Thinking about changing tac would like your thoughts.

RHachicho

Ok so basically the weight loss is really begging to slow down. I've gone from 338 lb's and 46% body fat to 256 lbs and 27% body fat which I think is a great achievement. I am also fitter and healthier than I have ever been in my entire life. In fact I am fitter and stronger than many thin people I know. And it has come to my attention that perhaps I am headed in the wrong direction.

When I started my diet I kind of went for the default position of ... I want to be thin and healthy. But the fact is I don't really care about being thin or having my 6 pack showing. I just want to be healthy and strong. And if that's the case. Is being fat really a bad thing?

I have been doing a lot of reading that suggests that being overweight really isn't the demon it's cracked up to be. Rather being metabolically abnormal is the leading cause of ill health. And that is caused by bad diet and lack of exercise than it is caused by the AMOUNT of food we eat. Please note nowhere in this post am I advocating going back to a diet of junk food and full sugar soda.

The Idea is I am going to log my calories. BUT I am going to eat as much healthy food as I want to. And I am going to push myself to be as physically fit as possible. I am going to get in 4 gym sessions (lifting and cardio) and at least 12 hours of walking in a week just for starters. When I feel my muscles can manage it (Which will probably be quite soon)I will start going for runs rather than walks.

I have never really much cared what others thought about my weight. And honestly I don't really think the few people I have seen who are fat but well muscles look bad. I think that might be right for me. What do you guys think of the idea?

wannakimmy

The Idea is I am going to log my calories. BUT I am going to eat as much healthy food as I want to.

Even too much "healthy food" can lead to gaining weight. I am not trying to be negative, just stating a fact.

Congrats on your loss thus far, I wish you the best.

RHachicho

Aye thanks mate but I am quite aware of that. I just don't really care all that much. I know it's not a common viewpoint. But as long as I am healthy I do not care if I am fat. And there is some evidence to suggest that if you are healthy. Then being fat doesn't actually matter all that much. It's just cos being fat and unhealthy often do go hand in hand that we have become obsessed with the idea that thin = healthy.

YamaMaya1

Providing you don't gain weight, and just maintain, you should be fine. Just because you've changed your goal doesn't mean you give up all you've worked for. As you get fitter and stronger you may need to increase your calories but for now I'd say put yourself on a maintaining schedule.

editorgrrl

Even too much "healthy food" can lead to gaining weight. I am not trying to be negative, just stating a fact.

^^^This.

Weight loss takes a whole lot of trial & error to find what works for you. So try your way for a few weeks, then reevaluate.

With 33.6 lbs. to go, set your goal no higher than 1 lb. per week. According to your diary, your calorie goal is only 1,800?!

Please, read the Sexypants post: http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/1080242-a-guide-to-get-you-started-on-your-path-to-sexypants

Kalikel

Congrats on your weight loss. That is fantastic, impressive and inspiring.

I believe the doctors. The fat is a risk factor for so many unhealthy things, some of which are well known (e.g. diabetes, cardiovascular disease) and some aren't.

I've seen 400 pound forty year olds, but not 400 pound eighty year olds. They don't stick the work "morbid" in front of "obesity" for nothing.

I cannot agree that a person who wants to healthy should be obese. But...

If you want to quit, do that! Everyone should do what makes them happy!

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SLLRunner

RHachicho,

Congratulations on your weight loss, and getting stronger and healthier. :drinker:

It sounds like you've found a plan that works for you. That's a good thing. And, I think being fit and strong is important, but for me it's about not being underweight anymore because I was overweight from day one. It's amazing to me that I've come this far.

I tend to eat more foods I perceive as more healthy, such as fruits, veggies, nuts, meats, homemade breads, and less of what I don't perceive as being all that great for me, such as cakes, cookies, ice cream, and other sugar loaded foods. In my opinion, there is nothing wrong with any food, it just comes down to preference. And, I do allow treats into my calorie goal each day because it's actually what keeps me on track.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts.

RHachicho

Aye I do appreciate the answers so far. But I just want to clarify something. I don't want to say that someone who wishes to be healthy should in fact be obese. I am simply saying that actually being obese doesn't seem to matter all that much as long as the person is otherwise healthy and fit. You do in fact see a few fat older people around. And these are mostly the fat people that have been active all their lives. Remember correlation != causation. Just because people are often fat and unhealthy does not mean fat = unhealthy. And "doctors" have been wrong before. Indeed the cooper study seems to support the idea that those who where fit and healthy did not suffer any ill effects from being overweight (note : we are NOT talking morbidly obese here.) In fact the group that suffered irrespective of fitness levels where those who where significantly underweight.

I basically want to try breaking the mold and seeing what it does for me. Im going to put down the calorie counting and pick up the weights and get running ... with a vengeance. It's just sometimes it seems as though all this calorie counting is struggling against what our bodies are designed to do. I am taking on board your suggestions though. And I do think that if I decide to do this I am going to count calories and do it at maintenance for a while and see what happens. No need to jump in at the deep end and lose months of progress.

MelodyandBarbells

Well at least you know how to lose weight, so if you did decide to lose again you should be able to

I'm in favor of maintaining too, if possible. Guess I'm not too sure what may be your end goal here. 300 lbs okay, so long as you've got some muscle definition showing under that and are physically fit? I'm thinking back to the pic you posted in that other thread I forget which

_Zardoz_

Sounds like your just trying to justify eating a lot of food to me. If you can't be bothered to carry on fine but try and be honest with yourself. Also I very much doubt you are 27% BF at that weight so I would wonder how you measured that. The medical consensus is being obese increases your chances of various illness's and reduces your life chances. if you search you can always find people that disagree with that but all the majority of reputable sources and research point to that. Good luck on whatever you do but you really need to be honest with your reasoning

BeginningAgainMay14

Cardiovascularly, you're right. Studies indicate it is better to be fat and fit than thin and unfit..

I don't think you've thought about your joints, though, especially if you want to add running to your workout program. Being severely overweight (regardless of your body fat percentage) is very hard on your knees and ankles. Knee replacement surgery is no picnic and has a surprisingly low success rate.

Do what will make you the happiest, but I can't help but think that you are setting yourself up for a lot of pain and suffering down the line if this is the route you choose.

MelodyandBarbells

Could you expand your thoughts on this: "It's just sometimes it seems as though all this calorie counting is struggling against what our bodies are designed to do."

Are you saying calorie counting is leaning towards making you eat too little, or that you're frustrated with calorie counting itself?

RHachicho

In truth I don't really have and "end goal" That pic was just an example of someone who has muscles and fat. My idea is to completely drop the idea that I have to be something other than what I am and just eat healthy nutritious food as much as I need to and ramp up the exercise to maximum capacity and see where my genetics take me.

zyxst

In for later reading

RHachicho

Cardiovascularly, you're right. Studies indicate it is better to be fat and fit than thin and unfit..

I don't think you've thought about your joints, though, especially if you want to add running to your workout program. Being severely overweight (regardless of your body fat percentage) is very hard on your knees and ankles. Knee replacement surgery is no picnic and has a surprisingly low success rate.

Do what will make you the happiest, but I can't help but think that you are setting yourself up for a lot of pain and suffering down the line if this is the route you choose.

Yeah that's one sound argument against this way of doing things. It's something I had thought about too. I guess if i do choose to take this route I will have to be really focused on building large muscles so that they take some of my weight rather than it all resting squarely on my joints.

RHachicho

Sounds like your just trying to justify eating a lot of food to me. If you can't be bothered to carry on fine but try and be honest with yourself. Also I very much doubt you are 27% BF at that weight so I would wonder how you measured that. The medical consensus is being obese increases your chances of various illness's and reduces your life chances. if you search you can always find people that disagree with that but all the majority of reputable sources and research point to that. Good luck on whatever you do but you really need to be honest with your reasoning

I am honest with my reasoning. My body fat was measured with that electrical meter where you have to grip the handles for a while. And that has been done thought my journey. Even my physical trainer comments that I have clearly put on muscle during this time. And that even before losing weight I had a lot to begin with. Make of that what you will but please refrain from accusing my of lying. Frankly I am insulted and disinclined to take anything you say seriously at this point. Remember that people are different. Underneath the fat I have ALWAYS been a very large very tall man with decent musculature.

liekewheeless

I think focusing on a healthy diet and being fit is more important than having a weight that's considered ideal. I could take note myself and work on that.

I don't know what your height is, and if you are very muscular etc. If you do have a lot of muscle compared to fat your weight won't fit in the BMI range anyway.

That all said. Your body isn't made to carry to much excess weight. Over time it will affect your joints and organs (they have to keep all of it going).

RHachicho

Could you expand your thoughts on this: "It's just sometimes it seems as though all this calorie counting is struggling against what our bodies are designed to do."

Are you saying calorie counting is leaning towards making you eat too little, or that you're frustrated with calorie counting itself?

Hmm it's not that I think calorie counting is bad I mean I have been doing it for months. I think it certainly helps to build healthier eating habits. I just think after a certain point you understand intrinsically what is an indulgence and what isn't. Before calorie counting it was very easy for me to make mistakes and use loads of olive oil in my cooking or eat a pack of jelly beans thinking ... hell how bad can they be. Calorie counting teaches you the weight of foods very very well. I just think that after a while you don't need to stick rigidly to the curriculum anymore. If that makes sense?

RHachicho

I think focusing on a healthy diet and being fit is more important than having a weight that's considered ideal. I could take note myself and work on that.

I don't know what your height is, and if you are very muscular etc. If you do have a lot of muscle compared to fat your weight won't fit in the BMI range anyway.

That all said. Your body isn't made to carry to much excess weight. Over time it will affect your joints and organs (they have to keep all of it going).

I am 6 foot 4 with a body frame that could probably be classified as XL my PT did some measurements and he said well Ramez, I'm just going to have to classify you as a large but honestly your a rank above that. It's just that people who are as big as you are are pretty rare. He estimated my ideal weight at somewhere between 210 - 230 lbs based on that.

xsmilexforxmex

So, personally I'm a 5'5" female and was shocked when, at 155lbs I was told I was 42% body fat per a bod pod (I asked the lady if they considered bust and booty size, she didn't take me seriously) and yet my fiancee is at 15% at 225 lbs and 6'6" so it doesn't surprise me that you can be at 27%.
^^Threw above in because so many people are having issues believing you're at 27%.^^

In the end, you have to do what works for you. Just be prepared that running will decrease muscle if you aren't eating enough to build back. That being said, I really don't feel what you're doing is anything different than a typical body builder does duing 'bulking' so I see nothing wrong with it if you're comfortable with the way you look and feel. (hope I understood correctly!)

MelodyandBarbells

Could you expand your thoughts on this: "It's just sometimes it seems as though all this calorie counting is struggling against what our bodies are designed to do."

Are you saying calorie counting is leaning towards making you eat too little, or that you're frustrated with calorie counting itself?

Hmm it's not that I think calorie counting is bad I mean I have been doing it for months. I think it certainly helps to build healthier eating habits. I just think after a certain point you understand intrinsically what is an indulgence and what isn't. Before calorie counting it was very easy for me to make mistakes and use loads of olive oil in my cooking or eat a pack of jelly beans thinking ... hell how bad can they be. Calorie counting teaches you the weight of foods very very well. I just think that after a while you don't need to stick rigidly to the curriculum anymore. If that makes sense?

Well, yeah

Whenever there's a "do you want to calorie count for the rest of your life" post, it seems to be a 50/50 split where some people felt they were doing this to learn certain habits, while others compared how little time it takes them to log vs their phenomenal results and decided it was worth it.

I don't eat only "healthy foods", so for me, not calorie counting would not work at this time. But yeah if my diet was mostly meat and vegetables, I probably wouldn't even need to count for as long as I have.

Do you use the app, though? I find it makes calorie counting truly easy

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RHachicho

Could you expand your thoughts on this: "It's just sometimes it seems as though all this calorie counting is struggling against what our bodies are designed to do."

Are you saying calorie counting is leaning towards making you eat too little, or that you're frustrated with calorie counting itself?

Hmm it's not that I think calorie counting is bad I mean I have been doing it for months. I think it certainly helps to build healthier eating habits. I just think after a certain point you understand intrinsically what is an indulgence and what isn't. Before calorie counting it was very easy for me to make mistakes and use loads of olive oil in my cooking or eat a pack of jelly beans thinking ... hell how bad can they be. Calorie counting teaches you the weight of foods very very well. I just think that after a while you don't need to stick rigidly to the curriculum anymore. If that makes sense?

Well, yeah

Whenever there's a "do you want to calorie count for the rest of your life" post, it seems to be a 50/50 split where some people felt they were doing this to learn certain habits, while others compared how little time it takes them to log vs their phenomenal results and decided it was worth it.

I don't eat only "healthy foods", so for me, not calorie counting would not work at this time. But yeah if my diet was mostly meat and vegetables, I probably wouldn't even need to count for as long as I have.

Do you use the app, though? I find it makes calorie counting truly easy

Yeah truthfully I don't have a smartphone /blush

What do you think of the idea of eating as much healthy food as I need but having a small weekly allowance for things like sweets say 500 - 1000 calories of em a week? I know it seems weird but I don't even think I will eat that much. Aside from the occasional soft serve ice cream in hot weather sweat treats don't really tempt me. Even without counting the vast majority of my calories would come from lean meats grilled veg fruit. And some refined carbs from my breakfast cereal and post workout panini.

RHachicho

Sounds like your just trying to justify eating a lot of food to me. If you can't be bothered to carry on fine but try and be honest with yourself. Also I very much doubt you are 27% BF at that weight so I would wonder how you measured that. The medical consensus is being obese increases your chances of various illness's and reduces your life chances. if you search you can always find people that disagree with that but all the majority of reputable sources and research point to that. Good luck on whatever you do but you really need to be honest with your reasoning

I am honest with my reasoning. My body fat was measured with that electrical meter where you have to grip the handles for a while. And that has been done thought my journey. Even my physical trainer comments that I have clearly put on muscle during this time. And that even before losing weight I had a lot to begin with. Make of that what you will but please refrain from accusing my of lying. Frankly I am insulted and disinclined to take anything you say seriously at this point. Remember that people are different. Underneath the fat I have ALWAYS been a very large very tall man with decent musculature.

As far as the bf reading, keep in mind that those bio impedance readers are swayed heavily by hydration and can be wildly inaccurate. No one is accusing you of lying, just pointing out reality. For instance I've had plenty of occasions where those readers gave me a bf% of 6, and I've never been anywhere near that.

You can chose to be insulted if you'd like but reality is reality. In our journey many of us do 2 things:
Overestimate the amount of muscle we have
Underestimate the amount of fat we have

Huh well I've heard of a bit of inaccuracy but for me it's always kind of measured up. As I have lost weight the reading has dropped gradually and consistently and has not swung wildly in any direction. When you say they have been influenced by hydration what do you mean exactly. What throws of the reading and how?

And it wasn't necessarily what he said that insulted me but the way he said it. I could feel the snark all the way from here lol.

MelodyandBarbells

Could you expand your thoughts on this: "It's just sometimes it seems as though all this calorie counting is struggling against what our bodies are designed to do."

Are you saying calorie counting is leaning towards making you eat too little, or that you're frustrated with calorie counting itself?

Hmm it's not that I think calorie counting is bad I mean I have been doing it for months. I think it certainly helps to build healthier eating habits. I just think after a certain point you understand intrinsically what is an indulgence and what isn't. Before calorie counting it was very easy for me to make mistakes and use loads of olive oil in my cooking or eat a pack of jelly beans thinking ... hell how bad can they be. Calorie counting teaches you the weight of foods very very well. I just think that after a while you don't need to stick rigidly to the curriculum anymore. If that makes sense?

Well, yeah

Whenever there's a "do you want to calorie count for the rest of your life" post, it seems to be a 50/50 split where some people felt they were doing this to learn certain habits, while others compared how little time it takes them to log vs their phenomenal results and decided it was worth it.

I don't eat only "healthy foods", so for me, not calorie counting would not work at this time. But yeah if my diet was mostly meat and vegetables, I probably wouldn't even need to count for as long as I have.

Do you use the app, though? I find it makes calorie counting truly easy

Yeah truthfully I don't have a smartphone /blush

What do you think of the idea of eating as much healthy food as I need but having a small weekly allowance for things like sweets say 500 - 1000 calories of em a week? I know it seems weird but I don't even think I will eat that much. Aside from the occasional soft serve ice cream in hot weather sweat treats don't really tempt me. Even without counting the vast majority of my calories would come from lean meats grilled veg fruit. And some refined carbs from my breakfast cereal and post workout panini.

The mostly healthy plus some treats actually sounds like what a lot of people do. It's one of the numerous moderation strategies out there. Maybe sweets aren't your poison. Some prefer salty treats. Personally I wouldn't eat anything I didn't truly want. That's why it's been pretty easy for *me* to cut out alcohol from my diet for the most part.

RHachicho

Could you expand your thoughts on this: "It's just sometimes it seems as though all this calorie counting is struggling against what our bodies are designed to do."

Are you saying calorie counting is leaning towards making you eat too little, or that you're frustrated with calorie counting itself?

Hmm it's not that I think calorie counting is bad I mean I have been doing it for months. I think it certainly helps to build healthier eating habits. I just think after a certain point you understand intrinsically what is an indulgence and what isn't. Before calorie counting it was very easy for me to make mistakes and use loads of olive oil in my cooking or eat a pack of jelly beans thinking ... hell how bad can they be. Calorie counting teaches you the weight of foods very very well. I just think that after a while you don't need to stick rigidly to the curriculum anymore. If that makes sense?

Well, yeah

Whenever there's a "do you want to calorie count for the rest of your life" post, it seems to be a 50/50 split where some people felt they were doing this to learn certain habits, while others compared how little time it takes them to log vs their phenomenal results and decided it was worth it.

I don't eat only "healthy foods", so for me, not calorie counting would not work at this time. But yeah if my diet was mostly meat and vegetables, I probably wouldn't even need to count for as long as I have.

Do you use the app, though? I find it makes calorie counting truly easy

Yeah truthfully I don't have a smartphone /blush

What do you think of the idea of eating as much healthy food as I need but having a small weekly allowance for things like sweets say 500 - 1000 calories of em a week? I know it seems weird but I don't even think I will eat that much. Aside from the occasional soft serve ice cream in hot weather sweat treats don't really tempt me. Even without counting the vast majority of my calories would come from lean meats grilled veg fruit. And some refined carbs from my breakfast cereal and post workout panini.

The mostly healthy plus some treats actually sounds like what a lot of people do. It's one of the numerous moderation strategies out there. Maybe sweets aren't your poison. Some prefer salty treats. Personally I wouldn't eat anything I didn't truly want. That's why it's been pretty easy for *me* to cut out alcohol from my diet for the most part.

Yeah I hardly drink at all myself. Apart from occasionally like once in a month or two when i go to or host a party. It's true that salty snacks tempt me more than sweet ones but honestly As long as I can sprinkle a little salt on my grilled veg or meat salty snacks don't really tempt me. Though I do tend to be guilty of slightly over salting my food sometimes. I guess if I decide to go ahead with this I will have to see if salt becomes a problem. I don't think sweet treats will. But salty ... maybe. Possibly I will have to incorporate stuff like that into a treat budget.

Regardless I intend to discuss this plan with my doctor and my PT before going ahead and see what they have to say about it too.

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77tes

Hi, and many congratulations on an amazing loss! You have made a major impact on your health. If you are satisfied with where you are, go ahead and try working without the net of calorie counting.

People (like my slim husband) who are lean for their whole lives eat according to their hunger signals, and many people here on MFP decide to transition away from calorie counting. I don't feel that this is a good option for me because I've had a disordered relationship with food for many years.

If you try not logging and find you are putting on fat, start logging again.

If you decide to shift to maintenance, it is a good idea to have a plan. One of my friends wrote this excellent blog on the subject.

http://www.myfitnesspal.com/blog/themedalist/view/what-s-your-maintenance-plan-624676

Good luck!

Rmenifield

i like your post....you are right you dont have to have a six pack to be healthy.and there is nothing wrong with being healthy and strong. to many people confuse healthy and fit..you can look fit and be sickly and lets not forget the term skinny fat. you have a plan stick with it foe 3 months and see if it works. after 3 months you will know what to add or take away for it to fit your goals.
remember eat what you want. as long as it fits your goals. dont be afraid of eggs(dont eat the yellow part they say) dont be afraid of real butter etc to many people get caught up with all these fads diets that dont work . they want to qoute doctors....but we have all seen this have you taken xyz..a major lawsuit has been filed.......just last week a doctor said it was the cure all potion. remember everyone is different what is healthy for you may not be healthy for someone else. it is not a one size fits all thing. just stick to what you know and your plan looks great let me know in 3 months did it work for you.

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