Doctor Says Phentermine Long Term Not a Problem....Really?

PCOS_Gal

Am I bullying you? In what way? By continuing to post? Because I called your plan to make this thread span 3 years silly? I haven't expressed any manner of opinion about your Phen use or offered any manner of unwanted advice. Where does the bully aspects come in?

Again...any confusion...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyber-bullying

Achrya

Maybe. Sorry to say, I'm in for the long haul. But don't let that stop you, please.

Wow...that is so incredibly sad for you...

On what level? Are we not doing the exact same thing: enjoying a derailed thread? Why would that be sadder for me than for you?

What an odd statement.

That you have committed yourself in it for the "long haul" as you put it....very sad...it isn't even your OP....wow...just...WOW.

Do you get snarky, snide and smug with people on other discussion boards and "long haul" it with them...or just My Fit Pal? because...there are support groups in the way of discussion boards for that as well....just sayin....

Didn't you commit yourself to trying to make this the longest thread ever, running for 3 years? Again, you're doing the same thing I am. Is your stance that being the OP gives you magical protection from your perception of "sad"?

How curious.

And yes, I also frequent video game forums when I have time. I find people interesting and people are truly themselves when anonymous on the internet. It's the best place to people watch and provoke honest response.

For example I'm clearly a sarcastic, mean, and snarky (but always honest) witch. My posting style makes that obvious.

Refer to the CG if you are confused....no provoking allowed...no snarky or mean allowed...we are suppose to play nice nice

Good thing I haven't been mean or snarky in a way the breaks the rules. At best you could say I'm further derailing a thread that the OP has already stated is derailed.

PikaKnight

Maybe. Sorry to say, I'm in for the long haul. But don't let that stop you, please.

Wow...that is so incredibly sad for you...

On what level? Are we not doing the exact same thing: enjoying a derailed thread? Why would that be sadder for me than for you?

What an odd statement.

That you have committed yourself in it for the "long haul" as you put it....very sad...it isn't even your OP....wow...just...WOW.

Do you get snarky, snide and smug with people on other discussion boards and "long haul" it with them...or just My Fit Pal? because...there are support groups in the way of discussion boards for that as well....just sayin....

Didn't you commit yourself to trying to make this the longest thread ever, running for 3 years? Again, you're doing the same thing I am. Is your stance that being the OP gives you magical protection from your perception of "sad"?

How curious.

And yes, I also frequent video game forums when I have time. I find people interesting and people are truly themselves when anonymous on the internet. It's the best place to people watch and provoke honest response.

For example I'm clearly a sarcastic, mean, and snarky (but always honest) witch. My posting style makes that obvious.

Refer to the CG if you are confused....no provoking allowed...no snarky or mean allowed...we are suppose to play nice nice

How is the drink game you set up NOT provoking? :huh:

Sarauk2sf

I don't know why you are asking for advice when you are going to do what you want to do anyway

And I am not going to post again...

Sarauk2sf

Ohai....

Achrya

Am I bullying you? In what way? By continuing to post? Because I called your plan to make this thread span 3 years silly? I haven't expressed any manner of opinion about your Phen use or offered any manner of unwanted advice. Where does the bully aspects come in?

Again...any confusion...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyber-bullying

So. What have I done with "intent to harm"?

PCOS_Gal

I don't know why you are asking for advice when you are going to do what you want to do anyway

And I am not going to post again...

Haha! FTW!

***Drink 4***

Sarauk2sf

Am I bullying you? In what way? By continuing to post? Because I called your plan to make this thread span 3 years silly? I haven't expressed any manner of opinion about your Phen use or offered any manner of unwanted advice. Where does the bully aspects come in?

Again...any confusion...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyber-bullying

http://www.stopbullying.gov/cyberbullying/what-is-it/

PCOS_Gal

Ohai....

ROTFLMBO!

***Drink 10***

1234terri

why ask for feedback when your mind is made up and you seem dead set on doing it no matter health effects-just go ahead and try it and let us know :-)

PCOS_Gal

Am I bullying you? In what way? By continuing to post? Because I called your plan to make this thread span 3 years silly? I haven't expressed any manner of opinion about your Phen use or offered any manner of unwanted advice. Where does the bully aspects come in?

Again...any confusion...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyber-bullying

So. What have I done with "intent to harm"?

Rule #1- Don't feed the Trolls

I am done feeding the Trolls

PCOS_Gal

why ask for feedback when your mind is made up and you seem dead set on doing it no matter health effects-just go ahead and try it and let us know :-)

*** Drink 4***

PikaKnight

Am I bullying you? In what way? By continuing to post? Because I called your plan to make this thread span 3 years silly? I haven't expressed any manner of opinion about your Phen use or offered any manner of unwanted advice. Where does the bully aspects come in?

Again...any confusion...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyber-bullying

So. What have I done with "intent to harm"?

Rule #1- Don't feed the Trolls

I am done feeding the Trolls

No one is trolling. The closest would actually be you.

smantha32

I wouldn't worry about the long term, I'd worry about it taking out my heart in the short term.

You only have 55lbs left to lose, easily do able even with PCOS. You simply need to eat slightly less than the average calorie deficit.

Edited to add: Cardiovascular side effects include palpitations, tachycardia, and elevation of blood pressure. In the central nervous system, it can cause overstimulation, restlessness, dizziness, insomnia, euphoria, dysphoria, tremor, and headache. Its gastrointestinal effects include dryness of the mouth, unpleasant taste, diarrhea, constipation, and other gastrointestinal disturbances. It may also cause allergic effects - urticaria and changes in libido.

Its less common, but more severe, side effects include:

Convulsions (seizures)
Fever
Hallucinations
Agitation and aggression
Bizarre behavior
Mental or mood changes
Exaggerated sense of well-being
Increased blood pressure
Severe or persistent light-headedness, fainting or headache
Periods of mania followed by period of depression
Fast or irregular heartbeat
Overactive reflexes
Tremors, trembling or shaking
Panic
Restlessness
Severe nausea, vomiting or diarrhea
Stomach cramps
Weakness
Constipation
Primary pulmonary hypertension
Regurgitant cardiac valvular disease
Pounding in the chest or shortness of breath

Being on any drug that can cause the above for any length of time cannot be a good thing.

I took it long term. I could only take half pills for one thing or I couldn't sleep at ALL.

I had heart palpitations, restlessness and dry mouth. It worked better for me as an appetite suppressant and I did develop a tolerance after awhile where it just stopped working, so it made no sense to keep taking it.
Also if I didn't also exercise while I was taking it, I never lost weight past the second week.

long story short: I've done just as well without it.

Achrya

Am I bullying you? In what way? By continuing to post? Because I called your plan to make this thread span 3 years silly? I haven't expressed any manner of opinion about your Phen use or offered any manner of unwanted advice. Where does the bully aspects come in?

Again...any confusion...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyber-bullying

So. What have I done with "intent to harm"?

Rule #1- Don't feed the Trolls

I am done feeding the Trolls

Hah.

I actually laughed out loud.

smantha32

I want to know if anyone can confirm using Phentermine as safe long term. I want to know if what this doctor is saying is accurate....as I stated in my OP.

there's all kinds of information out there that it's NOT safe to take it long term.

PCOS_Gal

I want to know if anyone can confirm using Phentermine as safe long term. I want to know if what this doctor is saying is accurate....as I stated in my OP.

there's all kinds of information out there that it's NOT safe to take it long term.

Never found any information about it being safe or unsafe long term other than the stated side effects...just that is was intended for short term use only. So if you have information about long term use (i.e. years) and effects...please share.

miller930

OP, I worked as a Pharmacy Technician for 15 years for a big chain Pharmacy, so I worked with between 15 and 20 Pharmacist over the years and I can honestly say that They all only recommended it for short term use only. That being said, new studies come out all the time and maybe Your Dr. is up on this or maybe He is misinformed. What I can suggest is to go to a couple of Your local Pharmacies and get a free Pharmacist consult at the window, which You can do regardless or not if You purchase Your prescriptions there. I may be biased but I've always believed that although Dr.'s can diagnose patients and write the prescriptions, a Pharmacist knows way better the cause and effects, and short or long term use of medications. Remember most Pharmacists today are Pharm D.'s which means they are Drs. too, only they dedicated their entire college years to studying chemicals and drugs in the human body not the illness or disease that would require them. I hope this help with Your question and Good Luck with Your Health and Goals.

EvgeniZyntx

Really, wasn't comparing Phentermine to aspirin. I was comparing how it is absurd to say I got X, Y ,Z from this drug when there is no statistically significant evidence to say otherwise. Aspirin was just a "For example"

Thanks for all the rest of the information on Aspirin though...I am sure someone will find it useful.

Additional Relevant to the UK and EU all surrounding the Fen-Phen (i.e bad heart valves) scare and why they pulled it...http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/710340.stm

Ah, but it was your example that was absurd.

If you are interested in the real reason for EU refusal of Phen - go to the source, EMA now publishes info on product reviews.

From the Qsiva filing.

Safety issues
Known adverse events with the use of phentermine are palpitations, tachycardia, elevation of blood
pressure, psychosis, CNS and gastrointestinal effects and with the use of topiramate paraesthesia, changes
in taste, ocular disorders, psychiatric and cognitive disorders. Many of these adverse events were also
reported with Qsiva as a fixed-dose combination of phentermine/topiramate in four pivotal Phase III studies
and two supportive Phase II studies. There was a dose-dependent increase in the incidence of depression
(3.8% in the mid dose group vs. 7.7% in the highest dose group, with 3.4% in the placebo group), anxiety
(4.8% vs. 7.9%, respectively, with 2.6% in the placebo group), insomnia (6.8% vs. 10.8%, respectively,
with 5.7% in the placebo group), paraesthesia (11.8% vs. 17.3%, respectively, with 1.2% in the placebo
group) and cognitive disorders (5.0% vs. 7.6%, respectively, with 1.5% in the placebo group; mainly
attention disturbances, memory impairment and language disorders). In the setting of long term use of this
product in a large population, the frequency of adverse psychiatric effects and their consequences, as well as
the cognitive effects, are unknown

.

Phentermine’s mechanism of action is of concern as it has sympathomimetic properties inducing cardiac stimulation and its use is associated with an increase in heart rate. It is only being approved for short term periods of treatment (less than three months) and its long term cardiac toxicity is unknown.

http://www.ema.europa.eu/docs/en_GB/document_library/Other/human/002350/WC500147577.pdf

As to your claim that there are no cardio cases, I can, really as last suggestion offer, the text from the label

there have been rare cases of PPH in patients who reportedly have taken phentermine alone.

The possible role of phentermine in the etiology of these valvulopathies has not been established and their course in individuals after the drugs are stopped is not known. The possibility of an association between valvular heart disease and the use of phentermine alone cannot be ruled out; there have been rare cases of valvular heart disease in patients who reportedly have taken phentermine alone.

So while I agree that it is highly unlikely to have a risk og heart disease, this is different from no cases.

Anyway, best of luck on your weight loss and quest for a doctor.

PS - Along with JoO there are another half dozen reputable journals around obesity and metabolism.

It is pointless continue to debate with you as you are ignoring all facts that I have stated (as well as glossing over the facts in your own cut and paste information) as well as forgoing all reason. You even ignored point blank the stated reason Phentermine was banned in the UK via my link and began to provide your own "Truth"...but I am learning people who do not like or believe in phentermine this is a running theme.... and the ideological debate will continue and those pesky things like facts will be overlooked for more visceral information like strongly stated judgements and opinions......That is what is truly absurd.

You posted a link to a BBC news opinion piece. I posted the actual EMA report and insert info. With regards to why it was banned in EU I would image the actual agency report is not cherry picking. It contains all the review info. If you truly want to discuss the UK decision, it would be my pleasure, but I think we are likely beyond that point, at least in this thread, but since I brought up EU legislation I stuck with that. The UK pharmaco-economics processes are actually very interesting and would suggest, for anyone interested to look up NICE and fourth barrier legislation.

And from the beginning I have stated that phen does have a role in some strategies for weight loss, it is less than ideal due to certain risks and I would only recommend it as a second choice (a recommendation that I understand doesn't concern you - as it's not only the opinion of a stranger on the Internet, and I fully agree with your approach - to ignore opinion) I've provided mostly the available info and facts from research studies were available and the fact that in the absence of long term studies, you are taking a risk on your DRs word, who is willing to prescribe off label. I'm sorry, but if anything I'm one of the likeliest posters here to take a information driven stance that tends to neutrality. You have received at no point any judgement from me about your person, the quality of your doctor (I actually do not even recommend you change doctors but that you discuss your concerns), or your choice.

The use of the word absurd was yours first. I do apologize if my bouncing it back is the cause of your upset.

Again, phen is a tool in an arsenal, it can be reasonably used, but long term success requires a methodological change in lifestyle and taking phen long term is outside of the indications, has potential unknown and unstudied risks.

If we had been talking about cholesterol drugs (in which I do have a vested interest that they be used - they provided a paycheck, in part) I would still take the same approach: indication and literature suggests that lifestyle change is both the first line of treatment and the lowest in risk incidence. Only on failure of lifestyle modification does it make sense to initiate treatment or at higher marker levels.

At this point, I do understand that you have made your point and I believe there is enough information for the casual reader interested in this to make their own decision and/or look for further information. With that, good luck, if you or others want more info from medical journals feel free to PM me. Pubmed and MESH can be a pain to navigate because medical keyword searches are sometimes very specific.

Cheers.

psuLemon

Thread is locked because its nothing but drama which violates rule 2 and its gone way off topic.


http://www.myfitnesspal.com/welcome/guidelines