thought were health food when they were cookies and such).People eat what is in front of them just like I did as a child eating from the garden and pasture field.
Hmm. What's "in front of me" is what I choose to cook or otherwise to put in front of me.There were no leftovers to have to put away after most meals.
We had leftovers eating mostly whole foods when I was a kid. I intentionally create meals where there will be leftovers now, as they are helpful for bringing lunch.We know today obesity is more a factor of what kind of calories we feed the body than how many calories we eat because the total calorie count has on average stayed the same.
No, we do not know this. The credible studies demonstrate that calories have increased a lot (including from fat!). There are NO credible studies that show that calories don't dictate weight loss, maintenance, or gain. All studies controlled for calories demonstrate that calories ARE the factor.
What you choose to eat, in a non controlled environment, probably determines how likely you are to overeat. If someone ate like the guidelines, they'd (on average) be less likely to overeat than if they ate some other ways that are common in the US currently. Indeed, you have frequently explained how you used to eat, and it was nothing like the guidelines.I still eat 2000-3000 calories daily staying away from processed foods containing added sugars and or any form of any grains.
You have frequently mentioned eating processed foods, not that there's anything wrong with that.
You don't track your calories, do you?
Many men eat 2000-3000 cal a day and maintain, as I believe you have said you are doing.I just got back from the huge annual insurance claims event PLRB and did not gain or loss a pound of weight unlike when eating my old WOE (Way of Eating) that I left Oct 2014 at the age of 63. In the past I always gained more than just water weight.
Rather obviously your current dietary restrictions -- which I agree seem to work for you -- made a lot of the foods you typically would have eaten off-limits. The same is true if one is doing W30 or 100% plant-based or logging and decides not to make an exception for the special event. None of that goes to the worth of the guidelines being discussed or to the effect of calories.
While cause and effects can be hard to define at least we can agree that since the event of government eating guidelines in the USA have been established that obesity, diabetes, cancer, etc have become worse.
The guidelines aren't being followed by most people, hence the results.
Or the guidelines are being followed by most people but the guidelines are based on flawed research.7 -
We have evidence that demonstrates that most people do not follow the guidelines.6
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