Keto
Replies
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@psuLemon it is perfectly normal for the regulars to question a new person who starts a thread called “keto” and asks if anyone else is doing it as to WHY they started keto. Just like with vegan, IF, carnivore, south beach, etc etc. anytime someone announces that they started a fad diet, those of us who have been around awhile are checking to make sure new people started THAT diet for the RIGHT reasons and not just because they read some nonsense where they would lose more weight because “unicorn farts”.
All different approaches work for different people. 1 person I work with has been doing keto for over 5 years and has kept the weight off. We wear photo ids. Keto might be so popular where I work because his badge photo has him being very obese and he is a normal weight now.
Keto is so popular at this company because of 1 person that when I decided to lose weight again and quietly started doing so at work, once it was noticeable people started saying things like “oh I didn’t know you were doing keto also” 🤦♀️.
So yes, anytime anyone starts a thread with “I started x diet anyone else doing x diet?” I’m going to ask some questions about what made you choose X diet and why do you think it will work for you? Too many people get discouraged quickly when the fad diet they have chosen doesn’t work out and they disappear. I’m simply just trying to take what I’ve learned along the way to help guide them in the right direction. If the right direction for that person is keto and they understand that it works the SAME as any other diet choice, fantastic! It’s always awesome when new people find the thing that will help them succeed.
As an FYI, been on here for over 5 years, so I’ve see many people and fads come and go.3 -
Nony_Mouse wrote: »Agreeing with both Lemur and Ann.
Also, why is there this automatic assumption that things like keto, or even low carb, aren't sustainable for the long term? Some people actually like eating keto, and may be perfectly happy to eat that way the majority of the time going forward. Personally, I wouldn't want to do 'traditional' keto (ie high fat and very low carb) either for weight loss nor as my 'normal', but I recognise that other people may, and may be perfectly happy and satisfied. There are also people who do it for medical reasons, or because they genuinely believe they feel better. Same with low carb. And actually, my maintenance diet is still generally lower carb (actually just checked back in my diary, and mostly I'd be eating around the 150g total carb mark on an average day, with higher days here and there). That's just how I eat when I'm being a healthy, mindful adult (not that I think eating higher carb is unhealthy or unmindful).
Diet breaks are super handy for maintenance practice. I highly recommend them, for multiple reasons.
OP, apologies for the thread hijack!
The thing that drives me nuts is that every keto/low carb thread has to divulge into arguing over semantics, but that same level of scrutiny is not applied to WFPB and vegan threads, which comes with just as high for failure and other semantics that if not address can actually cause malnutrition (i.e., lack of b12 or iron deficiencies).
The simple fact is all plans fail when there is not a long term plan to transition out. That doesn't matter if it's LCHF, vegan, zone, Med, etc... And I certainly recognize that the more flexible diets tend to have high success rates. But I also recognize that people often have to try several different strategies before they find the solution that works. So if this strategy seems appealing to the OP, then it doesn't need to be a debating on why.
At least in my observation, if it comes across (either deliberately or through ambiguity) that someone is adopting veganism or a WFPB diet as a method of weight management, that DOES often turn into an extended discussion and people are also told not to do something for weight loss if they don't want to do it for the rest of their lives.
I'm not saying that justifies what often happens on keto threads, I think we're just seeing that the general culture of this discussion forum is one that is opposed to anything perceived as a short term plan or an extreme dietary change designed to manage weight.
I think there are some GOOD things about that general culture, in that the predominant message in society is that we can "fix" our weight through the latest fad. There are also some things that are more negative, in that it misses a lot of the nuance of how long term maintainers actually manage their weight. The truth is that MANY of us adopt short term changes to help cut calories if the scale creeps up -- we'll do keto, or skip dessert, or stop having a starch with dinner. Not because we think certain foods are bad, but because we've identified the least painful ways for us to temporarily cut calories. When I get in my "danger zone," I'll just automatically cut back on the bread, pasta, and rice for a bit because I know that I won't miss them as much as I miss other foods. There's no intention to eat that way forever, the goal is to introduce a small deficit to get back into my preferred weight range.
Edit: To be clear, I think the mere mentioning of keto is more likely to get people in the thread talking about how you don't have to do keto, even if the OP doesn't do anything to suggest that they feel keto is required for weight loss. I would be incredibly frustrated if every mention of veganism was treated the same way.3 -
Dogmom1978 wrote: »Nony_Mouse wrote: »Agreeing with both Lemur and Ann.
Also, why is there this automatic assumption that things like keto, or even low carb, aren't sustainable for the long term? Some people actually like eating keto, and may be perfectly happy to eat that way the majority of the time going forward. Personally, I wouldn't want to do 'traditional' keto (ie high fat and very low carb) either for weight loss nor as my 'normal', but I recognise that other people may, and may be perfectly happy and satisfied. There are also people who do it for medical reasons, or because they genuinely believe they feel better. Same with low carb. And actually, my maintenance diet is still generally lower carb (actually just checked back in my diary, and mostly I'd be eating around the 150g total carb mark on an average day, with higher days here and there). That's just how I eat when I'm being a healthy, mindful adult (not that I think eating higher carb is unhealthy or unmindful).
Diet breaks are super handy for maintenance practice. I highly recommend them, for multiple reasons.
OP, apologies for the thread hijack!
The thing that drives me nuts is that every keto/low carb thread has to divulge into arguing over semantics, but that same level of scrutiny is not applied to WFPB and vegan threads, which comes with just as high for failure and other semantics that if not address can actually cause malnutrition (i.e., lack of b12 or iron deficiencies).
The simple fact is all plans fail when there is not a long term plan to transition out. That doesn't matter if it's LCHF, vegan, zone, Med, etc... And I certainly recognize that the more flexible diets tend to have high success rates. But I also recognize that people often have to try several different strategies before they find the solution that works. So if this strategy seems appealing to the OP, then it doesn't need to be a debating on why.
Wellll . . . I think there's some "eye of the observer" in that observation. (I do agree with your main point. What I disagree with is that keto is a special victim of hate in some way. Does it get some? Sure. Asking "could you keep this up forever" (or at least "longish term") is IMO a useful thought-point, for any dietary mode someone's considering. It's not necessarily and always synonymous with "don't even think of doing this if you can't keep going forever".)
There's weirdness that routinely hits vegan/vegetarian threads, too, though I admit it has a little different cast to it. ("you can't get enough protein to build muscle" has been a common thing, although the otherwise pretty execrable "Game Changers" has perhaps moderated that myth in the popular imagination.)
Part of the reason is that people are often adopting vegan/vegetarian eating for reasons in addition to (or completely separate from) weight management, usually something about avoiding animal exploitation, reducing environmental impact of one' eating, or that sort of thing.
Frankly, if I see a thread from someone who seems to be saying they're going vegetarian *just* in order to lose weight or for improved health (no other reasons), I routinely push back on that . . . even though I'm long-term vegetarian. For health or weight management, it's tangent to the important issues (nutrition and calories), and can distract from them; plus being vegetarian is slightly more difficult (nutritionally and especially socially) than being an omnivore.
Most people who are starting keto (that we see here) are doing it for weight management. Some of them are doing it because of popular mythology lately that it's somehow required to go low carb, or one can't lose weight. (I know you, Psu - and Nony - are much better informed that that . . . MUCH. And even I, who would never consider low carb personally - absent a health condition requiring it - recognize that carb reduction can have appetite control benefits for some people.)
It's pretty common for vegetarians here to think people here pick on vegetarians, IF-ers to think people pick on IF-ers, and so forth. Yeah, some people pick on things they don't do themselves, but I think we all tend to notice more when our own modes are criticized, especially when unreasonably criticized. That little burst of emotion cements the memory.
. . . speaking of digression. 😉😆
I bet if you pulled the latest 10 keto threads and 10 last plant based threads, the response would be significantly different. 😉
It would be much different because keto is the *HOT* thing for weight loss right now. The issue is with people who believe keto is magic. I work with a BUNCH of those people and 🙄 make that face at them ALL DAY.
If low carb works for you, awesome. I would be miserable. If you are doing keto because you think somehow that carbs are evil and the ONLY way to lose weight is to go low carb, then you are mistaken.
I’ve been around long enough to know the regulars (most of them anyway) understand that keto isn’t magic, but many newbies are under the impression that it is.
I have YET to see that with a vegan/vegetarian thread (with one exception where someone didn’t understand how they could go vegan and GAIN weight as if CICO doesn’t apply to vegans).
They aren't as common, but they've been out there over the years. I've seen people argue that it's impossible for a body to have excess weight if you're doing veganism "right" or that dairy makes you gain weight automatically, etc.3 -
To the OP, since its been almost a week now I hope you come back and tell us about your experience with keto so far! Its great that you and your husband are doing this together...seems like it can be a little easier when more than one person in the household is on board. Hopefully you are both successful and are able to work your way towards better health!4
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dragon_girl26 wrote: »To the OP, since its been almost a week now I hope you come back and tell us about your experience with keto so far! Its great that you and your husband are doing this together...seems like it can be a little easier when more than one person in the household is on board. Hopefully you are both successful and are able to work your way towards better health!
Thank you so much. We have both lost 5 pounds in the first 5 days. We aren’t super strict, more so making sure we are staying under calories and just keeping the carbs down by being more aware of what we are putting in our mouth. There’s a lot of strong opinions on the thread. Everyone bickering because they “have been on this site x years” and everyone always knows more than everyone else. Pretty funny I got called “new”. I’ve been a member since 2009. For the first 6 years I logged on religiously and did very well. I got divorced, remarried, life happened and things changed. Now I want to start over again and work on me and us. I appreciate you checking in with me and not adding to the bickering. 🤗
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Dogmom1978 wrote: »Just curious, if counting calories worked for you years ago, why are you now going to go keto??
Yea We are counting calories also. The keto part because I’m trying to work on my husbands liver. He’s not a drinker at all, but the dr said he has a fatty liver. I need to get him down some weight. I know he won’t do it alone, and if we can kind of go slow with lower carbs then I’ll take it.
A high fat diet is not recommended for someone with fatty liver disease.2 -
dragon_girl26 wrote: »To the OP, since its been almost a week now I hope you come back and tell us about your experience with keto so far! Its great that you and your husband are doing this together...seems like it can be a little easier when more than one person in the household is on board. Hopefully you are both successful and are able to work your way towards better health!
Thank you so much. We have both lost 5 pounds in the first 5 days. We aren’t super strict, more so making sure we are staying under calories and just keeping the carbs down by being more aware of what we are putting in our mouth. There’s a lot of strong opinions on the thread. Everyone bickering because they “have been on this site x years” and everyone always knows more than everyone else. Pretty funny I got called “new”. I’ve been a member since 2009. For the first 6 years I logged on religiously and did very well. I got divorced, remarried, life happened and things changed. Now I want to start over again and work on me and us. I appreciate you checking in with me and not adding to the bickering. 🤗
Sounds good.0 -
To the OP, I'd be happy to be a MFP friend on our keto journey! I did the keto diet for a year, lost a ton of weight and felt great, gained a bunch during emotional eating with COVID and not being active, and started again 4 months ago. So far I have actually reached my goal weight but to be smack in the middle of a healthy BMI I want to lose about 10 more lbs. I am always trying to learn as much as I can about the diet, and it always helps to have friends on keto, since it is controversial. I'm really glad to hear you and your husband are doing this together. I'm doing this separate from my husband, but he works out like a madman so he is already super fit and has a generally healthy diet. I could not do keto if he was bringing ice cream home! Congrats on the weight loss so far...I find that in the beginning you lose quickly and then the rate of weight loss slows as you get closer and closer to your goal. You got this!2
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I hate to be a 🦖 dinosaur but could someone please tell me what the acronym OP is?0
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dragon_girl26 wrote: »To the OP, since its been almost a week now I hope you come back and tell us about your experience with keto so far! Its great that you and your husband are doing this together...seems like it can be a little easier when more than one person in the household is on board. Hopefully you are both successful and are able to work your way towards better health!
Thank you so much. We have both lost 5 pounds in the first 5 days. We aren’t super strict, more so making sure we are staying under calories and just keeping the carbs down by being more aware of what we are putting in our mouth. There’s a lot of strong opinions on the thread. Everyone bickering because they “have been on this site x years” and everyone always knows more than everyone else. Pretty funny I got called “new”. I’ve been a member since 2009. For the first 6 years I logged on religiously and did very well. I got divorced, remarried, life happened and things changed. Now I want to start over again and work on me and us. I appreciate you checking in with me and not adding to the bickering. 🤗
You're welcome...I'm glad to hear its going well so far! I'll be the first to admit I'm no expert on everything, nor am I a perfect shining example of any "right way" to lose weight, outside of the calorie deficit part. (I've been on here a long time for a reason...because I struggle too, even after all this time!) To me, the right way is the way that works for you and helps you stick with it, whatever that means for you. Honestly, I think a lot of people here agree with that, too, as obviously there are a lot of different viewpoints!
As for the community, I know sometimes there is bickering over semantics in threads that can be off-putting, but there are also diamonds in the rough. There are some wonderful people who really want to be helpful, and I hope that you can gain wisdom from them as much as I have. (I know you said you've been around awhile..wasnt sure how much you'd dipped into the forums)
I never actually answered your OP question...I've never done keto myself, but I attempted low carb for about two weeks and realized that I was going nowhere fast. Lol If you don't have them, though, I would recommend checking out the South Beach cookbooks from your local library. They have some great recipe ideas and many low carb options. I actually learned that I love mashed cauliflower almost as much as mashed potatoes, and it's just as easy to make!
Anyway, good luck and good health!2 -
Op, you can also check out this group.
https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/group/394-low-carber-daily-forum3
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