Switching to veggie for health benefits

lemurcat2

NovusDies wrote: »

asliceofjackie wrote: »

AnnPT77 wrote: »

So lowball the protein content? I know I'm just expressing a crazy USAian thought here, but no, thank you.

According to our recommendations you will get enough protein if you eat a balanced diet and unless you're a body builder you will probably be just fine.

But really, it all comes down to a difference of opinion and I can appreciate what you're saying without agreeing with it.

I think the part you are not really grasping is the point I tried to make earlier today. It is not a switch that just anyone can flip easily. If it is not easy it might challenge adherence and impede weight loss.

It would probably be in my wheelhouse to transition to vegetarianism. I know my way around plant based proteins, I have meatless days on a regular basis because I like the variety, and I am a good cook. I am not going to do it though because it is too much of a change for me. As much as I love fish and I get most of amount of my non pb protein there I am not even willing to risk going full pescatarian. The reason is my health. I still have a lot of weight to lose and that is my number 1 priority. I am sticking with what is easiest for me and what is easiest is having most of the menu available to me.

I am already in better health and it will continue to improve on the road I am on. I don't need to throw in any extra rules or requirements.

She seems to be assuming it's easy since you just buy fake meat and sub it for meat. Not only is that not necessarily healthy and likely lower protein, but I doubt it's satisfying for most. When I eat vegetarian/plant based, I use a bunch of more ethnic foods from cultures where meatless is more common. I don't replace my steak with some minced tofu, ugh.

But you can't just sub tofu for meat, even if you want to eat that much of it (I'm not anti soy at all, but like to limit it to one meal per day at most), since the protein does not match up. And protein is for many, many people a very satisfying and satiating macro.

asliceofjackie

lemurcat2 wrote: »

Then please cite a source.

It was hard but I managed to find the NNR in English for you and here's a quote of exactly what I've been trying to say (minus the health aspect since we haven't covered that so much).

"The low energy density and the physico-chemical properties of most plant foods can contribute to weight maintenance. Because obesity and excessive body fat are established risk factors for most chronic diseases, including many types of cancer, low energy-density diets might also contribute to protection against a majority of chronic diseases."

Here's the full latest NNR (Nordic Nutrition Recommendation) 2012: http://norden.diva-portal.org/smash/get/diva2:704251/FULLTEXT01.pdf

There's also this:

"Mycket mat – lite kalorier

Grönsaker, frukt, rotfrukter, bönor och magra mjölkprodukter innehåller mycket vatten och/eller fibrer och lite kalorier i förhållande till vikt och volym. Därför kan man äta mycket av sådan mat utan att få i sig så mycket energi.

Fiberrika grönsaker som morötter, broccoli, kålrot och vitkål, vita bönor, kidneybönor, kikärtor, linser, ärtor och gröna bönor ger mycket fibrer och näring och mättar bra utan att ge så mycket kalorier."

Which is a direct quote from Livsmedelsverket (I think the US equivalent is USDA).
Here's the translation, use Google if you don't trust me to correct translate it.

"Lots of food - few calories

Vegetables, fruit, root vegetables, beans and low-fat dairy products contain a lot of water and/or fiber and a small amount of calories with respect to weight and volume. Therefore you can eat a lot of such food without getting a lot of energy (here meaning calories).

Vegetables rich in fiber such as carrots, broccoli, cabbage(s), white beans, kidney beans, chick peas, lentils, peas and green beans give a lot of fiber and nutrition, and will satiate you without having too many calories."

Source: https://www.livsmedelsverket.se/matvanor-halsa--miljo/dieter-och-viktnedgang1

Then there's this quote from Livsmedelsverket:

"En del är rädda för att proteinintaget ska bli för lågt med vegetarisk mat, men det är sällan något bekymmer."

Again translated by me.

"Some people are scared or worried that their protein intake will be too low with vegetarian food, this is however rarely an issue."

Source: https://www.livsmedelsverket.se/matvanor-halsa--miljo/kostrad-och-matvanor/vegetarisk-mat-for-vuxna

I don't know why, but I slightly feel like I'm defending the entire nation of Sweden at this point, lol. It's just in our culture to substitute meat with meat substitutes when we eat a vegetarian or vegan meal. It's probably (obviously) not the same everywhere.

@lemurcat2 Most meat substitutes are perfectly healthy and fine. Mostly you would substitute any minced meat with minced vegetarian options like tofu, oumph, soy or quorn and then recreate the same foods such as meatballs etc. So there's pretty much no difference between the vegetarian and the non-vegetarian dish in the end. This satisfies all vegetarians I know, including myself when I eat vegetarian food.

NovusDies

lemurcat2 wrote: »

NovusDies wrote: »

asliceofjackie wrote: »

AnnPT77 wrote: »

So lowball the protein content? I know I'm just expressing a crazy USAian thought here, but no, thank you.

According to our recommendations you will get enough protein if you eat a balanced diet and unless you're a body builder you will probably be just fine.

But really, it all comes down to a difference of opinion and I can appreciate what you're saying without agreeing with it.

I think the part you are not really grasping is the point I tried to make earlier today. It is not a switch that just anyone can flip easily. If it is not easy it might challenge adherence and impede weight loss.

It would probably be in my wheelhouse to transition to vegetarianism. I know my way around plant based proteins, I have meatless days on a regular basis because I like the variety, and I am a good cook. I am not going to do it though because it is too much of a change for me. As much as I love fish and I get most of amount of my non pb protein there I am not even willing to risk going full pescatarian. The reason is my health. I still have a lot of weight to lose and that is my number 1 priority. I am sticking with what is easiest for me and what is easiest is having most of the menu available to me.

I am already in better health and it will continue to improve on the road I am on. I don't need to throw in any extra rules or requirements.

She seems to be assuming it's easy since you just buy fake meat and sub it for meat. Not only is that not necessarily healthy and likely lower protein, but I doubt it's satisfying for most. When I eat vegetarian/plant based, I use a bunch of more ethnic foods from cultures where meatless is more common. I don't replace my steak with some minced tofu, ugh.

But you can't just sub tofu for meat, even if you want to eat that much of it (I'm not anti soy at all, but like to limit it to one meal per day at most), since the protein does not match up. And protein is for many, many people a very satisfying and satiating macro.

Most of what I eat that I like that is meatless are things I cook myself. I have tried many faux foods and I don't care for most of them. I like veggie burgers but only the ones that are not trying very hard to be beef.

The other reason I like to cook it myself is that I can get my macros where I want them to be and, like you, I can use spices, seasoning, etc from commonly vegetarian cultures.

I have my protein goal and I intend to hit it most days. Every choice I make has to satisfy what I believe is right for me not ask me to compromise.

lalalacroix

Spitspot81 wrote: »

Has anyone ever changed to a vegetarian diet and noticed a benefit in health and well-being?

I am moving towards a fully plant based diet but currently call myself pescatarian light. I eat fish, eggs and dairy but not a lot and not every day. My current diet is mostly vegetables, fruit and grains

To answer your question, I have some of the best energy levels I've had maybe my entire life. I'm not really surprised because I'm probably getting the best nutrients I've ever had. Also a little tmi, but I'm having excellent daily poops with all the fiber I consume. Never thought this would be as enjoyable as it is. Lol.

Over 10 years ago I was a vegetarian and then became vegan and was overweight the entire time. But at that time I did not eat as many vegetables as I do now and my diet was filled with a lot more bread and saucy pastas. And even though I am eating mostly plant based now, I can still easily go over my calories allotment so I track my calories to ensure weight loss.

lemurcat2

asliceofjackie wrote: »

lemurcat2 wrote: »

Then please cite a source.

It was hard but I managed to find the NNR in English for you and here's a quote of exactly what I've been trying to say (minus the health aspect since we haven't covered that so much).

"The low energy density and the physico-chemical properties of most plant foods can contribute to weight maintenance. Because obesity and excessive body fat are established risk factors for most chronic diseases, including many types of cancer, low energy-density diets might also contribute to protection against a majority of chronic diseases."

Thanks. I note that it does not cite actual results and uses "might" and "can" -- no indication that changing to veg alone actually causes weight loss.

Vegetables rich in fiber such as carrots, broccoli, cabbage(s), white beans, kidney beans, chick peas, lentils, peas and green beans give a lot of fiber and nutrition, and will satiate you without having too many calories."[/i]

Sure, but this doesn't relate to vegetarian vs. not. Non vegetarians should eat vegetables and some vegetarians do not.

@lemurcat2 Most meat substitutes are perfectly healthy and fine. Mostly you would substitute any minced meat with minced vegetarian options like tofu, oumph, soy or quorn and then recreate the same foods such as meatballs etc. So there's pretty much no difference between the vegetarian and the non-vegetarian dish in the end. This satisfies all vegetarians I know, including myself when I eat vegetarian food.

I don't eat minced meat all that often, so minced fake meat is hardly going to be a significant source of food in any event. I also don't agree that the taste is the same. I am happy eating veg, but not because I sub in fake meat (which as noted above is not less caloric if you consider protein and also subbing fake meat for real meat without other changes does not create a healthier diet).

AnnPT77

Spitspot81 wrote: »

Are you trying to lose weight? You're well within your optimal BMI range, so if you're restricting calories because you feel that you have too much body fat, I would recommend recomp instead of weight loss. Recomp involves eating at your TDEE and following a structured strength training program to build muscle and cut body fat.

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This is a photo from 2 days ago. I just think maybe I should lose a bit more weight before building more muscle, but after reading some of the replies from this post I wonder if I should up my calories, particularly fat intake?

I think you're looking really good, and could be at a good point to start recomposition - at least to consider it. Recomposition is a slow process (especially for women), but the result is to stay at the same weight while adding muscle . . . which means that fat continues to deplete. Many women consider the appearance outcome to be more positive than just sticking with low calories longer-term, once a healthy weight is achieved. As a bonus, a 120-pound body with relatively more muscle will burn slightly more calories all day every day, allowing you to eat a bit more and still maintain weight.

There's more information about recomposition in this very good thread:

https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10177803/recomposition-maintaining-weight-while-losing-fat

The thread includes some progress photos, from women as well as men, so you can see what's realistic/possible on this route.

Another option would be to cut your deficit to a truly tiny amount (100-200 calories daily max, lose maybe a pound a month), be sure to get enough protein, and begin a well-designed progressive strength training program. If you're relatively new to weight training, some muscle-mass gain may be possible even with a small deficit (and adequate protein), but if it works you could possibly continue to verrrrry slooooowly lose weight and fat (just a tiny bit faster than with pure recomp at maintenance calories) while starting beneficial increases in strength and muscle mass.

There's good info about strength training programs here (including some beginner bodyweight programs that don't require much if any equipment, and can be done at home if you don't have gym access):

http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10332083/which-lifting-program-is-the-best-for-you/

Moreover, speaking as an aging woman (I'm 63): Getting stronger while you're younger, and gains therefore easier, then working to maintain that gain, is a huge gift you can give your future self. Strength is useful in itself, helps foster strong bones (avoid osteopenia and dangerous fractures that plague some older women, and can even shorten lifespan), and helps keep you healthy and independent as you age. One of the most active, vital women I know is a 72-year-old who's been strength training regularly since her 30s, and can now do physical things many 30s-40s women struggle with, and her body looks at least 20 years younger than most women her age.

As far nutrition on increased calories, the recomposition thread would provide some guidance if you choose that route. Otherwise, this thread has some general info about macro settings:

https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/819055/setting-your-calorie-and-macro-targets

But, yes, in your case (given the comments about bowel issues in your OP), it might be worth a try increasing your fat a bit, to see if that helps. There's individual variation, but at a similar-ish size (5'5", mid-130s), just for comparison purposes, I shoot for 50g minimum fat daily. But if you're there already, trying a bit more won't hurt, as long as it doesn't give you any negative symptoms. If you've been very low on fat, you might want to increase gradually over a couple of weeks, just to be conservative.

Finally, I'd also like to apologize for derailing your thread into a side discussion about vegetarian nutrition that you didn't ask for! As a long-term vegetarian, I'm pretty passionate about vegetarian nutrition, and am a little too knee-jerk about feeling like someone should comment when there are comments I think are misleading.
:flowerforyou:

anniigetshealthy

I have been vegan since September 2018 after being mostly vegetarian for approx 6 months beforehand. I used to experience frequent gallbladder attacks, particularly when eating out. I have only had 2 since September, and both were caused by eating a food I did not know had heavy dairy in it. Needless to say, I have become much better at being cautious. I track my food daily, strength train 6 days per week, and have gained a lot of muscle since going vegan. I've never felt better or had more energy. Make sure you are eating enough, though! Tracking shows you when you are not only overeating, but undereating as well. I've had to adjust my daily calories/macros a few times since starting before getting where I am currently.

My only other piece of advice is to try to minimize the processed foods and meat substitutes. They are nice for a treat, but they are expensive and have long ingredient lists. Hope this helps!