How do you keep your food intake "Clean"?

weber22c

You were being condescending by assuming that everyone that chooses to avoid man-made additives is doing so because they aren't educated enough to know what those additives are. That they needed you to educate them.

No science degree is needed to Google an additive.

I'm not under the impression that I'm educating anyone here. That would require people being willing to consider other viewpoints.

Of course a science degree isn't required to look up an additive - once again, I was simply addressing one user's system of not ingesting anything which has an ingredient he or she can't pronounce. That is a very different story from a person such as yourself who has chosen to avoid a handful of specific additives.

And regarding your comment that nature has all of the vitamins every single person needs, that simply isn't true in every case. For example, vitamin B2 (aka riboflavin) supplementation is a very common part of treatment protocols for migraine sufferers. While many foods are indeed rich in vitamin B2, the amount of those foods you'd need to eat in order to achieve clinical efficacy just isn't feasible. For the average person with no health issues though, yes, whole foods do contain what you need, and taking supplements beyond that is just making expensive pee.

jonnythan

Also, the people who think natural = better are deluding themselves. Everything in nature has well-developed defense mechanisms. Surviving in nature is a constant arms race. Nature doesn't exist for our benefit. The history of organisms is a history of species taking advantage of one another, developing defenses against each other, and evolving new ways to get past those defenses and continue taking advantage of one another.

We exist because we evolved to survive despite other organisms' best efforts to screw us over. We evolved to be able to TOLERATE things in nature. They didn't evolve for OUR benefit.

sullus

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[/img]

WendyTerry420

Real food is clean food. making things from scratch. For example if you want chicken nuggets and French fries for dinner. Buy the chicken and bread them yourself. some might even say make your own bread crumbs and make your own French fries. sweet potato fries are so yummy with olive oil and some seasoning. Trying to keep the chemicals out of it, the less hands it touches the less processed it is.

If someone else makes it, it isn't clean anymore?

JoRocka

And here's how this plays out...each and every time.

Person(s) A: I want to eat clean.
Person(s) B: What you mean?
Person(s) A: No processed food! No junk! No chemicals!
Person(s) B: Everything is made of chemicals. What do you mean by junk? What processes are referring to specifically?
Person(s) A: I meant artificial chemicals. And by junk I mean that the food has no nutritional value. I can't actually specify the processing I'm talking about in an articulate way, but basically mean anything that's packaged in a box and stored with artificial preservatives.
Person(s) B: Do you have some compelling evidence that these "artificial" chemicals have adverse reactions to humans that's based in credible, peer-reviewed science? Also, anything with either a macro or micronutrient has nutritional value; for that matter, water has neither, but we still need it. Again, what's your problem with packaged items and their preservatives.

And here's what never ever happens, but I really want it to.

Person(s) A: This is a faith-based nutritional initiative that I attempt to support with unconvincing evidence, but when that falls through I retreat into a "All I'm saying is that this works for me" stance--even though, I've been speaking in general terms about everything up until now, indicating that it should work for most everyone. And in two seconds, I'll attempt to deflect from the actual conversation (because I have nothing to add) by commenting about how mean and unsupportive people are. I may also talk about some sort of lifestyle change and journey because I need to reify this whole philosophy at this point.


EDIT: there may or may not be a side debate on what constitutes compelling evidence.

I was driving to work the other day and came to an interesting realization that paleo/clean is like the christianity of food.

It's a loose analogy I freely admit- but it made me smile and chuckle on my way to work.

Ultimately it makes them feel better- gives people a leg to stand on (shakey and hypothetical but a 'leg' I guess none the less) and "it works" for them. Which is great- I'm all about doing what works for you.
They also tend to be exceptionally judgey about other peoples decisions with food. There are many "sects" if you will and often none of them agree with each other.

anyway- it was amusing to me- take it as far or as short as you like- and it isn't a judgement on either types- it's mostly an observation of steryeotypes that I made while driving to work. I don't hold anyone's belief's or choices against them as long as they are educated and understanding what they are doing. I dont' expect a full scientific break down of christianity- much like I don't expect any sort of scientific break down on paleo and why it works. It works- and it makes them happy.

For me ........ ingesting as few "chemicals" as possible ...... not easy, but I try drinker

well that's going to be an awfully short life- how do do it with the breathing of the H2O? I mean that right there violates your basic premise!!

god that's a short- and tragic life.

bcattoes

Oh, are you from West Virginia?

Hornsby

The only pro-God food plan....

http://www.danielplan.com/

:insertsarcasm:

bcattoes

You were being condescending by assuming that everyone that chooses to avoid man-made additives is doing so because they aren't educated enough to know what those additives are. That they needed you to educate them.

No science degree is needed to Google an additive.

I'm not under the impression that I'm educating anyone here. That would require people being willing to consider other viewpoints.

Of course a science degree isn't required to look up an additive - once again, I was simply addressing one user's system of not ingesting anything which has an ingredient he or she can't pronounce. That is a very different story from a person such as yourself who has chosen to avoid a handful of specific additives.

And regarding your comment that nature has all of the vitamins every single person needs, that simply isn't true in every case. For example, vitamin B2 (aka riboflavin) supplementation is a very common part of treatment protocols for migraine sufferers. While many foods are indeed rich in vitamin B2, the amount of those foods you'd need to eat in order to achieve clinical efficacy just isn't feasible. For the average person with no health issues though, yes, whole foods do contain what you need, and taking supplements beyond that is just making expensive pee.

*sigh* Now you are just being silly.

If someone chooses to eat natural foods and avoid additives, why do you care?

mikejs20

Personally I try to avoid process food, I eat a lot of fruit and veg grown on my allotment when its available or I go to our local indoor market, I find supermarket shopping is a nightmare there just seems to be isles of processed crap, ready meals full of sugar (who adds sugar to spag boll?) I do eat a lot of chicken which seems to be creping up in price all the time. I hate takeaways especially burgers (apparently if there was no lettuce in a big mac it would be classed as a desert wtf? )

I like to roast my vegetables in a little olive oil which helps your body absorb the vitamins, my biggest problem is the amount of coffee I seem to consume which is one of the only things I get in a supermarket.

thekyleo

The only pro-God food plan....

http://www.danielplan.com/

:insertsarcasm:

I was waiting for someone to mention this

awtume9

Now there are going to be dozens of people that are things like gym teachers, stay at home dads and car sales men that are going to come into this thread and tout that "science" does not suggest that eating kale is better than eating doritos and that will fight tooth and nail that a cheeseburger from 5 guys is just as healthy as a spinach salad. I laugh and move on.

What does this even mean?

sullus

The only pro-God food plan....

http://www.danielplan.com/

:insertsarcasm:

I was waiting for someone to mention this

Heh - the "Miracle Diet" ... You can only have Fish Sandwiches and Wine.

JoRocka

Now there are going to be dozens of people that are things like gym teachers, stay at home dads and car sales men that are going to come into this thread and tout that "science" does not suggest that eating kale is better than eating doritos and that will fight tooth and nail that a cheeseburger from 5 guys is just as healthy as a spinach salad. I laugh and move on.

What does this even mean?

considering kale is absolutely the most disgusting thing pushed on us by the "health food" guru's I'm all about dorito's and bugers.

*kitten* eating kale. that *kitten* is nasty.

stealthq

Now there are going to be dozens of people that are things like gym teachers, stay at home dads and car sales men that are going to come into this thread and tout that "science" does not suggest that eating kale is better than eating doritos and that will fight tooth and nail that a cheeseburger from 5 guys is just as healthy as a spinach salad. I laugh and move on.

What does this even mean?

That she believes that the only people who make posts referring to science are know-nothings. Oh, and that context (as far as your overall diet and needs) does not matter when considering which food is a better choice.

Whatever. Perhaps she does not realize that there are plenty of people on here who have science careers. And that there are plenty of people who simply enjoy science and know what they're talking about, degree or no.

CrusherKun

The only pro-God food plan....

http://www.danielplan.com/

:insertsarcasm:

I was waiting for someone to mention this

Is this the "Fishes and Loaves" diet? Cause i eat a whole whitefish fillet and 2 slices of 12 grain bread (yes 12 as in the appossels (typo likely sue me) - 3-4 times a week....Im down for it

RelevantKnowledge

I've always enjoyed nutrient dense foods over those of less nutritional density, but I've never really considered myself a "clean eater". I don't kick myself for enjoying a couple beers a night or for the weekly "dirty" burger and fries. To each their own, I suppose.

ChrisM8971

If you cant pronounce the names of the ingredients or the list takes up half the label, you shouldn't be putting it in your body.

Then what do you eat??? Even fruits and veggies are made up of things I can't pronounce....

Wow, where do you shop? I have yet to see the ingredient list of chemicals on the side of an apple.

here you go...

Alpha-Linolenic-Acid, Asparagine, D-Categin, Isoqurctrin, Hyperoside, Ferulic-Acid, Farnesene, Neoxathin, Phosphatidyl-Choline, Reynoutrin, Sinapic-Acid, Caffeic-Acid, Chlorogenic-Acid, P-Hydroxy-Benzoic-Acid, P-Coumaric-Acid, Avicularin, Lutein, Quercitin, Rutin, Ursolic-Acid, Protocatechuic-Acid, and Silver, Vitamin A, B1, B2, and B6, Niacin, Pantothenic acid, Folic acid, Vitamin C and Vitamin E, Calcium, Copper, Iron, Magnesium, Manganese, Phosphorus, Pottassium, Selenium, Sodium, and Zinc, Tryptophan, Threonine, Isoleucine, Leucine, Lycine, Methionine, Cystine, Phenylalanine, Tyrosine, Valine, Argenine, Histidine, Alanine, Aspartic Acid, Glutamic Acid, Glycine, Proline, and Serine and Trace amounts of Boron and Cobalt

I'd suggest steering clear of you apple until you figure out what all of these things are...

What stores show this on their labels?

Love this view on things, so if the food industry comes up with nice, easily pronounceable names for everything on the box then hey presto, its clean?

Best to eat all foods in moderation

stealthq

Also, the people who think natural = better are deluding themselves. Everything in nature has well-developed defense mechanisms. Surviving in nature is a constant arms race. Nature doesn't exist for our benefit. The history of organisms is a history of species taking advantage of one another, developing defenses against each other, and evolving new ways to get past those defenses and continue taking advantage of one another.

We exist because we evolved to survive despite other organisms' best efforts to screw us over. We evolved to be able to TOLERATE things in nature. They didn't evolve for OUR benefit.

No, no, NO!

We are the center of the universe. Everything was created to serve us! Isn't it obvious!? That's why there's nothing natural that can harm us in any way!!!

Oh. Wait ...