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Santa Barbara shooting
Replies
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I don't think they are going to make this one all about guns though.. they are saying he was obsessed with Brett Easton Ellis' American Psycho..
Patrick Bateman - the last mass shooter in Australia also blammed Ellis' work ...
In the same way as a gun.. Ellis' novels are just a novel.. its simply art... millions of copies sold and there are not millions of killers.
these SSRI antidepressants need to be investigated more though.. I'm telling you years down the line we are going to hear that this has been the culprit.0 -
I wish he would've been given the metal healthy he obviously needed. There were videos posted days ago that were warnings of what he was about to do. His parents informed authorities, who did nothing. They deemed him not to be a threat because he didn't have any weapons, but how can that be when all the guns and ammo he used were legally purchased and registered to him.
Such a horrible tragedy. Already one of the victims has been identified as a local, and UCSB is a popular nearby college so possibly more locals involved :-( So sad, I was just in Isla Vista only a few weekends ago and thinking what a nice little beach town area :-(
He was in mental health outpatient treatment. At least that's what the one news article I read said.
yep, and like every other mass shooter, he was pumped full of psychotropics..
I'm telling you its just bizarre. That stuff makes people do terrible things.0 -
glad you said something.. so she just hates men. ...this is seriously why I have always enjoyed dating international women so much more then domestic girls...
Its comparing ladies to girls period. there were all good things with the first feminist movement.. and then it just became hating on dudes.. makes no sense to me.
One lucky thing about Salem is if we call her a witch she would prob welcome it with the weirdo name and occultist necklace.
Oh, for the love of all things holy.0 -
Misogyny would be easier labeled if everything a guy does wasn't thrown under that handle... pay for a meal, open a door.. read hugh jackman's interview last week in mens fitness? he was accused of being a misogynist for holding open a door for a women.
glad you said something.. so she just hates men. ...this is seriously why I have always enjoyed dating international women so much more then domestic girls...
Its comparing ladies to girls period. there were all good things with the first feminist movement.. and then it just became hating on dudes.. makes no sense to me.
One lucky thing about Salem is if we call her a witch she would prob welcome it with the weirdo name and occultist necklace.
A big problem is this way of thinking that feminism is all hating men. That's not what it's about at all. It's about being treated like a person, and not like an object.
This links to the whole "not all men" thing...you are getting too caught up in defending yourself and saying that you are not a rapist or a killer or a misogynist to realize that there are men out there who are, and they make the world a very uncomfortable and sometimes very scary place to be a woman . Feminism is not an attack on you personally... It is asking you to realize that there are men out there, for example this santa barbara shooter who get very upset when they believe that they are entitled to a woman's body and are denied access to that body, and do dangerous and violent things, and that women would like to stop being treated like they only exist to be objects of sexual gratification for men.
This happens in many different forms-not every woman has been raped or killed by someone who wouldn't take no for an answer, but most likely if you ask any woman you know, they will have instances in which they have felt unsafe or uncomfortable because of a man's advances. This even relates to your first comment about paying for a meal, opening a door---those gestures alone aren't bad-in fact, they're often appreciated. The issue arises when the man believes that he is entitled to sex because he was "nice" to you or bought you something--the whole friend zone idea.
This is not an attack on you. I definitely don't hate all men, and most women don't. Just try to understand life from a different perspective.0 -
Misogyny would be easier labeled if everything a guy does wasn't thrown under that handle... pay for a meal, open a door.. read hugh jackman's interview last week in mens fitness? he was accused of being a misogynist for holding open a door for a women.
glad you said something.. so she just hates men. ...this is seriously why I have always enjoyed dating international women so much more then domestic girls...
Its comparing ladies to girls period. there were all good things with the first feminist movement.. and then it just became hating on dudes.. makes no sense to me.
One lucky thing about Salem is if we call her a witch she would prob welcome it with the weirdo name and occultist necklace.
A big problem is this way of thinking that feminism is all hating men. That's not what it's about at all. It's about being treated like a person, and not like an object.
This links to the whole "not all men" thing...you are getting too caught up in defending yourself and saying that you are not a rapist or a killer or a misogynist to realize that there are men out there who are, and they make the world a very uncomfortable and sometimes very scary place to be a woman . Feminism is not an attack on you personally... It is asking you to realize that there are men out there, for example this santa barbara shooter who get very upset when they believe that they are entitled to a woman's body and are denied access to that body, and do dangerous and violent things, and that women would like to stop being treated like they only exist to be objects of sexual gratification for men.
This happens in many different forms-not every woman has been raped or killed by someone who wouldn't take no for an answer, but most likely if you ask any woman you know, they will have instances in which they have felt unsafe or uncomfortable because of a man's advances. This even relates to your first comment about paying for a meal, opening a door---those gestures alone aren't bad-in fact, they're often appreciated. The issue arises when the man believes that he is entitled to sex because he was "nice" to you or bought you something--the whole friend zone idea.
This is not an attack on you. I definitely don't hate all men, and most women don't. Just try to understand life from a different perspective.
I appreciate your explanation.0 -
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I would hope people are giving thought to the #yesallwomen messages that are in response to this.0
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Maybe I'm cold-hearted, but I don't feel very much sympathy for him. All of my sympathy goes out to the families of his victims.
My hearts do go out to the family, but I feel very sorry for the young man as well.0 -
It's purely a mental health issue. There were signs that were ignored, a long list of problems, and history to learn from. It has nothing to do with guns, or knives. What if he used bombs made from the internet? Then it wouldn't be such a huge "american" issue? Well coming from a Canadian, we're having this trouble too. Did you hear about the boy that stabbed 5 people at a grad party last month in Calgary? 5 people are dead! Just because he used a knife, doesn't mean we shouldn't discuss the implications of it, but because we can't circle it back to gun control, no one is giving as big of a crap. It's mental health issues and the cutbacks from the government that is causing this, not who owns a gun, knife, vehicle, chainsaw, etc.0
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It's purely a mental health issue. There were signs that were ignored, a long list of problems, and history to learn from. It has nothing to do with guns, or knives. What if he used bombs made from the internet? Then it wouldn't be such a huge "american" issue? Well coming from a Canadian, we're having this trouble too. Did you hear about the boy that stabbed 5 people at a grad party last month in Calgary? 5 people are dead! Just because he used a knife, doesn't mean we shouldn't discuss the implications of it, but because we can't circle it back to gun control, no one is giving as big of a crap. It's mental health issues and the cutbacks from the government that is causing this, not who owns a gun, knife, vehicle, chainsaw, etc.
Its not cutbacks from government :noway:
but I did read about that... very sad...
he was on SSRI Psychotropics as well... I'm telling you.. this has to be discussed at the federal congressional level.0 -
Narcissism and Aspergers are two potential attributes that contribute. I heard he had 49 loaded magazines. Only mental health makes sense here. Our minds are the weapon.0
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Gun laws will stop nothing. Havent we all hear that guns do not kill people, people kill people.0
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A big problem is this way of thinking that feminism is all hating men. That's not what it's about at all. It's about being treated like a person, and not like an object.
This links to the whole "not all men" thing...you are getting too caught up in defending yourself and saying that you are not a rapist or a killer or a misogynist to realize that there are men out there who are, and they make the world a very uncomfortable and sometimes very scary place to be a woman . Feminism is not an attack on you personally... It is asking you to realize that there are men out there, for example this santa barbara shooter who get very upset when they believe that they are entitled to a woman's body and are denied access to that body, and do dangerous and violent things, and that women would like to stop being treated like they only exist to be objects of sexual gratification for men.
This happens in many different forms-not every woman has been raped or killed by someone who wouldn't take no for an answer, but most likely if you ask any woman you know, they will have instances in which they have felt unsafe or uncomfortable because of a man's advances. This even relates to your first comment about paying for a meal, opening a door---those gestures alone aren't bad-in fact, they're often appreciated. The issue arises when the man believes that he is entitled to sex because he was "nice" to you or bought you something--the whole friend zone idea.
This is not an attack on you. I definitely don't hate all men, and most women don't. Just try to understand life from a different perspective.
Exactly! Thank you for explaining this more eloquently than I would have lol0 -
It's purely a mental health issue. There were signs that were ignored, a long list of problems, and history to learn from. It has nothing to do with guns, or knives. What if he used bombs made from the internet? Then it wouldn't be such a huge "american" issue? Well coming from a Canadian, we're having this trouble too. Did you hear about the boy that stabbed 5 people at a grad party last month in Calgary? 5 people are dead! Just because he used a knife, doesn't mean we shouldn't discuss the implications of it, but because we can't circle it back to gun control, no one is giving as big of a crap. It's mental health issues and the cutbacks from the government that is causing this, not who owns a gun, knife, vehicle, chainsaw, etc.
Its not cutbacks from government :noway:
but I did read about that... very sad...
he was on SSRI Psychotropics as well... I'm telling you.. this has to be discussed at the federal congressional level.
Sorry, I don't know how the gov't in the US is ran, but I worked in the mental health field in Canada, and they hacked and slashed us so bad that we have more issues now with people with mental disabilities than we ever have before. I've seen first hand what it does to people who can't access the appropriate support or funding. When you're paying your workers $10/hr to help people, you can't even afford to pay off your student loan. The services and supports have been cut down to bare minimum, our homeless rate has skyrocketed because people with mental health issues "fall through the cracks" and even those that can find support, can't afford to live because AISH is such a joke. It is a government issue.0 -
I wish he would've been given the metal healthy he obviously needed. There were videos posted days ago that were warnings of what he was about to do. His parents informed authorities, who did nothing. They deemed him not to be a threat because he didn't have any weapons, but how can that be when all the guns and ammo he used were legally purchased and registered to him.
Such a horrible tragedy. Already one of the victims has been identified as a local, and UCSB is a popular nearby college so possibly more locals involved :-( So sad, I was just in Isla Vista only a few weekends ago and thinking what a nice little beach town area :-(
He was in mental health outpatient treatment. At least that's what the one news article I read said.
yep, and like every other mass shooter, he was pumped full of psychotropics..
I'm telling you its just bizarre. That stuff makes people do terrible things.
You know, it is. I had a thought. Most people who truly have Bipolar Disorder are initially MIS-diagnosed as having depression and put on anti-depressants. Anti-depressants exacerbate the manic state...soooo...someone who may only think about crazy stuff and do mildly "bad" things while manic and NOT on anti-depressants could go absolutely bonkers when on an anti-depressant which is made specifically to ELEVATE mood. Makes sense that they would be mis-diagnosed with depression since mania feels great. If it feels great, it's not something most people tell the doctor is WRONG with them.
Also, I've found articles linking aggression and antidepressant use. Should be interesting reads.0 -
Am I the only one who really dislikes it when people use a tragedy to further an agenda?
If they didn't we'd have to rely solely on Salem's other thousand posts to know she hates men.
glad you said something.. so she just hates men. ...this is seriously why I have always enjoyed dating international women so much more then domestic girls...
Its comparing ladies to girls period. there were all good things with the first feminist movement.. and then it just became hating on dudes.. makes no sense to me.
One lucky thing about Salem is if we call her a witch she would prob welcome it with the weirdo name and occultist necklace.
A.) Quality women can be found all around the world, just as immature girls can be too...
B.) Feminism is seen as a bad word now because many people, even those who claim it for their own, don't fully understand it. It's not supposed to be about hate, it's not supposed to be about women being better than men, it's not supposed to be about women BEING treated as men. It's suppose to be about women having the strength and courage to be who they want to be, who they really are. If you truly want to be a housewife then that is a beautiful thing and should be persued, however, if you don't want that life and you want to go after a high power career then do it.
I hate when feminists tear down the opposite sex or women who choose to do something against their own beliefs, it defeats the purpose of the whole movement...
Thank you! Too few people know what feminism actually is and attack it based on their ignorant assumptions.
Also, this crime is considered an act of misogyny because the attacker felt like he was entitled to sleep with some women who said "no" to him. Unfortunately, women are shut off from their right to say "no" by the whole "friendzone" BS that's floating around now. Yeah, don't care if you're a nice guy, I don't have to have sex with you if I don't want to.
Additionally, to respond to the "more women should carry guns so they don't get raped" (paraphrased) comment: women shouldn't have to worry about being raped. Women shouldn't have to carry a gun, or a knife, or put their keys between their fingers to ward off a possible attacker just because they're alone. Where is the responsibility for the people who rape? Do they get off scott free because their victim was alone/wearing a skirt/drunk or drugged? No, they committed a crime and the victim of the crime should not be held responsible for doing something COMPLETELY NORMAL like walking.
With that, I'm just leaving the thread because I already know that this will not end well. Maybe you guys can sift through my posts to see how much I hate men too /sarcasm0 -
I would hope people are giving thought to the #yesallwomen messages that are in response to this.
THIS!
I mean, the shooter wrote a 140 page manifesto LOADED with misogyny (and racism, both internalized and outward). He frequented so-called MRA sites and described himself as an "alpha male". People who think it's not an issue about society as a whole haven't seen the dudes on the internet actually supporting his actions, and absolutely need to see what's being talked about in the #yesallwomen tag.
Of course he was clearly unhinged, but you add that with the entitled sexist mentality and he just becomes one of the ones to actually act on his hatred.0 -
My son goes to UCSB and I even know the apartment building where Rodger lived quite well. Thank you. And, yes, I blame guns. Hell yes I blame guns. The fact that you can say "Well, yeah, deaths happen all the time that are not caused by guns" does not exonerate our lax and irresponsible gun laws. The is a stupid argument. I am quite sure the parents of the two girls shot outside the sorority -- killed very rapidly and easily, without the slightest chance of defending themselves -- and the father of the boy who was just buying a sandwich would agree.
There are too many gun laws in California as it is and they are not enforced. I blame law enforcement and State mental health, and the parents. There were warning signs, action could have been taken but it wasn't.
Sure, hindsight is twenty-twenty. That's the cliche because it is true. Easy to see the signs after the fact. Not so with the present. The present is never so transparent and predictable.
Better to restrict or get rid of the guns. Another gun is not a shield for the innocents and potential, and actual, victims and never will be. Dodge City was not the safest city in America because everyone had a gun to defend themselves. It was actually the most violent and deadly.
Time to say our children -- your children, my children, Santa Barbara's children, Newtown's children, Columbine's children, Sparks', Nev., children, etc. -- are more important than unrestricted access and ownership. Seems the lesser price to pay...
If more gun control is the answer to a 'safer city" please explain Chicago or Los Angeles...
Again, your logic is faulty. No one says it is a simple, one-dimensional problem, or that one single law is going to prevent every single killing, every day of the year. But we don't need to say that.
I think the point is: Given all the problems we have, if someone unknown to you was to decide that they had a grudge against you, or your wife or husband, or someone else in your family, would you rather that person was armed with a semi-automatic or a knife?
C'mon. You must choose one. Which would you choose?
You cannot argue that with restrictions it would not be much harder for a potential multiple murder to get a firearm. That's what a restriction is. Saying that a restriction is not going to be perfect is not an acceptable objection -- when it might save somebody's little boy's life.
Personally, I choose that boy's life. We have freedom in this country. Not complete freedom. We never have had complete freedom.0 -
Sorry.0
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My son goes to UCSB and I even know the apartment building where Rodger lived quite well. Thank you. And, yes, I blame guns. Hell yes I blame guns. The fact that you can say "Well, yeah, deaths happen all the time that are not caused by guns" does not exonerate our lax and irresponsible gun laws. The is a stupid argument. I am quite sure the parents of the two girls shot outside the sorority -- killed very rapidly and easily, without the slightest chance of defending themselves -- and the father of the boy who was just buying a sandwich would agree.
There are too many gun laws in California as it is and they are not enforced. I blame law enforcement and State mental health, and the parents. There were warning signs, action could have been taken but it wasn't.
Sure, hindsight is twenty-twenty. That's the cliche because it is true. Easy to see the signs after the fact. Not so with the present. The present is never so transparent and predictable.
Better to restrict or get rid of the guns. Another gun is not a shield for the innocents and potential, and actual, victims and never will be. Dodge City was not the safest city in America because everyone had a gun to defend themselves. It was actually the most violent and deadly.
Time to say our children -- your children, my children, Santa Barbara's children, Newtown's children, Columbine's children, Sparks', Nev., children, etc. -- are more important than unrestricted access and ownership. Seems the lesser price to pay...
Sorry, I don't agree with the restriction or ban on guns. People kill people. What device they use is not as important as is the why do they kill people. This POS killed three people with a knife but I don't see anyone saying a word about that except Crazy Steve. Earlier this year a crazy POS killed 38 people in China with a knife. I have seen people killed with all kinds of weapons unfortunately in my previous career as a firefighter. Gun laws keep lawful people from being able to protect themselves. They don't apply to people like this or the gang bangers in Chicago because they don't care. They are going to do what they want to do without thought as to what weapon they use. They will use what is available.
This quote was from the first page so it's most likely been forgotten, however, there is always something to be said for restricting weapons from everyone. Yes, that would include law-abiding people BUT it also restricts people from having guns who should 100% not have them at all.
That's extremely important. I live in Edmonton, Canada, and do you know how often I hear of shootings?
Rarely.
You can't dismiss the obvious results from more restrictive gun laws just because this man also carried a knife.0
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