Changed goal from 1kg a week to 0.75kg with zero weight loss

richiechowns

So over the last week I have changed my goal weight loss from 1kg a week, which I had achieved for 4 weeks, to 0.75kg a week as I started the T25 Beta cycle (half way through week 2) which adds light weights to the programme not used on Alpha.

Anyone think I may have stabilized due to adding muscle? I've not changed my activity level, still come close to or just under my calorie goal and I do fairly well on each of my macros - I've upped protein slightly to hit goal over the last week or so.

Diet is wholefood plant-based and I'd be interested in opinions. I know the scales are not always a good indication of body composition, so I may have added muscle but seems a bit quick and the weights are pretty small.

Avidkeo

Light weights aren't going to give you enough muscle change in 2 weeks to mask fat loss. However you may be retaining water from starting a new exercise regime.

Also weight loss is not linear. You will lose some days/weeks, and gain a little others. Keep going, and if you are in calorie deficit, you will lose. Oh and a plateau is over a month at the same weight, not 2 weeks.

Good luck!

richiechowns

Avidkeo wrote: »

Light weights aren't going to give you enough muscle change in 2 weeks to mask fat loss. However you may be retaining water from starting a new exercise regime.

Also weight loss is not linear. You will lose some days/weeks, and gain a little others. Keep going, and if you are in calorie deficit, you will lose. Oh and a plateau is over a month at the same weight, not 2 weeks.

Good luck!

Interesting reference water retention as I have been drinking loads, but I guess could still be holding some. Also I should say I've been doing my current plan for 6 1/2 weeks, so T25 Alpha is a mixture of cardio and then body weight stuff, like squatting, press-ups - the sort of things that tone your muscles - Beta just adds weights to give that extra resistance and focus on compound type movements.

At some point, I'd like to be in a position to hold maintenance, as my running picks up again (added running in last few weeks again as well) but also be a bit more toned. As a sub-3 marathon runner I was fit but not that toned.

AnnPT77

richiechowns wrote: »

Avidkeo wrote: »

Light weights aren't going to give you enough muscle change in 2 weeks to mask fat loss. However you may be retaining water from starting a new exercise regime.

Also weight loss is not linear. You will lose some days/weeks, and gain a little others. Keep going, and if you are in calorie deficit, you will lose. Oh and a plateau is over a month at the same weight, not 2 weeks.

Good luck!

Interesting reference water retention as I have been drinking loads, but I guess could still be holding some. Also I should say I've been doing my current plan for 6 1/2 weeks, so T25 Alpha is a mixture of cardio and then body weight stuff, like squatting, press-ups - the sort of things that tone your muscles - Beta just adds weights to give that extra resistance and focus on compound type movements.

At some point, I'd like to be in a position to hold maintenance, as my running picks up again (added running in last few weeks again as well) but also be a bit more toned. As a sub-3 marathon runner I was fit but not that toned.

Keep in mind that eating more (switching from 1kg/week to 0.75kg/week) adds not only calories, but probably also some extra carbs (even if a perfectly healthy, non-excessive amount) and little more sodium compared to your previous routine, and also increases your average daily digestive system contents. The extra carbs require a little more water retention while the carbs are being metabolized (shows up on the scale, isn't fat), the extra sodium requires a little more water retention to balance electrolytes (shows up on scale, isn't fat), and the extra digestive contents also show on the scale, but aren't fat. (Simplistically, holding an apple in your hand adds bodyweight in the same way as holding it in your digestive tract.)

So, increased exercise, more water retention for muscle repair. More food, more water weight and digestive contents. None of that is fat, but it bumps up the scale weight for a while, hiding continuing fat loss going on in the background (as long as you're still in a calorie deficit).

Hang in there: Your fat loss will overtake the water/digestive contents weirdness soon.

If you haven't read this yet, it'd be a good read:

https://physiqonomics.com/the-weird-and-highly-annoying-world-of-scale-weight-and-fluctuations

Oh, and: Sadly, not muscle increase, not that fast, not with that routine (which I'm sure is a fine routine, BTW).

Under ideal conditions, a man working hard at it would be getting good results if he gained a half-pound of muscle per week (half that, for a woman), without using illegal/unsafe drugs to do it. Ideal conditions would include a good, progressive strength training program (i.e., focused heavy lifting), excellent nutrition (especially protein), relative youth, favorable genetics, relative beginner-hood to strength training, and a calorie surplus. You're doing many good things, but they don't match those ideal conditions. Therefore, it's very likely that any muscle mass gain is well below half a pound a week, so it's unlikely to outpace fat loss on the scale. Water weight can definitely do that, though.

Best wishes!

richiechowns

Thanks @AnnPT77, I had a slight loss this week. Going to give it a few more weeks, then probably sit at maintenance for a while and see if I can up the training

Zimm7

richiechowns wrote: »

Thanks @AnnPT77, I had a slight loss this week. Going to give it a few more weeks, then probably sit at maintenance for a while and see if I can up the training

Increasing training for weight loss is a tough road. Reevaluate your calorie intake. You have to be in a calorie deficit for weight loss.

richiechowns

tzimmer10211 wrote: »

richiechowns wrote: »

Thanks @AnnPT77, I had a slight loss this week. Going to give it a few more weeks, then probably sit at maintenance for a while and see if I can up the training

Increasing training for weight loss is a tough road. Reevaluate your calorie intake. You have to be in a calorie deficit for weight loss.

Sorry that wasn't clear, I'm don't have loads to lose, so by upping my training which is well within my capabilities and sitting at maintenance I'm hoping to see body changes that are reduced bf% and a few gains.

mmapags

richiechowns wrote: »

tzimmer10211 wrote: »

richiechowns wrote: »

Thanks @AnnPT77, I had a slight loss this week. Going to give it a few more weeks, then probably sit at maintenance for a while and see if I can up the training

Increasing training for weight loss is a tough road. Reevaluate your calorie intake. You have to be in a calorie deficit for weight loss.

Sorry that wasn't clear, I'm don't have loads to lose, so by upping my training which is well within my capabilities and sitting at maintenance I'm hoping to see body changes that are reduced bf% and a few gains.

Eating at maintenance and increasing training, particularly resistance training, is referred to as Body Recomposition, or Recomp. Ideally, over time, you accomplish just what you are wanting, a leaner, stronger body. Just bear in mind it is a slow process. So, patience.

PAV8888

And body recomp sounds like a better plan (than a caloric deficit for weight loss) for someone who predominantly seems to be after performance and strength increases.

AnnPT77

Since several are suggesting you consider recomposition (not a bad plan IMO as well), here's the classic thread on the subject:

https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10177803/recomposition-maintaining-weight-while-losing-fat

richiechowns

AnnPT77 wrote: »

Since several are suggesting you consider recomposition (not a bad plan IMO as well), here's the classic thread on the subject:

https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10177803/recomposition-maintaining-weight-while-losing-fat

Thanks, that is a big thread so lots to go through. I'll take a look... in the mean time, do you have any thoughts on this question I've asked on there please?

Can anyone link me to how this work if you have changeable exercise patterns please? For example, I don't go to the gym and follow a weights program as such, I run and do differing distances and intensity some days, others I'll do a T25 type HIIT/weights type program, others I'll do body weight training.

Is it a case of setting your activity levels as a week view, rather than a day view? I work on my backside around 8 hours a day, I do get up and walk a bit but most of the time it is early exercise and then later walking, cycling or running.

mmapags

richiechowns wrote: »

AnnPT77 wrote: »

Since several are suggesting you consider recomposition (not a bad plan IMO as well), here's the classic thread on the subject:

https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10177803/recomposition-maintaining-weight-while-losing-fat

Thanks, that is a big thread so lots to go through. I'll take a look... in the mean time, do you have any thoughts on this question I've asked on there please?

Can anyone link me to how this work if you have changeable exercise patterns please? For example, I don't go to the gym and follow a weights program as such, I run and do differing distances and intensity some days, others I'll do a T25 type HIIT/weights type program, others I'll do body weight training.

Is it a case of setting your activity levels as a week view, rather than a day view? I work on my backside around 8 hours a day, I do get up and walk a bit but most of the time it is early exercise and then later walking, cycling or running.

Sounds like you are not clear on the N.E.A.T. method that MFP operates on. Seems like you are confusing with the TDEE method. On MFP, you set your activity level based on how active you are in daily life with no intentional exercise. Then you log intentional exercise and you will get additional calories. (There is much discussion of the accuracy of the calories and many people only consume a portion of them.) The advantage for you is on the days you workout, you get calories to fuel that and it is based on that days exercise.

So, you don't have to factor anything in to your activity level for exercise. Only how active you are in daily life before exercise. Sounds like sedentary from what you describe above with basically sitting for 8 hours per day.

Then log your intentional exercise, walking, cycling, running, body weight or whatever and eat back some portion of those calories. (Pick a number between 50 and 100% and stay with that.) After a month or 2, track real world results and adjust. Your starting point is all based on general population estimates. After you have a good amount of your own data, you can see how those estimates apply to you.

For you, the N.E.A.T. method seems ideal with your changing exercise patterns. The other most commonly used method is T.D.E.E. and that requires some consistency to be accurate. Am I understanding your question correctly?

richiechowns

@mmapags this is a learning curve for me again, I first logged on here 5 years ago, have forgotten everything I learned then (2 kids) and was so focused on my marathon time, calories and body composition etc were not really a factor - although should have been I guess.

As I had a lay off from running, my initial concern was to lose a few kg, so I hit it harder than maybe I should, going a kg a week when really I only had say 15-20lbs to lose. Since I've started the T25, wanting to get a bit more toned, I thought it best to reevaluate and ask people who have a bit more recent experience, so appreciate the advice.

From what you and others say, I should set my activity level to sedentary and my goal to maintenance, log my activities through Garmin into MFP and then eat back between 50 and 90% of those - monitor and then see what happens with measurements? Is that understanding correct?

mmapags

richiechowns wrote: »

@mmapags this is a learning curve for me again, I first logged on here 5 years ago, have forgotten everything I learned then (2 kids) and was so focused on my marathon time, calories and body composition etc were not really a factor - although should have been I guess.

As I had a lay off from running, my initial concern was to lose a few kg, so I hit it harder than maybe I should, going a kg a week when really I only had say 15-20lbs to lose. Since I've started the T25, wanting to get a bit more toned, I thought it best to reevaluate and ask people who have a bit more recent experience, so appreciate the advice.

From what you and others say, I should set my activity level to sedentary and my goal to maintenance, log my activities through Garmin into MFP and then eat back between 50 and 90% of those - monitor and then see what happens with measurements? Is that understanding correct?

Yes! You are dead on with that. Are you still looking to lean down body fat a little? Or just recomp?

AnnPT77

richiechowns wrote: »

AnnPT77 wrote: »

Since several are suggesting you consider recomposition (not a bad plan IMO as well), here's the classic thread on the subject:

https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10177803/recomposition-maintaining-weight-while-losing-fat

Thanks, that is a big thread so lots to go through. I'll take a look... in the mean time, do you have any thoughts on this question I've asked on there please?

Can anyone link me to how this work if you have changeable exercise patterns please? For example, I don't go to the gym and follow a weights program as such, I run and do differing distances and intensity some days, others I'll do a T25 type HIIT/weights type program, others I'll do body weight training.

Is it a case of setting your activity levels as a week view, rather than a day view? I work on my backside around 8 hours a day, I do get up and walk a bit but most of the time it is early exercise and then later walking, cycling or running.

You'll be better off getting answers on that thread from regulars/experienced people in that thread.

While I posted the recomp thread for you, and have read enough to know that it's quite sound, I'm not a recomp-er myself, so don't generally participate in the thread. (For myself, I just try to get good nutrition, stay at a healthy weight, do activities I find fun, and stay strong/fit enough to keep what I hope are good odds of healthy independence into my even-older age (I'm 64 now). If I recomp doing that, swell. If I don't, swell. I don't have the remotest interest in improving my body to look more attractive, or toned, or anything like that. I don't disrespect those who do have such goals - I fully support others in any healthful goals, healthfully pursued - but I don't have those goals myself.). Recomp is good stuff, I've done some in the past (more or less by accident, without knowing it had a name!).

If someone on the recomp thread, some less experienced/knowledgeable person, posts something misleading or incorrect, then others more experienced will post a clarification/correction. You'll get good advice, as long as you pay attention (and even note who gets multiple "disagrees" vs. multiple "like"/"insightful"). You're in good hands on that thread.

Mmapags has given you good advice here (and there) about the calorie issues.

Wishing you all the best! :drinker: