So you want a nice stomach
Replies
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I suggest the TDEE-20% method. www.1percentedge.com/ifcalc (If you have questions please feel free to ask them here).
First of all, great post.
Secondly, is there a reason for recommending the above TDEE calculator instead of MFP calculator used for setting up our initial profile? In the Help section, MFP states: When you create your profile, we ask you for your age, height, weight, gender, and normal daily activity level. We use these factors to determine the calories required to maintain your current weight. We also ask how much weight you would like to lose or gain per week, and with this goal in mind we subtract calories (for weight loss) or add calories (for weight gain) to determine your daily calorie and nutrient goals.
I do see the 1percentedge calculator has more bells and whistles with macros. And there is a difference in daily calories aloted when I enter my data in both calculators. But for simplicity sake isn't MFP"s calculator good enough?
Again, thanks for your original post.
I set my targets originally with the MFP calculator but recently started sending people to that 1percentedge calculator because MFP has lately been giving some users dangerously low target numbers and I consider it a health hazard. Plus, usmcmp recommended that on, and I really trust her advice because she knows what she's doing.0 -
I suggest the TDEE-20% method. www.1percentedge.com/ifcalc (If you have questions please feel free to ask them here).
First of all, great post.
Secondly, is there a reason for recommending the above TDEE calculator instead of MFP calculator used for setting up our initial profile? In the Help section, MFP states: When you create your profile, we ask you for your age, height, weight, gender, and normal daily activity level. We use these factors to determine the calories required to maintain your current weight. We also ask how much weight you would like to lose or gain per week, and with this goal in mind we subtract calories (for weight loss) or add calories (for weight gain) to determine your daily calorie and nutrient goals.
I do see the 1percentedge calculator has more bells and whistles with macros. And there is a difference in daily calories aloted when I enter my data in both calculators. But for simplicity sake isn't MFP"s calculator good enough?
Again, thanks for your original post.
@peterjens There are a few reasons why I suggest using the TDEE method. I would have liked to have just told people how to set their MFP goals to work for them, but there is no one size fits all way to do it. The TDEE method is closer to one size fits all.
1. The average user comes in and tells MFP they want to lose 2 pounds per week. For most woman it automatically tells them to eat 1200 calories. 1200 calories is appropriate for a very small group of women who are short and not very active with not much weight to lose. Plenty of women have a TDEE of around 2000, so 1200 is close to half of their maintenance number.
2. Many people are afraid to eat back their exercise calories. They don't understand that MFP doesn't take into account their exercise, so they think it's counterproductive to eat back what they burn. The TDEE method takes into account BMR, Exercise and Non-Exercise Activity. This means the calorie goal is appropriate for their overall activity level including exercise, people aren't severely under eating.
3. Not everyone exercises every day. For someone eating 1200 calories and burning 400 every other day it makes them feel like they absolutely have to do something to be able to eat a little more. This is why people log cooking for 10 minutes or washing the dishes as exercise. The TDEE method can give them a guilt free flat rate intake, so real exercise is for pleasure, not punishment for eating or trying to earn more food.
4. MFP's method is great for the average beginner, but it missed body composition. I know the general population is just trying to lose weight and doesn't have much lean mass to begin with. There are plenty of former athletes who may be carrying extra lean mass, which MFP doesn't take into account and the TDEE method does. MFP tells me that I would maintain at 2100 calories, but my maintenance is much higher.
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Hi! So I went to the IFCalc website. It's an Intermittent fasting calculator? I don't understand how this website helps. -30% under TDEE? What if i did 50% How do you decide on the carbs/fat split? Thanks in advance
@MisJeWel Use this website instead. iifym.com/iifym-calculator
It will give you approximately the same TDEE, but the macros are a bit more average person friendly, where the other one is a bit more for bodybuilders. The website is an intermittent fasting site, but the calculator had nothing to do with intermittent fasting.
The reason you don't want to do -30% or -50% is because they are less sustainable and because you are going to have a tough time meeting your body's needs. That means more of a chance of losing lean mass, which is going to take you further from having a lean stomach. The entire goal of this is to reduce body fat while keeping your muscle. This is the difference between simply dieting and what fitness models do.0 -
@usmcmp - I attempted to read all forty pages of this thread but the task was overwhelming. I was searching for your advise on what to plug into the calculator for a preferred carb/fat ratio for the TDEE -20% mode (w/ 1gr/lb bodyweight)?
And just for clarification I think I read on one page where you refer to the Rest graph for all days of the week whether or not you train or rest - correct?
Thanks again for such a helpful post.0 -
@usmcmp - I attempted to read all forty pages of this thread but the task was overwhelming. I was searching for your advise on what to plug into the calculator for a preferred carb/fat ratio for the TDEE -20% mode (w/ 1gr/lb bodyweight)?
And just for clarification I think I read on one page where you refer to the Rest graph for all days of the week whether or not you train or rest - correct?
Thanks again for such a helpful post.
@peterjens I know that most people aren't sure quite what to do with the original TDEE calculator. It's created a bit more towards bodybuilders and I wish I could edit the OP to change the site to iifym.com/iifym-calculator/ since this one is more streamlined and the macros are set up closer to what most people will find sustainable and fitting.
ETA: The original calculator I posted automatically sets the graphs up for recomposition. That means most people would reach their goal weight in 5-10 years because they would lose very little fat.0 -
@usmcmp - I entered my data into iifym's calculator and was surprised at how many calories I was allotted per day including the 20% subtraction for weight loss! I'm a 61 year-old male, 5'6", 199 lbs, ~34% bf. I plugged in moderately active only because I love to play racquetball daily, swim once/wk, strength train once/week and bike thrice/week - all these are for one hour periods. Otherwise, I just sit at home and play my ukulele and shop for and cook my meals, oh, and read forums. My BMR is 1660, TDEE is 2427 (5 times/week status) and with 20% weight reduction my allotment is 1941 calories. After about a month of hovering around 1500 calories, 1941 calories seems extravagant. Am I missing something? Will I lose weight? Do I have to eat the extra calories if I am not really hungry? Thanks for your opinion(s). Thanks for your patience with me.0
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@usmcmp - I entered my data into iifym's calculator and was surprised at how many calories I was allotted per day including the 20% subtraction for weight loss! I'm a 61 year-old male, 5'6", 199 lbs, ~34% bf. I plugged in moderately active only because I love to play racquetball daily, swim once/wk, strength train once/week and bike thrice/week - all these are for one hour periods. Otherwise, I just sit at home and play my ukulele and shop for and cook my meals, oh, and read forums. My BMR is 1660, TDEE is 2427 (5 times/week status) and with 20% weight reduction my allotment is 1941 calories. After about a month of hovering around 1500 calories, 1941 calories seems extravagant. Am I missing something? Will I lose weight? Do I have to eat the extra calories if I am not really hungry? Thanks for your opinion(s). Thanks for your patience with me.
@peterjens That sounds sort of right. You are probably between lightly active and moderately active (since you don't do much other than your exercise). That wouldn't drop your TDEE very much though. The general guidance many people get when starting out here is to not eat under their BMR. That's the amount of calories you would need if you were in a coma (even just laying in bed burns more calories than your BMR since most of us roll around versus laying still).
The reason you should try to eat about 1900 calories is because our bodies find that breaking down muscle is sometimes easier than using stored fat for energy. The further you are away from the calories you maintain weight at the more likely you are to lose lean mass. The further away from your TDEE you are the more imbalanced cortisol and leptin get. These hormones are important to the fat loss process.
I highly suggest slowly increasing calories rather than jumping up 400 calories. Sometimes when people first increase they see a jump in the scale that freaks them out. This is part of the process of restoring balance in the body as far as hormones goes, but often the scale shows a loss within a week or two.0 -
Wow, this post was eye opening! MFP suggested, like you said, eating 1200 cals/day for 2lb/week weight loss. Since early January I've managed to lose 15lbs sticking close to that (usually 100 cals less on weekdays, maybe a couple hundred over weekends), doing pretty much cardio only, 35 mins a day (crosstrainer or treadmill) during the weekdays (I go during my lunch break). I don't really find myself ever super hungry with this setup, but I suspected I was going to start plateauing doing cardio only
I just started adding weights back in this week, after getting over a 2 weeks sickness. So far I've done 20min cardio and the remaining 10-15min weights. I usually go to the gym 4-5 days out of the work week and try to do something at home one day on the weekend.
My IIFYM stats are very similar to peter's above, but I'm 29, 5'10 and currently 192ish, trying to get down to 150ish. So it looks like I need to start eating more! I find this kind of scarey though! Since my time is so limited at the gym, should I shoot for something like 3 days weights and 2 days cardio? I do enjoy cardio, or at least, I don't mind it!
Wish I had seen this sooner, thanks for all the info and advice you've posted.0 -
verlorenkoh wrote: »Wow, this post was eye opening! MFP suggested, like you said, eating 1200 cals/day for 2lb/week weight loss. Since early January I've managed to lose 15lbs sticking close to that (usually 100 cals less on weekdays, maybe a couple hundred over weekends), doing pretty much cardio only, 35 mins a day (crosstrainer or treadmill) during the weekdays (I go during my lunch break). I don't really find myself ever super hungry with this setup, but I suspected I was going to start plateauing doing cardio only
I just started adding weights back in this week, after getting over a 2 weeks sickness. So far I've done 20min cardio and the remaining 10-15min weights. I usually go to the gym 4-5 days out of the work week and try to do something at home one day on the weekend.
My IIFYM stats are very similar to peter's above, but I'm 29, 5'10 and currently 192ish, trying to get down to 150ish. So it looks like I need to start eating more! I find this kind of scarey though! Since my time is so limited at the gym, should I shoot for something like 3 days weights and 2 days cardio? I do enjoy cardio, or at least, I don't mind it!
Wish I had seen this sooner, thanks for all the info and advice you've posted.
@verlorenkoh You're still very early into this, so no better time to start than now!
I highly suggest checking out a variety of lifting programs. The biggest suggested ones are Starting Strength, Stronglifts 5x5, and New Rules of Lifting for Women. You can also check out all the free programs on Bodybuilding.com, they even have a few questions to answer to help guide you towards a program. Many of the bodybuilding.com programs are a mix of lifting and cardio.
As I suggested to Peter, slowly increase your calories. Not that it's bad to jump that many, but it will keep your weight from fluctuating a lot within a few days and keeps you sane. With increased calories does come the importance of being accurate when weighing food and logging. It's less of a deficit, so big errors impact it. I ran your stats and I suggest bumping up to 1800, but don't forget that your exercise is included in this (on a weekly total) so log your exercise burns as 1 calorie.0 -
verlorenkoh wrote: »Wow, this post was eye opening! MFP suggested, like you said, eating 1200 cals/day for 2lb/week weight loss. Since early January I've managed to lose 15lbs sticking close to that (usually 100 cals less on weekdays, maybe a couple hundred over weekends), doing pretty much cardio only, 35 mins a day (crosstrainer or treadmill) during the weekdays (I go during my lunch break). I don't really find myself ever super hungry with this setup, but I suspected I was going to start plateauing doing cardio only
I just started adding weights back in this week, after getting over a 2 weeks sickness. So far I've done 20min cardio and the remaining 10-15min weights. I usually go to the gym 4-5 days out of the work week and try to do something at home one day on the weekend.
My IIFYM stats are very similar to peter's above, but I'm 29, 5'10 and currently 192ish, trying to get down to 150ish. So it looks like I need to start eating more! I find this kind of scarey though! Since my time is so limited at the gym, should I shoot for something like 3 days weights and 2 days cardio? I do enjoy cardio, or at least, I don't mind it!
Wish I had seen this sooner, thanks for all the info and advice you've posted.
Just for reference, I'm 45, started at 145 pounds, ate 1350 calories per day and lost 20 pounds since October. I can't imagine eating only 1200! You are larger and younger than I and so will (barring medical conditions) burn through MORE than me. Don't fear fueling your workouts!0 -
Thank you both for the advice! Looking up those lifting strats now
And I already know how I can healthily add in those extra 500-600 calories. 0 -
Nobody will ever see this comment but...
Cardio needs to be a minimum of twice a week better off three times. Start a lifting routine without cardio and your asking for heart problems.0 -
realityhack wrote: »Nobody will ever see this comment but...
Cardio needs to be a minimum of twice a week better off three times. Start a lifting routine without cardio and your asking for heart problems.
@realityhack That makes no sense. Lifting improves VO2Max (a measure of cardiovascular health). How would lifting cause heart problems if you don't do cardio "a minimum of twice a week"? Do you have any studies that support your claim?0 -
Wow. No way. Do you have any more advice? I need moar - so I don't die.realityhack wrote: »Start a lifting routine without cardio and your asking for heart problems.0 -
realityhack wrote: »Nobody will ever see this comment but...
Cardio needs to be a minimum of twice a week better off three times. Start a lifting routine without cardio and your asking for heart problems.
It happened to Fred Sanford
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realityhack wrote: »Nobody will ever see this comment but...
Cardio needs to be a minimum of twice a week better off three times. Start a lifting routine without cardio and your asking for heart problems.
It happened to Fred Sanford
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qfResyFrqlM 0 -
realityhack wrote: »Nobody will ever see this comment but...
Cardio needs to be a minimum of twice a week better off three times. Start a lifting routine without cardio and your asking for heart problems.
Not at all.0 -
realityhack wrote: »Nobody will ever see this comment but...
Cardio needs to be a minimum of twice a week better off three times. Start a lifting routine without cardio and your asking for heart problems.
lolno0 -
realityhack wrote: »Nobody will ever see this comment but...
Cardio needs to be a minimum of twice a week better off three times. Start a lifting routine without cardio and your asking for heart problems.
Doing my home state proud.....not
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@usmcmp - I entered my data into iifym's calculator and was surprised at how many calories I was allotted per day including the 20% subtraction for weight loss! I'm a 61 year-old male, 5'6", 199 lbs, ~34% bf. I plugged in moderately active only because I love to play racquetball daily, swim once/wk, strength train once/week and bike thrice/week - all these are for one hour periods. Otherwise, I just sit at home and play my ukulele and shop for and cook my meals, oh, and read forums. My BMR is 1660, TDEE is 2427 (5 times/week status) and with 20% weight reduction my allotment is 1941 calories. After about a month of hovering around 1500 calories, 1941 calories seems extravagant. Am I missing something? Will I lose weight? Do I have to eat the extra calories if I am not really hungry? Thanks for your opinion(s). Thanks for your patience with me.
@peterjens That sounds sort of right. You are probably between lightly active and moderately active (since you don't do much other than your exercise). That wouldn't drop your TDEE very much though. The general guidance many people get when starting out here is to not eat under their BMR. That's the amount of calories you would need if you were in a coma (even just laying in bed burns more calories than your BMR since most of us roll around versus laying still).
The reason you should try to eat about 1900 calories is because our bodies find that breaking down muscle is sometimes easier than using stored fat for energy. The further you are away from the calories you maintain weight at the more likely you are to lose lean mass. The further away from your TDEE you are the more imbalanced cortisol and leptin get. These hormones are important to the fat loss process.
I highly suggest slowly increasing calories rather than jumping up 400 calories. Sometimes when people first increase they see a jump in the scale that freaks them out. This is part of the process of restoring balance in the body as far as hormones goes, but often the scale shows a loss within a week or two.
@usmcmp - According to my Health o meter scale (which I will assume is accurate) the two pounds I lost this week was mostly muscle (1.4#) vs fat (.6#). I am going to experiment with increasing my daily calories.
What do you think about this ratio (http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/macro-math-3-keys-to-dialing-in-your-macro-ratios.html) using the lower-fat carb loss recommendation?
Thanks0 -
@usmcmp - I entered my data into iifym's calculator and was surprised at how many calories I was allotted per day including the 20% subtraction for weight loss! I'm a 61 year-old male, 5'6", 199 lbs, ~34% bf. I plugged in moderately active only because I love to play racquetball daily, swim once/wk, strength train once/week and bike thrice/week - all these are for one hour periods. Otherwise, I just sit at home and play my ukulele and shop for and cook my meals, oh, and read forums. My BMR is 1660, TDEE is 2427 (5 times/week status) and with 20% weight reduction my allotment is 1941 calories. After about a month of hovering around 1500 calories, 1941 calories seems extravagant. Am I missing something? Will I lose weight? Do I have to eat the extra calories if I am not really hungry? Thanks for your opinion(s). Thanks for your patience with me.
@peterjens That sounds sort of right. You are probably between lightly active and moderately active (since you don't do much other than your exercise). That wouldn't drop your TDEE very much though. The general guidance many people get when starting out here is to not eat under their BMR. That's the amount of calories you would need if you were in a coma (even just laying in bed burns more calories than your BMR since most of us roll around versus laying still).
The reason you should try to eat about 1900 calories is because our bodies find that breaking down muscle is sometimes easier than using stored fat for energy. The further you are away from the calories you maintain weight at the more likely you are to lose lean mass. The further away from your TDEE you are the more imbalanced cortisol and leptin get. These hormones are important to the fat loss process.
I highly suggest slowly increasing calories rather than jumping up 400 calories. Sometimes when people first increase they see a jump in the scale that freaks them out. This is part of the process of restoring balance in the body as far as hormones goes, but often the scale shows a loss within a week or two.
@usmcmp - According to my Health o meter scale (which I will assume is accurate) the two pounds I lost this week was mostly muscle (1.4#) vs fat (.6#). I am going to experiment with increasing my daily calories.
What do you think about this ratio (http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/macro-math-3-keys-to-dialing-in-your-macro-ratios.html) using the lower-fat carb loss recommendation?
Thanks
@peterjens That article is written for bodybuilders, not the average person. Also, the fact that she thinks somatotypes actually exist is very telling. Somatotypes (endomorph/mesomorph/ectomorph) was a idea written by a psychologist in 1954 and has been debunked multiple times. When an author mentions dieting by body type I tend to ignore their advice completely.
The reality of setting macros is that you need to find what works for you. I do highly suggest eating at least .8g of protein per pound of lean body mass (up to 1g per pound if it's not a struggle to reach it). Other than that play with your fat and carbohydrate levels. You do need fat for metabolic processes, so don't try to eliminate fats in your diet.0 -
Yeah, I'm def not a bodybuilder. I will heed your protein guideline and experiment. I hate to lose the muscle that I've worked so hard to gain one rep at a time. I'll check in later with my results. Thanks.0
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Bump0
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OP I have a question! I find on days when I'm working that I sometimes can't hit all my macros. Is it important to hit 0's on all my macros everyday or is it okay to just be under <20 on protein or carbs and call it a day? Also right now it calculated my -20% TDEE at 1740 which is around what I each everyday (I workout 7 days a week, 2 of those being cardio days). I'm hesitant to increase +20% because that just seems like so much more than what I'm used to. Would you suggest that increase to be necessary?
Thank you so much for your help!0 -
mydearnicole wrote: »OP I have a question! I find on days when I'm working that I sometimes can't hit all my macros. Is it important to hit 0's on all my macros everyday or is it okay to just be under <20 on protein or carbs and call it a day? Also right now it calculated my -20% TDEE at 1740 which is around what I each everyday (I workout 7 days a week, 2 of those being cardio days). I'm hesitant to increase +20% because that just seems like so much more than what I'm used to. Would you suggest that increase to be necessary?
Thank you so much for your help!
@mydearnicole I don't really understand what your goal is. Are you trying to lose weight or gain weight? First you said -20% and now you are saying +20%.
If you are worried that increasing from a low current number up to 1740 then check out several other calculators to make sure that you are accurately putting your data in to come out with the right number. You don't have much weight to lose, so it wouldn't hurt to just use the MFP method and set your goal to lose a pound or half a pound per week.0 -
I really really want to give you a thumbs up but your number 4 is making me cringe.
What about it? There's nothing wrong with cardio. I suggested no more than an hour total for a week. If diet is on point there is no need for more than that and it is good to include cardio in any program. I did mention in the first point that people need to weigh their food. Sometimes it doesn't happen (a taste here or going out to eat) and cardio can help offset those extra calories.
Cardio burns calories. I use it with metoblic training everyday. Cardio by itself wont do anything but combined with a sculpting program it should work. My issue is this. Ive done these programs before. Like pt/24 7 and ripped in 30. It worked. The first time. Now cycling back to it. It doesnt. Anyone who could shed some light on that it would be amazing.0 -
stclairm823 wrote: »I really really want to give you a thumbs up but your number 4 is making me cringe.
What about it? There's nothing wrong with cardio. I suggested no more than an hour total for a week. If diet is on point there is no need for more than that and it is good to include cardio in any program. I did mention in the first point that people need to weigh their food. Sometimes it doesn't happen (a taste here or going out to eat) and cardio can help offset those extra calories.
Cardio burns calories. I use it with metoblic training everyday. Cardio by itself wont do anything but combined with a sculpting program it should work. My issue is this. Ive done these programs before. Like pt/24 7 and ripped in 30. It worked. The first time. Now cycling back to it. It doesnt. Anyone who could shed some light on that it would be amazing.
It's your diet. Diet is the cornerstone for transformations.
Cardio helps burn some calories, but it's easy to blow half an hour worth of running in 30 seconds worth of eating. Cardio by itself means improved heart and lungs. An appropriate calorie intake and lifting means better body composition.0 -
stclairm823 wrote: »I really really want to give you a thumbs up but your number 4 is making me cringe.
What about it? There's nothing wrong with cardio. I suggested no more than an hour total for a week. If diet is on point there is no need for more than that and it is good to include cardio in any program. I did mention in the first point that people need to weigh their food. Sometimes it doesn't happen (a taste here or going out to eat) and cardio can help offset those extra calories.
Cardio burns calories. I use it with metoblic training everyday. Cardio by itself wont do anything but combined with a sculpting program it should work. My issue is this. Ive done these programs before. Like pt/24 7 and ripped in 30. It worked. The first time. Now cycling back to it. It doesnt. Anyone who could shed some light on that it would be amazing.
Also, what do you mean by "sculpting" program? If you are talking about the videos like "30 day shred" or whatever, that isn't going to do it. Look at USMCMP's very first post for recs on the kinds of workouts that actually will help change your bodycomp. (Hint: No VCR/DVD needed)0 -
Nobody will ever see this comment but...
Cardio needs to be a minimum of twice a week better off three times. Start a lifting routine without cardio and your asking for heart problems.Not at all.lolnoDoing my home state proud.....not
At this point the best approach for anyone searching for correct answer for "Cardio requirement/Start Lifting and Heart Problems" your best bet would be talk to a Cardiologist. Only and only a cardiologist will be able to give you a correct answer based off your current health condition, family history including your ECG Test.
Now back to ....So I want a nice stomach.0 -
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