2 weeks on Lyle Mcdonald's RFLD...advice please?

deethebee83

Hello...first of all please can I ask people to refrain from making judgements about me doing this diet and how unhealthy it is. It's not a long-term diet and I've tried everything else to lose weight and this has been my absolute last resort.

I have PCOS and so obviously have a very sluggish metabolism. I'm 5ft 2, 31, 147lbs so in the overweight category and would like to lose 10-20lbs to be within a healthy BMI. I've tried healthy eating, low carb, modest calorie restriction, and now I'm trying "starvation". Even though I know it's a bad way to lose weight, I figured it's fool proof. How can you NOT lose weight on less than 1,000 cals a day right?? Well, I'm 2 weeks in and the scale hasn't budged...at all. the good news is that my measurements have decreased...slightly! But measurements alone can be deceiving as you could measure slightly higher or lower and get different results so I decided to use both the scale and measurements. I recently bought a new scale that measures BF and muscle and according to this scale I'm at 31% BF and 33% muscle. I was working out before starting this diet but stopped due to the low calories so I don't see how I could have gained muscle.

I'm struggling to keep going as the hunger in unbearable and including my free meals and refeeds I'm taking in an average of around 900 cals per day. I was hoping anyone who's had experience with this kind of diet may be able to offer some possible reasons why my scale weight hasn't moved at all. I can't be retaining water for this long. I'm drinking plenty of water as well! I'm not sure if I can continue with this at this rate but if this doesn't work and nothing else has I'm completely stuck!

Thanks for any help

Cortelli

Starvation? Free meals and refeeds? Don't do silly things like this.

Branstin

If you re-read your post then you will find that you answered your own quesiton. It seems that you have kicked your body into stravation mode and it is holding onto the little bit of food it is getting which could cause weight gain and weight stalling.

Have you spoken to your doctor, nutritionist, and a dietitian?

lindsey1979

If you have PCOS, you likely have insulin resistance. Low carb is the best diet for those of us with insulin resistance because it helps control the insulin spikes caused by carbs (especially high glycemic carbs). It is often very difficult to lose weight if you have insulin resistance for this reason. One drug that is very commonly prescribed to help with this is metformin, which helps your body metabolize glucose properly.

I'd speak to your doctor and/or a nutritionist about both of these issues -- it's extremely common to be very hard to take off weight with PCOS and insulin resistance.

19TaraLynn84

You said to please refrain from making judgements, but you also asked for advice. I'll have to make a judgement to give you my advice. You are hungry. You need to eat. You already stated it's a bad way to lose weight, so no one needs to tell you this. Since you only have a small amount to lose, you will have to accept that it's not going to come off quickly. Please stop trying extreme dieting and just find a moderate deficit to aim for. You will be much happier and much healthier.


ETA: I know it's harder to lose weight with PCOS, but there are plenty of women who have done it without extreme measures.

Miamiuu

Do you know how many carbs you are eating now? Perhaps if you lowered your carbs some and ate more protiens you would feel fuller and not feel the hunger urges. Also ask your doctor about phetermine I think its called that since you have tried everything Its a drug Ive seen people talk about on here helping them lose weight. Might be able to eat more than 900 with it and still lose weight.

deethebee83

Hi all, first of all thanks for the responses, but as I said I have tried everything and I just wanted advice on why I may not have lost any scale weight. I have done an awful lot of research and as I said this was a last resort.

Branstin - starvation mode takes longer than 2 weeks to kick in. I'm saying I've not lost ANY scale weight since starting - not that I've stalled. As far as I understand it, metabolism tends to take at least a month to slow and it's only by about 10% so eating under 1,000 cals should still produce weight loss. Also I believe that metabolism doesn't slow as much if you're within 1,000 cals of maintenance cals and I certainly am.

Lindsey - I don't have IR, I've had all the tests done. I've done low carb and it only worked in the beginning. I staye at the same weight for 2 years on low carb. Even did Atkins at the beginning of the year eating under 20g carbs a day and gained weight. It's not all about carbs for me. I've been on metformin in the past and it did nothing, prescribed not because I have IR but just to see if it would help me lose weight. I've also spoken to dieticians and my doctor - they can't offer me anything I don't already know or haven't already tried.

TaraLynn - the advice was about why I haven't lost weight on this diet, not general weight loss advice because I've done a ton of research and haven't found the answer for me. It's not like I've been doing this for months, it's 2 weeks. Before that I was eating far more calories at a deficit but still wasn't losing anything. I'm all for being healthy but there hasn't BEEN a healthy way for me to lose any weight. 2 YEARS I've been at a plateau increasing cals, decreasing cals, cutting this cutting that. I have done it all. This is the first time I've decided to go extreme because nothing else was working. I'm sick of waiting around for years for something to click and work.

Miamiuu - I can't really go any lower on carbs, I'm only eating around 20g a day mostly veg. Most of my cals come from protein. It's a perfectly designed "crash" diet and this is why I can't understand the lack of weight loss. I'll check with my doctor about what you mentioned though, thanks.

Sadly I'm still lacking a reasonable explanation as to why my body just won't shift the extra fat. Oh well!

usmcmp

Sadly I'm still lacking a reasonable explanation as to why my body just won't shift the extra fat. Oh well!

You aren't being accurate. You aren't weighing and measuring everything. Bites, licks and tastes add up. I did RFLD and with how restrictive it was I had "just a bite" of everything my kids ate. It's better to stick to lower carbs (since you have PCOS) and a reasonable deficit. Be accurate. Strength train.

deethebee83

Oh I definitely am being accurate - I weigh everything that goes into my mouth whether it's veggies, protein or yoghurt! The only times I slip a little is on free days and I still try to add an estimated amount to my daily calories. But even if I ate 3000 cals on those days which would not be possible since I'm refeeding on starches and fruits I would still only be taking in an average on 1,200 cals a day which should still produce SOME weight loss. I absolutely do not take bites of things until they're weighed and accounted for or part of a free meal and I know they won't be a big deal.

It may still be water loss so I'll give it a few days and see...

LolBroScience

open your diary.

Cortelli

Hi all, first of all thanks for the responses, . . . [snip]

It sounds like you've really done your homework and also consulted your physician. Absent some undiagnosed medical condition, it really sounds like somehow, some way, you're consuming more calories then you think you are.

I agree with LolBroScience - open your diary and maybe one of us will spot something that helps identify the mystery.

But please don't do this quasi attempt at "starvation" - it is silly -- unhealthy, and not sustainable.

lindsey1979

I don't know --- it definitely sounds like something is up. When I went in for a thyroid issue, my doc checked a whole bunch of stuff -- adrenals, liver, glucose/insulin, vitamin deficiencies, etc. -- that's how he found the insulin resistance as well as two other severe vitamin deficiencies (D and magnesium). Unless you get it all on track, they can mask one another in certain aspects -- like inability to lose weight.

So, if you're really confident in your intake/exercise calculations, the only thing I can think of is that you have something else going on that you don't know about in addition to the PCOS. Any chance you can speak with someone that specializes in metabolism specifically?

icame2win60

Your problem is that you're following diet advice from someone with the last name McDonald. You should have known better, I'm very disappointed in you OP.

deethebee83

Ok I've made my diary public, however, on my "free" days I don't always count all calories but I make sure it's no more than 200 calories more than what's in my diary (those days are a Weds and a Sat). I am really not one of those people who just munches on things randomly or estimates consumption. If I snack on something it's after it's accounted for and weighed. The extras I have on my cheat days may be something like 5 almonds, one chocolate and a piece of fruit. You can choose to not believe me if you want but that's the truth. Also, the first week I was very ill so one day shows only 200 calories taken in all day and that's accurate because I was too ill to eat anything else.

Anyway, since posting this I have noticed a change in the scale so I'm assuming it was water weight. I'm down to 145.4lbs now and 30.5% body fat. It's only 1.4lbs loss since the start but at least it's something I suppose. I also mentioned in my original post that my measurements appear to have gone down so I know I've lost SOMETHING, I just couldn't figure out why the scale wasn't showing it.

Cortelli - The only calories I don't log on low cal days will be something like a small bit of cucumber or some lettuce. Absolutely nothing significant. Even if I were consuming 300 cals more a day than I'm logging (which is not possible!) I'd still be in a deficit. You can leave out the judgements of this diet please. I'm not here to be convinced to do something else and I don't plan on sustaining it long term. I am following a plan set out in a book by a fitness professional and it's perfectly safe. I wouldn't say it's silly if it's a last resort and the only other option is to remain overweight.

Lindsey - I've had my glucose and thyroid and all that checked. My thryoid was borderline so I have to go back for another test in a few months as it has been borderline before but then it went back into normal a few months later. As for vitamin deficiencies, I take supplements but before starting this diet I worked very hard at making sure I was eating a wide variety of nutrients. I will ask to check other vitamin levels next time I go anyway. I'm very confident about my calculations in my food diary - I tend to underestimate the exercise and I take off calories from them as well to make up for the calories I would have burned resting. My diary is very accurate apart from on refeed days as mentioned above but I do work out on those days and I don't eat my exercise cals. I'm one of those very strict dieters - no matter how crap I feel I will keep going and log everything if I'm determined to do it. Not any specialists I can see in my area unfortunately but I will ask my GP in case!

mercurywinks

I've noticed that you seem to state continually, to several different posters that you have free days or what ever...and you make sure that you don't go over 200 calories on those days and you say things like you under estimate your exorcise, or over estimate it. Sounds to me like to much guess work. If your desperate enough to do this insane diet, you desperate enough to buckle down and really count EVERYTHING, even on your off days. It's obvious you've done your research and your home work and had all the testing done that you need to but you have to remember, no matter WHAT the normal results are for this kind of diet, no matter what the standard results are for ANY kind of diet, every human body is made a little differently. My room mate has PCOS and she tried a diet, specialized and paid for with her specific medical conditions in mind and she gained 5 pounds, even following the diet. It was just something unique to her bodily process.
You say you've tried everything, well now you've tried this to, and its not working either. Maybe you should move on to something else or just focus on living your life and eating the best way possible for you.

deethebee83

Mercurywinks - I never said I overestimate my exercise. I sometimes put in 60 minutes when I've done 70. That would mean I'm burning off MORE than I'm estimating, which is a good thing. I also choose the activity that burns the least amount of weight e.g. if I'm cycling and it feels like I'm putting in a good effort I still choose "light effort" when I add it in to my diary. 400 extra calories of food a week is really no big deal, it makes so little difference if a lb of fat is 3,500. If I was eating say, an extra burger or a bag of chips and not counting it I'd tend to agree with you but I'm not. I'm saying that at least 90% of my calories are accounted for - I don't say that's too much guesswork. If I've calculated a 5,000 cal weekly deficit but the deficit is actually 4,300 does that not still mean that I have created a deficit of more than 1lb per week? In that case even an underestimation of 700 cals should create weight loss at a rate of at least 1lb per week. I have not even lost that much. If you're suggesting that I am actually underestimating my calories by more than 1,000 per week you're wrong. If I'm lying then I'm only lying to myself. But I'm not. I do my best to count everything even on refeed days but hell I'm only human and I've slipped up, but I do my absolute best to counter it ALL in. That might mean eating a bit less the next day, exercising more, or checking the calories after I've eaten them and adding them on. If I'm out by a couple of hundred calories I know that over the course of a week it just doesn't matter that much because I've still created a large deficit.

Anyway, obviously if I could just be happy with my weight then I wouldn't be here in the first place. But I'm miserable either way so I figure it's better to be miserable and losing weight than miserable and gaining it, leading to further misery. I have not yet come to the conclusion that this diet just doesn't work. 2 weeks isn't enough to determine that and my body has changed a bit so really it's working better than the other diets have! Outside of this diet there are no other things to try so I'm afraid I can't just give up, I have to give it a good go.

MonaLisaLianne

You might want to check out "The Fast Diet." You eat sensibly (meaning healthy foods and reasonable calories) 5 days a week, and on two non-consecutive days you limit yourself to 500 calories. My husband was well on the way to metabolic syndrome. By following a variation of The Fast Diet, and walking for 10 minutes every day, he succeeded in losing 35 lbs., brought his fasting blood glucose to normal levels, and lowered his blood pressure to almost normal.

deethebee83

You might want to check out "The Fast Diet." You eat sensibly (meaning healthy foods and reasonable calories) 5 days a week, and on two non-consecutive days you limit yourself to 500 calories. My husband was well on the way to metabolic syndrome. By following a variation of The Fast Diet, and walking for 10 minutes every day, he succeeded in losing 35 lbs., brought his fasting blood glucose to normal levels, and lowered his blood pressure to almost normal.

Sorry to say I've tried that with no results. It only creates a modest deficit if your maintenance cals are below 2,000 a day. I estimate mine to be at about 1,600 (accounting for genetics and PCOS) so my deficit would only be 2,200 a week. If I can't even lose 1lb per week on a 5,000 cal deficit imagine what it's like trying to lose on a 2,200 deficit. It drives you insane counting calories religiously for years on end and even if weight loss was linear (which it isn't) it'd take me at least 4 months just to lose 10lbs and I'd have to be very strict with my maintenance intake. Honestly I find that far more unsustainable than a short term crash diet that would take half that amount of time and allows for breaks and flexibility. I think it can be a helpful way to lose weight for people who have high maintenance cals but not for everyone. My mom's the same. She's an inch shorter than me, most likely only burning 1,500 cals a day and has tried doing the 5:2 diet as well but not lost anything.

usmcmp

Ok I've made my diary public, however, on my "free" days I don't always count all calories but I make sure it's no more than 200 calories more than what's in my diary (those days are a Weds and a Sat). I am really not one of those people who just munches on things randomly or estimates consumption. If I snack on something it's after it's accounted for and weighed. The extras I have on my cheat days may be something like 5 almonds, one chocolate and a piece of fruit. You can choose to not believe me if you want but that's the truth. Also, the first week I was very ill so one day shows only 200 calories taken in all day and that's accurate because I was too ill to eat anything else.

I looked back through your diary. There were days you were eating 2000 calories and they didn't look accurate. There were days you had quick add calories, which tells me you are NOT accurate. The moment you stop lying to yourself you will see results. You are eating more than you think you are.

I did the calculations for you and here is my suggestion: For the next month eat 1500 calories every day on the dot while being 100% accurate. If you can't weigh it or account for it perfectly do not eat it. Get at least 110g of protein. Start strength training.

Cortelli

I looked back through your diary. There were days you were eating 2000 calories and they didn't look accurate. There were days you had quick add calories, which tells me you are NOT accurate. The moment you stop lying to yourself you will see results. You are eating more than you think you are.

I did the calculations for you and here is my suggestion: For the next month eat 1500 calories every day on the dot while being 100% accurate. If you can't weigh it or account for it perfectly do not eat it. Get at least 110g of protein. Start strength training.

I think this is likely good advice for you, OP. I only spent a little bit of time reviewing your diary, but the thing that always leaps out at me for people who insist they are weighing everything, is how frequently the servings come up as nice, round numbers (eg 100g, 150g, 50g, 70g). I *do not* weigh religiously, but when I do weigh, I am constantly getting 113g, 64g, 96g, etc. -- if you are really struggling with tracking and losing weight, then I implore you to be rigorously accurate and truthful with yourself -- weigh everything (don't figure you might have a few hundred extra calories per day but it couldn't possibly be more) and record the weight accurately -- don't round and don't estimate. Accurate data will set you free.

And while I appreciate your struggle,

You can leave out the judgements of this diet please.

Sorry - this isn't happy, happy zone. I will not "judge" *you* as a bad person, but I absolutely will feel free to share my view on this diet you're experimenting with. You of course are free to ignore it.

deethebee83

Ok I've made my diary public, however, on my "free" days I don't always count all calories but I make sure it's no more than 200 calories more than what's in my diary (those days are a Weds and a Sat). I am really not one of those people who just munches on things randomly or estimates consumption. If I snack on something it's after it's accounted for and weighed. The extras I have on my cheat days may be something like 5 almonds, one chocolate and a piece of fruit. You can choose to not believe me if you want but that's the truth. Also, the first week I was very ill so one day shows only 200 calories taken in all day and that's accurate because I was too ill to eat anything else.

I looked back through your diary. There were days you were eating 2000 calories and they didn't look accurate. There were days you had quick add calories, which tells me you are NOT accurate. The moment you stop lying to yourself you will see results. You are eating more than you think you are.

I did the calculations for you and here is my suggestion: For the next month eat 1500 calories every day on the dot while being 100% accurate. If you can't weigh it or account for it perfectly do not eat it. Get at least 110g of protein. Start strength training.

I don't know if you are ignoring my posts or if you're just trying to be arrogant but I already explained that those days with 2000 or so cals are my free days and on those days I have slipped up by around 200 cals which would not make a big dent in my deficit. As I said above, 90% of my cals are accurate. All other days every morsel is accounted for apart from maybe a few lettuce leaves and some cucumber. Nothing that could make much of an impact on the deficit. I don't see any point in lying to myself or anyone else. I'd be wasting everyone's time including my own. Who are you to say that my diary doesn't "look" accurate?? Am I missing something about how an accurate diary should look?? And in general if I haven't logged all my cals for the day I don't click the complete button at the bottom. If you really wanted to be nitpicky you could go over the last 2 weeks and check which days I completed my diary and which I didn't!

I didn't make this post to ask for how anyone else thinks I should be eating to lose weight. There's a very good reason why I've chosen this diet and why I am NOT going to do what you suggest. And the last time I checked there was such a thing as freedom of choice. It's my choice. Why do you feel the need to put me down for that? Does it make you feel important or good about yourself? I actually find this diet to be far more sustainable for me than a moderate calorie deficit that forces me to eat at the exact same cals EVERY day for months on end! Do you not think I've been there, done that? It's not for me. I'm doing what is sustainable for me based on experience because, you know, we're not all the same! When are people going to realise that and drop the judgemental "know it all" attitude? I don't know why I expected more from people on this site, I've seen it so many times before. You've found what works for you obviously, that's great. Does that mean that you know what will work for me or have any right to tell me I'm lying to myself? I don't think so. If you really want to believe that I am underestimating my calories by more than 4,000 a week despite everything I've said then please take your suggestions and give them to someone who wants them. You obviously have trouble believing that someone could be at a large deficit and not losing much weight and that's just ignorant. All I'm trying to do is find out why and fix the problem. If you think a 1500 calorie diet is going to generate more weight loss than my current diet then you must think there are over 6000 calories unaccounted for in my week! What would even be the point in taking the time to fill in a food diary if you were going to be THAT inaccurate?? Wow. I didn't realise I came across as so damn stupid. Stupid enough to trust people to look at my food diary, maybe even read the notes where I am brutally honest, and not start calling me a liar because that's the ONLY possible explanation for my lack of weight loss. Can't possibly have anything to do with water retention or a slow metabolism or some other factor. Ignore all the other ways I said I've tried to lose weight in the past because someone who so blatantly LIES would not put in that much effort and years of their life to fix their health. I assume your suggestion is based on some average calculations yet I don't believe anything I've said should give the impression that I'm an average female with a healthy metabolism. If I really wanted some idea of what an average female needs to lose weight, I wouldn't need you to give it to me.

Oh and by the way, I'm a training Nutritionist. Wasting time trying to lose weight whilst lying about it would not only be pointless in my personal life but also my professional life. But thanks for being a good example of a general faceless internet know it all.