Binge eating
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Dogmom1978 wrote: »A cheat meal is something that people have once in a while and NOT a meal where they can’t move afterwards.
A cheat meal is eating something high calorie and not good for you (like ice cream), but it’s NOT eating the entire 1/2 gallon.
I think you need to do some research into what the normal cheat meal consists of
"Normal" of course is subjective, as is "cheat meal". It is all very personal and not something that can, I think, be researched.
Myself, I do not have "cheat meals" but instead have "treats" and I quite enjoy, very very occasionally, allowing myself to eat a whole tub of ice cream.
Mind you, 1/2 a gallon sounds a lot and I don't think in the UK you can buy it in that big a pack without going for catering sizes and instead I am thinking more of the 480ml size container.1 -
Ok let’s say it’s not a diet. If someone tells you they are at 5’8 140 lbs with 14% body fat would you tell them they need to diet or keep doing what they are doing?
It is very common these days, and shortsighted, to believe that a healthy weight is an indication of a healthy lifestyle. That is not the case. You also should not consider this as a means to maintain your current numbers. You are able to maintain your weight despite this behavior not because of it.
You said that when running out of time you inhaled 3 desserts. You could not have enjoyed them if you ate that fast so why would you do it? Did you feel panicked about not getting enough food for this trip?
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I only binge when I plan on doing it. Outside of AYCE places, I will goto carousel sushi places and binge until i'm satisfied. Sometimes that could be 20 plates of sushi or more plus udon plus desserts. So that could be counting as i'm paying a-la cart.
There are other times where I have unlimited amounts of food for free such as family gathering that I don't binge at. At these family events, there are usually tons of food left over. However if these event's fall on the week that I am dieting, I just bring my own food. I can sit in a room where everyone is eating pizza, chicken wings, and all kinds of greasy food and just eat my own food without the craving of just having 1 slice of pizza or chicken wing. I have junk food around the house at all times that I don't touch. My wife eats them occasionally whenever she has wants to. It doesn't bother me that she is eating it or give me urge to just take a bite.
Same with office events before the coronavirus happened. I will goto happy hour and not drink or have any of the bar food if doesn't coincide with my diet plans even though all the food and drinks are free.
I have also cut off food in an instant once I found out it was negatively affecting my diet. Examples are those 1.1k containers of cashews from costco. Before I tracked calories, I would eat an 8 ounce cup of it a day because it taste good and nuts were suppose to be healthy. I would buy multiple containers when they are on sale so they are always available since I used to go though them so fast. Once I found out how high of calories that 1 8 ounce cup was, I literally stopped eating them that day. So right now, I have 3 brand new unopen containers of cashews that is about to expire on 11/2/2020. I started eating them again since I don't want to waste food, but I am eating just 10 gram or 60 calories a day now since it is healthy fat, and eating less avocado.
Yesterday meal as i mentioned, i didn't eat nearly as much as the time before. Reason being my wife and I was engaged in a interesting conversation so there was a lot of time just spent talking. Also I know eating until I couldn't walk like last time is not a good thing so I was waiting for food to digest before getting another plate giving myself time to digest to see if i was still really hungry. It just turns out that as this would have been the first time in 3 week I was going to have dessert I wanted to get ice cream and cake. Unfortunately due to all the chatting, time just got away from us. When i went to get my first 2 pieces of cake, I though we had about 15 minutes left. And as I said, i thought the cheese cake tasted good and I wanted to get 2 more pieces and ice cream . However when I got back to my seat, the host said time was up. So instead of throwing the food away, I just quickly ate them.
I know lots of people will say i'm in denial, and i'm tired of arguing or justifying myself as that was never the point of the thread. I know I have an iron will and I don't do anything unless I want to regardless of if it will make family members or co-workers uncomfortable. I just never saw it as something will be detrimental to my health. But I am not so closed minded that i'm not going to do research on it. I won't eat till I am sitting out side of the restaurant cause i can't move again cause i'm not that naive to think that that was ok, but I'm also not going to stop having my "cheat" meals. Not going to use the word binge since everyone reacts so negatively to it. lol2 -
But I am not so closed minded that i'm not going to do research on it. I won't eat till I am sitting out side of the restaurant cause i can't move again cause i'm not that naive to think that that was ok, but I'm also not going to stop having my "cheat" meals. Not going to use the word binge since everyone reacts so negatively to it. lol
Ah yes, this needs to be said. "Binge eating" (etymology) is an identified medical term for an extreme eating disorder. Using this word for what you do is somewhat inappropriate and can be confusing when discussing with other people (especially those that do suffer from it).
At the end of the day, you have to do what you think it is best for you! What works best for you. Only you know your body, what it can handle and how it responds to stimuli. So use the feedback that other people are giving you here and find out whether you need to change or alter your habits accordingly.
Hope that helps, cheers..C:
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It sounds like you also have some impulses around getting your money’s worth, and putting yourself into a very uncomfortable position in order to do so. That’s something I might investigate about myself.3
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So not sure why replies weren't, No, I don't plan binge eats, Yes it is an unhealthy relationship with food.
I don't see me asking if it was healthy for my body. I didn't ask if I should go get professional help. I didn't ask for help to break this habit. I didn't ask for people's opinion if this is a good diet strategy.
Most people say something when they see someone engaging in unhealthy, potentially self-harming behavior.
If someone posted “does anyone else plan on getting blackout drunk on a regular basis? I don’t drink much on other days.” The responses would probably be concerned about alcoholism and liver function. It is the same thing.
Your behavior is unhealthy even if you aren’t trying to lose weight. I think down deep you know this, which is why you asked the question to begin with. I think you were hoping we all would reply “Yes, I binge eat on a regular basis, usually around 5,000 calories. It is totally normal, don’t worry!”
We didn’t respond how you expected and now you are justifying your eating and doing all kinds of mental gymnastics trying to convince us this is normal, or at least not as bad as we think.
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So not sure why replies weren't, No, I don't plan binge eats, Yes it is an unhealthy relationship with food.
I don't see me asking if it was healthy for my body. I didn't ask if I should go get professional help. I didn't ask for help to break this habit. I didn't ask for people's opinion if this is a good diet strategy.
Most people say something when they see someone engaging in unhealthy, potentially self-harming behavior.
If someone posted “does anyone else plan on getting blackout drunk on a regular basis? I don’t drink much on other days.” The responses would probably be concerned about alcoholism and liver function. It is the same thing.
Your behavior is unhealthy even if you aren’t trying to lose weight. I think down deep you know this, which is why you asked the question to begin with. I think you were hoping we all would reply “Yes, I binge eat on a regular basis, usually around 5,000 calories. It is totally normal, don’t worry!”
We didn’t respond how you expected and now you are justifying your eating and doing all kinds of mental gymnastics trying to convince us this is normal, or at least not as bad as we think.
Yes, my ex thinks he doesn't have a drinking problem because he "only drinks on Sundays." However, he got blackout drunk Every. Single. Sunday.
All his blood tests and such were fine.
I expect it to catch up to him eventually, if it hasn't already.7 -
Ok let’s say it’s not a diet. If someone tells you they are at 5’8 140 lbs with 14% body fat would you tell them they need to diet or keep doing what they are doing?
Do you think bulimia is healthy? This is what you've described reminds me of, although your purges are not immediate, but over time, as you cut calories drastically to make up for your excesses.5 -
There are not many things that are good in huge excess. I have often banked calories to enjoy a bigger meal on the weekends. It helps with my compliance. What it sounds like you are doing is a very extreme version of it.
Oh and I think the word you are looking for is gorging not binging.
It sounds like if you slowed WAY down and fully appreciated the calories instead of making it an effort to get as much food down as possible your feeling of fullness would have a chance to kick in and then you would have less calories to offset with your iron will.8 -
Humor me here please-
What do you gain out of cramming in as much food as possible as quickly as possible? It’s certainly not to taste the food, or to enjoy a reward for being strict the rest of the week. Maybe if we can get the answer to that question we can figure out why you do what you do and what a better coping mechanism might be.5 -
Side note- I used to do something similar when my routine was too strict. Do you allow for treats and food you genuinely enjoy when you’re tracking your calories strictly? That might alleviate the desire to gorge yourself on your days off.2
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There are not many things that are good in huge excess. I have often banked calories to enjoy a bigger meal on the weekends. It helps with my compliance. What it sounds like you are doing is a very extreme version of it.
Oh and I think the word you are looking for is gorging not binging.
It sounds like if you slowed WAY down and fully appreciated the calories instead of making it an effort to get as much food down as possible your feeling of fullness would have a chance to kick in and then you would have less calories to offset with your iron will.
I prefer to use the word "splurging" myself. Never liked the term "cheat meal" and binging has some negative connotations with it, as seen by all the responses here.2 -
@briscogun @novusdies I agree, i'm going to stop saying binge since it probably isn't exactly what I am doing. But my form of dieting is to eat in a deficit to have a nice meal much like what you guys do. My opinion is eating at maintenance will just lead to weight gain. There are always going to be occasions that you will go over your calories. I just prefer to be ahead of the game instead of trying to play catch up after the fact.
@msalicia07 I do not cram as much in as quickly as possible, and I am enjoying what I am eating. How these hot pot places work is you get a small bowl of soup base of your choice and you go get what ever veggies, meat you wan to cook. So you are not getting 2 lbs of food at a time to boil at once. You are getting small dishes cooking, eating, getting back up and going back to see what else you want. So first plate, i may want some beef, then I may want some shrimp, then I may want some veggies. But there is a decision making process every time to say yep, that taste good and I like some more or that looks good, I want to try that. This time, they had wax apple as one of their fruit, So i got 2 apples worth of that. Why, because I like how it taste. I have stated before in other forms and thread.
Do I allow for treats when i'm dieting? Typically no. Trying to go on a deficit on 2000 calorie diet is already hard enough if you are also trying to eat healthy. If you want to eat your fruit severing, veggies, and protein, and carb. There is very little room for treats. For example, below is 1600 calories. For me personally, I am starving if I only ate that.
10oz chicken breast 480 calories
200g avocado 320 calories
2 apple 180 calories
400g broccoli 100 calories
100g bread 310 calories
150g of cooked rice 210 calories
Of course, there are exceptions I am willing to make. Like if my wife said she just wants to go out to a fancy restaurant for some reason and her mind is set on it. Then I will go and have a nice meal with her and not worry about the diet. Happy wife happy life right? I just am not willing to make those exceptions for co-workers or aunts and uncles.
@spyro88 Why do I plan having nice meal or cheat meal or splurging? I was taught that planning is critical part of success. You have to plan for retirement, vacation, diet, dates, and many other things. So why wouldn't I plan for my cheat meal? For me, planing means I don't wake up the next day with regret of eating all those calories. I plan on not worrying about how many calories I am eating. I plan on not trying to burn off more calories after these meals.
@gallicinvasion These hot pot places cost 14.60 USD total. We don't tip where I live. It doesn't take much to get my moneys worth so that's not it. In fact, when my wife went on a short vacation down south few weeks ago. We went to one of the best AYCE places I have ever been too. It cost 3x the amount and there was no time limit. However on that day, I did not get anywhere close to stuffing myself. Why? Because I didn't want too. Why? Because we had plans for some HIIT later that night. lol. So being around food doesn't make me lose control of my impulses or feeling the need to get my moneys worth.1 -
Sounds like you have it all figured out then.
One final thought- you mentioned you don’t allow for treats because you have little wiggle room with your calories and would be hungry otherwise. However, you manage to fit in these “scheduled binges” as you’ve called them to maintain your weight. Personally, I would divide that additional 5,000+ calories into my daily life to have more balance. We’re all trying to play the long game here, presumably
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True, but for me, going to the park every week for a get away isn't as enjoyable as going over seas for vacation.
And I don't think I have it all figured out. I just don't think I'm in denial of a problem that I need to seek professional help.2 -
I'm a binger by nature. I can control it while dieting; but as soon as I stop trying to control it, I start binging. I know exactly what binging is and have done it hundreds of times during my life. There is nothing about stuffing yourself in a restaurant to the point where you can barely get to the car to get home, that I don't understand or haven't done scores of times. OP, everything you've described in your binges could easily fit into the category of "appetizer" for one of my binges. I've eaten twice or thrice what you've described and then headed over to the next restaurant for another full meal as though I hadn't eaten in a day, and then gone to 7-11 for snacks. I've had more than my share of splitting up my binges between two restaurants so as not to be humiliated in front of the wait staff due to how much food I was ordering and eating.
I have been on diets with planned binges. Or "off days". Or cheat days. Or whatever you want to call them. Rather than split semantic hairs over the definitions, I'll just put it like this: I've been on diets where I would have a day per week (or per two weeks) where it was understood in advance that I was going to eat as much food as I wanted to with no remorse on that scheduled day -- all the junky Chinese buffet glop and chocolate and ice cream and chips I love dearly that I'd denied myself during the week. That would be my "reward" for dieting the rest of the time. I've even lost weight that way - for a time. Of course, all the weight came back later, which is the real moral of the story.
I still have a psychological predisposition for unhealthy binging even though I've gotten much better at controlling it. Recognition of having that disorder is a key component of getting it under control. It is no different than any other addiction: step one is being honest with yourself. OP, are you being honest with yourself?
At the beginning of covid, in January, I had already been on a diet for 6 months and lost 50 pounds. I've lost another 30 since then, 80 total. I'm still on the diet. 40 more pounds to go and I will be in a normal BMI range. All good. But here's what happened to me one day in February. My wife and I were stockpiling foods in preparation for the great plague that would end up with the world looking like the set of Omega Man. Nowadays it seems silly to be that dramatic about it, but back in February it seemed sensible. We stockpiled years worth of pasta, rice, cans of tomato sauce, etc. And one more thing. 7 boxes of Pepperidge Farm cookies. Like, a box of milano's, and a box of double chocolate milanos, and a box of chessmen, and so on. Because if you're going to die in the apocalypse, you should have cookies.
One night, right when I was in the middle of my very successful, very disciplined 1700 calorie per day diet, I went to the storeroom and ate every single cookie. 7 packages of Pepperidge Farm. 8.400 calories. All gone. For no reason. Wasn't hungry. Didn't plan on eating any cookies until I was literally standing in front of the boxes. It just happened. Each cookie, I thought, one more cookie. And then all 7 boxes of cookies, 100+ cookies, were gone. Then, knowing the day was completely shot, I declared it an off day and put 7 or 8 slices of cheddar cheese on an open faced bagel and toasted it in the oven. So we're talking about a 10,000+ calorie binge.
In an hour.
Ima give you one piece of advice. Don't schedule binge days or meals. Those planned binge/cheat/off meals/days/hours contain the seeds of total systemic diet failure. It is not a question of "if" but "when". The ONLY reason Pepperidge Farm day didn't lead to Pepperidge Farm Day # 2 for me in February is because I've had a year to develop a new mind set and was able to pull back from the brink. In previous diet efforts, I did not pull back from the brink and everything fell apart.
The only reason binging is working for you is because it hasn't not worked yet. One of these days it will stop working and you will gain weight incredibly fast - so fast your head will spin and you won't even know what hit you. You'll skip your weigh-in on the scale, and then you'll give yourself another day to get it all out of your system, and then a week to really enjoy stuff before going back to granola or the other bland crap, and then you'll decide to regroup the following Monday, and when that doesn't work it'll be the first of the next month, and then the first of the next year, and 5 or 7 years from now you'll rejoin MFP and ask what people think about binging.
It's going to happen. No binger is immune from that. Hitting a new weight high is the inexorable outcome of uncontrolled binge behavior, whether it happens next week or in 2024.
Give yourself one meal every week or preferably every two weeks where you get a few hundred extra calories (as in 300 or 400) and learn to live with that. Get into good habits, mentally, with food. Count every calorie and don't ever give yourself permission to not do so. There is no reason not to have treats, but if you have any disposition to being overweight and binging, there is no reason to have total free-for-all off-days.
As I said, cheat days work until they don't, and eventually, they don't.
If you can't operationalize that - if you say to yourself "yeah, that seems sensible, I'll do that" and then next week you experience a gorge-fest - then address it as an eating disorder and stop telling yourself you've got it all under control, because you don't, or eventually won't.12 -
You seem to have changed your mind over the course of the thread that you are now not eating until you are physically sick, but just having a treat meal. What you are saying now contradicts with your original post. (Gorging until you are sick is a problem, having a treat meal obviously isn't).
Anyway as another poster said - sounds like you have it all worked out. Good luck to you.5 -
@igfrie Thanks for sharing. BMI is a useless measurement in my opinion and many other peoples. While it works for most people, it doesn't work for people with large amounts of muscle mass. The only number I care about is body fat%, my blood works numbers, my cardio vascular health and if I have enough strength to do things someone of my size should be able to do. Ideally, like to exceed the average on the strength aspect.
If you read my many post, I concede that I may have used the wrong word to start the thread. If I would have started the thread with "planning cheat meal and knowing when to stop eating when your full", the direction of this thread could have been much different. I am not a binger and have no reason to believe that one day i'll be looking back asking my self what happened. I am eating because I feel hungry.
Really, what I want to know is how much time do you need to give food to digest before the signals are sent to your brain letting you know that you are full. When i'm full, I stop eating. The one time I ate till couldn't move, I didn't eat dinner or anything else that day. This week even though I ate 4000+ calories, I ate dinner and before bed meal that day because I was hungry.
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The often quoted number is around 20 minutes.
I've felt ill a few times after eating. Once finishing a (for me) huge restaurant meal (it was delicious, and of course I've been taught to empy my plate), and once at a Christmas family dinner (dessert buffet). Nauseous to the point of needing 15 minutes in the cold air outside to 'recover'. Ever since, I recognise the feeling in my stomach right before reaching 'breaking' point and I stop dead in my tracks (not a single bite more, even if it means leaving a nearly full plate), and I've never felt nauseous from overeating since then.
YMMV, I think we have very different food habits (I prefer daily treats and AYCE restaurants don't appeal to me) and we're from different food cultures as well. But for me, extra large meals mess with my hunger signals. I don't know if it's because of stretching of the stomach or simply out of whack hunger and satiety hormones, but I'm always hungrier the following meal times.0 -
Hi OP
Just for clarity:
Whatever you call it, everything you have described does not sound like a healthy relationship with food. From the 'I eat loads and load till I can't move' and 'I ate food very quickly because we had to leave soon' to the 'no no, this is normal and completely fine, I have no problem with the way I'm eating'.
Saying you're fine with the way you're eating doesn't mean that you have a healthy relationship with food. In fact, the length you're going to to explain quite how fine your relationship with food is (despite all evidence to the contrary) seems to completely contradict the initial question asked.
And that question. You asked if this was a healthy relationship with food and everyone said no. Then you decided to explain to everyone why it was fine and was a healthy relationship with food. And that hasn't changed anyone's mind. Everyone has continued to say 'no, it's not healthy'. Downplaying what you've said before just keep cementing our opinion that no, you do not have a healthy relationship with food.
We are not going to allow you to use us to justify your actions. Because you know that, deep down, it isn't healthy, otherwise you wouldn't have asked the question.4 -
The troublesome thing about this thread is that you are seemingly proud of your system and the results you believe you can contribute to it. Your numbers are good and for some reading this or hearing you tell your story in real life that makes you an authority figure because they are desperate enough to try anything. They will read all the posts explaining why this is a bad idea as the unenlightened.
I am not blaming you for anything. The people posting here are meant to be adults and hopefully you are not telling your "amazing" story to kids in real life. People have to be responsible for themselves but I can assure you that at least one person has read this and is probably trying the 'gorge til you can't move' plan.
Does seem like a good time to use one of my favorite sayings:
"It is what you learn after you know it all that counts"5 -
Said on page 3.
Also. I am not promoting my behavior nor am I telling people they can binge and lose weight and remain fit.
Said on page 4
Also I know eating until I couldn't walk like last time is not a good thing so I was waiting for food to digest before getting another plate giving myself time to digest to see if i was still really hungry.
Said on page 2
I know this habit isn't normal, and I probably do have a unhealthy relationship with food.2 -
Does anyone else purposely plan binge eating meals? I have a habit of going to ayce places and binge eating until the point where I can't move or about to puke. I don't feel bad about it after do it like most people. I do this about once or twice a month. Is this considered an unhealthy relationship with food? Doing this doesn't affect my weight.I'm early 40's. I don't plan on eating until I feel bad physically. It usually just happen because I feel like I can eat another plate or bowl of ice cream. But after eating for 90 minutes to 2 hours straight, it suddenly hits me that I am stuffed, and that last plate was a mistake.For example, tomorrow lunch, I am going to an ayce. I know i am going to eat 10x more food than I should. What I hope don't happen is what happened last time. Last time, when I was done, I literally could not walk and had to sit outside on the sidewalk for 15 minutes.
Yes, these are the posts that are in question. It’s okay to change your verbiage but not the story. Either way, everyone is just trying to help you and tell you the truth. Sincerely. We have nothing to gain otherwise.3
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