Calorie deficit not the answer?

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  • lindsey1979
    lindsey1979 Posts: 2,395 Member
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    There are actually is quite a bit of research out there on the benefits of fasting. One of the apparent benefits is change in you IGF-2 hormones. When fasting, your body is able to focuses on cellular repair due to what they believe is the shift in IGF-2 levels -- also the reason why so much cellular repairs occurs during sleep. Some theorize that by fasting, you're giving your body greater time to repair and recovery, leading to less of certain conditions like diabetes, and increasing longevity.

    One of the short term improvements that has been seen by fasting is an increase in insulin sensitivity levels, which can be quite important for those with insulin resistance issues (over 40% of US adults have insulin resistance in pre-diabetic or diabetic levels).

    Now, the nutritional content of food -- macros and micros -- is a different issue. If you're eating nutritionally deficient food, there I've seen no difference on meal timing in this regard. The fasting issue is not related to that at all as someone can eat junk all throughout the day or in just one sitting -- fasting doesn't increase that likelihood one way or the other. Or at least I've seen no research ever linking the two.
  • LoupGarouTFTs
    LoupGarouTFTs Posts: 916 Member
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    I practice IF and target specific calorie and macronutrient goals. ED, not once.

    And who's to say what's norm?

    Oh, please. Now you're just grasping at straws for things to argue with me about. Just apologize for making assumptions and move on.
    Nope. You said what you said. And have no first hand knowledge or clear understanding of IF or IIFYM. Your claims are all assumptions.

    No one is going to apologize. If you want to wait for one feel free but I suggest you don't as I'm sure you don't want to stay up all night.

    If I had said what you thought I said, that would be fine--unlike some people, I can admit to my mistakes (and have, in this very thread). However I never said anything derogatory about IIFYM. You made an assumption. You were wrong. Now you're not willing to admit to your mistake. C'est la vie. Not everyone has the intestinal fortitude to do it. I accept that and don't hold it against you. Cheers. Feel free to put me on ignore, since you choose to misinterpret everything I say--that way you can't misinterpret more of what I say.

    I agree with the other people who say that the OP (who I assume has never returned to this thread) just needs to log his food to determine what his actual intake is. Even people who are doing IIFYM need to know what foods they are attempting to fit into macros and what their macros are set at to begin with.
  • confetticupcake
    confetticupcake Posts: 30
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    Also starving all day and then eating one meal, it is very likely you are eating more than 1500 in one sitting. After not eating all day you will be ravenously hungry and when you start eat it'll be hard to stop eating.

    Start eating breakfast and lunch. Eat a smaller dinner. Your metabolism will be faster & you'll feel better.

    No...just no.

    lol k
  • ljk3
    ljk3 Posts: 9
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    Nice! OK... I will recheck BMR and track every morsel by weighing everything... i will drink only water and start jogging 3 days per week.... I will report my baseline information and report back in 2 weeks to see what if anything has changed... stay tuned.
  • Marlena0708
    Marlena0708 Posts: 27 Member
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    Nice! OK... I will recheck BMR and track every morsel by weighing everything... i will drink only water and start jogging 3 days per week.... I will report my baseline information and report back in 2 weeks to see what if anything has changed... stay tuned.

    I think that's a great plan and a great place to start. Good luck.

    I'm sorry your topic went so badly off the rails. :ohwell:
  • ljk3
    ljk3 Posts: 9
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    Off the rails is part of the fun... didn't think IF was going to dominate... havent seen this much activity since someone threw a cupcake into a weight watchers meeting!
  • MelodyandBarbells
    MelodyandBarbells Posts: 7,725 Member
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    Wow :laugh:
  • tinkbaby101
    tinkbaby101 Posts: 180 Member
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    Nice! OK... I will recheck BMR and track every morsel by weighing everything... i will drink only water and start jogging 3 days per week.... I will report my baseline information and report back in 2 weeks to see what if anything has changed... stay tuned.

    Excellent place to start.
  • tracydr
    tracydr Posts: 528 Member
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    There are actually is quite a bit of research out there on the benefits of fasting. One of the apparent benefits is change in you IGF-2 hormones. When fasting, your body is able to focuses on cellular repair due to what they believe is the shift in IGF-2 levels -- also the reason why so much cellular repairs occurs during sleep. Some theorize that by fasting, you're giving your body greater time to repair and recovery, leading to less of certain conditions like diabetes, and increasing longevity.

    One of the short term improvements that has been seen by fasting is an increase in insulin sensitivity levels, which can be quite important for those with insulin resistance issues (over 40% of US adults have insulin resistance in pre-diabetic or diabetic levels).

    Now, the nutritional content of food -- macros and micros -- is a different issue. If you're eating nutritionally deficient food, there I've seen no difference on meal timing in this regard. The fasting issue is not related to that at all as someone can eat junk all throughout the day or in just one sitting -- fasting doesn't increase that likelihood one way or the other. Or at least I've seen no research ever linking the two.
    Do you have actual journal articles on the diabetes and fasting? Cortisol raises blood sugar, glucagon would be revved to the max to maintain a fasting sugar and so when they break the fast, hypothetically the blood sugar will go very high, before plummeting with the over increase in insulin, then glucagon will come back to fix the problem and they will overshoot again.
    I can say from being a doctor for almost 20 years, that I see this in real life when patients do a bunch of blood sugars and keep a log for me. If they skip breakfast after a night of fasting, havoc is wrought. Here's a statement about this from the Mayo website. Still not a journal article but this is what we see in real life:

    What is the dawn phenomenon that some people with diabetes experience? Can anything be done about it?

    Answers from Maria Collazo-Clavell, M.D.
    The dawn phenomenon, also called the dawn effect, is the term used to describe an abnormal early-morning increase in blood sugar (glucose) — usually between 2 a.m. and 8 a.m. — in people with diabetes.

    Some researchers believe the natural overnight release of hormones — including growth hormones, cortisol, glucagon and epinephrine — increases insulin resistance, causing blood sugar to rise. High morning blood sugar may also be caused by insufficient insulin the night before, incorrect medication dosages or carbohydrate snack consumption at bedtime.

    If you have persistently elevated blood sugar in the morning, checking your blood sugar once during the night — around 2 a.m. or 3 a.m. — for several nights in a row will help you and your doctor to determine if you have the dawn phenomenon or if there's another reason for an elevated morning blood sugar reading.
  • tennisdude2004
    tennisdude2004 Posts: 5,609 Member
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    In
  • lindsey1979
    lindsey1979 Posts: 2,395 Member
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    As for sources, I read mine in a book, so I'm not sure if these are the exact same I originally saw, but a quick google search found this article: http://fitness.mercola.com/sites/fitness/archive/2013/03/01/daily-intermittent-fasting.aspx

    with the following references (links are in the original article):
    2 Cell Metabolism June 6, 2012: 15(6); 848-860
    3 V. D. Longo - Evidence for Programmed Aging
    4 American Journal of Clinical Nutrition July 2007: 86(1); 7-13
    5 Journal of Clinical Endocrinology and Metabolism 1991:74(4); 757-765 (PDF)
    6 New England Journal of Medicine 2013; 368:446-454

    If you do a little googling with IF and IGF and insulin sensitivity, I'm sure you'll come up with even more research on your own.
  • DerekVTX
    DerekVTX Posts: 287 Member
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    Dump the diet soda. Just dump it.

    +1 on that. It will still spike your insulin levels (or so they say) and make you hungry. Its chemical garbage.
  • threnjen
    threnjen Posts: 687 Member
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    Did anyone link this yet? I don't feel like reading this whole thread. Yeah, I know...
    http://www.acaloriecounter.com/blog/why-am-i-not-losing-weight/

    Edit: Yep someone posted it already. Fine, let's look at it again!
  • LoupGarouTFTs
    LoupGarouTFTs Posts: 916 Member
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    Mercola? Seriously?
  • lindsey1979
    lindsey1979 Posts: 2,395 Member
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    Mercola? Seriously?

    He's not incapable of writing summary articles. The cites are the same regardless of Mercola or someone else you respect more writes up the summary. It's not like he did the actual studies. So, how about focus on the content of the message rather than the one delivering through summary.

    Or you could do just a little of your own research rather than asking others on a website to spoonfeed it to you.
  • Heatherybit
    Heatherybit Posts: 91 Member
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    What do you eat on Mondays?
    ... for science.

    :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

    Can't...stop..laughing....
  • LoupGarouTFTs
    LoupGarouTFTs Posts: 916 Member
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    Mercola? Seriously?

    He's not incapable of writing summary articles. The cites are the same regardless of Mercola or someone else you respect more writes up the summary. It's not like he did the actual studies. So, how about focus on the content of the message rather than the one delivering through summary.

    Or you could do just a little of your own research rather than asking others on a website to spoonfeed it to you.

    I wouldn't trust Mercola to write a "summary article" on the containment properties of a wet paper bag. That being said, if you make assertions, expect people to ask you to back them up.
  • lindsey1979
    lindsey1979 Posts: 2,395 Member
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    Mercola? Seriously?

    He's not incapable of writing summary articles. The cites are the same regardless of Mercola or someone else you respect more writes up the summary. It's not like he did the actual studies. So, how about focus on the content of the message rather than the one delivering through summary.

    Or you could do just a little of your own research rather than asking others on a website to spoonfeed it to you.

    I wouldn't trust Mercola to write a "summary article" on the containment properties of a wet paper bag. That being said, if you make assertions, expect people to ask you to back them up.

    And I did. You don't trust the summary article author, then fine, go find your own. Or read the underlying studies and those scientists instead of being dismissive of those studies because you don't like the summary author. But I guess that would require actual effort. I found the article helpful because it had actual links to those studies, so people could read them for themselves.

    It's really not that hard -- these aren't esoteric subjects. They take only simple google searches. But some people on this site are soooo lazy, then have the audacity to complain that someone else's quick searches aren't up to their standards. Stop being so intellectually lazy and then complain about others' attempts to help when you've provided ZERO effort yourself.

    It's no one's duty on this site to do all the work for you, or anyone else. It's just sharing of information, not a symposium.
  • LoupGarouTFTs
    LoupGarouTFTs Posts: 916 Member
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    Mercola? Seriously?

    He's not incapable of writing summary articles. The cites are the same regardless of Mercola or someone else you respect more writes up the summary. It's not like he did the actual studies. So, how about focus on the content of the message rather than the one delivering through summary.

    Or you could do just a little of your own research rather than asking others on a website to spoonfeed it to you.

    I wouldn't trust Mercola to write a "summary article" on the containment properties of a wet paper bag. That being said, if you make assertions, expect people to ask you to back them up.

    And I did. You don't trust the summary article author, then fine, go find your own. Or read the underlying studies and those scientists instead of being dismissive of those studies because you don't like the summary author. But I guess that would require actual effort. I found the article helpful because it had actual links to those studies, so people could read them for themselves.

    It's really not that hard -- these aren't esoteric subjects. They take only simple google searches. But some people on this site are soooo lazy, then have the audacity to complain that someone else's quick searches aren't up to their standards. Stop being so intellectually lazy and then complain about others' attempts to help when you've provided ZERO effort yourself.

    It's no one's duty on this site to do all the work for you, or anyone else. It's just sharing of information, not a symposium.

    Burden of Proof fallacy
    Ad hominem fallacy
    Proof by assertion

    In any case, when people ask for proof, in general they are asking for legitimate sources. Mercola is not generally recognized as a legitimate source.

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