what to do about kid failing
Replies
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I am going through the exact same thing as you except my son is 15. He is "LAZY". So, I took away his TV / XBOX, so when he comes home and goes to his room, there is NOTHING he can do BUT homework! (He wasn't doing it at all). He did tell me he doesn't understand it at all so I called the school and requested he get tested for an IEP. This way, if he passes the IEP, I know my son is just being lazy and I'll give up. If he fails the IEP, then he'll get the help he needs.
His coach told him he cannot come to practice until he gets 30 mins min of extra help each day with a note from the teacher saying that he did get the xtra help.
This just started on Monday. So I'll wait until he gets tested in 6 weeks (it's a long process before he can get tested)... if it turns out he passes this IEP, then I'll tell him he's gonna fail in life... oh well. TOUGH LOVE
Ok. I am a special education teacher....you CANNOT pass or fail an IEP. You complete a comprehensive assessment. IF he has a learning disability-which he very well could-I hope you apologize for calling him lazy. Students with learning disabilities have average IQ or intellect, but their brains process things differently than yours or mine...so while he may be 'smart' his brain cannot figure out math the way other kids his age would.
Oh, and another tidbit...if you want to expedite the process, you could ask that they complete the evaluation concurrent to the interventions. They may or may not do it, but it's worth a shot.
and some have significantly above average intelligence.
That would be us. Myself and both my sons. SO frustrating when teachers think he's being lazy because he 'gets good grades in the other classes' well, no ****. You'd think that would be a sign of disorder not of intent. Ugh, one math teacher would tell my son to 'try and figure it out'. This makes me nuts because you tell the kids to come for help and then...?
I think it's helpful to approach the problem holistically. Don't assume they are lazy unless there is a pattern of behavior there.0 -
As someone who got really good grades in some stuff (English, anything writing, actual art, social studies, history) and did horribly in math, even with a tutor...I can say this:
He may just not get it.
Life was great for me with numbers - add, subtract, multiply, divide...until they threw in letters and parenthesis. To me, they just didn't go together.
I felt like Algebra was designed to trick me.
Only one math teacher - Mr. Gribi - could get through to me in the World of Numbers after my first brush with Algebra. And it is because he knew how to bring the abstract to the real world. (edit...he would take real life situations and apply math. Stock market pages. Check books. Doing taxes. Stuff you'd actually use one day.)
So, I recommend finding a Mr. Gribi to tutor your stepson maybe two or three days a week.
Don't give up on him. Lots of people in life will do that, and it's disappointing. He needs his parents to keep supporting him. I felt pretty unsupported when I got grounded for my grades when I really was trying...you sound like a super caring stepmom, so partner up with his dad and see if you can find the right tutor for him. Good luck to all of you!0 -
It's good he is getting tutoring. You can also try incentives (aka bribery), and also punishment if he continues to show such little effort. I understand the problem because I personally suck at math and didn't do great in high school math. When I got serious and got to college, I normally required about 6-8 hours of tutoring a week to survive with b grades. Maybe he needs more help. Basically, it sounds like you are TRYING, and sometimes that is all a parent can do. The kid is 17. Do YOUR best in encouraging him and getting him help, and the rest falls on him.0
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This is what I think. I'm guessing from all the posts that you've figured out certain math subjects are harder than others. That said, there was a study done regarding graduation rates, and they found students were two hundred percent more likely to graduate if they passed high school algebra. It is a class than can make or break a person's confidence in their academic abilities. In addition, math is typically taught in a building spiral in elementary, touching on topics over and over in increasing difficulty, whereas in high school, it is taught linearly by broad subjects and to mastery in one semester. That's mumbo jumbo for they expect a student to learn a whole lot about one topic (algebra), and do it very well in a short amount of time. They have to "get it" from the first lesson, or they will be behind by the second, and so forth, because they are literally going through centuries of math discoveries in a matter of months. If there was any deficiency earlier, in arithmetic, if he isn't able to instantly recall basic math facts (addition, subtraction, multiplication), or has trouble multiplying, dividing or adding fractions, or doing square roots, he's going to have a hard time with algebra. It's one of those subjects that really requires a lot of prior proficiency to do well in. So what do you do? Sit with him and the tutor, do a wide sample of problems and see where the disconnect is. Is it remembering which theorem to use? Is it simple arithmetic problems? Is he having problem going beyond a few steps in the problem (some of those require many, many steps). This is a subject that requires encouragement, IMO. The class is kicking his butt, and he needs a coach in the corner helping him to get back in the ring. Just my two cents.
This needs to be read again.0 -
This is what I think. I'm guessing from all the posts that you've figured out certain math subjects are harder than others. That said, there was a study done regarding graduation rates, and they found students were two hundred percent more likely to graduate if they passed high school algebra. It is a class than can make or break a person's confidence in their academic abilities. In addition, math is typically taught in a building spiral in elementary, touching on topics over and over in increasing difficulty, whereas in high school, it is taught linearly by broad subjects and to mastery in one semester. That's mumbo jumbo for they expect a student to learn a whole lot about one topic (algebra), and do it very well in a short amount of time. They have to "get it" from the first lesson, or they will be behind by the second, and so forth, because they are literally going through centuries of math discoveries in a matter of months. If there was any deficiency earlier, in arithmetic, if he isn't able to instantly recall basic math facts (addition, subtraction, multiplication), or has trouble multiplying, dividing or adding fractions, or doing square roots, he's going to have a hard time with algebra. It's one of those subjects that really requires a lot of prior proficiency to do well in. So what do you do? Sit with him and the tutor, do a wide sample of problems and see where the disconnect is. Is it remembering which theorem to use? Is it simple arithmetic problems? Is he having problem going beyond a few steps in the problem (some of those require many, many steps). This is a subject that requires encouragement, IMO. The class is kicking his butt, and he needs a coach in the corner helping him to get back in the ring. Just my two cents.
This needs to be read again.
Thank you, consider it reread.0 -
I also wonder about the level of algebra if this is a new school. My thirteen year old, they have doing high school algebra and geometry and thats the BASIC level. Why they can't do, you know, 8th grade levels is beyond me. Not to mention different school systems have different, uh, interesting ways of teaching.
Mine aces algebra but struggles with geometry and word problems (words and numbers don't mix in his head). SO it may be a more involved situation then presented at first light.0 -
I feel like it isn't the tutor, I feel like it is him. I have seen him understand and do problems and he does ok. But I feel like he only works to understand the problems that come easily to him and refuses to put in the effort to understand the ones he doesn't get right away, no matter what I say or do to help him.
Yep, I've got one of those too .. however, she responds to rewards, so now I give her a horse card (she's horse mad) when she does all of the questions correctly and not just the 'easy' ones - and guess what .... she's getting them right.
Maybe there's something you can use to 'motivate' him to try the difficult ones?0 -
Squeaked by with a C...but only after i turned around in class and had the girl behind me teach me, the teacher was less than helpful and would explain things the exact same way...
I have a degree,masters and am applying to law school...Made my only D in college in math...Goodness do I hate Math0 -
After reading all the posts, here are my thoughts.
He has recently been pulled out of his home environment and possibly changed schools. Altho yes, he needed to be taken out of his environment, it still is a loss for him and affects his self esteem and motivation.
From his perspective, it may be perceived as "Mom didn't want me and dumped me on Dad and his new wife, who don't have a clue about what I am going thru. Nothing I do is right. I am tired of trying to please everyone. I just don't care anymore."
You are quite a bit younger than his mother, and he may have been hearing his mother complain about you and his dad for awhile, so he came in with a chip on shoulder to begin with. Don't know the situation, but this is common among divorces.
You and Dad will need to earn some street cred with him.
Are you happy that he is living with you? really? Most likely you resent the fact that you now have to raise HIS son, cuz mom did a lousy job at it. You work 7 days a week. You have no experience with raising kids. And you get thrown into motherhood with a 17 yr old who has been thru a lot.
You are way in over your head, and need some help.
Where is dad in all of this? You haven't mentioned him at all. Sounds like he has left all of this to you to figure out on your own.
HE needs to be doing most of the legwork here. HE is the parent and has the responsibility of helping HIS son get thru this tough time and learn how to succeed. Yes, you are a team, and you will need to be involved, but the teen will do much better if he feels like his dad actually wants him there in your household, and feels like he is worth the time and effort.
Family counseling would be a big help for all of you. This is a huge turning point in this kid's life. If he feels like a failure now, he will become a statistic. He will drop out of school and make so many bad choices for his life.
You and dad need to become a team. Help this young man to feel like he is wanted and accepted into your family. Look at him thru his eyes and see the pain and struggle that he can't express in any other way accept what appears to you as apathy.
Do everything you can to convince him that you love him, you understand his struggles, and you truly want to help him to succeed.
Yeah, it is hard parenting a teen when you have had them from day one and all is going well. It is even harder in your situation.
Be the hero that this young man needs.0 -
As someone who also didn't really get along with math, something that helped me was making it RELEVANT. Numbers and symbols in a book didn't work. What really helped was being able to take that knowledge and those equations and apply them to a more tangible, real-world scenario.
Of course, it helps if a teacher / tutor / someone experienced in using this math in the real world is there to help with this.0 -
My son is 14, and he gets great grades on just about everything. There's a couple things he gets bad grades on that I know he could do better, and there's somethings that he just doesn't bother to turn in. With just a few "zeroes" in the mix, that brings his grades down all the time. I've tried grounding, lecturing, and everything else. I'm in the same boat. Don't know what to do either. Good luck.0
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I have a brother who is 15 years old, hes always in this situation, he will just not put forth the effort to "make it" I dont know what it takes to influence this boy to try harder....he lives with his father who doesnt check his grades and stay on top of his homework...or anything to do with school. My moms trys to do everything to help the situation but my brother just wont give her a chance....he blows it off. I know most of you are concern with getting you child through high school, I just want my brother to get out of middleschool. He has already been held back 3 times.0
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couldnt agree more!0
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Lol, my mom taught my brother algebra with dollar bills. Seriously, my brother understood money denominations and calculations, but when it came to hard numbers, he somehow blanked out.
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Maybe he's a geometry kid. A lot of kids are good at geometry or algebra, but not both. I was a geometry kid. And it's rougher for us because you take 2-3 years of algebra and only one of geometry.
If he's doing well in other subjects but not math, he's not lazy. Something's going on, he's not understanding. He tells you he thinks he's ready or thinks he did well because he doesn't want you to bug him about it. Bug him about it.0 -
Disclaimer: I'm an entry-level actuary so I do well with math. I tutored for 3 years in college - athletes, older students, you name it. But I'm not a parent by any means, so I don't have any advice there
Sit down with him for homework, go over every problem. Talk it out in a way that makes it relatable to real life. Most of the time, that's a huge help. I once tutored a kid on a football scholarship. D's in math, ok grades elsewhere. He wasn't a very good student but was great at football. Worked hard when I had him, I rewarded him with Wendy's or McDonald's for lunch. He took Algebra as a summer class so that was all we focused on that summer. Started with an F. When we worked together, I would help him go section-by-section and go over the basics of that section. Took notes, wrote down examples, etc. Did the homework problems, studied for the tests. Before I knew it, he passed with an A!!! I later found out he had 2 kids (he was 19!) and a fiance he was supporting. So, he wanted it badly - he just had to have someone who understood math and could work 1-on-1 with him to help him succeed. But he did and your stepson can too. He might need someone to believe in him and let him know that he matters.. that person is you!
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After reading all the posts, here are my thoughts.
He has recently been pulled out of his home environment and possibly changed schools. Altho yes, he needed to be taken out of his environment, it still is a loss for him and affects his self esteem and motivation.
From his perspective, it may be perceived as "Mom didn't want me and dumped me on Dad and his new wife, who don't have a clue about what I am going thru. Nothing I do is right. I am tired of trying to please everyone. I just don't care anymore."
You are quite a bit younger than his mother, and he may have been hearing his mother complain about you and his dad for awhile, so he came in with a chip on shoulder to begin with. Don't know the situation, but this is common among divorces.
You and Dad will need to earn some street cred with him.
Are you happy that he is living with you? really? Most likely you resent the fact that you now have to raise HIS son, cuz mom did a lousy job at it. You work 7 days a week. You have no experience with raising kids. And you get thrown into motherhood with a 17 yr old who has been thru a lot.
You are way in over your head, and need some help.
Where is dad in all of this? You haven't mentioned him at all. Sounds like he has left all of this to you to figure out on your own.
HE needs to be doing most of the legwork here. HE is the parent and has the responsibility of helping HIS son get thru this tough time and learn how to succeed. Yes, you are a team, and you will need to be involved, but the teen will do much better if he feels like his dad actually wants him there in your household, and feels like he is worth the time and effort.
Family counseling would be a big help for all of you. This is a huge turning point in this kid's life. If he feels like a failure now, he will become a statistic. He will drop out of school and make so many bad choices for his life.
You and dad need to become a team. Help this young man to feel like he is wanted and accepted into your family. Look at him thru his eyes and see the pain and struggle that he can't express in any other way accept what appears to you as apathy.
Do everything you can to convince him that you love him, you understand his struggles, and you truly want to help him to succeed.
Yeah, it is hard parenting a teen when you have had them from day one and all is going well. It is even harder in your situation.
Be the hero that this young man needs.
From the lack of mention of Dad, and the apparent problems with bio-Mom, I think the OP is doing a pretty admirable job, given that she's not actually a parent to a child who is 12 months or less away from being responsible for himself. If the child sees nothing else, he would at least see the contrast in interest/involvement. He may not, however, understand the OP's actions as those of someone who care about him and wants what's in his best interest if he has no experience with that kind of parenting.
Personally, I would have a conversation, alone, with him and explain why you've done what you've done, lay out what the outcomes boil down to (scraping by, reapeting, sumemr school ,or no degree and poor job prospects as a way to start life on his own) so he understands the potential paths, and then make clear to him that if you knew something that could help him and he was open to it that you would do it. He might know what would help. He might not. Either way, he'll know you care. And, it's pretty obvious that you do care.
And, as an aside, while it might be nice for the OP to have the time and the will to check his homework with him, blasting her for not doing so overlooks two things: 1) he's 17 and no more than 12 months from being able to be held fully responsible for himself and the roof over his head; and 2) he has two parents - whatever skill level of parenting they may be - who actually are responsible for parenting him and not putting forth effort by choice.0 -
I haven't read all the answers or your replies, but I can say hand on heart that with math that no matter how many times I am shown it just doesn't sink in. I can think I know what to do, agree that I know what to do, but then when I go to do a problem my mind is blank.
however I did have a tutor a few years ago who had a completely different approach and I suddenly knew what it was all about! maybe you need to find a tutor who approaches the subject in a different manner. Everyone has different teaching methods and it's finding the one that clicks with you
good luck0 -
I wondered the same thing with my daughter that is 10 and we had her tested and found out she has a learning disability in Math....no matter how much she studies it does not sink in and she gets really upset about it and I know she is trying. See if he really is not getting it because it appeared she was being lazy at first too, but she was just giving up because of the difficulty.0
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I seem to be in a small minority that got - and still gets - along really well with math.
There could be a million reasons why he's not doing well. Maybe he's not a math guy, maybe he's not an algebra guy, maybe he doesn't like it, maybe he can't be arsed to do it, etc...
He's 17, almost an adult. I vote you let him sink or swim on his own...
P.S.
"I did fine." is the answer 99% of teenagers would give their parents when asked about any exam, regardless of how they actually did.
ETA:
The only problem I ever had with math - and which I largely still have - is that when faced with large equations I tend to do 15 simplification steps at once which often results in getting half of them slightly wrong.
This is why I gravitated more towards algebra and topology than towards analysis or geometry.
If he thinks he understands fine and (genuinely) thinks he did fine on exams but always seems to get it wrong, maybe he has the same problem. Try doing the problems more slowly.0 -
I was like your stepson: I hated the math teacher and he hated me, I hated that school and I almost hated my mom, I didn't gave a eff for all of them and had always the lowest grades in mathematics, not because I'm an idiot but I just wasn't interested. I was not even gone to a university and although all this I have become one of the best IT-security consultants. So, my advice is, ask him why he has no interest in maths and receiving your help and try to help him eliminating the reason for his constant failing or let him learn this life lesson on his own. Option #2 saves you time...My stepson is 17 and taking algebra, he is absolutely failing miserably his highest grade was a 76 and that was a friggin homework grade. He came to live with us in August of last year and didn't have good influences or study habits where he was, he does ok in his other classes. He just can't seem to get his crap together in this algebra class, I have him tutoring Saturdays and staying after Mondays. I have been nice, mean, strict, lenient and now I feel like I just don't care anymore because I feel like he isn't TRULY putting in the effort. He turns in all of his assignments but he even fails the homework, I asked how he failed homework since he had time to check his answers to make sure he was doing it right. He acted like he didn't know how to check his answers which I know he does because I showed him how and by now should be friggin common sense. Also he can probably plug any problem into search on his tablet and get a step by step answer, he is just lazy and not using his brain. I am not sure what he hopes to accomplish by failing this class considering his butt is going to go to summer school or get held back. Either way he HAS to pass this class and I have told him this. I am at my wits end, what do I do? I've kinda just stopped caring because he's gotta grow up sometime and realize some things just don't go away. Part of me wants to just let this happen and him just learn the hard way. But does anyone have any ideas before I do this or is it just better to let him learn this life lesson on his own?0 -
I was like your stepson: I hated the math teacher and he hated me, I hated that school and I almost hated my mom, I didn't gave a eff for all of them and had always the lowest grades in mathematics, not because I'm an idiot but I just wasn't interested. I was not even gone to a university and although all this I have become one of the best IT-security consultants. So, my advice is, ask him why he has no interest in maths and receiving your help and try to help him eliminating the reason for his constant failing or let him learn this life lesson on his own. Option #2 saves you time...My stepson is 17 and taking algebra, he is absolutely failing miserably his highest grade was a 76 and that was a friggin homework grade. He came to live with us in August of last year and didn't have good influences or study habits where he was, he does ok in his other classes. He just can't seem to get his crap together in this algebra class, I have him tutoring Saturdays and staying after Mondays. I have been nice, mean, strict, lenient and now I feel like I just don't care anymore because I feel like he isn't TRULY putting in the effort. He turns in all of his assignments but he even fails the homework, I asked how he failed homework since he had time to check his answers to make sure he was doing it right. He acted like he didn't know how to check his answers which I know he does because I showed him how and by now should be friggin common sense. Also he can probably plug any problem into search on his tablet and get a step by step answer, he is just lazy and not using his brain. I am not sure what he hopes to accomplish by failing this class considering his butt is going to go to summer school or get held back. Either way he HAS to pass this class and I have told him this. I am at my wits end, what do I do? I've kinda just stopped caring because he's gotta grow up sometime and realize some things just don't go away. Part of me wants to just let this happen and him just learn the hard way. But does anyone have any ideas before I do this or is it just better to let him learn this life lesson on his own?
Yup, I too was like your stepson. I was angry when I was younger and didn't really give a crap about school, more importantly math because it required more work then most classes. I'm now a physical Science major in college and no longer an angry person. Sometimes you gotta learn the hard way, and sometimes it's not the course material holding you back, but instead other things in your life.0 -
I tutored math in college... sometimes it takes more than one go around for some people. I have seen people struggle and struggle and struggle the first time through and do fine the second.
It is like the information had to do an initial imprint but they got so far behind that it was spinning wheels trying to catch up the rest of the year... but when they took the class again they were able to start at the begining ahead of the curve and never got behind again..... and passed with no problems.0 -
I tried so hard in algebra and physics my junior year. I did okay in algebra, but I did make some choices that led to my failure, although I can't really imagine myself passing that class. However I probably would've failed physics even if I hadn't skipped school. I tried so hard, I paid attention in class, I tried doing the homework, but I always did something wrong. I just could not do it for the life of me. Seriously, if I had to solve a physics problem to save my life, I would be dead. No joke. And I felt stupid. Really stupid because I felt like I was the only one who couldn't do it.
Chances are, your stepson feels stupid and like he is the only one not getting it. I was also really depressed and paranoid at the time. I was having trouble focusing. Try observing him a while if he seems withdrawn or like he doesn't have a lot of energy he might be depressed.0 -
If there is one thing I dislike, it is this notion that some people are good at math and some are not.
Not everyone is going to be a genius. But everyone with a reasonable has enough basic aptitude to get through to get through high school math, even calculus.
The problem with math is that everything you need to do is built on what you learned before. English, history, etc., are not like that.
In math, in order to do this week's assignment, I need to have a fair grasp of last week's assignment. In history, I could drop into a one class in the middle of a semester, and I could be tested on what happened in that class and I could do well.
That is why math is harder. If you miss something you get lost.
Your stepson goes to tutoring and stays late once a week. For a high school kid, that is being pretty diligent. Despite what he says, he has not given up. Sometimes kids do not want to admit they care about something that they possibly might not achieve.
He might need to take a step back, and restart the class. Or, even go back and retake the previous class.
It is hard to catch up in math.0 -
I was in the same boat as you are. What I had done with my son who was totally interested in dirt bikes, if it was a fraction problem, I used his dirt bike for example as if we were building a bike together, and what the fraction would be, if we had 1/4, 1/2 or 3/4 of it put together...etc.
They will not learn if they are not interested in a subject. Somehow, someway...you need to make it fun. 0 -
You sound like you have given up on him...awesome.0
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You sound like you have given up on him...awesome.
you wanna know what you sound like.............prob not. Continue on being useless to others. Awesome.
I love these guys showing up saying absolutely nothing of importance for no other reason than to see there words on the screen.
What's the point of showing up and being useless? Just to be an @ss about something. Glad you have that kind of time in your day.
Now if you don't mind, I'll get back to my grown up problems.0 -
You sound like you have given up on him...awesome.
you wanna know what you sound like.............prob not. Continue on being useless to others. Awesome.
I love these guys showing up saying absolutely nothing of importance for no other reason than to see there words on the screen.
What's the point of showing up and being useless? Just to be an @ss about something. Glad you have that kind of time in your day.
Now if you don't mind, I'll get back to my grown up problems.
Sounds to me like I struck a nerve.0 -
You sound like you have given up on him...awesome.
you wanna know what you sound like.............prob not. Continue on being useless to others. Awesome.
I love these guys showing up saying absolutely nothing of importance for no other reason than to see there words on the screen.
What's the point of showing up and being useless? Just to be an @ss about something. Glad you have that kind of time in your day.
Now if you don't mind, I'll get back to my grown up problems.
Wow, Hawkeye, I think you really hit the bulls-eye there, a response like that proves it0
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