Why I hate Body Fat Percentage!

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  • usmcmp
    usmcmp Posts: 21,220 Member
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    very interesting read about how much muscle one can expect to naturally build (with out steroids, HGH, etc) till they reach thier genetic limit
    NOTE: All the formulas to arrive at your maximum muscle potential in this article are based on natural male bodybuilders who are extremely dedicated individuals and have lifted for oftentimes 10+ years.

    http://www.builtlean.com/2011/03/30/how-much-muscle-can-you-gain-naturally/

    How close are the men's numbers to women, in your opinion?

    I ran mine and I think over a lifetime of lifting it is fairly close. I'm about two solid years in with about 133 pounds lean mass and it says my max is about 158.

    That's what I was thinking. I'm at about 129 pounds of lbm (hydrostatic assessment)and I'm hoping to get to 133 with a 12 week bulk this winter. Of course, my bf is and will be way higher than yours - you look awesome!

    Thank you! My body fat is higher now than in the picture. I'm trying to gain. One thing to remember when gaining is that just like fat loss, lean gains are not linear. (Note: These are all approximates based on a wide variety of data) I gained 3 pounds of lean mass in my first 8 week coming off a strict diet. I gained 1 pound of lean mass the next 8 weeks and half a pound in the next 8 weeks. I'm going in for another weigh in next week.

    I just tried and failed at a 12 week bulk. I'd go up a couple of pounds and then drift back to where I was. 4 1/2 pounds of lean mass is completely awesome, especially with your base.

    Consistently overeating is WAY harder than people think it is. I think more people eat at maintenance and then gain through binges than consistently adding too much to their plate

    I have no problem eating. I gain more fat than I should because I can eat. I will have to go through lots of mini cuts. I do think a lot of people just fear eating if they've been fat before. They call it the former fat boy syndrome. Sometimes it's more successful (although seemingly very slow) to just try to recomposition.
    http://www.jcdfitness.com/2009/10/the-former-fat-boy-syndrome/
  • AlliSteff
    AlliSteff Posts: 211 Member
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    Interesting- I know that for me, I have lost maybe 1 lb over the past few months, but with checkins at my gym (having a professional measure body fat with calipers), I have dropped almost 10 % body fat. I am stronger, in good cardio shape, look much smaller, and have dropped a clothing size. And basically have lost no weight.
  • No_Finish_Line
    No_Finish_Line Posts: 3,661 Member
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    very interesting read about how much muscle one can expect to naturally build (with out steroids, HGH, etc) till they reach thier genetic limit
    NOTE: All the formulas to arrive at your maximum muscle potential in this article are based on natural male bodybuilders who are extremely dedicated individuals and have lifted for oftentimes 10+ years.

    http://www.builtlean.com/2011/03/30/how-much-muscle-can-you-gain-naturally/

    How close are the men's numbers to women, in your opinion?

    thats a good question.

    here is a link to a calculator that you put your hieght and a few other inch measurements and it gives you an idea of how much you would weight at your maximum muscle potential at a given BF %

    http://www.weightrainer.net/bodypred.html

    it doesn't toggle between male and female, which would suggest that it doesn't matter (or its a poorly constructed calculator).

    here is a link to an article with the formulas the calculator is based on. It doesn't specifically address the differences between men and women, other then to say that men will naturally have more muslce building potential because thier bodies produce more testosterone

    http://www.weightrainer.net/potential.html

    all we know is that the information is based on a study of Male natural BB. My bet is that the chart isn't that accurate for most women.




    All i wanted to say was that 26 lbs of muscle in a year, even your first year is very unlikely.

    if anyones done it they were probably well above average in genetics, and perhaps somehow underweight to begin with. or they used test or something.

    I was thinking about this last night, and i remembered a local guy that is the exact same height as me, but appears to have maybe twice as much muscle. Didn't really sync with my notions of whats really within the realm of possibility for a guy my size. so i chalked it up to him probably be well above average in genetics.

    then i remembered he was also the guy that offered to take me through a testosterone cycle.

    I guess my point is just that people should have more realistic expectations.
  • albayin
    albayin Posts: 2,524 Member
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    very interesting read about how much muscle one can expect to naturally build (with out steroids, HGH, etc) till they reach thier genetic limit
    NOTE: All the formulas to arrive at your maximum muscle potential in this article are based on natural male bodybuilders who are extremely dedicated individuals and have lifted for oftentimes 10+ years.

    http://www.builtlean.com/2011/03/30/how-much-muscle-can-you-gain-naturally/

    How close are the men's numbers to women, in your opinion?

    I ran mine and I think over a lifetime of lifting it is fairly close. I'm about two solid years in with about 133 pounds lean mass and it says my max is about 158.

    That's what I was thinking. I'm at about 129 pounds of lbm (hydrostatic assessment)and I'm hoping to get to 133 with a 12 week bulk this winter. Of course, my bf is and will be way higher than yours - you look awesome!

    Thank you! My body fat is higher now than in the picture. I'm trying to gain. One thing to remember when gaining is that just like fat loss, lean gains are not linear. (Note: These are all approximates based on a wide variety of data) I gained 3 pounds of lean mass in my first 8 week coming off a strict diet. I gained 1 pound of lean mass the next 8 weeks and half a pound in the next 8 weeks. I'm going in for another weigh in next week.

    I just tried and failed at a 12 week bulk. I'd go up a couple of pounds and then drift back to where I was. 4 1/2 pounds of lean mass is completely awesome, especially with your base.

    Consistently overeating is WAY harder than people think it is. I think more people eat at maintenance and then gain through binges than consistently adding too much to their plate

    I have no problem eating. I gain more fat than I should because I can eat. I will have to go through lots of mini cuts. I do think a lot of people just fear eating if they've been fat before. They call it the former fat boy syndrome. Sometimes it's more successful (although seemingly very slow) to just try to recomposition.
    http://www.jcdfitness.com/2009/10/the-former-fat-boy-syndrome/

    I think you hit the nail on the head...yes, I am afraid of being fat-ter than now since I have been struggling all my life to be thinner but never succeeded...I am afraid if I eat, I will end up bigger
  • albayin
    albayin Posts: 2,524 Member
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    Interesting- I know that for me, I have lost maybe 1 lb over the past few months, but with checkins at my gym (having a professional measure body fat with calipers), I have dropped almost 10 % body fat. I am stronger, in good cardio shape, look much smaller, and have dropped a clothing size. And basically have lost no weight.

    Seriously? I understand the scale number thing...but really 1 pound makes such difference? I am not doubting your words but it's just too good to be true...
  • Alastair007
    Alastair007 Posts: 673 Member
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    If you cant measure it you cant manage it. We measure calories, probably with a fair degree of inaccuracy, but because we measure it we control the amount we eat. Looking in a mirror helps but to judge the difference week by week is quite difficult if not subjective and inaccurate. Any measure, scale, pinch test (body fat), tape measure, if done with reasonably good equipment and consistently at the same time each week, will show a trend over time.
    It is rare to gain muscle without gaining fat, and to loose fat without loosing muscle. And it would seem reasonable thing to do to measure body fat and watch the trend over time. This does not suggest that after a week and based on one result you change your whole exercise and diet program, but slight modifications over time.
  • AlliSteff
    AlliSteff Posts: 211 Member
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    Interesting- I know that for me, I have lost maybe 1 lb over the past few months, but with checkins at my gym (having a professional measure body fat with calipers), I have dropped almost 10 % body fat. I am stronger, in good cardio shape, look much smaller, and have dropped a clothing size. And basically have lost no weight.

    Seriously? I understand the scale number thing...but really 1 pound makes such difference? I am not doubting your words but it's just too good to be true...

    I mean, I would LOVE it if my scale was wrong! But I weight myself once a week, same time of day....and yeah. The difference has really been the body fat for me (I upped my lifting game) anad it is definitely visible. I put on a dress yesterday with short sleeves (which were like a little too tight last year), and it fit perfectly. The shirts that I have purchased recently haven been smalls and extra smalls (except for Theory- why do they run so small!?), the dresses and skirts have all been smalls. They would have all been mediums last summer.
  • yopeeps025
    yopeeps025 Posts: 8,680 Member
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    Interesting- I know that for me, I have lost maybe 1 lb over the past few months, but with checkins at my gym (having a professional measure body fat with calipers), I have dropped almost 10 % body fat. I am stronger, in good cardio shape, look much smaller, and have dropped a clothing size. And basically have lost no weight.

    Seriously? I understand the scale number thing...but really 1 pound makes such difference? I am not doubting your words but it's just too good to be true...

    I mean, I would LOVE it if my scale was wrong! But I weight myself once a week, same time of day....and yeah. The difference has really been the body fat for me (I upped my lifting game) anad it is definitely visible. I put on a dress yesterday with short sleeves (which were like a little too tight last year), and it fit perfectly. The shirts that I have purchased recently haven been smalls and extra smalls (except for Theory- why do they run so small!?), the dresses and skirts have all been smalls. They would have all been mediums last summer.

    Calipers are not that accurate and they only tell you the fat under the skin you have lost .You clearly loss something though. What about the Visceral fat? Time to take a ride in the body pod for better body fat % results.
  • likitisplit
    likitisplit Posts: 9,420 Member
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    Interesting- I know that for me, I have lost maybe 1 lb over the past few months, but with checkins at my gym (having a professional measure body fat with calipers), I have dropped almost 10 % body fat. I am stronger, in good cardio shape, look much smaller, and have dropped a clothing size. And basically have lost no weight.

    Seriously? I understand the scale number thing...but really 1 pound makes such difference? I am not doubting your words but it's just too good to be true...

    I mean, I would LOVE it if my scale was wrong! But I weight myself once a week, same time of day....and yeah. The difference has really been the body fat for me (I upped my lifting game) anad it is definitely visible. I put on a dress yesterday with short sleeves (which were like a little too tight last year), and it fit perfectly. The shirts that I have purchased recently haven been smalls and extra smalls (except for Theory- why do they run so small!?), the dresses and skirts have all been smalls. They would have all been mediums last summer.

    Wasn't it "I Lift Heavy Acrylics" who did a year recomp - maintenance + heavy lifting. 134 to 134 lbs and the difference is breath-taking.
  • likitisplit
    likitisplit Posts: 9,420 Member
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    Interesting- I know that for me, I have lost maybe 1 lb over the past few months, but with checkins at my gym (having a professional measure body fat with calipers), I have dropped almost 10 % body fat. I am stronger, in good cardio shape, look much smaller, and have dropped a clothing size. And basically have lost no weight.

    Seriously? I understand the scale number thing...but really 1 pound makes such difference? I am not doubting your words but it's just too good to be true...

    I mean, I would LOVE it if my scale was wrong! But I weight myself once a week, same time of day....and yeah. The difference has really been the body fat for me (I upped my lifting game) anad it is definitely visible. I put on a dress yesterday with short sleeves (which were like a little too tight last year), and it fit perfectly. The shirts that I have purchased recently haven been smalls and extra smalls (except for Theory- why do they run so small!?), the dresses and skirts have all been smalls. They would have all been mediums last summer.

    Calipers are not that accurate and they only tell you the fat under the skin you have lost .You clearly loss something though. What about the Visceral fat? Time to take a ride in the body pod for better body fat % results.

    If she wants to go that far. To the OP's point, aren't the results she's getting good enough to make a solid decision about what she's doing?
  • MamaFunky
    MamaFunky Posts: 735 Member
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    I had a BF analysis not to long ago and it came it at 15.5% This seems about right since I am seeing some increased ab and over all muscle definition. I did it more out of curiosity and as a tool to help guide me in on my fitness journey. I turned 40 and was getting all kinds of other general health tests done like cholesterol, etc...so I just thought it would be good to know.

    Was it 100% accurate...not sure...but it was good to see what it came out to be. The trainer did a 7 point test with calipers 3 different times, then took the average. I wouldn't mind doing it again in the next few months...I would be curious if it decreases as I up my strength training, or possibly increase depending on other circumstances.

    OP you make some great points, as always. If someone wants to get an analysis completed, do it with a reputable trainer that knows what they are doing and use it as a guide. Just like we use the scale, our clothes, our cholesterol levels, etc....I think it can be useless information for everyone. Not necessary, but useful.
  • yopeeps025
    yopeeps025 Posts: 8,680 Member
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    Interesting- I know that for me, I have lost maybe 1 lb over the past few months, but with checkins at my gym (having a professional measure body fat with calipers), I have dropped almost 10 % body fat. I am stronger, in good cardio shape, look much smaller, and have dropped a clothing size. And basically have lost no weight.

    Seriously? I understand the scale number thing...but really 1 pound makes such difference? I am not doubting your words but it's just too good to be true...

    I mean, I would LOVE it if my scale was wrong! But I weight myself once a week, same time of day....and yeah. The difference has really been the body fat for me (I upped my lifting game) anad it is definitely visible. I put on a dress yesterday with short sleeves (which were like a little too tight last year), and it fit perfectly. The shirts that I have purchased recently haven been smalls and extra smalls (except for Theory- why do they run so small!?), the dresses and skirts have all been smalls. They would have all been mediums last summer.

    Wasn't it "I Lift Heavy Acrylics" who did a year recomp - maintenance + heavy lifting. 134 to 134 lbs and the difference is breath-taking.

    I have figure out my body recomp diet. Now I want to try to push for a little bit more fat lost and still get stronger. That is a perfect diet needed for that.
  • likitisplit
    likitisplit Posts: 9,420 Member
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    very interesting read about how much muscle one can expect to naturally build (with out steroids, HGH, etc) till they reach thier genetic limit
    NOTE: All the formulas to arrive at your maximum muscle potential in this article are based on natural male bodybuilders who are extremely dedicated individuals and have lifted for oftentimes 10+ years.

    http://www.builtlean.com/2011/03/30/how-much-muscle-can-you-gain-naturally/

    How close are the men's numbers to women, in your opinion?

    I ran mine and I think over a lifetime of lifting it is fairly close. I'm about two solid years in with about 133 pounds lean mass and it says my max is about 158.

    That's what I was thinking. I'm at about 129 pounds of lbm (hydrostatic assessment)and I'm hoping to get to 133 with a 12 week bulk this winter. Of course, my bf is and will be way higher than yours - you look awesome!

    Thank you! My body fat is higher now than in the picture. I'm trying to gain. One thing to remember when gaining is that just like fat loss, lean gains are not linear. (Note: These are all approximates based on a wide variety of data) I gained 3 pounds of lean mass in my first 8 week coming off a strict diet. I gained 1 pound of lean mass the next 8 weeks and half a pound in the next 8 weeks. I'm going in for another weigh in next week.

    I just tried and failed at a 12 week bulk. I'd go up a couple of pounds and then drift back to where I was. 4 1/2 pounds of lean mass is completely awesome, especially with your base.

    Consistently overeating is WAY harder than people think it is. I think more people eat at maintenance and then gain through binges than consistently adding too much to their plate

    I have no problem eating. I gain more fat than I should because I can eat. I will have to go through lots of mini cuts. I do think a lot of people just fear eating if they've been fat before. They call it the former fat boy syndrome. Sometimes it's more successful (although seemingly very slow) to just try to recomposition.
    http://www.jcdfitness.com/2009/10/the-former-fat-boy-syndrome/

    I think you hit the nail on the head...yes, I am afraid of being fat-ter than now since I have been struggling all my life to be thinner but never succeeded...I am afraid if I eat, I will end up bigger

    I think this is why most people - especially women - should try a bulk at some point during their life. Actively working to build and feed muscles by overeating and getting slightly fatter completely changes your relationship to your body and the world of food. Even though I failed, things make a lot more sense to me and I feel like I've "fat-proofed" myself for the future.

    The minute I had to choose to eat a bag of Doritos, not as a treat but at a requirement to meet my calorie goals, I gained a huge sense of perspective about palatability and the meaning of food in my life.
  • holothuroidea
    holothuroidea Posts: 772 Member
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    How myopic.

    When you're only talking a percent or two either way, no BF% isn't really a great way to track progress. When you get down to a certain BF%, it becomes easier to track your progress by how you feel because you're close to your goal. This is a sort of "fine tuning" mode and BF% isn't accurate enough (nor does it change in small enough measurable increments) to measure these small progress markers and the eye and your clothes do become a better gauge. Likewise, worrying about muscle loss isn't a big problem for people in your condition and may only be losing/gaining 10lbs at a time, but it is a major concern for people who start significantly overweight and have a lot of pounds to lose.

    When you have a significant amount of fat to lose BF% is a very useful number. Generally the inaccuracy will be the same for each measurement, so you aren't necessarily going to be able to measure your exact BF% at any given time but you will be able to track your progress from one month to the next with fairly good accuracy. Furthermore, it's better to have a goal BF% than a goal weight when you start out heavy. Not everyone looks the same at every BF% but it is a much better predictor for appearance than weight is and when you're far away from your goal (and maybe have never even been there before) it's impossible to know what you'll look at any given goal weight.

    Just because something isn't relevant for your particular situation, Mr.SixPackProfilePicture, doesn't mean it's not relevant for anybody else.
  • likitisplit
    likitisplit Posts: 9,420 Member
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    Interesting- I know that for me, I have lost maybe 1 lb over the past few months, but with checkins at my gym (having a professional measure body fat with calipers), I have dropped almost 10 % body fat. I am stronger, in good cardio shape, look much smaller, and have dropped a clothing size. And basically have lost no weight.

    Seriously? I understand the scale number thing...but really 1 pound makes such difference? I am not doubting your words but it's just too good to be true...

    I mean, I would LOVE it if my scale was wrong! But I weight myself once a week, same time of day....and yeah. The difference has really been the body fat for me (I upped my lifting game) anad it is definitely visible. I put on a dress yesterday with short sleeves (which were like a little too tight last year), and it fit perfectly. The shirts that I have purchased recently haven been smalls and extra smalls (except for Theory- why do they run so small!?), the dresses and skirts have all been smalls. They would have all been mediums last summer.

    Wasn't it "I Lift Heavy Acrylics" who did a year recomp - maintenance + heavy lifting. 134 to 134 lbs and the difference is breath-taking.

    I have figure out my body recomp diet. Now I want to try to push for a little bit more fat lost and still get stronger. That is a perfect diet needed for that.

    I gained 2.5 pounds of muscle and lost 2.5 pounds of fat in 12 weeks, which is pathetic but still....

    I was underestimating my exercise but, retrospectively, I was probably eating about 150 calories over maintenance most days, and undereating slightly during higher activity days. I'd go up a pound or two and then slide back down, then go up a pound or two and slide back down.

    Bulking and cutting would provide more efficient muscle gains/fat loss over the same period of time.
  • Iwishyouwell
    Iwishyouwell Posts: 1,888 Member
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    I do believe that more people need to let the mirror be their guide. It amazes me how many people spout off obviously incorrect bodyfat measurements, all because of faulty methods. Or the people who get to some arbitrary goal weight and scream "WHY DO I STILL HAVE SO MUCH FAT?!?".

    Above all weight tracking methods, let your mirror be the guide. You'll have reached a reasonable goal when you like what's staring back at you, at least somewhat.
  • yopeeps025
    yopeeps025 Posts: 8,680 Member
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    I do believe that more people need to let the mirror be their guide. It amazes me how many people spout off obviously incorrect bodyfat measurements, all because of faulty methods. Or the people who get to some arbitrary goal weight and scream "WHY DO I STILL HAVE SO MUCH FAT?!?".

    Above all weight tracking methods, let your mirror be the guide. You'll have reached a reasonable goal when you like what's staring back at you, at least somewhat.

    It is hard to see mirror progress. That is if you step into the bathroom everyday. I have been using photos progress instead.
  • jwdieter
    jwdieter Posts: 2,582 Member
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    http://weightology.net/weightologyweekly/?page_id=218
  • bravid98
    bravid98 Posts: 80 Member
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    No kidding, that's why we have trend lines... :laugh:

    zjbic8.jpg

    I weigh in every day at the same time and about the same hydration level. I'm a satisfied customer of body fat %.
  • AlliSteff
    AlliSteff Posts: 211 Member
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    Interesting- I know that for me, I have lost maybe 1 lb over the past few months, but with checkins at my gym (having a professional measure body fat with calipers), I have dropped almost 10 % body fat. I am stronger, in good cardio shape, look much smaller, and have dropped a clothing size. And basically have lost no weight.

    Seriously? I understand the scale number thing...but really 1 pound makes such difference? I am not doubting your words but it's just too good to be true...

    I mean, I would LOVE it if my scale was wrong! But I weight myself once a week, same time of day....and yeah. The difference has really been the body fat for me (I upped my lifting game) anad it is definitely visible. I put on a dress yesterday with short sleeves (which were like a little too tight last year), and it fit perfectly. The shirts that I have purchased recently haven been smalls and extra smalls (except for Theory- why do they run so small!?), the dresses and skirts have all been smalls. They would have all been mediums last summer.

    Calipers are not that accurate and they only tell you the fat under the skin you have lost .You clearly loss something though. What about the Visceral fat? Time to take a ride in the body pod for better body fat % results.

    Yeah, I know they aren't the MOST accurate- but it was the same trainer doing the same spots with the same calipers plugged into the same equation (I belive 4 spots, each measured 3 times and averaged)....so I think I can at least view this as a trend, even if it isn't 100% accurate. My understanding, at least with visceral fat, was that waist to hip ratio is a big signifier of possible issues without scanning. My last measurement of waist to hip ratio was a .66 (LOW is considered under .72 for my age)- as of two months ago.

    In addition, bra size has changed dramatically- from a 36 band size to a 32.

    All with pretty much no weight change

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