Is BMI really BS?

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  • stevencloser
    stevencloser Posts: 8,911 Member
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    I'm surprised no one posted this yet.

    lose-weight-bmi.jpg

    Yea, but more people that are closer aligned to the obese guy use the ripped the guy as their excuse.
    True enough. But the longer you do strength training the less accurate bmi becomes for you. It's only good for basically sedentary people.
  • juggernaut1974
    juggernaut1974 Posts: 6,212 Member
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    Why does everything in life have to be either A) The absolute truth or B) Complete BS?

    Is BMI the absolute truth? No

    Is BMI Complete BS? No

    It's one tool/metric one can use. It should not be the only one.

    As to the pic above - that would seem to imply that a scale is BS too, as both weigh 250 lbs.

    Taking BMI in isolation with no relevant context would be like one of the above people saying they weigh 250 lbs. with no relevant context.
  • Wonderob
    Wonderob Posts: 1,372 Member
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    Why does everything in life have to be either A) The absolute truth or B) Complete BS?

    Is BMI the absolute truth? No

    Is BMI Complete BS? No

    It's one tool/metric one can use. It should not be the only one.

    As to the pic above - that would seem to imply that a scale is BS too, as both weigh 250 lbs.

    Taking BMI in isolation with no relevant context would be like one of the above people saying they weigh 250 lbs. with no relevant context.

    I think you're missing the point

    Most aren't saying that the BMI chart is total BS at all.

    Is BMI the absolute truth? No

    Is it complete BS to rely on the BMI charts? Yes
  • WhyLime113
    WhyLime113 Posts: 104 Member
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    Saying its completely useless is just as short sighted as saying that its the ultimate metric.

    It's one tool and its important to recognize exactly what it tells you. And for what it tells you, and for its intended use, it is pretty good for the general population.

    And we are back to the general population argument

    Am I in the general population? Is my wife?

    So we both look at the BMI chart and find we're both on the verge of healthy/overweight

    Tell me how it's pretty good for me or my wife based on what you know?

    I'm not sure what your point is. There are athletic people, typically those who have years of resistance training experience, for whom the BMI scale may not be reasonable.

    There are also those who are in denial about their level of fatness.

    I cannot determine the answer to this in your specific example based on the information I currently have.

    Do you believe that all calorie estimation calculators are completely useless because there are outliers?
    You keep saying outliers. But when there are so many examples of when BMI doesn't work, those aren't outliers. Outliers are rarities that skew the data. Get much more than a couple and it stops being an outlier and is now a trend.

    Me, for example, I'm fat. I'm willing to admit that I'm fat. That's why I'm here, I'm not in denial. BMI tells me I'm obese, I've talked to my doctor, I'm not close to carrying enough fat to be considered obese. But now I'm just another outlier. It's not a matter of people denying fatness, it's that BMI is a really poor scale because it doesn't actually take in the numerous other variables. Body fat % is what people ought to be looking at.

    Literally all BMI tells you it the relationship between your height and weight. For the 'average' population (whatever that means), it may be able to say whether or not you're 'too' skinny or 'too' fat. You can find that exact same thing out more reliably by way of body fat percentage, so why would you use BMI, which may be skewed based on presence of muscle mass or bone density or body frame?

    It doesn't tell you anything about your health, and it's based on old information as to what is 'acceptable' weight wise. It doesn't actually consider what is a healthy weight for different individuals. Two people of the same height both weigh 110 pounds will have the same BMI. However, one may need to gain some fat the other may be very healthy, sitting pretty at that number. It's medically a rather useless index when there's so many other reliable, more scientifically backed means of determining health and wellness and fitness level.
  • QueenBishOTUniverse
    QueenBishOTUniverse Posts: 14,121 Member
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    Why does everything in life have to be either A) The absolute truth or B) Complete BS?

    Is BMI the absolute truth? No

    Is BMI Complete BS? No

    It's one tool/metric one can use. It should not be the only one.

    As to the pic above - that would seem to imply that a scale is BS too, as both weigh 250 lbs.

    Taking BMI in isolation with no relevant context would be like one of the above people saying they weigh 250 lbs. with no relevant context.

    Except ALOT of people, companies, and even health professionals DO take BMI in isolation without any other context.
  • 123stefania
    123stefania Posts: 167 Member
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    I think the only people on the planet to whom you should listen regarding your weight loss goals are your doctor, and the person in your mirror, but that's just me.

    I agree with you!
  • sweetpea03b
    sweetpea03b Posts: 1,124 Member
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    I read an article that was talking about people that are athletic not really puttting a whole lot of stock in the BMI chart because obviously if you have more muscle you are going to weigh more. If you are in your healthy range... I would worry more about fat %. My goal weight is just above the healthy range for my size...and I'm going to see when I get there if I feel I need to lose a little more or if I'm happy there. My goal is 140 and the top of the healthy range is 136... so you know, that's pretty close.
  • Hornsby
    Hornsby Posts: 10,322 Member
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    I'm surprised no one posted this yet.

    lose-weight-bmi.jpg

    Yea, but more people that are closer aligned to the obese guy use the ripped the guy as their excuse.
    True enough. But the longer you do strength training the less accurate bmi becomes for you. It's only good for basically sedentary people.

    Oh I agree. I have a BMI of 24.3 which is the upper side of healthy. I'm 6', 178lbs and have a BF% of 14-15% (est). I am hardly some physical specimen like Adrian Peterson, but I am pretty fit in my opinion and still working on BF%. I am only around 5-6lbs from being classified as overweight. So yea, I get the picture, but I think that the US view on what "Normal" is has become so skewed due to so much of the population being overweight that they use the too much muscle/large framed/naturally bulky excuse when it really doesn't apply to them.
  • juggernaut1974
    juggernaut1974 Posts: 6,212 Member
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    I think you're missing the point

    Most aren't saying that the BMI chart is total BS at all.

    I was answering the OP's question only...which is whether or not it is BS
    Is it complete BS to rely solely on the BMI charts? Yes

    FIFY
    Except ALOT of people, companies, and even health professionals DO take BMI in isolation without any other context.

    And obvsiously I would disagree with that approach...but that's the fault of the person relying solely on one metric with no context, not the metric itself.
  • Mr_Knight
    Mr_Knight Posts: 9,532 Member
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    I'm surprised no one posted this yet.

    Probably because it's grossly inaccurate. Here's what a lean and fit 6'1, 185 lbs looks like...

    cristiano-ronaldo-1-435.jpg
  • Mr_Knight
    Mr_Knight Posts: 9,532 Member
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    So we both look at the BMI chart and find we're both on the verge of healthy/overweight

    Tell me how it's pretty good for me or my wife based on what you know?

    Your profile says you're trying to lose weight - that sure sounds like "overweight" to me.

    Score another right answer for BMI.
  • Wonderob
    Wonderob Posts: 1,372 Member
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    Is it complete BS to rely solely on the BMI charts? Yes

    As soon as you start to add in other measures such as BF, age, body composition, tape measure info, then you are making BMI completely redundant - hence no point using it in the first place
  • juggernaut1974
    juggernaut1974 Posts: 6,212 Member
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    Is it complete BS to rely solely on the BMI charts? Yes

    As soon as you start to add in other measures such as BF, age, body composition, tape measure info, then you are making BMI completely redundant - hence no point using it in the first place

    The same argument could be made about any metric - weight, waist size, etc.
  • QueenBishOTUniverse
    QueenBishOTUniverse Posts: 14,121 Member
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    I'm surprised no one posted this yet.

    Probably because it's grossly inaccurate. Here's what a lean and fit 6'1, 185 lbs looks like...

    cristiano-ronaldo-1-435.jpg

    And again, here's what an overweight 167lb 5'8" non-professional athlete looks like.
    8b68900702e83dd30dc1e06ac5344b2cc466.jpg
  • Wonderob
    Wonderob Posts: 1,372 Member
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    So we both look at the BMI chart and find we're both on the verge of healthy/overweight

    Tell me how it's pretty good for me or my wife based on what you know?

    Your profile says you're trying to lose weight - that sure sounds like "overweight" to me.

    Score another right answer for BMI.

    I haven't updated that in a while and even if I was still trying, that would be totally irrelevant to the BFI charts

    The athlete with 12% body fat who wants to lose 2 pounds to make himself a bit sharper before the season starts - is he 'overweight'?

    "Score another right answer for BMI." Hmm seriously?
  • Wonderob
    Wonderob Posts: 1,372 Member
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    I'm surprised no one posted this yet.

    Probably because it's grossly inaccurate. Here's what a lean and fit 6'1, 185 lbs looks like...

    cristiano-ronaldo-1-435.jpg

    And again, here's what an overweight 167lb 5'8" non-professional athlete looks like.
    8b68900702e83dd30dc1e06ac5344b2cc466.jpg

    Just extremes to prove the point, that's all

    Those like me who don't (unfortunately) look like Ronaldo, will still find the results skewed
  • Hornsby
    Hornsby Posts: 10,322 Member
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    I'm surprised no one posted this yet.

    Probably because it's grossly inaccurate. Here's what a lean and fit 6'1, 185 lbs looks like...

    cristiano-ronaldo-1-435.jpg

    And again, here's what an overweight 167lb 5'8" non-professional athlete looks like.
    8b68900702e83dd30dc1e06ac5344b2cc466.jpg

    What is that trying to prove?

    I think I am lost.
  • SideSteel
    SideSteel Posts: 11,068 Member
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    Saying its completely useless is just as short sighted as saying that its the ultimate metric.

    It's one tool and its important to recognize exactly what it tells you. And for what it tells you, and for its intended use, it is pretty good for the general population.

    And we are back to the general population argument

    Am I in the general population? Is my wife?

    So we both look at the BMI chart and find we're both on the verge of healthy/overweight

    Tell me how it's pretty good for me or my wife based on what you know?

    I'm not sure what your point is. There are athletic people, typically those who have years of resistance training experience, for whom the BMI scale may not be reasonable.

    There are also those who are in denial about their level of fatness.

    I cannot determine the answer to this in your specific example based on the information I currently have.

    Do you believe that all calorie estimation calculators are completely useless because there are outliers?
    You keep saying outliers. But when there are so many examples of when BMI doesn't work, those aren't outliers. Outliers are rarities that skew the data. Get much more than a couple and it stops being an outlier and is now a trend.


    In this case perhaps I'm using the wrong terminology when I say outlier since one definition places outliers distant from the group.

    What I mean to say is this: BMI will be accurate for most people and there will also exist some people for whom it will not be accurate for. I believe it will be a reasonable metric for most people, but it is only one piece of information and it should be treated as such.

    As an aside, I also believe that there are several people who are in the overweight category who believe BMI is just wrong because they have all kinds of muscle mass or bone density, when the truth is they are just overweight and in denial.
  • QueenBishOTUniverse
    QueenBishOTUniverse Posts: 14,121 Member
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    Just extremes to prove the point, that's all

    Those like me who don't (unfortunately) look like Ronaldo, will still find the results skewed

    Oh I know, but the argument that the average person is just delusional about how fat they are is obnoxious and condescending. No sorry, you don't have to be a body builder or an extreme athlete to be an outlier on BMI charts.
  • SideSteel
    SideSteel Posts: 11,068 Member
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    I think you're missing the point

    Most aren't saying that the BMI chart is total BS at all.

    I was answering the OP's question only...which is whether or not it is BS
    Is it complete BS to rely solely on the BMI charts? Yes

    FIFY
    Except ALOT of people, companies, and even health professionals DO take BMI in isolation without any other context.

    And obvsiously I would disagree with that approach...but that's the fault of the person relying solely on one metric with no context, not the metric itself.

    ^ I agree with all of this.

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