Anyone else not believe in "starvation mode?"

FedUpFattie

I have a hard time swallowing this concept, especially for those of us who are obese. From what I've read, starvation mode only kicks in after you have lost more than 90% of your total fat storage in an effort to preserve what you have left, thus slowing down your metabolism. It would not make sense for the body to do this when fat storage is overly abundant. The purpose of having fat is for the body to use it in times of famine ( in our case, dieting), so why would our bodies suddenly hold onto the stored energy it needs to survive for the sake of survival itself?

There are many more aspects of this theory I find flawed, but I'd like to hear from others.

gmhaggie06

yes, it's not really a real thing. There was a great article about it somewhere, talked about the Holocaust and a Minnesota experiment among other sources. Basically said, if there was a "starvation" mode wouldn't you have seen photos of normal looking chubby people in concentration camps? You've got the gist of the argument, there is indeed some slowing of metabolism but to a much smaller degree than most people think, AND you have to be approaching level of base-body fat % to really get an effect from it.

erickirb

"Starvation Mode" is real, but many people that use the term don't really understand what it really is.

The body is always in a state of flux, but if your deficit is too large that your body cannot break down fat stores fast enough, then your body will begin to use muscle as fuel, as well as reducing non-life sustaining functions. This will effect hair, nails, skin, alertness, energy, etc. The result is a slightly lower BMR, meaning the deficit that you thought was 1000 cals/day, may really only be 800 or so, due to your body reacting to the large deficit to "preserve" itself. So the downside is a slower than expected weight loss.

There is also the issue of malnutrition, Many on VLCD do not get the required micro nutrients and over time can have negative health side effects.

_John_

He and the tooth fairy play cards with Santa and the Easter bunny every second Tuesday....

Peachygirl14

I do not believe in starvation mode.

Rather than starving yourself, eat something that is high in fiber and protein (rather than carbs) to keep you full. With this method, your will not feel hungry but your body will still burn that stored fat (instead of using the ones you are taking in and will not tell you to take in more carbs (which is turned to stored fat)

Fiber and protein are digested slower than carbs, especially simple carbs (which turns into stored fat). If your stomach is digesting nothing, it will send the signal to your brain that it is hungry. Remember that fat is used by our body to "maintain" itself. Kinda like a "thermostat". So if you eat more fiber and protein, your body will not go into "survival mode" and maintain the rate of metabolism, thus burning more of excess fat as compared when you are on starvation mode.

BrainyBurro

i'm violating my better judgement by not posting a funny cat gif here, but...

...read this and things will make more sense to you.

http://www.aworkoutroutine.com/starvation-mode/

prettyface55

I used to believe that it was real.. ( the way people here think it is) But I have met soo many people with amazing results from low calorie diets and they are all perfectly healthy and look amazing. i Also have read many articles on the forums here and I do not believe in it. I do believe how ever that If you eat anything below 1000 calories is just ridiculous and not sustainable in the long run and will set you up for failure.

inside_lap

yes, it's not really a real thing. There was a great article about it somewhere, talked about the Holocaust and a Minnesota experiment among other sources. Basically said, if there was a "starvation" mode wouldn't you have seen photos of normal looking chubby people in concentration camps? You've got the gist of the argument, there is indeed some slowing of metabolism but to a much smaller degree than most people think, AND you have to be approaching level of base-body fat % to really get an effect from it.

Yep. Starvation mode exists but it is not what people in most health forums THINK it is. Most people that talk about starvation mode on here have never read the original studies and have no idea what they are talking about.

Edit: For the record, I have read the original studies.

shining_light

Your body can't count calories. Doesn't matter if you're eating slightly below maintenance or actually starving; your RMR drops slightly. As I said, though, that's due to eating any amount below maintenance. Your metabolism can't just grind to a halt; your body just expends calories slightly more efficiently. This is why doctors prescribe obese patients VLC diets, because they know that their body still needs energy to function. We don't just suddenly start to photosynthesize in an effort to hold onto body fat. That doesn't make sense.

iplayoutside19

yes, it's not really a real thing. There was a great article about it somewhere, talked about the Holocaust and a Minnesota experiment among other sources. Basically said, if there was a "starvation" mode wouldn't you have seen photos of normal looking chubby people in concentration camps? You've got the gist of the argument, there is indeed some slowing of metabolism but to a much smaller degree than most people think, AND you have to be approaching level of base-body fat % to really get an effect from it.

Yep. Starvation mode exists but it is not what people in most health forums THINK it is. Most people that talk about starvation mode on here have never read the original studies and have no idea what they are talking about.

Exactly. Starvation Mode is a real thing. However, it's a misapplied concept to anyone is a western society. When I think starvation mode, I think concentration camp, walking across Siberia type stuff. Slowing motabolism because you've cut a few calories? In general terms, No.

kamalelwa

I for one do not believe hat starvation mode is the way to loose weight. It does more harm than god when you deprive yourself of the needed nutrients to be healthy--I have always felt that portion control is the way to go!!!! I am walking proof that it works!!!

Peachygirl14

I think many of these articles are too obsessed with calories rather than the ratio of carbs, protein and fiber.

if you eat more fiber than protein and even more less carbs, you will feel less hungry, thus allowing your body to use stored fat. And the starvation theory does not even make more sense especially given that eating fiber makes you feel more full in the longer period. You can make an experiment for one day. For a meal, eat only veggies and meat/fish and time how long it takes for you to feel hungry. Then take carb rich meal and time it too. You'll feel less hungry when you eat veggies and meat/fish over carb laden food.

I think the weight issue has more to do with "digestion". If your stomach is empty, the brain thinks you will need to eat regardless of the fat in your body and slows down metabolism. If you have something in your stomach that is digested slower, your brain won't think your body is starving.

FedUpFattie

Thanks for all the feedback. The reason I'm asking is because I am on a forum for people who have recently had weight loss surgery; in our case, the gastric sleeve. The sleeve is designed to make it impossible to consume large amounts of food, and in most cases more than 600 calories per day at the start unless you are pretty much eating Crisco from a spoon. Yet there are so many people who have had this surgery who are just weeks out screaming "starvation mode! Starvation mode! I have to get my calories up to 1200 or I'll DIE!!" No joke, someone actually said that. What's the point of the surgery, then?

Very frustrating to have so many misinformed people misinforming a new wave of people every time they begin weight loss attempts. I also don't think a warning about it belongs at the bottom of the myfitnesspal food diary page, but that's just me.

Peachygirl14

Just try keeping yourself "full" with lots of fiber and protein.

I'm not much of a calorie counter to be honest. I do listen though to my body and have in mind what my mom told me

Carbs are easily digested, hence you're hungry easily
Protein makes you less hungry than carbs
Fiber makes you less hungry than carbs and protein

I kept this in mind and lost some weight. Didnt really count calories. But in a few months, my jeans started fitting me again! Yay!

I think it's all about developing a more "proportioned" habit than always counting calories.

Eating small but frequent meals helps. It boosts your metabolism. Also eating more slowly rather than shoving more food in your mouth.


With the growing obesity worldwide, weight loss is a "good" business venture. So you really lots of this.

One thing to keep in mind, do not believe much of the marketing labels in food products. Low fat, protein bars, "weight watchers". Often times, they are loaded with HIDDEN SUGARS, which basically means, more carbs. Better to eat homecooked meals made from meat, veggies, etc.

If you're on a busy sched, what you can do is cook a lot on your free day and then store them in your ref or freezer and just reheat it when you need a quick meal.

TheSlorax

I think many of these articles are too obsessed with calories rather than the ratio of carbs, protein and fiber.

if you eat more fiber than protein and even more less carbs, you will feel less hungry, thus allowing your body to use stored fat. And the starvation theory does not even make more sense especially given that eating fiber makes you feel more full in the longer period. You can make an experiment for one day. For a meal, eat only veggies and meat/fish and time how long it takes for you to feel hungry. Then take carb rich meal and time it too. You'll feel less hungry when you eat veggies and meat/fish over carb laden food.

I think the weight issue has more to do with "digestion". If your stomach is empty, the brain thinks you will need to eat regardless of the fat in your body and slows down metabolism. If you have something in your stomach that is digested slower, your brain won't think your body is starving.

I'm not trying to be rude, but you do not understand what this thread is about. I would suggest reading the link above and coming back when you are more informed. helpful hint: they are not talking about hunger pangs.

Anxietea13

I don't believe it. I can fast for multiple days, not be hungry, and then get right back on it and lose weight. I don't think your body shuts down from lack of food if you're 150 pounds and up. Your body has more than enough to feed off of, therefor doesn't starve.

wheird

I think many of these articles are too obsessed with calories rather than the ratio of carbs, protein and fiber.

if you eat more fiber than protein and even more less carbs, you will feel less hungry, thus allowing your body to use stored fat. And the starvation theory does not even make more sense especially given that eating fiber makes you feel more full in the longer period. You can make an experiment for one day. For a meal, eat only veggies and meat/fish and time how long it takes for you to feel hungry. Then take carb rich meal and time it too. You'll feel less hungry when you eat veggies and meat/fish over carb laden food.

I think the weight issue has more to do with "digestion". If your stomach is empty, the brain thinks you will need to eat regardless of the fat in your body and slows down metabolism. If you have something in your stomach that is digested slower, your brain won't think your body is starving.

Not to pick on you, but this is a prime example of not understanding a process and spreading misinformation. "Starvation mode" has nothing to do with the feeling of hunger.

And yes, it does exist, but most people do not understand it.

Peachygirl14

I think many of these articles are too obsessed with calories rather than the ratio of carbs, protein and fiber.

if you eat more fiber than protein and even more less carbs, you will feel less hungry, thus allowing your body to use stored fat. And the starvation theory does not even make more sense especially given that eating fiber makes you feel more full in the longer period. You can make an experiment for one day. For a meal, eat only veggies and meat/fish and time how long it takes for you to feel hungry. Then take carb rich meal and time it too. You'll feel less hungry when you eat veggies and meat/fish over carb laden food.

I think the weight issue has more to do with "digestion". If your stomach is empty, the brain thinks you will need to eat regardless of the fat in your body and slows down metabolism. If you have something in your stomach that is digested slower, your brain won't think your body is starving.

It is related.

Your body does not necessarily burn fat when you are hungry. Your body burns more fat if you are less hungry and your stomach is filled with fiber.

Carbs are converted to stored fat.

Fat comes in many form. Carbs are converted to fat. Meat and fish contain their own fat. There are good and bad fats.

TheSlorax

I think many of these articles are too obsessed with calories rather than the ratio of carbs, protein and fiber.

if you eat more fiber than protein and even more less carbs, you will feel less hungry, thus allowing your body to use stored fat. And the starvation theory does not even make more sense especially given that eating fiber makes you feel more full in the longer period. You can make an experiment for one day. For a meal, eat only veggies and meat/fish and time how long it takes for you to feel hungry. Then take carb rich meal and time it too. You'll feel less hungry when you eat veggies and meat/fish over carb laden food.

I think the weight issue has more to do with "digestion". If your stomach is empty, the brain thinks you will need to eat regardless of the fat in your body and slows down metabolism. If you have something in your stomach that is digested slower, your brain won't think your body is starving.

It is related.

Your body does not necessarily burn fat when you are hungry. Your body burns more fat if you are less hungry and your stomach is filled with fiber.

Carbs are converted to stored fat.

Fat comes in many form. Carbs are converted to fat. Meat and fish contain their own fat. There are good and bad fats.

no. all wrong. sorry.

again, please read up on these concepts and come back when you are able to contribute to the actual subject at hand.

jennegan1

yes, it's not really a real thing. There was a great article about it somewhere, talked about the Holocaust and a Minnesota experiment among other sources. Basically said, if there was a "starvation" mode wouldn't you have seen photos of normal looking chubby people in concentration camps? You've got the gist of the argument, there is indeed some slowing of metabolism but to a much smaller degree than most people think, AND you have to be approaching level of base-body fat % to really get an effect from it.

Yep. Starvation mode exists but it is not what people in most health forums THINK it is. Most people that talk about starvation mode on here have never read the original studies and have no idea what they are talking about.

Exactly. Starvation Mode is a real thing. However, it's a misapplied concept to anyone is a western society. When I think starvation mode, I think concentration camp, walking across Siberia type stuff. Slowing motabolism because you've cut a few calories? In general terms, No.

What does walking across Siberia type stuff have to do with starvation mode?

ihad

This is a very well done write-up.

http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/1077746-starvation-mode-adaptive-thermogenesis-and-weight-loss

cwolfman13

In the context of how it is often used here on MFP, no....it is miss-used and not understood by most of the people who talk about it. You cannot for example put weight on while in a calorie deficit due to "starvation mode"...

That said, it is a real thing...

But really, the danger to VLCD, especially when done without supervision is a substantial lacking of nutrients. Most people who do this here on MFP, aren't under the supervision of a dietitian or other medical professional and know little to nothing about actual proper nutrition.

What is worse is that it is often some young female who maybe has 5-10 cosmetic fat Lbs to lose who are all over these boards severely under-eating and malnourishing themselves. There is a substantial difference in what is appropriate calorie consumption for someone who is morbidly obese vs someone who really just needs to go work on some body re-comp and that seems to get lost on a lot of these young girls and even older women here.

jennegan1

yes, it's not really a real thing. There was a great article about it somewhere, talked about the Holocaust and a Minnesota experiment among other sources. Basically said, if there was a "starvation" mode wouldn't you have seen photos of normal looking chubby people in concentration camps? You've got the gist of the argument, there is indeed some slowing of metabolism but to a much smaller degree than most people think, AND you have to be approaching level of base-body fat % to really get an effect from it.

Yep. Starvation mode exists but it is not what people in most health forums THINK it is. Most people that talk about starvation mode on here have never read the original studies and have no idea what they are talking about.

Exactly. Starvation Mode is a real thing. However, it's a misapplied concept to anyone is a western society. When I think starvation mode, I think concentration camp, walking across Siberia type stuff. Slowing motabolism because you've cut a few calories? In general terms, No.

What does walking across Siberia type stuff have to do with starvation mode?

I get what you are trying to say but you should mention the concentration camps in Siberia and other countries

Peachygirl14

From the article:

Most people’s definition of starvation mode goes something like this:

To lose weight, you need to consume less calories. BUT, if you consume TOO few calories, your metabolism slows down so much so that your body enters a state where weight loss stops completely.

---

And technically, fiberous food has less(not totally devoid of) calories right?

Enter the proportion of carbs, protein, and fiberous food.

And 1200 calories is not really bad or low unless you only get your calories from carb.

Peachygirl14

yes, it's not really a real thing. There was a great article about it somewhere, talked about the Holocaust and a Minnesota experiment among other sources. Basically said, if there was a "starvation" mode wouldn't you have seen photos of normal looking chubby people in concentration camps? You've got the gist of the argument, there is indeed some slowing of metabolism but to a much smaller degree than most people think, AND you have to be approaching level of base-body fat % to really get an effect from it.

Yep. Starvation mode exists but it is not what people in most health forums THINK it is. Most people that talk about starvation mode on here have never read the original studies and have no idea what they are talking about.

Exactly. Starvation Mode is a real thing. However, it's a misapplied concept to anyone is a western society. When I think starvation mode, I think concentration camp, walking across Siberia type stuff. Slowing motabolism because you've cut a few calories? In general terms, No.

What does walking across Siberia type stuff have to do with starvation mode?

I get what you are trying to say but you should mention the concentration camps in Siberia and other countries

Did the people in the Siberian camps eat protein and fiber or merely simple carbs?

dfeinblum

It's been proven to be a myth. That's why it's unbelievable.

Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minnesota_Starvation_Experiment

ndj1979

oh hello again starvation mode myth thread..

starvation mode from eating 1200 cals a day or skipping snack 23 out of 24 = NO

Starvation mode from eating zero calories for a prolonged period greater than 72 hours = YES

/end thread

ElizabethFuller

Me for one. Having watched my friend's daughter starve herself to almost skin and bone over a period of about a year I would say that there was no point when this poor little soul was "in starvation mode", "turning all the calories into fat" or "skinny fat".
If it was something that truelly occurs then famine in third world countries would be less fatal. Possibly just a first world condition.

Unknown

This content has been removed.

ndj1979

I for one do not believe hat starvation mode is the way to loose weight. It does more harm than god when you deprive yourself of the needed nutrients to be healthy--I have always felt that portion control is the way to go!!!! I am walking proof that it works!!!

ummm, not sure I understand this...

davert123

Here you go, this shows what the biological adaptive response commonly called "starvation mode" is

http://www.annualreviews.org/doi/abs/10.1146/annurev.physiol.68.040104.105739