Can I gain muscle without gaining weight?
Replies
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"You can't gain muscle without eating at a surplus"
This is absolutely the number one biggest bit of bro science that I see every day. Absolutely you can. Not as much, and not as quickly, but you very much can gain muscle and lose fat at the same time.
Caveat: It's not easy.
If you are eating at a slight deficit, and are working out with weights heavy enough to be in the 2-8 rep range before failure, and are getting enough protein (THIS IS KEY) then you will gain strength and muscle.
You don't need to eat at a surplus, but you do need to take in enough protein. How much is enough? That's up for debate and is another hotbed of bro science. I tend to err on the side of caution and take in about 1g of protein for every pound of lean body mass (which you can find calculators to estimate for you).
Eating gobs of food to make up a huge surplus is the reason why a lot of gym people get into harmful bulk/cut cycles. You don't need to put on a pound of fat for every pound of muscle, then lose muscle trying to burn that fat off. It's dumb, and I don't get why people think it's the right way to do it.
The calories you burn working out and generally living will come from the food you eat first, and when that runs out, your body will attack fat stores, and only when those are gone (or nearly gone) will it work on metabolizing muscle tissue. Unless you're eating at a severe deficit, your body will have enough calories from the food you eat and the fat you have on you to use the protein you're eating to repair damage. It won't be as fast, or efficient as putting on muscle while you are swimming with calories from eating a lumberjack's diet, but it will go on.
If you are eating at a severe deficit, about the most you can hope for is that the lifting you do will offset the loss of muscle, but if you can find a balance (that's the hard part), then you can gain muscle and lose fat.
Note, you will not do either quickly. If you are looking to crash your fat, or bulk up in a hurry, you should probably concentrate on one or the other. If you're happy to make a lifestyle change to lift heavy and eat right for the foreseeable future, then you absolutely, 100%, assuredly CAN lose fat and gain muscle.
While I would agree with you because I've put on muscle over the past year while eating at a slight deficit, there is a diminishing marginal return on how much muscle someone can gain on a deficit, and the gains are not as high as most people have in mind when they're trying to recomp. Newbies can gain a visible amount, but someone who has been lifting for a while cannot (Truth be told, a drug free lifter has a limit on how much muscle can be gained even with bulk-cut cycles). Further, the deficit cannot be large (not even a 1 pound a week) unless the person is obese (because there is probably plenty of lean mass and no need to do anything other than retain what is already there while cutting fat), the diet has to be precise with respect to protein and fat ratios (this is true with muscle retention in normal body weight or slightly overweight and also with maintenance), and it takes a painfully long time. A slow bulk and a slow cut are simply more effective and more time efficient.0 -
Thanks, guys! Yeah, I was planning on going harder with the weights after the DVD. That being said, I absolutely will gain muscle from the DVD because I have very little upper body strength. I can do two push-ups and can barely life 4-pound weights more than 10 times. 30DS requires a lot of weight exercises that are killing me!
Anyway, I suppose I'll see how my weight is after 30DS and I might decide to continue with cardio instead (training for races). Of course, I'll take an after picture and if I look better, I won't care if I weigh more! Thanks again. :-)
I don't mean to be rude or mean or anything, you do what you want, but the fact that you are more concerned about getting to this "magical weight" of 105lbs is more important to you than the fact that you can barely lift 4lbs (a gallon of milk is around 8lbs) is very confusing to me. I agree with the others, get rid of the scale. If you eat more and gain muscle you will gain some weight, but you'll look and feel better, so ignore the number on the scale. Best of luck!0 -
1 lb of muscle weighs the same as 1 lb of fat
1 lb per cubic inch of muscle is as dense and 1 lb per cubic in of fat
You are all wrong! HAHA0 -
Thanks, guys! Yeah, I was planning on going harder with the weights after the DVD. That being said, I absolutely will gain muscle from the DVD because I have very little upper body strength. I can do two push-ups and can barely life 4-pound weights more than 10 times. 30DS requires a lot of weight exercises that are killing me!
Anyway, I suppose I'll see how my weight is after 30DS and I might decide to continue with cardio instead (training for races). Of course, I'll take an after picture and if I look better, I won't care if I weigh more! Thanks again. :-)
increased strength does not equal increased muscle mass, it's important to know that. so you may get stronger, but you're not going to build mass.
Aside from that, until you realize there is a difference between the scale and health & asthetics I can't help you. The scale is really quite meaningless as a singular tool for measuring health. While being lighter may mean that your bf can pick you up, being lighter does not equal being healthier or fitter . . . besides at 110 pounds I could pick you up and throw you around like a rag doll (I'm 5'3"). Good luck to you.0 -
Yes, you can replace with fat you have left (very little based on your stats ^) with muscle without gaining weight. In your case, it would be toning with very little muscle gain because you have very little to work with. The question is, do you plan to increase your strength much? If not, minimum strength game will come from the increased tone and as long as you maintain your cardio and healthy eating habits, you should not face any major obstacles.I'm at 110 pounds and my ultimate goal weight is 105. I just started 30 Day Shred and I'm going to actively try to gain muscle. However, I still want to get down to 105. Is it possible or am I going to see scale increases because muscle weighs more than fat?
Btw, I'm 5'2" and I usually eat ~1300 on average. I haven't eaten too many more calories to account for the 30 Day Shred...yet!
Note: 105 is your goal weight; fine. However, do not let the number control you but you control the number. In other words, if you gain a pound of two of muscle, which pushes your weight to 107, why should it be a concern if you are still in a healthy BMI and the neglible gain was from a positive activity? Just a note, I did see your later comment about not caring if you gain a little but the way you started off your initial post and the title of the post is why I am throwing a bit of caution in here.0 -
Stop focusing on a number on a scale and focus on the lbs your lifting.
*protein farts*0 -
What is up with females and weight!!!
BODY COMPOSITION BODY COMPOSITION BODY COMPOSITION >
THROW AWAY YOUR CHIT USELESS SCALE!!!
As a (formerly skinny fat) female who used to be obsessed with the scale, I COMPLETELY agree with this!!!
THIS! Heavy lifting changed my life (& my body-- for the better)0 -
Thanks, guys! Yeah, I was planning on going harder with the weights after the DVD. That being said, I absolutely will gain muscle from the DVD because I have very little upper body strength. I can do two push-ups and can barely life 4-pound weights more than 10 times. 30DS requires a lot of weight exercises that are killing me!
Anyway, I suppose I'll see how my weight is after 30DS and I might decide to continue with cardio instead (training for races). Of course, I'll take an after picture and if I look better, I won't care if I weigh more! Thanks again. :-)
I don't mean to be rude or mean or anything, you do what you want, but the fact that you are more concerned about getting to this "magical weight" of 105lbs is more important to you than the fact that you can barely lift 4lbs (a gallon of milk is around 8lbs) is very confusing to me. I agree with the others, get rid of the scale. If you eat more and gain muscle you will gain some weight, but you'll look and feel better, so ignore the number on the scale. Best of luck!
This tbh. I'd be far more worried about your apparent severe lack of muscle than a measley 5lb.0 -
Do you have a way of estimating your body fat percentage? That would be a better measure than the scale.0
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Kid know's what he's talking about, throw that **** out, get big gains. I don't even own a scale, *gasp* I know I'm doomed to be a lard, oh wait, that's a load of bull. People on this forum are so obsessive, it can't be healthy to worry this much about weight. "Omgah I just ate a snickers gotta go weigh myself n see if I got fat". If you don't have fat to burn what do you think your body is going to turn to...that's right!What is up with females and weight!!!
BODY COMPOSITION BODY COMPOSITION BODY COMPOSITION >
THROW AWAY YOUR CHIT USELESS SCALE!!!0 -
What is so special about 105lbs? What if you look better and are a smaller size at 115lbs?
30 day shred is not a muscle gaining program, neither is 1300 calories a day. To gain muscle I lifted heavy weights including squats, deadlifts and bench press and ate 3000 calories a day.0 -
What is so special about 105lbs? What if you look better and are a smaller size at 115lbs?
30 day shred is not a muscle gaining program, neither is 1300 calories a day. To gain muscle I lifted heavy weights including squats, deadlifts and bench press and ate 3000 calories a day.
I think this needs repeated. This time last year I was 110lbs, on the low side for my height and frame but still healthy, running more than lifting but I still was not happy with my body at all. Today I'm 124lbs, body fat and composition is much better and I am more confident and so happy with my body. I still love running but lifting has always been in my life and I dedicated myself to that since November. Get over a specific number!0 -
Gaining strength and gaining muscle aren't the same thing. One can get stronger without adding muscle.Thanks, guys! Yeah, I was planning on going harder with the weights after the DVD. That being said, I absolutely will gain muscle from the DVD because I have very little upper body strength. I can do two push-ups and can barely life 4-pound weights more than 10 times. 30DS requires a lot of weight exercises that are killing me!
Anyway, I suppose I'll see how my weight is after 30DS and I might decide to continue with cardio instead (training for races). Of course, I'll take an after picture and if I look better, I won't care if I weigh more! Thanks again. :-)
Gaining muscle usually needs a surplus and body fat increase usually accompanies it. That will no doubt include weight increase.
Not my rules, but that's how it happens.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness industry for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition0 -
To gain muscle you have to gain weight - in a caloric deficit it isn't gona happen, and it isn't gonna happen properly unless you lift actual weights. Sure you may gain a slight amount of muscle at first but it won't be much because your body isn't going to be doing anything that's actually really muscle building - if that makes sense?
This.
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agree! it's not about a number on the scaleWhat is up with females and weight!!!
BODY COMPOSITION BODY COMPOSITION BODY COMPOSITION >
THROW AWAY YOUR CHIT USELESS SCALE!!!0 -
What is so special about 105lbs? What if you look better and are a smaller size at 115lbs?
30 day shred is not a muscle gaining program, neither is 1300 calories a day. To gain muscle I lifted heavy weights including squats, deadlifts and bench press and ate 3000 calories a day.
pretty much this. OP, meet staci. she's awesome. she's 11 pounds HEAVIER (142 pounds) in the picture on the right compared to the picture on the left.
http://www.nerdfitness.com/blog/2011/07/21/meet-staci-your-new-powerlifting-super-hero/0 -
I have yet to see a skinny person on calorie deficit gain muscle. It's not broscience, it's the basic law of thermodynamics."You can't gain muscle without eating at a surplus"
This is absolutely the number one biggest bit of bro science that I see every day. Absolutely you can. Not as much, and not as quickly, but you very much can gain muscle and lose fat at the same time.
Caveat: It's not easy.
If you are eating at a slight deficit, and are working out with weights heavy enough to be in the 2-8 rep range before failure, and are getting enough protein (THIS IS KEY) then you will gain strength and muscle.
You don't need to eat at a surplus, but you do need to take in enough protein. How much is enough? That's up for debate and is another hotbed of bro science. I tend to err on the side of caution and take in about 1g of protein for every pound of lean body mass (which you can find calculators to estimate for you).
Eating gobs of food to make up a huge surplus is the reason why a lot of gym people get into harmful bulk/cut cycles. You don't need to put on a pound of fat for every pound of muscle, then lose muscle trying to burn that fat off. It's dumb, and I don't get why people think it's the right way to do it.
The calories you burn working out and generally living will come from the food you eat first, and when that runs out, your body will attack fat stores, and only when those are gone (or nearly gone) will it work on metabolizing muscle tissue. Unless you're eating at a severe deficit, your body will have enough calories from the food you eat and the fat you have on you to use the protein you're eating to repair damage. It won't be as fast, or efficient as putting on muscle while you are swimming with calories from eating a lumberjack's diet, but it will go on.
If you are eating at a severe deficit, about the most you can hope for is that the lifting you do will offset the loss of muscle, but if you can find a balance (that's the hard part), then you can gain muscle and lose fat.
Note, you will not do either quickly. If you are looking to crash your fat, or bulk up in a hurry, you should probably concentrate on one or the other. If you're happy to make a lifestyle change to lift heavy and eat right for the foreseeable future, then you absolutely, 100%, assuredly CAN lose fat and gain muscle.
Yes there are exceptions to the statement (overweight/obese person, returning athlete, newbie to weight lifting, enhancement user), but by in large adding any significant amount of muscle while on calorie deficit isn't going to happen.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness industry for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition0 -
A pound is a pound regardless of what it is. 1 pound of muscle does not weigh more than one pound of fat. 1.1 pounds of muscle weighs more than 1 pound of fat or vice versa. Muscle is more dense and takes up less room.
One of those fun replies to "How do I get big fast?" ... Get fat, and In no time at all you too can have 20 inch upper arms, thighs as thick as tree limbs! You don't even have to get off the couch...assuming the pizza delivery guy will come in and hand you the 2 extra larges you are having for dinner.0 -
The most important number on a scale.................................................how much does that bacon weigh?
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness industry for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition0 -
OP, did you know what your actual TDEE was prior to losing weight? 1300 calories seems low for someone whose quite active with your particular stats and goals. Your total deficit should be small - no greater than 300 calories - since you're focusing more on body recomposition.0
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No.
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The most important number on a scale.................................................how much does that bacon weigh?
Where is the Like button?0 -
I've focused on lifting heavy , upping the protein. I've learned to step away from the scale as I've actually gained 4 lbs since doing this I focus on how I feel and how cut I am now. That's in my opinion0
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I have yet to see a skinny person on calorie deficit gain muscle. It's not broscience, it's the basic law of thermodynamics."You can't gain muscle without eating at a surplus"
This is absolutely the number one biggest bit of bro science that I see every day. Absolutely you can. Not as much, and not as quickly, but you very much can gain muscle and lose fat at the same time.
Caveat: It's not easy.
If you are eating at a slight deficit, and are working out with weights heavy enough to be in the 2-8 rep range before failure, and are getting enough protein (THIS IS KEY) then you will gain strength and muscle.
You don't need to eat at a surplus, but you do need to take in enough protein. How much is enough? That's up for debate and is another hotbed of bro science. I tend to err on the side of caution and take in about 1g of protein for every pound of lean body mass (which you can find calculators to estimate for you).
Eating gobs of food to make up a huge surplus is the reason why a lot of gym people get into harmful bulk/cut cycles. You don't need to put on a pound of fat for every pound of muscle, then lose muscle trying to burn that fat off. It's dumb, and I don't get why people think it's the right way to do it.
The calories you burn working out and generally living will come from the food you eat first, and when that runs out, your body will attack fat stores, and only when those are gone (or nearly gone) will it work on metabolizing muscle tissue. Unless you're eating at a severe deficit, your body will have enough calories from the food you eat and the fat you have on you to use the protein you're eating to repair damage. It won't be as fast, or efficient as putting on muscle while you are swimming with calories from eating a lumberjack's diet, but it will go on.
If you are eating at a severe deficit, about the most you can hope for is that the lifting you do will offset the loss of muscle, but if you can find a balance (that's the hard part), then you can gain muscle and lose fat.
Note, you will not do either quickly. If you are looking to crash your fat, or bulk up in a hurry, you should probably concentrate on one or the other. If you're happy to make a lifestyle change to lift heavy and eat right for the foreseeable future, then you absolutely, 100%, assuredly CAN lose fat and gain muscle.
Yes there are exceptions to the statement (overweight/obese person, returning athlete, newbie to weight lifting, enhancement user), but by in large adding any significant amount of muscle while on calorie deficit isn't going to happen.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness industry for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
Most of the MFP population are newbies. While the gains are minimal and generally not visible (because of volumetric considerations), they are possible. Just not even remotely optimal.0 -
What is up with females and weight!!!
BODY COMPOSITION BODY COMPOSITION BODY COMPOSITION >
THROW AWAY YOUR CHIT USELESS SCALE!!!
Agreed!0 -
Strength training is done with a barbell and big wheels, not a DVD.
This0 -
No.
[/Thread]0 -
Oh and just saw, you are 5'2 and 110? You do realise that it's very, very low right?
Muscles = Eating at a surplus and lifting heavy0 -
The most important number on a scale.................................................how much does that bacon weigh?
now /thread0 -
However, I still want to get down to 105. Is it possible or am I going to see scale increases because muscle weighs more than fat?
I didn't read through all of the pages, but I'm curious about why you want to be a certain scale weight. Do you need to "make weight" for a competition or something? If not, why strive to achieve a certain weight?0
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