Squats overrated?
version45
Posts: 35 Member
Everything I've read extolls the virtues of squats above all other forms of exercise. So I've been methodically doing them once a week, with heavy weight and fairly high intensity, for nearly half a year now. But after squat day, my legs are next to useless with soreness for the next two to three days (like even walking or going up the stairs takes some mental preparation!) and I find myself avoiding jogging, soccer, basketball, etc.
Isn't this defeating the purpose of exercise, if the consequences of performing it precludes us from enjoying normal life? Does anyone else experience this from squats? If so, do you have any suggested alternative exercises?
Isn't this defeating the purpose of exercise, if the consequences of performing it precludes us from enjoying normal life? Does anyone else experience this from squats? If so, do you have any suggested alternative exercises?
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Replies
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Everything I've read extolls the virtues of squats above all other forms of exercise. So I've been methodically doing them once a week, with heavy weight and fairly high intensity, for nearly half a year now. But after squat day, my legs are next to useless with soreness for the next two to three days (like even walking or going up the stairs takes some mental preparation!) and I find myself avoiding jogging, soccer, basketball, etc.
Isn't this defeating the purpose of exercise, if the consequences of performing it precludes us from enjoying normal life? Does anyone else experience this from squats? If so, do you have any suggested alternative exercises?
Perhaps you need to find a different rep/frequency/volume approach that works for you and your recovery and fits with your other activities?
For instance: 85% for three triples is easy to recover from. 5x5 at the same intensity is not. Of course, this all depends on your current fitness, strength, age, gender, etc...0 -
- do what you enjoy doing and ditch the squats.
"ducks head as a dozen squat enthusiasts swoop in from the nearby squat rack"0 -
I often read people going on about the dreaded "legs day" where they systematically destroy their legs for the next week with heavy weights and numerous reps. Each to their own but I've never done this and my legs are muscled and I can actually use them so I don't understand the fascination. I can see the benefit if you're a body builder or something but for normal life, as you say, it's a pain.
I do squats, but I don't use massive weights (goblet squats with a kettlebell), but I also do lunges (again, not too heavy), cycling to work (which I couldn't do if I did heavy legs days), walking and hill sprints and my legs are fine with only mild soreness that doesn't stop me doing anything I want to do.0 -
I always feel like I've done a good leg workout if my legs are feeling my crap the next day after having done squats. In saying that squats should not be the only leg workout you do, do walking lunges, leg curls, stiff leg deadlift or the deadlift itself.0
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I often read people going on about the dreaded "legs day" where they systematically destroy their legs for the next week with heavy weights and numerous reps. Each to their own but I've never done this and my legs are muscled and I can actually use them so I don't understand the fascination. I can see the benefit if you're a body builder or something but for normal life, as you say, it's a pain.
I do squats, but I don't use massive weights (goblet squats with a kettlebell), but I also do lunges (again, not too heavy), cycling to work (which I couldn't do if I did heavy legs days), walking and hill sprints and my legs are fine with only mild soreness that doesn't stop me doing anything I want to do.
This is also a good point.
What is your goal? Increased strength? Hypertrophy?
After the birth of my daughter, I did Dan John's Easy Strength. Squatting every day. But only 60-70% Intensity for either 2x5, 5,3,2 or 3x3. Greasing the groove. Got my front squat easily over bodyweight without any soreness, on no sleep and a crappy diet. You've got to ask yourself what you want to achieve, then pick the tool/method....0 -
There are plenty of other workouts you can do that train your legs besides squats. Squats are usually suggested because it is more of a full body workout than most others. Do what works for you.0
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When you say heavy weight and high intensity, just how many are you doing and at what intensity? And what other exercise are you doing alongside the squats?0
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Everything I've read extolls the virtues of squats above all other forms of exercise. So I've been methodically doing them once a week, with heavy weight and fairly high intensity, for nearly half a year now. But after squat day, my legs are next to useless with soreness for the next two to three days (like even walking or going up the stairs takes some mental preparation!) and I find myself avoiding jogging, soccer, basketball, etc.
Isn't this defeating the purpose of exercise, if the consequences of performing it precludes us from enjoying normal life? Does anyone else experience this from squats? If so, do you have any suggested alternative exercises?
Perhaps you need to find a different rep/frequency/volume approach that works for you and your recovery and fits with your other activities?
For instance: 85% for three triples is easy to recover from. 5x5 at the same intensity is not. Of course, this all depends on your current fitness, strength, age, gender, etc...
I recommend ignoring all post saying you can replace squats...you can't. But, this response says it all. It appears to me that you are suffering from the same problem I suffer from...age. I recover much slower then I used to and had to change sets/reps for squat day. I'm still not a fan of doing legs but I know my overall fitness has improved because I do them.0 -
Everything I've read extolls the virtues of squats above all other forms of exercise. So I've been methodically doing them once a week, with heavy weight and fairly high intensity, for nearly half a year now. But after squat day, my legs are next to useless with soreness for the next two to three days (like even walking or going up the stairs takes some mental preparation!) and I find myself avoiding jogging, soccer, basketball, etc.
Isn't this defeating the purpose of exercise, if the consequences of performing it precludes us from enjoying normal life? Does anyone else experience this from squats? If so, do you have any suggested alternative exercises?
Perhaps you need to find a different rep/frequency/volume approach that works for you and your recovery and fits with your other activities?
For instance: 85% for three triples is easy to recover from. 5x5 at the same intensity is not. Of course, this all depends on your current fitness, strength, age, gender, etc...
I recommend ignoring all post saying you can replace squats...you can't. But, this response says it all. It appears to me that you are suffering from the same problem I suffer from...age. I recover much slower then I used to and had to change sets/reps for squat day. I'm still not a fan of doing legs but I know my overall fitness has improved because I do them.
I'll add two thoughts to this:
(1) I'm 41 and am fine after legs day, even after 90 minute workouts, but I've been doing this a while and anytime I skip my legs workout for more than 1 or 2 sessions I have hell to pay for it on when I go back. My advice here is to stick with it as the DOMS will eventually go down. That and do a little cardio after your workouts. It doesn't need to be a full run, even walking will help, and definitely go play your sports the next day as it will relieve the pain.
(2) It got better when I started squatting twice a week rather than just once. If you're very advanced then once a week is enough but I've gotten better strength gains, and reduced the effects of DOMS with squatting twice a week.0 -
Im currently reading this book about strength training
http://startingstrength.com/index.php/site/books
It has the best explanation of the mechanics of each type of exercise, as well as how to do them correctly. Squats is the one exercise they emphasize the most, and I personally love squatting. Having said that, it's not the only exercise that will make your legs strong. It is, however, the best way to work on your posterior chain, if that's your goal, of course.
Hope this helps! Cheers0 -
I've only been lifting a few months and my legs don't suffer like they did the first few weeks. I do squats at every workout, but I'm not quickly increasing my load. About every week or two I add 5 lbs instead of every workout. I only get some mild DOMS after the days I increase the load. It's nothing like the suffering I had when I first learned to squat.0
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I recommend ignoring any post that says you can't replace an exercise... nothing should be sacred. Having said that, changing from one high intensity and volume session a week to two moderate sessions can be enough to reduce doms greatly. This is also true of bench and pretty much any exercise except perhaps deadlifts. However if you feel that the reward from squats is not equalling the effort you put in then by all means drop them for something else and see if you can find a better balance between effort in the gym and soreness outside of it.0
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Wow, great advice from this community, thanks all. My squats currently consist of 4 sets of 10 reps at 225,275,315,335. These are followed by deadlifts, lunges, and straight legged deadlifts. I'm 6', 185 lbs, and 44 years old, so I'm inclined to think that Sunofabeach is spot on about highlighting my age.
Six months ago, my goals were initially just to take command of my health, get lean, and enjoy my body (which as any midlife person knows, can creep away from you). A consequence of my decision was joining an over 40 pickup basketball league, which has been fantastically fun. The squats have definitely been beneficial, because after a couple of months of doing them, I could dunk a basketball like I used to in high school. I just had to wait for five days after squats before I could even CONSIDER trying to walk, much less jump and dunk.
I think perhaps I will drop the weight, although when I tried this before, I felt like I wasn't really exercising very hard. I noticed a drop in explosive power, too, but since it's all just recreational, not a big deal. Thanks for your experience everyone, I shall keep tinkering with the workout. Maybe try some new ones like yoga, which I've never really had the courage to try out.0 -
how dare you talk about squats like that
but seriously, i think the problem lies in the recovery aspect rather than the exercise itself. are you getting enough sleep, and a proper macro split? how much do you eat in a typical day?
i also agree with doing them twice a week rather than just once, it'll adjust your quads faster so DOMS isnt an issue0 -
The more you do the less it hurts.
Right now, your body is letting you know how weak you are.
(Nice numbers!)
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Wow, great advice from this community, thanks all. My squats currently consist of 4 sets of 10 reps at 225,275,315,335. These are followed by deadlifts, lunges, and straight legged deadlifts. I'm 6', 185 lbs, and 44 years old, so I'm inclined to think that Sunofabeach is spot on about highlighting my age.
Six months ago, my goals were initially just to take command of my health, get lean, and enjoy my body (which as any midlife person knows, can creep away from you). A consequence of my decision was joining an over 40 pickup basketball league, which has been fantastically fun. The squats have definitely been beneficial, because after a couple of months of doing them, I could dunk a basketball like I used to in high school. I just had to wait for five days after squats before I could even CONSIDER trying to walk, much less jump and dunk.
I think perhaps I will drop the weight, although when I tried this before, I felt like I wasn't really exercising very hard. I noticed a drop in explosive power, too, but since it's all just recreational, not a big deal. Thanks for your experience everyone, I shall keep tinkering with the workout. Maybe try some new ones like yoga, which I've never really had the courage to try out.
4x10 is a bucketload of volume. Add in Deads and other ancillary exercises on the same day and you've got a massive workout.
The answer isn't to drop the weight and continue your existing rep scheme. The answer is to try a different intensity/volume scheme.
You also need to look at this volume of squatting in the context of your other activity, sleep, caloric surplus/deficit and hydration. If everything were equal, you could recover better if you were in a caloric surplus.0 -
What is odd to me is that after 6 months your body hasn't adapted to the point where you barely get sore.0
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What is odd to me is that after 6 months your body hasn't adapted to the point where you barely get sore.
My guess is he's been pushing himself real hard.
He's got pretty decent numbers for someone who only got interested in working out 6 months ago. Plus he's doing all sorts of other activities that are cutting into his recovery. And he's deadlifting and squatting in the same workout...0 -
Try dropping the deadlifts on the same day. Squats & deadlifts are both big compound lifts, hitting a lot of the same muscles.
Do the squats & then some isolation excercises, change the isolation excersises regularly, ior work out a rotation.
Not really from an expert advise - but I did the strong lifts 5x5 routine for some time, they recomend just doing 1 set of 5 deadlifts after those squats, reason being that the squats hammered the muscles involved.
D0 -
Wow, great advice from this community, thanks all. My squats currently consist of 4 sets of 10 reps at 225,275,315,335. These are followed by deadlifts, lunges, and straight legged deadlifts. I'm 6', 185 lbs, and 44 years old, so I'm inclined to think that Sunofabeach is spot on about highlighting my age.
I wouldn't chalk it up to age. Granted - I'm "only" 35, almost 36 but I have worked out for years with competitive natural bodybuilders in their 50's who don't find age to be as big a problem as you're having. What I'd advise is to move your deadlifts to your back day. I have never done so many big lifts in one day - I suspect THAT'S what's killing your legs for days on end. If you're going as heavy on the other excercises as you are on squats I'm not surprised your sapped for a few days.
Here is my leg day - and I recover just fine within a day or two.
Squat (185 x 12, 225 x 10, 315 x 8)
Leg Press (180 x 12, 270 x 10, 360 x 8, 450 x 6)
Calf Raise machine (150 x 12 ,160 x10, 170 x 8)
Leg Extension (150 x 12 ,160 x10, 170 x 8)
Leg Curls ((150 x 12 ,160 x10, 170 x 8)
I go heavy on deadlifts - and I couldn't imagine doing them on leg day.0 -
My rear end doesn't think so. :-)
Seriously though personally I love the way squats targets so many different areas in one movement. I feel my hamstrings, glutes, quads, thighs, core, and my upper back working hard.
Also I love how I can progress. If a weight starts to gets to easy just add more!
However, if I did not enjoy doing squats I would not continuing doing it.0 -
I am a firm believer in full range of motion Squats are great but must be balanced with a reverse motion0
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I just had to wait for five days after squats before I could even CONSIDER trying to walk, much less jump and dunk.
For my money this is a big part of your problem. The longer you avoid activity the longer you'll be sore. Sore or not, I continue my regular activity, perhaps with a longer warmup. Nothing gets rid of the soreness faster than the next workout.0 -
Everything I've read extolls the virtues of squats above all other forms of exercise. So I've been methodically doing them once a week, with heavy weight and fairly high intensity, for nearly half a year now. But after squat day, my legs are next to useless with soreness for the next two to three days (like even walking or going up the stairs takes some mental preparation!) and I find myself avoiding jogging, soccer, basketball, etc.
Isn't this defeating the purpose of exercise, if the consequences of performing it precludes us from enjoying normal life? Does anyone else experience this from squats? If so, do you have any suggested alternative exercises?
I would have to stay that your body does not recover well from workouts. Research cold showers after workouts.0 -
What is odd to me is that after 6 months your body hasn't adapted to the point where you barely get sore.
What is odd to me is how much more than me he's lifting after only 6 months...(and at a similar age/weight as mine).
:indifferent:0 -
OP, I just read SOB's advice, and he's not saying to decrease the weights. This isn't about age (he's 41 and doesn't have severe DOMS anymore), this is about you trying to do too much on one day. His advice was to keep at it and add in an extra legs day to your weekly routine.
Also 4x10 and then deadlifts? You'd be better at a 5x3 or a 5x5 at heavier weights once a week, dropping dead lifts on your heavy squat day, and having a deadlift day followed by lighter squats. SOB also said to get moving after you squat. 20-30 minute jog, foam roll, walk, etc. Don't sit and let the DOMS settle in. Your stats are really good. How's your form? How much are you deadlifting?
Just came in to clarify the advice given to you. Want you to be successful and not give up on squats just because your legs day is too much volume.0 -
Wow, great advice from this community, thanks all. My squats currently consist of 4 sets of 10 reps at 225,275,315,335. These are followed by deadlifts, lunges, and straight legged deadlifts. I'm 6', 185 lbs, and 44 years old, so I'm inclined to think that Sunofabeach is spot on about highlighting my age.
Six months ago, my goals were initially just to take command of my health, get lean, and enjoy my body (which as any midlife person knows, can creep away from you). A consequence of my decision was joining an over 40 pickup basketball league, which has been fantastically fun. The squats have definitely been beneficial, because after a couple of months of doing them, I could dunk a basketball like I used to in high school. I just had to wait for five days after squats before I could even CONSIDER trying to walk, much less jump and dunk.
I think perhaps I will drop the weight, although when I tried this before, I felt like I wasn't really exercising very hard. I noticed a drop in explosive power, too, but since it's all just recreational, not a big deal. Thanks for your experience everyone, I shall keep tinkering with the workout. Maybe try some new ones like yoga, which I've never really had the courage to try out.
4x10 is a bucketload of volume. Add in Deads and other ancillary exercises on the same day and you've got a massive workout.
The answer isn't to drop the weight and continue your existing rep scheme. The answer is to try a different intensity/volume scheme.
You also need to look at this volume of squatting in the context of your other activity, sleep, caloric surplus/deficit and hydration. If everything were equal, you could recover better if you were in a caloric surplus.
This.
Seems like to much but yet not enough.
I would definitely change your programming- I would drop the amount of work you are doing- and do legs on two different days rather than trying to shove all that work into one day.
Are you using a specific program?
what's your end goal?0 -
Foam Roll.0
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I would increase frequency and decrease the volume per session. Also, look into active recovery. After your leg day what do you do - Take a rest day, sit around etc? You'd be better off doing some form of light movement.0
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You could be starting with too much weight too fast and not stretching enough. Work up from bodyweight if you have to. Also, your muscles can lose what strength/endurance they have in as little as 2 days so doing them only once a week is likely not enough. Try doing them every 3 days for now and work towards doing them every 2 days. Carbs after a workout also help reduce the acid build up in the muscles and may help reduce soreness.0
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