Learn What it means to "Eat Clean"
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um folks, I thought the whole point of MFP was to encourage others along their journey to better health. Clearly there are differing opinions on this post, but I think folks need to take a step back and be kinder. just consider the impact of cutting words
Good advice, but is your jam "clean"?0 -
I've just never seen someone provide the advice of "eat what you want as long as it fits your macros" without mentioning/explaining the IIFYM philosophy and reminding them to stay under/at their calorie goal.
Not sure if serious.
Yes, I was being serious. I didn't mean to imply that those posts have NEVER happened- just that I haven't seen any. I can't imagine there are too many people who coach others to pay a bunch of attention to macros, but to disregard caloric intake.0 -
I've just never seen someone provide the advice of "eat what you want as long as it fits your macros" without mentioning/explaining the IIFYM philosophy and reminding them to stay under/at their calorie goal.
Not sure if serious.
Yes, I was being serious. I didn't mean to imply that those posts have NEVER happened- just that I haven't seen any. I can't imagine there are too many people who coach others to pay a bunch of attention to macros, but to disregard caloric intake.
If they are meeting their macros their calories should fall in line. It's the part about not just eating junk they leave out. In fact, some seem dead set on wanting others to think they eat mostly junk.0 -
I've just never seen someone provide the advice of "eat what you want as long as it fits your macros" without mentioning/explaining the IIFYM philosophy and reminding them to stay under/at their calorie goal.
Not sure if serious.
Yes, I was being serious. I didn't mean to imply that those posts have NEVER happened- just that I haven't seen any. I can't imagine there are too many people who coach others to pay a bunch of attention to macros, but to disregard caloric intake.
If they are meeting their macros their calories should fall in line. It's the part about not just eating junk they leave out. In fact, some seem dead set on wanting others to think they eat mostly junk.
I still don't recall seeing any posts telling people that they should eat mostly junk, or telling people that they eat mostly junk. The posts I've seen are all about moderation, saying things like "I don't deprive myself of things that I like if it fits into my day".
But, I digress. Clearly we have experienced different types of posts on the forums.0 -
I've just never seen someone provide the advice of "eat what you want as long as it fits your macros" without mentioning/explaining the IIFYM philosophy and reminding them to stay under/at their calorie goal.
Not sure if serious.
Yes, I was being serious. I didn't mean to imply that those posts have NEVER happened- just that I haven't seen any. I can't imagine there are too many people who coach others to pay a bunch of attention to macros, but to disregard caloric intake.
If they are meeting their macros their calories should fall in line. It's the part about not just eating junk they leave out. In fact, some seem dead set on wanting others to think they eat mostly junk.
That's the impression I got reading several posts. It took an 'argument' about eating 'healthy' foods to find out what IIFYM really means.0 -
I have never seen any pro-iifym person say any of the following:
As opposed to the donut patrol? who feels the need to launch into EVERY "clean eating" thread and go on and on about donuts and pizza (I eat pizza, btw)?How can you tell someone is a "Clean Eater"?
Don't worry - they'll tell you.
The "iifym" crowd is just as sanctimonious by and large as the "clean eaters".
In the end, it all comes to personal preference, and to what EACH OF US thinks will sustain us for life, as well as what is sustainable by us.
IIFYM may work great as a lifestyle approach for some. And so-called "clean eating" (I hate that term) may work for others. It works for me. I've been at maintenance for 12 years.
-you will get cancer
-wait until you're 70
-my way is the only way anyone can be healthy
However, "clean eating" discussions always devlove into those completely baseless assertions, which are always made from the same 'side.'
Funny, I have never heard any of those statements from this OP nor read them on any other 'clean eating' threads.
You obviously didn't read the threads where several posters were bashing jonnythan. Their belief (and what sadly sounded like hope) that he would be sick when he gets older was pathetic.0 -
I've just never seen someone provide the advice of "eat what you want as long as it fits your macros" without mentioning/explaining the IIFYM philosophy and reminding them to stay under/at their calorie goal.
Not sure if serious.
Yes, I was being serious. I didn't mean to imply that those posts have NEVER happened- just that I haven't seen any. I can't imagine there are too many people who coach others to pay a bunch of attention to macros, but to disregard caloric intake.
If they are meeting their macros their calories should fall in line. It's the part about not just eating junk they leave out. In fact, some seem dead set on wanting others to think they eat mostly junk.
I still don't recall seeing any posts telling people that they should eat mostly junk, or telling people that they eat mostly junk. The posts I've seen are all about moderation, saying things like "I don't deprive myself of things that I like if it fits into my day".
But, I digress. Clearly we have experienced different types of posts on the forums.
Or it's just that you already know what IIFYM means. And no, the posts don't say "eat mostly junk". They simply list all the fast food places they ate this week, all the ice cream they eat daily, post pics of 3000 calorie burgers or bacon ice cream and just leave it at that. No mention of the lean meats or vegetables they also had. No mention that these are the minority and not the staples of their diet. It's the perception they project. Some when pressed about needing fruits and vegetables for vitamins will only say "take a multi-vitamin" as if they never eat them. Why do this? What is the point?
ETA: Sorry, I don't expect you to have the answer since I wasn't talking about you. I just don't get it.0 -
I've just never seen someone provide the advice of "eat what you want as long as it fits your macros" without mentioning/explaining the IIFYM philosophy and reminding them to stay under/at their calorie goal.
Not sure if serious.
Yes, I was being serious. I didn't mean to imply that those posts have NEVER happened- just that I haven't seen any. I can't imagine there are too many people who coach others to pay a bunch of attention to macros, but to disregard caloric intake.
If they are meeting their macros their calories should fall in line. It's the part about not just eating junk they leave out. In fact, some seem dead set on wanting others to think they eat mostly junk.
I still don't recall seeing any posts telling people that they should eat mostly junk, or telling people that they eat mostly junk. The posts I've seen are all about moderation, saying things like "I don't deprive myself of things that I like if it fits into my day".
But, I digress. Clearly we have experienced different types of posts on the forums.
Or it's just that you already know what IIFYM means. And no, the posts don't say "eat mostly junk". They simply list all the fast food places they ate this week, all the ice cream they eat daily, post pics of 3000 calorie burgers or bacon ice cream and just leave it at that. No mention of the lean meats or vegetables they also had. No mention that these are the minority and not the staples of their diet. It's the perception they project. Some when pressed about needing fruits and vegetables for vitamins will only say "take a multi-vitamin" as if they never eat them. Why do this? What is the point?
ETA: Sorry, I don't expect you to have the answer since I wasn't talking about you. I just don't get it.
I think their point is that you don't have to deny food you love in order to be fit and healthy. As well, many of the IIFYM people also have open diaries so if one really wanted to know what their complete dietary intake was, it only takes a few minutes.0 -
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I've just never seen someone provide the advice of "eat what you want as long as it fits your macros" without mentioning/explaining the IIFYM philosophy and reminding them to stay under/at their calorie goal.
Not sure if serious.
Yes, I was being serious. I didn't mean to imply that those posts have NEVER happened- just that I haven't seen any. I can't imagine there are too many people who coach others to pay a bunch of attention to macros, but to disregard caloric intake.
If they are meeting their macros their calories should fall in line. It's the part about not just eating junk they leave out. In fact, some seem dead set on wanting others to think they eat mostly junk.
I still don't recall seeing any posts telling people that they should eat mostly junk, or telling people that they eat mostly junk. The posts I've seen are all about moderation, saying things like "I don't deprive myself of things that I like if it fits into my day".
But, I digress. Clearly we have experienced different types of posts on the forums.
Or it's just that you already know what IIFYM means. And no, the posts don't say "eat mostly junk". They simply list all the fast food places they ate this week, all the ice cream they eat daily, post pics of 3000 calorie burgers or bacon ice cream and just leave it at that. No mention of the lean meats or vegetables they also had. No mention that these are the minority and not the staples of their diet. It's the perception they project. Some when pressed about needing fruits and vegetables for vitamins will only say "take a multi-vitamin" as if they never eat them. Why do this? What is the point?
ETA: Sorry, I don't expect you to have the answer since I wasn't talking about you. I just don't get it.
I think their point is that you don't have to deny food you love in order to be fit and healthy. As well, many of the IIFYM people also have open diaries so if one really wanted to know what their complete dietary intake was, it only takes a few minutes.
Having at one time been one who had never heard the term IIFYM, they don't make their point well.0 -
I've just never seen someone provide the advice of "eat what you want as long as it fits your macros" without mentioning/explaining the IIFYM philosophy and reminding them to stay under/at their calorie goal.
Not sure if serious.
Yes, I was being serious. I didn't mean to imply that those posts have NEVER happened- just that I haven't seen any. I can't imagine there are too many people who coach others to pay a bunch of attention to macros, but to disregard caloric intake.
If they are meeting their macros their calories should fall in line. It's the part about not just eating junk they leave out. In fact, some seem dead set on wanting others to think they eat mostly junk.
I still don't recall seeing any posts telling people that they should eat mostly junk, or telling people that they eat mostly junk. The posts I've seen are all about moderation, saying things like "I don't deprive myself of things that I like if it fits into my day".
But, I digress. Clearly we have experienced different types of posts on the forums.
Or it's just that you already know what IIFYM means. And no, the posts don't say "eat mostly junk". They simply list all the fast food places they ate this week, all the ice cream they eat daily, post pics of 3000 calorie burgers or bacon ice cream and just leave it at that. No mention of the lean meats or vegetables they also had. No mention that these are the minority and not the staples of their diet. It's the perception they project. Some when pressed about needing fruits and vegetables for vitamins will only say "take a multi-vitamin" as if they never eat them. Why do this? What is the point?
ETA: Sorry, I don't expect you to have the answer since I wasn't talking about you. I just don't get it.
I think, honestly, most people who post the pictures/gifs/etc do it in jest. I would assume those people simply believe that everyone on this site can infer that eating complete and utter junk as their only food source isn't healthy. I haven't seen anything as of yet regarding the "take a vitamin" bit, but obviously that's not something that I agree with (and I highly doubt anyone who talks about IIFYM in a serious/helpful manner would agree with it either).
There's a negative perception about clean eating too, though, and I guess that's my point. It's spoken about in a way that implies as long as you eat clean, you won't gain weight, which I think we both know isn't true.
I think clean eating threads take a harder beating than IIFYM threads because "eating clean" is such a vague term.
Edited for clarification.0 -
Yes, I agree. It was seeing the open diaries of the IIFYM'ers that helped me a great deal when I first started here. I thought I had to give up everything I loved under the misconception that it wasn't 'healthy' i.e. low fat, low sodium, organic... whatever. I couldn't believe they could go to McDonalds and/or eat ice cream and still meet their goals. It was a revelation for me and learning about that kind of moderation has helped me stay on the wagon this time. Also, IIFYM has clear guidelines, whereas 'clean' eating has as many definitions as it does followers, so the former is just simpler and more sustainable, IMO.I've just never seen someone provide the advice of "eat what you want as long as it fits your macros" without mentioning/explaining the IIFYM philosophy and reminding them to stay under/at their calorie goal.
Not sure if serious.
Yes, I was being serious. I didn't mean to imply that those posts have NEVER happened- just that I haven't seen any. I can't imagine there are too many people who coach others to pay a bunch of attention to macros, but to disregard caloric intake.
If they are meeting their macros their calories should fall in line. It's the part about not just eating junk they leave out. In fact, some seem dead set on wanting others to think they eat mostly junk.
I still don't recall seeing any posts telling people that they should eat mostly junk, or telling people that they eat mostly junk. The posts I've seen are all about moderation, saying things like "I don't deprive myself of things that I like if it fits into my day".
But, I digress. Clearly we have experienced different types of posts on the forums.
Or it's just that you already know what IIFYM means. And no, the posts don't say "eat mostly junk". They simply list all the fast food places they ate this week, all the ice cream they eat daily, post pics of 3000 calorie burgers or bacon ice cream and just leave it at that. No mention of the lean meats or vegetables they also had. No mention that these are the minority and not the staples of their diet. It's the perception they project. Some when pressed about needing fruits and vegetables for vitamins will only say "take a multi-vitamin" as if they never eat them. Why do this? What is the point?
ETA: Sorry, I don't expect you to have the answer since I wasn't talking about you. I just don't get it.
I think their point is that you don't have to deny food you love in order to be fit and healthy. As well, many of the IIFYM people also have open diaries so if one really wanted to know what their complete dietary intake was, it only takes a few minutes.0 -
Most people I hear on MFP are concerned, understandably, with weight management. Few are specialists in cancer treatment, management of diabetes, cardiac disease, etc. But preventing and dealing with those diseases contribute to my overall concept of healthy eating. (They've hit my family particularly hard in the past.) So, I guess I am interested in a larger view of nutrition than just weight loss.
I know enough about nutrition to know that I cannot parse all the scientific literature on the subject. For lack of any more reliable source I tend to pay attention to what institutions like the U.S. National Institutes of Health and the U.S. National Cancer Institute have to say about nutrition. Their recommendations contribute to the formation of the standard of care throughout the country. To wit:
U.S. National Cancer Institute's page on Nutrition in Cancer Care
http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/pdq/supportivecare/nutrition/Patient/page1
U.S. National Institute of Health's page on Nutrition in the care of Cardiac Illness
http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/002436.htm
American Heart Association's page on nutrition
http://www.heart.org/HEARTORG/GettingHealthy/NutritionCenter/HealthyDietGoals/Healthy-Diet-Goals_UCM_310436_SubHomePage.jsp
I'm not sure I trust these guys either. I just mistrust them less than any other source I can find at the moment. In any case, if you find that the recommendations of the above institutions are incorrect, I urge you to contact them directly and set them straight.0 -
Most people I hear on MFP are concerned, understandably, with weight management. Few are specialists in cancer treatment, management of diabetes, cardiac disease, etc. But preventing and dealing with those diseases contribute to my overall concept of healthy eating. (They've hit my family particularly hard in the past.) So, I guess I am interested in a larger view of nutrition than just weight loss.
I know enough about nutrition to know that I cannot parse all the scientific literature on the subject. For lack of any more reliable source I tend to pay attention to what institutions like the U.S. National Institutes of Health and the U.S. National Cancer Institute have to say about nutrition. Their recommendations contribute to the formation of the standard of care throughout the country. To wit:
U.S. National Cancer Institute's page on Nutrition in Cancer Care
http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/pdq/supportivecare/nutrition/Patient/page1
U.S. National Institute of Health's page on Nutrition in the care of Cardiac Illness
http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/002436.htm
American Heart Association's page on nutrition
http://www.heart.org/HEARTORG/GettingHealthy/NutritionCenter/HealthyDietGoals/Healthy-Diet-Goals_UCM_310436_SubHomePage.jsp
I'm not sure I trust these guys either. I just mistrust them less than any other source I can find at the moment. In any case, if you find that the recommendations of the above institutions are incorrect, I urge you to contact them directly and set them straight.
Ok, I didn't read all the links.
But, from the Cancer Care page
" A healthy diet includes eating and drinking enough of the foods and liquids that have the important nutrients (vitamins, minerals, protein, carbohydrates, fat, and water) the body needs."
Fits nicely in with IIFYM guidelines, right?
Nothing specific about clean eating though.0 -
Clean eating is a subjective turn thrown around by different followers of whatever crazy fitness phenom is current. I just eat to meat my nutrient goals.0
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I agree IIFYM gives you pretty clear guidelines. But I have yet to feel convinced that IIFYM and counting and measuring WILL be the answer for many folks in KEEPING THE WEIGHT OFF LONG TERM. Of course it will if folks do it forever. Is that sustainable? Time will tell.
I do believe that focusing on whole foods, and aiming for eating diet rich in fresh vegetables and fruits will. If that becomes a lifestyle. Which it did for me.
But yet, folks seem to mock that approach. Openly. My lifestyle was called "sad" on here recently. :laugh:
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See, here's what confuses me. There are people who have this approach and are obese and are not losing on it. So, unless you have a component that accounts for how much food people are eating, I don't see how this method would be better than IIFIYM for long-term maintenance. Unless you mean that you think people are more likely to stick to your method than they would to the constant tracking of IIFIYM, and that's obviously debatable unless/until someone does a study.
I mean, if you follow IIFIYM, you are guaranteed to maintain weight (barring medical, stress, yada) because you're regulating your calories and nutrition. If you aren't tracking, then you're not doing IIFIYM anymore, and it wasn't IIFIYM that didn't work.
If you follow your plan, a person could easily start eating more whole foods, stay heavy on the veggies and fruit and still gain weight.
I can only speak from my own experience, but it's near impossible for me to overeat with my focus on a mostly whole foods, plant based diet. For instance, today I broke my fast at noon with 2 servings of brown rice with mushrooms, bell peppers, onion and carrots mixed in. I was full for hours and it was around 350 calories. For supper I had 2 servings of beans with more veggies, diced olives and a spoonful of full fat sour cream.. Another 400ish calories and I'm stuffed. So for today I've had under 800 calories, feel full/no hunger at all, and I have no desire to eat anything else tonight. But yet my maintenance calorie goal is somewhere around 1,800 calories. I also did a brisk two mile walk after supper, so there's extra calories I'm supposed to add in. If anything since switching to this way of eating I've continued to lose weight, even though I'm in maintenance.
I tend to stick to 'ingredients' instead of pre-made items and I either make things from them (like a batch of raw apple muffins or a bean dish), or I eat them as is (fresh veggies are eaten raw or steamed etc). For me this way of eating has allowed me to maintain effortlessly, with no tracking.0 -
You should check out the book Wheat Belly. It talks about how wheat today is not as healthy as they market it to be. I started back on my clean eating after letting myself go the last 11 months cause of work stress and I'm on day 3 of no grains/sugar and have lost 6lbs but that's also cause I have a lot to lose. Eating clean can be hard sometimes cause I'm such a foodie!!I'd love to see what meal plans and recipes you have! Also, is wheat bread considered clean? I'm thinking not, right? Are only natural foods (one ingredient) considered "clean". I'm sure I sound like a tool, but hey, it's an honest question. lol0
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I can only speak from my own experience, but it's near impossible for me to overeat with my focus on a mostly whole foods, plant based diet. For instance, today I broke my fast at noon with 2 servings of brown rice with mushrooms, bell peppers, onion and carrots mixed in. I was full for hours and it was around 350 calories. For supper I had 2 servings of beans with more veggies, diced olives and a spoonful of full fat sour cream.. Another 400ish calories and I'm stuffed. So for today I've had under 800 calories, feel full/no hunger at all, and I have no desire to eat anything else tonight. But yet my maintenance calorie goal is somewhere around 1,800 calories. I also did a brisk two mile walk after supper, so there's extra calories I'm supposed to add in. If anything since switching to this way of eating I've continued to lose weight, even though I'm in maintenance.
I tend to stick to 'ingredients' instead of pre-made items and I either make things from them (like a batch of raw apple muffins or a bean dish), or I eat them as is (fresh veggies are eaten raw or steamed etc). For me this way of eating has allowed me to maintain effortlessly, with no tracking.
750 calories a day is unhealthy no matter what you eat.0 -
You should check out the book Wheat Belly. It talks about how wheat today is not as healthy as they market it to be. I started back on my clean eating after letting myself go the last 11 months cause of work stress and I'm on day 3 of no grains/sugar and have lost 6lbs but that's also cause I have a lot to lose. Eating clean can be hard sometimes cause I'm such a foodie!!I'd love to see what meal plans and recipes you have! Also, is wheat bread considered clean? I'm thinking not, right? Are only natural foods (one ingredient) considered "clean". I'm sure I sound like a tool, but hey, it's an honest question. lol
Why would you suggest a work of fiction?0 -
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