Why I hate Body Fat Percentage!

BusyRaeNOTBusty

Good post OP.

vismal

I hear people saying: No no, don't use scale weight use bodyfat percentage! Or no, no don't use body fat percentage use appearance. Or no no don't use appearance use tape measure.

I'm just sitting here thinking to myself...why not just use all of them. Its not like you have to pick one. More data the better right?

This is what I was saying. Why not track weight, body fat, measurements, etc. Even blood work, lifting stats and mile run times are good things to track. They are all indicators of progress. Plus, with body composition it is better to have lots of data.

I think what Vismal is saying (and he can correct me if I am wrong) is not so much omg don't do this its a waste of time so much as he is saying that too many people become myopically focused on achieving the magic number of 10% or 18% and ignore other factors that are arguably more important like...how much energy do they have....how strong are they feeling....how far can they run....what is their functional strength....how do they look.

That said I think its perfectly fine to measure bodyfat percentage and have a goal in mind, just as long as you are rational enough to realize that measurements aren't 100% accurate and your goal might end up needing to shift as you learn more about your own body.

The is exactly what I was attempting to convey.

Yagisama

I'll be honest, I use a handheld electrical impedance device to track body fat. I don't care about accuracy, as long as the device has somewhat decent precision.

I just care about a general trend over a long period of time and I know that different levels of hydration can influence the result.

That said, I don't really have a goal body fat percentage. And if I really cared about a somewhat more accurate figure, I'd schedule a water displacement test. But it's just one (of many) metrics for me and I just keep track of it for fun.

usmcmp

I think what Vismal is saying (and he can correct me if I am wrong) is not so much omg don't do this its a waste of time so much as he is saying that too many people become myopically focused on achieving the magic number of 10% or 18% and ignore other factors that are arguably more important like...how much energy do they have....how strong are they feeling....how far can they run....what is their functional strength....how do they look.

That said I think its perfectly fine to measure bodyfat percentage and have a goal in mind, just as long as you are rational enough to realize that measurements aren't 100% accurate and your goal might end up needing to shift as you learn more about your own body.

That can be said about everything. Don't focus only on scale. Don't focus only on body fat. Don't focus only on looks (this can be one of the worst). There are tons of goal posts people have in fitness or weight loss and they let those determine their worth.

albayin

I think what Vismal is saying (and he can correct me if I am wrong) is not so much omg don't do this its a waste of time so much as he is saying that too many people become myopically focused on achieving the magic number of 10% or 18% and ignore other factors that are arguably more important like...how much energy do they have....how strong are they feeling....how far can they run....what is their functional strength....how do they look.

That said I think its perfectly fine to measure bodyfat percentage and have a goal in mind, just as long as you are rational enough to realize that measurements aren't 100% accurate and your goal might end up needing to shift as you learn more about your own body.

That can be said about everything. Don't focus only on scale. Don't focus only on body fat. Don't focus only on looks (this can be one of the worst). There are tons of goal posts people have in fitness or weight loss and they let those determine their worth.

Seriously...I actually like using clothes fit...but it has to be the same pair of old pants...

usmcmp

I think what Vismal is saying (and he can correct me if I am wrong) is not so much omg don't do this its a waste of time so much as he is saying that too many people become myopically focused on achieving the magic number of 10% or 18% and ignore other factors that are arguably more important like...how much energy do they have....how strong are they feeling....how far can they run....what is their functional strength....how do they look.

That said I think its perfectly fine to measure bodyfat percentage and have a goal in mind, just as long as you are rational enough to realize that measurements aren't 100% accurate and your goal might end up needing to shift as you learn more about your own body.

That can be said about everything. Don't focus only on scale. Don't focus only on body fat. Don't focus only on looks (this can be one of the worst). There are tons of goal posts people have in fitness or weight loss and they let those determine their worth.

Seriously...I actually like using clothes fit...but it has to be the same pair of old pants...

Mine are a few pairs of pants, but they have to be freshly washed.

No_Finish_Line

Tape measures can increase due to bloating or increased fat or water retention.
Scale weight can increase due to water weight or fat or lean mass or all of them.

Some people are going to obsess about anything and everything. Instead of saying they shouldn't focus on body fat (which actually is a good thing to track along with weight and measurements) you should have just said people should just stop obsessing about numbers in general. I think people should take as many data points as possible. Weight, measurements, calipers, bio electrical impedance, lifting stats, blood tests, mile times, etc.

You point out that the tests are not accurate, which I agree, but if they use the same method over and over it gives them a fairly constant trend. They might be off 5%, but they will probably always be off 5%.

But if a body fat percentage technique has a margin of error of +/- 5% then to me it's 100% worthless. So if it says 15% I could be as high as 20 which means I still have lots of fat to lose, or as low as 10 which means I have very little fat left to lose. The trends aren't reliable either meaning they are not always off by the same amount. If that were true they would have more use. I agree tape measurements and scale weights can be thrown off by water retention. But If you weigh yourself daily, and take a weekly average, comparing week to week over the course of a month, that will account for water weight swings. Scale weight would only increase due to lean mass if you were actively trying to gain lean mass, in which case, you want scale weight to go up.

if you've ever used a caliper on yourself, you know that its basically impossible to get the same % twice

I think the formula's that require you to input different tape measure measurments (while the least accurate) are by far the most consistent.

when using calipers, you have to worry about errors in the input (slightly different test sight or amount of skin you pinch will make a big difference).

Its hard to screw up a tape measurement. so changes in the % are due to actual changes in your body.

EDIT: suprised you are advocating daily weighting

No_Finish_Line

An untrained male can gain about 26 lbs of lean mass in his first year of training if he is eating in a SURPLUS.

Holy crap should I be so lucky, I was thinking it was more like 10 lbs not 26.

That number comes from this article: http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/muscle-gain/whats-my-genetic-muscular-potential.html

i don't care it comes from, few if any will ever gain that much in a year.

most would be lucky to put on 30 lbs of actually muscle during thier entire lifting career IMO

CA_Underdog

But my entire point was at what point would high accuracy ever be critical?

I agree we rarely need high accuracy--consistency is plenty! Professional athletes may differ. I didn't take on the majority of your post, just your knock on BIA scales as "trash", when I've found them helpful.

At what point is knowing that number going to change anything? I bet you knew your body fat was decreasing despite that graph.

I use it in the following ways--

1. Your real body fat % doesn't change much day-to-day. A small change in body fat % gives me more confidence in a weight reading. A big change in body fat % gives me less confidence in a weight reading. In other words, this help me figure out if that weekly 4lb weight loss is "real" or simply due to water weight.

2. When you hit a weight-loss plateau, what your body fat percentage is doing can be both insightful and motivating. If your composition is improving, keep at it! Otherwise, it's time to consider modifying your plan.

3. It helps gauge the relative effectiveness of a particular fitness regimen. I've done ones where I lost weight but my body fat % remained relatively unchanged. I started a new one and I'm curious how it will compare.

I'm wondering how often people are actually compliant with all these things.
Abstain from eating and drinking within 4 hours of the test
Avoid exercising within 12 hours of the test
Void (urinate) completely prior to testing
Avoid taking diuretics prior to testing unless instructed by your physician

Weighing in the morning, after peeing, gets you most of the above.

Do not drink alcohol within 48 hours of the test

I've never found a can of beer, a glass of wine, or a light workout to impact results much. If you drink heavily, and don't replenish with water, certainly that can have a dehydrating effect and affect results! Also, I've found long endurance efforts such as marathons can influence results closer to 48 hours.

I question whether the guy making 10 bucks an hour at planet fitness is going to help create a "perfect condition".

That's one reason I prefer BIA. All the "cautions" are within my realm of control, and I can do it often enough (my scale uploads my results daily) to easily weed out any one-off statistically abnormalities.

oOTeresaOo

Just wanna say thanks for all the post and the info you give out. You seem very knowledgeale and can trully tell you like to help others! Anywho, Ive kicked the scale recently and went to measuring BF. Now ur tellign me not to :-/ and thats fine! I try not to obcess but i need to buckle down on nutrition. Ive dropped 40 lbs very slowly and I know its all on me, mostly over eating.
Which leads to calculating cals and macros. i work out (lift weights and run) about 3 times a week and aim for 5 doesnt always happen but if it does , then great!

So how would you suggest calculating cals/macros?

Using IIFYM calc :

Athletes Formula 170lbs 5'7"
GRAMS per day CARBS125.5, PROTEIN 170, FAT 68, FIBER 34 - 43=CALORIES 1794

Lean Mass Formula: 170 lbs 28%BF Ht 5'7"
GRAMS per day CARBS 196.1, PROTEIN153, FAT 49, FIBER 34 - 43=CALORIES 1837


Again, thanks for all the help!

No_Finish_Line

i think people often say 'well i was 180, then i lifted for a year or two, ate at a surplus, now i'm 210. So i gained 30 lbs of muscle', when that is obviously not true

WrenAlive

I've enjoyed reading this Post (and all the debate that followed) I'm just getting back into exercising (&tracking) and trying to lose the weight I put on over the last year. I was getting a little overwhelmed with all the Data out there on BF%. I have a scale That will track it but I know it is far from accurate, (it says I am appox 40%, & morbidly obese) when really at 146lbs I only have about 20ish lbs of extra fat. I also started Tracking BF by a Measurement comparison calculation, (neck, waist & hip ) which gives me a number about 8% lower and more realistic. However it's just one other number that I am tracking, and not taking to seriously. Currently I am Taking monthly Photos, Body Measurements, BF%, and then Daily Weight.

I like charts, I like graphs, I find keeping a record keeps me motivated. I try not to let any of the numbers stress me out too much. But I was starting to overwhelm myself with all the BF data out there on what is "Ideal" how much is Healthy or what I "should" have. So this post was nice to see another take on it.

Hopefully soon I will have some real progress photos to show. But for now I just have to rely on the fact that partner thinks I feel firmer, The numbers haven't moved yet, but how I feel, and how I "feel" are what matter the most anyway.

Aaron_K123

I think what Vismal is saying (and he can correct me if I am wrong) is not so much omg don't do this its a waste of time so much as he is saying that too many people become myopically focused on achieving the magic number of 10% or 18% and ignore other factors that are arguably more important like...how much energy do they have....how strong are they feeling....how far can they run....what is their functional strength....how do they look.

That said I think its perfectly fine to measure bodyfat percentage and have a goal in mind, just as long as you are rational enough to realize that measurements aren't 100% accurate and your goal might end up needing to shift as you learn more about your own body.

That can be said about everything. Don't focus only on scale. Don't focus only on body fat. Don't focus only on looks (this can be one of the worst). There are tons of goal posts people have in fitness or weight loss and they let those determine their worth.

Well yeah but if we distill it down like that then really the answer to every question ever posed on MFP is "Don't be dumb".

yopeeps025

VIsmal is correct. My thoughts are the body fat% should become the norm for health risk issues rather the Body mass index which is even more incorrect then anything else measurement with health.

usmcmp

I think what Vismal is saying (and he can correct me if I am wrong) is not so much omg don't do this its a waste of time so much as he is saying that too many people become myopically focused on achieving the magic number of 10% or 18% and ignore other factors that are arguably more important like...how much energy do they have....how strong are they feeling....how far can they run....what is their functional strength....how do they look.

That said I think its perfectly fine to measure bodyfat percentage and have a goal in mind, just as long as you are rational enough to realize that measurements aren't 100% accurate and your goal might end up needing to shift as you learn more about your own body.

That can be said about everything. Don't focus only on scale. Don't focus only on body fat. Don't focus only on looks (this can be one of the worst). There are tons of goal posts people have in fitness or weight loss and they let those determine their worth.

Well yeah but if we distill it down like that then really the answer to every question ever posed on MFP is "Don't be dumb".

I've seen you ask the same question that you have previously answered for others.

No_Finish_Line

very interesting read about how much muscle one can expect to naturally build (with out steroids, HGH, etc) till they reach thier genetic limit

NOTE: All the formulas to arrive at your maximum muscle potential in this article are based on natural male bodybuilders who are extremely dedicated individuals and have lifted for oftentimes 10+ years.

according to the article, someone who is 5'10'' with average genetics would max out thier muscle building potential at 170 lbs (assuming 6% bf)

doesn't really discuss how much one can build, i guess thats more of a function of where you start. didn't realize that height would play a role but obviously that makes sense.

i think you'd have to be taking steriods to put on 26 lbs of actual muscle in one year

yungibear

In to save this read for later!

giftogab

this was awesomely written. thank you sir.