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Are harsh straightforward reality checks good?

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13

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  • Xellercin
    Xellercin Posts: 924 Member
    edited June 2022
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    I wish someone had, but to be honest, one doc said something dismissive to me and it did really get me thinking. I asked about my weight (don't think I was at my biggest but obviously overweight) and he was healthy and thin and said something like, "I'm sure heart disease will eventually kill you, like the majority of us...".

    I was kind of looking for a prod or something to tell me to lose the weight and get in better shape. Nothing.

    I have a feeling that many docs are just so jaded at this point because they see so many people that either get easily offended or flat out won't listen, so why bother.

    My present doctor (who I started seeing after I lost the weight and got in pretty good shape) only sees patients that take initiative and work to keep healthy. He will literally drop you as a patient if you're a "give me a pill to fix me" type of patient. He told me he nearly stopped practicing prior to opening up his own practice. Told me about a patient that was Type II Diabetic and he counseled that patient that he should give up all the soda he was drinking or he could lose his leg. The patient said, "take the leg, you're not taking my soda...". WTF!

    I can imagine being a doc these days or a nutritional counselor is trying to say the least. My Daughter is dating a guy going to Medical school. Super nice guy, but I'm thinking, why would you want to?

    I agree that your doctor should be straightforward about your weight. There is actually a whole thread on this topic a few threads down from here called "Does your doctor comment on your weight". It's your doctor's job to help you monitor your health, and maintaining a healthy weight is a big part of that. I'm not sure why people get offended when their doctor brings it up.

    However, the OP of this thread was lamenting that no one in his life (friends, family) had said anything. I don't think most people would react well to those types of unsolicited comments.

    People get offended when you tell them their blood pressure is high or that they need to take their meds as prescribed.

    Generally people are quite stressed about their own health, scared, and not usually in the most open, emotionally receptive state in a medical environment. That's why we call it "white coat syndrome."

    Overall, people can only receive information they are prepared to receive. That's why there's an entire discipline out there design to recognize and help move people through states of readiness.

    The most resourceful doctors take the time to study how to do this.
  • ninerbuff
    ninerbuff Posts: 48,745 Member
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    As a trainer, I have to be harsh and straight forward many times. I mean, that's what they hired me for.........accountability and assistance. I'll always use the approach of positive re enforcent first and foremost, but if they are complaining about lack of progress, then I have to be upfront and honest and not really worry too much about feelings, but giving them logical reasoning as to why they aren't reaching expectations.
    No one likes to hear about their short comings. But many times people are unaware of them and they never get fixed.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

    9285851.png
  • wunderkindking
    wunderkindking Posts: 1,615 Member
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    ninerbuff wrote: »
    As a trainer, I have to be harsh and straight forward many times. I mean, that's what they hired me for.........accountability and assistance. I'll always use the approach of positive re enforcent first and foremost, but if they are complaining about lack of progress, then I have to be upfront and honest and not really worry too much about feelings, but giving them logical reasoning as to why they aren't reaching expectations.
    No one likes to hear about their short comings. But many times people are unaware of them and they never get fixed.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

    9285851.png

    If someone hired you to do it, they literally know their primary shortcoming - that they need someone else to point out what they're doing wrong because they don't see it.

    This is markedly different than aunt Sally taking the opportunity to tell someone their fat.
  • Hiawassee88
    Hiawassee88 Posts: 35,754 Member
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    ninerbuff wrote: »
    As a trainer, I have to be harsh and straight forward many times. I mean, that's what they hired me for.........accountability and assistance. I'll always use the approach of positive reinforcement first and foremost, but if they are complaining about lack of progress, then I have to be upfront and honest and not really worry too much about feelings, but giving them logical reasoning as to why they aren't reaching expectations.
    No one likes to hear about their short comings. But many times people are unaware of them and they never get fixed.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

    9285851.png

    Right on the money because logical reasoning is not harsh straightforward reality. There's a big difference. Who's reality? Harsh anything is usually mean and nasty without any filters. People won't go back for more of that.
  • loafylaw
    loafylaw Posts: 1 Member
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    This is something I struggle with. My daughter is very overweight and I say nothing. She sometimes says she is fat and I just say something like “I know it is frustrating when you want to lose and can’t” or I just say nothing. I don’t deny it but I see no reason to affirm what she knows. I am never sure of the right thing to say.
  • Xellercin
    Xellercin Posts: 924 Member
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    loafylaw wrote: »
    This is something I struggle with. My daughter is very overweight and I say nothing. She sometimes says she is fat and I just say something like “I know it is frustrating when you want to lose and can’t” or I just say nothing. I don’t deny it but I see no reason to affirm what she knows. I am never sure of the right thing to say.

    Could you ask a child psychologist how best to handle this?
  • SuzySunshine99
    SuzySunshine99 Posts: 2,987 Member
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    Xellercin wrote: »
    loafylaw wrote: »
    This is something I struggle with. My daughter is very overweight and I say nothing. She sometimes says she is fat and I just say something like “I know it is frustrating when you want to lose and can’t” or I just say nothing. I don’t deny it but I see no reason to affirm what she knows. I am never sure of the right thing to say.

    Could you ask a child psychologist how best to handle this?

    I'm assuming her daughter is an adult, not a child.
    It doesn't sound like her daughter is in denial about her weight, so the mother is correct in staying neutral unless asked for help.
  • wunderkindking
    wunderkindking Posts: 1,615 Member
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    I. I think your cause and effect is wrong on the Japan example.

    It's normal to say something bluntly because it's rare.

    It isn't rare because it's called out.

    It's rare because they have a very different diet and lifestyle culturally.
  • fitmattnotfatmatt
    fitmattnotfatmatt Posts: 23 Member
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    RaquelFit2 wrote: »
    Every once in a while I need a "straightforward reality check." But when someone offers one make sure you feel it's valid. People can have their own agendas and tell you something that isn't reality based.

    In January, mom said I was "fat" and better lose weight NOW. I needed that push. Too much pushing and I'll get aggravated. "Tough love," in moderation, helps me.

    I agree with this. A straightforward push is sometimes necessary but you need to be in the headspace to receive it. Otherwise I feel that I just dig in deeper.
  • Hiawassee88
    Hiawassee88 Posts: 35,754 Member
    edited July 2022
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    @fitmattnotfatmatt Understood and appreciated. I'd take logical reasoning from a trainer or fitness pro before I'd take it from a close family member. You just need more 'willpower' and other multi-crap that family members say to one another. If they can't do it then I just tune them out. Show me or all of the blather in the world won't convince me. Anyone can hide behind words but the results don't lie.
  • fitmattnotfatmatt
    fitmattnotfatmatt Posts: 23 Member
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    A family member's motives are different. They might be surprised or worried about your general well-being. A trainer is going to talk about what goals and objectives do you have and are decisions being made to get closer or further away from them. If a trainer tells me, that's not getting you close to your goal and look here's objective data to support it i.e. weight/measurements, that's pretty straightforward and correct. Sometimes, when you get close to some trainers, they want it almost as bad as you do and they get frustrated when you aren't in alignment with that.
  • fitmattnotfatmatt
    fitmattnotfatmatt Posts: 23 Member
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    @fitmattnotfatmatt Understood and appreciated. I'd take logical reasoning from a trainer or fitness pro before I'd take it from a close family member. You just need more 'willpower' and other multi-crap that family members say to one another. If they can't do it then I just tune them out. Show me or all of the blather in the world won't convince me.

    Interesting thing about willpower, it is an exhaustible resource for people. You need to switch it up to replenish it otherwise you run out until you give your decision making a rest.
  • Hiawassee88
    Hiawassee88 Posts: 35,754 Member
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    @fitmattnotfatmatt 🤠 Motivation and willpower are limited resources. Momentum will take you much further down the road than those two ever will. Got constant stops and restarts? Constantly restarting causes burnout.

    We don't need a new beginning and there's no such thing as the Finish Line. Our very next meal is our new beginning. There's always another meal coming around the corner. I'm never starting over again and I mean it. Long term weight stability requires focus until new cognitive behavior skills take hold. It doesn't happen overnight and it might take more than two years. They take longer than 21 days or 6 weeks.

    If you can't hold onto it then I'm not interested. I've had enough temporary bandaids to last me a lifetime. Show me the results and show me the way. I simply haven't got the time for anything else.
  • fitmattnotfatmatt
    fitmattnotfatmatt Posts: 23 Member
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    @fitmattnotfatmatt 🤠 Motivation and willpower are limited resources. Momentum will take you much further down the road than those two ever will. Got constant stops and restarts? Constantly restarting causes burnout.

    We don't need a new beginning and there's no such thing as the Finish Line. Our very next meal is our new beginning. There's always another meal coming around the corner. I'm never starting over again and I mean it. Long term weight stability requires focus until new cognitive behavior skills take hold. It doesn't happen overnight and it might take more than two years. They take longer than 21 days or 6 weeks.

    If you can't hold onto it then I'm not interested. I've had enough temporary bandaids to last me a lifetime. Show me the results and show me the way. I simply haven't got the time for anything else.

    I can learn a lot from you!
  • Hiawassee88
    Hiawassee88 Posts: 35,754 Member
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    @fitmattnotfatmatt I've been sitting outside in my rig because there's another major storm. I might have to make a run for it....more roads washing out. I was thinking about this the entire time.

    Matt, I'm a brat. 🤣 I can't handle anymore diets or another temporary fix. I drew my line in the sand and I stand firm. It saddens me to see others work so hard and then eat it all back. I have empathy and compassion for them but that's why others are paid to help pull them back UP. I find it exhausting.

    I came here to find the holy grail and antidote to dieting blather and foaming at the mouth about weight. I found it, I really did. Two words. Portion control. Learning how to moderate portions while enjoying every food you love is the pathway to long term weight stability.

    That's all I've ever wanted and anyone can have it. I found some mentors here that have shown me the way. They're real and too legit to quit. It sounds so simple but it's not always easy. Finely tuned marketing has messed with our heads. It took me a long time to unwind that thinking. I lingered long on childhood when we never gave a thought to the meals placed before us. We were too busy enjoying our school career and friends to worry about every morsel we ate. No one was dieting or suffering with angst over their food portions.

    I wanted that back and come hell or high water, no one will take it from me ever again. I'll be in my rig if you need me.
  • Hiawassee88
    Hiawassee88 Posts: 35,754 Member
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    @fitmattnotfatmatt 🌲 I believe in taking what we need from a bunch of different sources. If it doesn't come naturally, we need to continue using the cattle prod on ourselves. The minute we give up the fight, it's human nature to start coasting. We fall back on our insight based awareness which is not the whole picture. No one has all of the answers.

    Empathetic friends, a coach or witness can hold space while we gain clarity for reaching our goals. They can offer us insightful reflections. No one has to live in our body. We all need to feel safe inside of our bodies.

    When someone is harsh, our bodies and minds shut down. We go into sympathetic overdrive with harsh criticism. Harsh anything creates another disconnect for the brain. Feeling alone during the weight loss process is lonely. Moving positively away from self-loathing and self-criticism is the most security promoting thing we can do.

    Daily living is hard enough without having to choose between 'who I am' and 'who others want me to be'. Our brains abandon ship during distress. We have to keep fighting the good fight.

    My brain is good at winging it and I love to fly by the seat of my pants. Detailed plans and programs make me laugh like a hyena. 😂 It's a good thing I don't work at NASA. I'd figure out a way to bring 'em home but it probably wouldn't be in a straight line.

    Matt. I believe we need to make everything uniquely ours. We need to believe it's our idea and take what works for us. Use it. Own it. Fight for it.
  • ninerbuff
    ninerbuff Posts: 48,745 Member
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    ninerbuff wrote: »
    As a trainer, I have to be harsh and straight forward many times. I mean, that's what they hired me for.........accountability and assistance. I'll always use the approach of positive reinforcement first and foremost, but if they are complaining about lack of progress, then I have to be upfront and honest and not really worry too much about feelings, but giving them logical reasoning as to why they aren't reaching expectations.
    No one likes to hear about their short comings. But many times people are unaware of them and they never get fixed.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

    9285851.png

    Right on the money because logical reasoning is not harsh straightforward reality. There's a big difference. Who's reality? Harsh anything is usually mean and nasty without any filters. People won't go back for more of that.
    Well I've had clients where I've had to tell them that if they don't get their *kitten* into the gym regularly and work on their fitness and losing the excess poundage they need to, they're likely not going to be around in a few years. But that's about as harsh as it gets.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

    9285851.png
  • Xellercin
    Xellercin Posts: 924 Member
    edited July 2022
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    ninerbuff wrote: »
    ninerbuff wrote: »
    As a trainer, I have to be harsh and straight forward many times. I mean, that's what they hired me for.........accountability and assistance. I'll always use the approach of positive reinforcement first and foremost, but if they are complaining about lack of progress, then I have to be upfront and honest and not really worry too much about feelings, but giving them logical reasoning as to why they aren't reaching expectations.
    No one likes to hear about their short comings. But many times people are unaware of them and they never get fixed.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

    9285851.png

    Right on the money because logical reasoning is not harsh straightforward reality. There's a big difference. Who's reality? Harsh anything is usually mean and nasty without any filters. People won't go back for more of that.
    Well I've had clients where I've had to tell them that if they don't get their *kitten* into the gym regularly and work on their fitness and losing the excess poundage they need to, they're likely not going to be around in a few years. But that's about as harsh as it gets.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

    9285851.png

    Same. I've told patients incredibly harsh things to get them to snap out of complacency.

    However, we are professionals they are paying for our advice. By default it's expected that what we say is for the benefit of the person paying us.

    Even then, if we are good at our jobs, we don't use such harshness unless we've assessed that the dynamic will benefit from it.

    As I said from the beginning, it all comes down to the context and what the listener perceives as the intent of the message.

    If my PT says I need to get my sh--+ together and do my exercises or else I'm going to end up looking like Quasimodo with a full on hunch back by the time I'm 50, I know she's looking out for me.

    If Karen from finance says that to me, she can shove it because no one asked her opinion.
  • burtonv3
    burtonv3 Posts: 4 Member
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    No. It doesn't help and it isnt a random strangers business. Generally people lose weight when they have the resources to support them.
  • Hiawassee88
    Hiawassee88 Posts: 35,754 Member
    edited July 2022
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    @ninerbuff The appreciation is on my side of the table. There ain't nothin' harsh about you. We're lucky to have your knowledge. I've learned a great deal from you. Truth.

    I have a close relative who's really harsh. He lived during the LBJohnson years. He calls the women in our family, LBJ's. Lard Bu## J's. He'll tell any of them, I see you've really larded UP, again. Harsh. He's a real dream at family reunions.

    Trouble is, he's in great shape and he practices what he preaches. At his age, his doctors say they haven't seen anyone like him. He's pretty, too. Handsome sonuvagun.