Meatless The Better
Replies
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If you want to refuse to be what nature intended you to be thats your choice, but because you came here to try and shove that nonesense down our throats, you got a disagree from me as well.1
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wilson10102018 wrote: »Other than getting flamed for saying my experiences, I am happy to have a lot of successful vegans weigh in, as it were. I do think that persons who assume that an adult would comment to a woman on their body shape reasonableness is pretty perverted. Where on earth would that happen? I can't imagine who would even suggest such a thing.
If you can't fathom that an adult would make a overtly or indirectly make comments to another adult (or a child) about their body shape and it being unreasonable (or reasonable) then you're very out of touch with the world around you.
Actually, I am a polite, kindly person. I would never comment to another person about his or her body shape. And, unlike many of you, ad hominem attacks are not in my play book.
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wilson10102018 wrote: »wilson10102018 wrote: »Other than getting flamed for saying my experiences, I am happy to have a lot of successful vegans weigh in, as it were. I do think that persons who assume that an adult would comment to a woman on their body shape reasonableness is pretty perverted. Where on earth would that happen? I can't imagine who would even suggest such a thing.
If you can't fathom that an adult would make a overtly or indirectly make comments to another adult (or a child) about their body shape and it being unreasonable (or reasonable) then you're very out of touch with the world around you.
Actually, I am a polite, kindly person. I would never comment to another person about his or her body shape. And, unlike many of you, ad hominem attacks are not in my play book.
As polite and kindly as you may be, I think you need to take a not even kind of hard look at the world outside of your experience. Not everyone experiences the world the way that you do, in fact, most people don't experience it the way you do. Saying that is far from an ad hominem attack. Would you like an example? Google sexism in the workplace. This is nothing new and if you're unable to understand or admit that, then that says a lot.
Mind you, I would also argue that your comments about your son's dates are far from polite and kind, but other people have already pointed that out.13 -
Most diseases come from genetics and acquired ones from environmental or weight issues.
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IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
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I don't have any studies to hand - but being overweight is a huge factor in many diseases - cardiovascular risk( heart disease, strokes) diabetes, arthritis - to name a few obvious ones.
Do you really need studies to confirm that??7 -
paperpudding wrote: »I don't have any studies to hand - but being overweight is a huge factor in many diseases - cardiovascular risk( heart disease, strokes) diabetes, arthritis - to name a few obvious ones.
Do you really need studies to confirm that??
Most and some are two different words. Had ninerbuff said "some" then that wouldn't have been questionable. Never mind that age and taking part in various sports are are both very large contributors to arthritis (by which I'm assuming we're both talking about osteoarthritis). I can think of plenty of diseases and conditions for which weight isn't a large risk factor as well. Type 1 diabetes, scoliosis, various forms of hearing loss...0 -
wilson10102018 wrote: »wilson10102018 wrote: »Other than getting flamed for saying my experiences, I am happy to have a lot of successful vegans weigh in, as it were. I do think that persons who assume that an adult would comment to a woman on their body shape reasonableness is pretty perverted. Where on earth would that happen? I can't imagine who would even suggest such a thing.
If you can't fathom that an adult would make a overtly or indirectly make comments to another adult (or a child) about their body shape and it being unreasonable (or reasonable) then you're very out of touch with the world around you.
Actually, I am a polite, kindly person. I would never comment to another person about his or her body shape. And, unlike many of you, ad hominem attacks are not in my play book.
As polite and kindly as you may be, I think you need to take a not even kind of hard look at the world outside of your experience. Not everyone experiences the world the way that you do, in fact, most people don't experience it the way you do. Saying that is far from an ad hominem attack. Would you like an example? Google sexism in the workplace. This is nothing new and if you're unable to understand or admit that, then that says a lot.
Mind you, I would also argue that your comments about your son's dates are far from polite and kind, but other people have already pointed that out.
You just can't help yourself, can you?
I shared my experience without directing my comments to a specific person (unlike you) and in a forum where it is utterly appropriate to share that experience whether you agree with it or not. I suppose there is something about that experience that triggers you in some way and I am sorry for that, but I don't need to shut up because of your issues.
So, feel free to continue to reject my experience as I have shared it, but if you continue personal attacks, I'll complain.2 -
wilson10102018 wrote: »wilson10102018 wrote: »wilson10102018 wrote: »Other than getting flamed for saying my experiences, I am happy to have a lot of successful vegans weigh in, as it were. I do think that persons who assume that an adult would comment to a woman on their body shape reasonableness is pretty perverted. Where on earth would that happen? I can't imagine who would even suggest such a thing.
If you can't fathom that an adult would make a overtly or indirectly make comments to another adult (or a child) about their body shape and it being unreasonable (or reasonable) then you're very out of touch with the world around you.
Actually, I am a polite, kindly person. I would never comment to another person about his or her body shape. And, unlike many of you, ad hominem attacks are not in my play book.
As polite and kindly as you may be, I think you need to take a not even kind of hard look at the world outside of your experience. Not everyone experiences the world the way that you do, in fact, most people don't experience it the way you do. Saying that is far from an ad hominem attack. Would you like an example? Google sexism in the workplace. This is nothing new and if you're unable to understand or admit that, then that says a lot.
Mind you, I would also argue that your comments about your son's dates are far from polite and kind, but other people have already pointed that out.
You just can't help yourself, can you?
I shared my experience without directing my comments to a specific person (unlike you) and in a forum where it is utterly appropriate to share that experience whether you agree with it or not. I suppose there is something about that experience that triggers you in some way and I am sorry for that, but I don't need to shut up because of your issues.
So, feel free to continue to reject my experience as I have shared it, but if you continue personal attacks, I'll complain.
It's almost funny because I'm not actually rejecting your experience. I am saying that not everyone experiences the world the way you do though. That you don't experience something does not mean that that something doesn't exist. I also find it dismaying but in some ways not exactly shocking that you don't seem to think that adults don't make overt or indirect comments about whether or not a person has an "reasonable" body shape to their face. It doesn't actually take a lot of time realize that people have been doing that for a very long time and continue to do so today. Do you want a specific example? Air India flight attendants. From the article:
.The airline said that the “normal” BMI for an air hostess is between 18 and 22, “overweight” between 22 and 27, and “obese” for a value above 27. For male attendants the brackets were 18 to 25, 25 to 30, and above. The NHS says a “healthy” BMI is between 18.5 and 24.9.
And no, I'm not triggered by what you've said (as if that would somehow make me less than?). I am, however, willing to stand up and say that I strongly disagree with your idea that it's unfathomable that "an adult would comment to a woman on their body shape reasonablenes" and answer your question as to "where on earth would that happen?". I mean, it would be awesome if it didn't happen, but it does.7 -
Omfg Christmas3
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wilson10102018 wrote: »wilson10102018 wrote: »wilson10102018 wrote: »Other than getting flamed for saying my experiences, I am happy to have a lot of successful vegans weigh in, as it were. I do think that persons who assume that an adult would comment to a woman on their body shape reasonableness is pretty perverted. Where on earth would that happen? I can't imagine who would even suggest such a thing.
If you can't fathom that an adult would make a overtly or indirectly make comments to another adult (or a child) about their body shape and it being unreasonable (or reasonable) then you're very out of touch with the world around you.
Actually, I am a polite, kindly person. I would never comment to another person about his or her body shape. And, unlike many of you, ad hominem attacks are not in my play book.
As polite and kindly as you may be, I think you need to take a not even kind of hard look at the world outside of your experience. Not everyone experiences the world the way that you do, in fact, most people don't experience it the way you do. Saying that is far from an ad hominem attack. Would you like an example? Google sexism in the workplace. This is nothing new and if you're unable to understand or admit that, then that says a lot.
Mind you, I would also argue that your comments about your son's dates are far from polite and kind, but other people have already pointed that out.
You just can't help yourself, can you?
I shared my experience without directing my comments to a specific person (unlike you) and in a forum where it is utterly appropriate to share that experience whether you agree with it or not. I suppose there is something about that experience that triggers you in some way and I am sorry for that, but I don't need to shut up because of your issues.
So, feel free to continue to reject my experience as I have shared it, but if you continue personal attacks, I'll complain.
It's almost funny because I'm not actually rejecting your experience. I am saying that not everyone experiences the world the way you do though. That you don't experience something does not mean that that something doesn't exist. I also find it dismaying but in some ways not exactly shocking that you don't seem to think that adults don't make overt or indirect comments about whether or not a person has an "reasonable" body shape to their face. It doesn't actually take a lot of time realize that people have been doing that for a very long time and continue to do so today. Do you want a specific example? Air India flight attendants. From the article:
.The airline said that the “normal” BMI for an air hostess is between 18 and 22, “overweight” between 22 and 27, and “obese” for a value above 27. For male attendants the brackets were 18 to 25, 25 to 30, and above. The NHS says a “healthy” BMI is between 18.5 and 24.9.
And no, I'm not triggered by what you've said (as if that would somehow make me less than?). I am, however, willing to stand up and say that I strongly disagree with your idea that it's unfathomable that "an adult would comment to a woman on their body shape reasonablenes" and answer your question as to "where on earth would that happen?". I mean, it would be awesome if it didn't happen, but it does.
First of all, I don't get my life experiences from stories on the Internet. I live them with neighbors, family and colleagues. And, in my world not one person would ever look at a unrelated female and say something as crass as "nice body shape you have" or "you could lose a few pounds." I swear I have never one time heard a person say such a thing. If you and the jelly person have people around you saying that type of thing you need to associate with a better class of people.
Second, I don't care to have you or anyone else agree with me. And, it does not bother me one bit that there are other people in the world with a different experiences. I share mine, you can share yours without attacking and criticizing mine. OK?2 -
I'm going to bow out of the current line of derailment now because it's very clear we're going nowhere fast and, given the context, it's simply not worth it.4
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littlegreenparrot1 wrote: »lynn_glenmont wrote: »littlegreenparrot1 wrote: »Personally I have landed on a current plan of less meat, less often, but better quality when I do have it.
I like to eat plant based foods, it seems to suit me, with a genetic heritage from English peasants it's the kind of pattern they would have had.
Do you limit yourself to the sort of fruits and nuts that might be gleaned from hedge rows, root vegetables, grains, and beer that likely made up the bulk of the diet of your English peasant ancestors?
No, but am sure they would have enjoyed a banana if they could have got hold of one. I said kind of, not exactly.
They would not have had access to much meat.
I'm just trying to explain how something that suits me, may not suit others.
I'm sure they would have enjoyed a chicken or some beef or pork or lamb if they could have got hold of it too. I don't see how that's different from the bananas.
I don't have any problem with anyone choosing a plant-based diet. I'm just trying to figure out why you brought up the "genetic heritage from English peasants" as support for that choice. Are you suggesting that a few centuries of a generally plant-based diet enforced by poverty affected their genes?5 -
paperpudding wrote: »lynn_glenmont wrote: »littlegreenparrot1 wrote: »Personally I have landed on a current plan of less meat, less often, but better quality when I do have it.
I like to eat plant based foods, it seems to suit me, with a genetic heritage from English peasants it's the kind of pattern they would have had.
Do you limit yourself to the sort of fruits and nuts that might be gleaned from hedge rows, root vegetables, grains, and beer that likely made up the bulk of the diet of your English peasant ancestors?
Slightly related to topic trivia.
When the skeleton later proven to be that of King Richard 3rd was first undergoing tests, one of the early investigations showed it was not that of a peasant - because the bone density reflected higher meat and calcium intake than peasants of the day.
Yes I know that has zero relevance to what our diet should be today, but fascinating nevertheless.
To me, anyway
Well, it does suggest that if you're concerned about bone density, following the diet of 15th century English peasants might not be advisable.9 -
Well, yes, Lynn, there is that.
I knew my post was in fact relevant and on topic - if rather cryptically so.
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littlegreenparrot1 wrote: »
I like to eat plant based foods, it seems to suit me, with a genetic heritage from English peasants it's the kind of pattern they would have had.
I don't know why you have gotten snarky responses to saying this.
In the US, there have been interesting studies over the past few decades comparing immigrants and their progeny with people back in the Old Country (or here) still eating their traditional diets. The old resistance to certain diseases common here pretty obviously starts to disappear once they abandon the traditional eating for more typically American patterns. Same genetics, the big change is diet.
The same is seen in countries that start to shift toward American eating patterns to some degree, such as in Japan.
These are very complex phenomena, of course, but the idea that we might find our ancestors' eating habits of some use to us in our pursuit of optimum health and comfort is not bizarre. Of course we have access to foods they didn't, but it doesn't hurt to use that idea as a starting point (especially when it works for you ...). Also there can be genetic components to enzyme production needed for digestion, and it is not bizarre to speculate that different genetic heritages can mean that certain foods may be better suited to your own genetic tendencies toward enzyme production.
A really interesting current theory is that some of this is related to our friendly flora in the intestinal tract, which would be passed along through the generations through the maternal environment. The friendlies are very much involved in human digestion, and changes in the flora can mean changes in digestibility of foods and thus extraction of nutrients.
One other difference may also be that Americans have been using antibiotics pretty liberally since my childhood in ancient times, when generally doctors did cultures before prescribing a full course. Nowadays they tend to look more for markers of infection (such as nitrogen levels in urine or maybe white blood cell counts) that can be quickly tested with automatic equipment available in the local doctor's office, and prescribe broad-spectrum antibiotics that can wipe out the good microbeasties with the bad. Probiotics and cultured foods like yoghurt can help replenish, but not with the same microflora populations that were lost.
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wilson10102018 wrote: »I had lots of encounters feeding the vegan girls my two sons brought around over 20 years of dating with me making vegan lunches, dinners and snacks for a dozen or more of them. An unheahier looking group you could not assemble from the privileged class these kids came from. I could usually tell a meat eater from her good color, nice skin and hair and reasonable body shape. Where the vegans were a pathetic looking bunch, underweight or overweight, dull hair and skin, etc. And, this was in one of the richest zipcodes in the US. Kids that were in private school at $30,000 per year per kid. I can't imagine what the kids on a tight food budget do with a vegan diet.
My guess is that the rich vegan girls were dieting... There is a common myth that eating vegan or vegetarian helps you lose weight. A vegan diet just avoids animal products, but can be just as unhealthy as any other approach can be. Oreos are accidentally vegan, after all. They may have been vegan, but they weren't smart vegan.
They were probably eating a very unbalanced diet with lots of vegan junk food, since they had the money to do so. Poorer vegans have to be smarter and eat more simply. It is not hard to get sufficient protein on a smart vegan diet. The rich girls were showing signs of not getting enough protein (particularly in their hair), but that was because they were not smart vegans and were likely perpetually dieting, meaning not enough food calories also and in times of scarcity - the hair sacrifices its needs for the greater good. (When I couldn't keep food down for an extended period due to illness, I started shedding dead hair more than the cats. The hair started to grow back when I was able to eat again.)
The overweight ones could also have been alternating between feast and famine, which makes weight management mechanisms in the body very unhappy and can mean a significant increase in the body's natural weight setpoint in preparation for the constant threat of famine.
Anyway - I had been vegetarian for at least 12 years when I returned to carnivore eating for allergy diagnosis and control for a year. My food bill DOUBLED. Really. I would always recommend eating vegetarian or vegan to somebody on a tight budget, because you can get much more bang for your buck that way.
My food bills went back to normal when finally after a year, I couldn't stand eating any more dead animals and went back to my vegetarian ways. Actually, by then they were my vegan ways since it turned it I was allergic to dairy and egg... I knew I had big problems with milk since I was six years old, but didn't realize that other dairy was also the reason for some chronic problems. The cats were really disappointed to lose such easy access to carnivore-friendly leftovers.
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Lol, never heard of onset diabetes? https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2879283/
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
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wilson10102018 - to be more specific about dumb things dieters turned vegan can do:
Rich kids especially can afford to eat in restaurants. At that time, without the vegan options more available today, they probably were just subtracting animal protein without replacing it with non-animal protein. Take the chicken off the salad but not add beans, for example.
Rich kids are less likely to even think of beans as a major food group... For the non-rich, opening a can of beans for a meal is pretty natural.
A young and stupid vegan might eat nothing but French fries and soda when going to fast food places with friends.
Dieters are notorious for avoiding bread as "fattening". I have seen them eat the toppings but leave behind the crust when eating pizza (a waste of food not congenitally possible for me). But bread is a good and easy source of protein. Even white bread - it just lacks the large amount of fiber in whole grain bread. There are other good sources of protein (other grains and seeds and legumes, for example), so we don't have to eat bread. But for young people on the run, bread is a quick protein source which a young and stupid vegan dieter may be omitting but not replacing.
Likewise dieters often avoid good and easy protein sources like peanut butter. This can be a problem for young people who don't think in terms of replacing the nutritional value with other sources.
You can see how easy it would be for the "vegan girls" your sons dated to become protein deficient. The problem was not a real vegan diet, but rather their limited interpretation of it. Their access to money was actually an obstacle to eating better.2 -
nytrifisoul wrote: »If you want to refuse to be what nature intended you to be thats your choice, but because you came here to try and shove that nonesense down our throats, you got a disagree from me as well.
Did nature intend for you to use a computer to tell us this?11 -
This thread was never *on* the rails, but woo boy did it go off it.13
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wilson10102018 wrote: »wilson10102018 wrote: »wilson10102018 wrote: »wilson10102018 wrote: »Other than getting flamed for saying my experiences, I am happy to have a lot of successful vegans weigh in, as it were. I do think that persons who assume that an adult would comment to a woman on their body shape reasonableness is pretty perverted. Where on earth would that happen? I can't imagine who would even suggest such a thing.
If you can't fathom that an adult would make a overtly or indirectly make comments to another adult (or a child) about their body shape and it being unreasonable (or reasonable) then you're very out of touch with the world around you.
Actually, I am a polite, kindly person. I would never comment to another person about his or her body shape. And, unlike many of you, ad hominem attacks are not in my play book.
As polite and kindly as you may be, I think you need to take a not even kind of hard look at the world outside of your experience. Not everyone experiences the world the way that you do, in fact, most people don't experience it the way you do. Saying that is far from an ad hominem attack. Would you like an example? Google sexism in the workplace. This is nothing new and if you're unable to understand or admit that, then that says a lot.
Mind you, I would also argue that your comments about your son's dates are far from polite and kind, but other people have already pointed that out.
You just can't help yourself, can you?
I shared my experience without directing my comments to a specific person (unlike you) and in a forum where it is utterly appropriate to share that experience whether you agree with it or not. I suppose there is something about that experience that triggers you in some way and I am sorry for that, but I don't need to shut up because of your issues.
So, feel free to continue to reject my experience as I have shared it, but if you continue personal attacks, I'll complain.
It's almost funny because I'm not actually rejecting your experience. I am saying that not everyone experiences the world the way you do though. That you don't experience something does not mean that that something doesn't exist. I also find it dismaying but in some ways not exactly shocking that you don't seem to think that adults don't make overt or indirect comments about whether or not a person has an "reasonable" body shape to their face. It doesn't actually take a lot of time realize that people have been doing that for a very long time and continue to do so today. Do you want a specific example? Air India flight attendants. From the article:
.The airline said that the “normal” BMI for an air hostess is between 18 and 22, “overweight” between 22 and 27, and “obese” for a value above 27. For male attendants the brackets were 18 to 25, 25 to 30, and above. The NHS says a “healthy” BMI is between 18.5 and 24.9.
And no, I'm not triggered by what you've said (as if that would somehow make me less than?). I am, however, willing to stand up and say that I strongly disagree with your idea that it's unfathomable that "an adult would comment to a woman on their body shape reasonablenes" and answer your question as to "where on earth would that happen?". I mean, it would be awesome if it didn't happen, but it does.
First of all, I don't get my life experiences from stories on the Internet. I live them with neighbors, family and colleagues. And, in my world not one person would ever look at a unrelated female and say something as crass as "nice body shape you have" or "you could lose a few pounds." I swear I have never one time heard a person say such a thing. If you and the jelly person have people around you saying that type of thing you need to associate with a better class of people.
Second, I don't care to have you or anyone else agree with me. And, it does not bother me one bit that there are other people in the world with a different experiences. I share mine, you can share yours without attacking and criticizing mine. OK?
I think it would be "polite" and "kind" to use my name when you're discussing me, not "jelly person." If the entire name is too much for you, you can also use "Jane."
I saw you write that these women your sons were dating had body shapes that were "unreasonable." What class of person are you? Because I've never before witnessed someone discussing their sons' dates that way and that is why I called it out.16 -
In the US, there have been interesting studies over the past few decades comparing immigrants and their progeny with people back in the Old Country (or here) still eating their traditional diets. The old resistance to certain diseases common here pretty obviously starts to disappear once they abandon the traditional eating for more typically American patterns. Same genetics, the big change is diet.
Links please!1 -
Lol, never heard of onset diabetes? https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2879283/
Of course I have. We could go back and forth with conditions that do and don't involve weight as a major risk factor, but where's the fun in that? Again, some and most are two very different words are they not?0 -
What I find amazing is that after all these decades, millions of persons and tens of thousands of formal studies, we don't know the finite answer...
On my part I chose to stick to caloric restriction for life and I eat low meat/fat, low processed food, just egg whites (no yolk) and high vegetables & legumes. I value much a low total cholesterol and low blood pressure. I am sure that I can invoke many studies to support my food choices and others will find just about the opposite .
Again, amazing.0 -
Lol, never heard of onset diabetes? https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2879283/
Of course I have. We could go back and forth with conditions that do and don't involve weight as a major risk factor, but where's the fun in that? Again, some and most are two very different words are they not?
If the claim was that most diseases come from one of (1) genetics, (2) environmental factors, or (3) weight issues, what would be other major sources? Accidents (or other non-environmental physical risks)? Drug side effects (which might be "environmental" if interpreted broadly)? ("Environmental" could be a pretty broad thing.)
I'm not trying to be confrontational here; I'm truly confused. I think it's just that I interpreted niner's post differently, but I'm wondering if I'm missing something major in the disease landscape. Earlier, you mentioned "Type 1 diabetes, scoliosis, various forms of hearing loss", but IMU T1 is significanly genetic, scoliosis often some combination of genetic predisposition with environmental factors, and (I think) most hearing loss either genetic or environmental.
I'm wondering whether the disagreement is more about the scope of "most" in the claim, frankly.2 -
wilson10102018 - to be more specific about dumb things dieters turned vegan can do:
Rich kids especially can afford to eat in restaurants. At that time, without the vegan options more available today, they probably were just subtracting animal protein without replacing it with non-animal protein. Take the chicken off the salad but not add beans, for example.
Rich kids are less likely to even think of beans as a major food group... For the non-rich, opening a can of beans for a meal is pretty natural.
A young and stupid vegan might eat nothing but French fries and soda when going to fast food places with friends.
Dieters are notorious for avoiding bread as "fattening". I have seen them eat the toppings but leave behind the crust when eating pizza (a waste of food not congenitally possible for me). But bread is a good and easy source of protein. Even white bread - it just lacks the large amount of fiber in whole grain bread. There are other good sources of protein (other grains and seeds and legumes, for example), so we don't have to eat bread. But for young people on the run, bread is a quick protein source which a young and stupid vegan dieter may be omitting but not replacing.
Likewise dieters often avoid good and easy protein sources like peanut butter. This can be a problem for young people who don't think in terms of replacing the nutritional value with other sources.
You can see how easy it would be for the "vegan girls" your sons dated to become protein deficient. The problem was not a real vegan diet, but rather their limited interpretation of it. Their access to money was actually an obstacle to eating better.
In general, I agree with your recent posts on this thread, in most respects.
But I really, really don't agree with the bolded. Yes, there's a little protein in most bread. But "a good and easy source of protein", as a generality? I don't agree with that.
There are protein-supplemented breads, for sure. There are breads (even without a protein supplement per se) that have more protein than others. But normal bread is going to have 4-5 grams of protein per slice, generously, and maybe 80 calories (some more, some less). As a vegetarian, I figure something with 10 calories (from all content) per gram of protein is a "good" protein source, and 20 calories is kind of OK-ish for an overall dish/food. (Peanut butter is around 25 calories per gram of protein, because more fat than protein.)
Eating the crust of a pizza is going to add a negligible amount of protein to anyone's diet. I'd hate for any new vegetarians/vegans to think otherwise.7 -
What I find amazing is that after all these decades, millions of persons and tens of thousands of formal studies, we don't know the finite answer...
On my part I chose to stick to caloric restriction for life and I eat low meat/fat, low processed food, just egg whites (no yolk) and high vegetables & legumes. I value much a low total cholesterol and low blood pressure. I am sure that I can invoke many studies to support my food choices and others will find just about the opposite .
Again, amazing.
We may not know what diet is "best" (if such a term can even be applied to a single diet), but we have long-term population results that show us that humans seem to be able to thrive on diets that are low or very low in meat and diets that have lots of meat. It really seems to be about meeting your overall nutritional needs (as well as maintaining a healthy body weight), which can be done in all sorts of dietary contexts.
My conclusion: We don't need meat for good health. But we don't need to avoid it either.9 -
It didn’t work for me. I was Vegetarian and then Vegan for over ten years.
Going lower carb/Primal and focusing on proteins and healthy fats changed my body and my mind.
Carb fog, sluggishness, bloat, puffiness, mood swings, blood glucose fluctuations and episodes of reactive hypoglycemia are all gone.
It wasn’t an easy choice for me, ethically, because I really care about animals, but not feeling like *kitten* because of fibromyalgia, falling asleep every afternoon, and brain fog makes it easier to accept the idea that I need to eat meat in order to feel well. I do try to do this as humanely as I can.
Soy foods and beans just don’t cut it for me. Believe me, I tried. I did it “right”. It’s just too many grains/legumes/starches, and ultimately, processed “meat substitutes” for me to feel well.4
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