Deceit, Willful Ignorance Mingled with Misinformation

MrTolerable

I have repeatedly over two months inquired about if it would be possible to gain weight while keeping my body fat percentage consistent or ideally even lowering it. - I was told over and over and over again by almost everyone that the answer is NO - some fat must be acquired when gaining weight.

I am now two weeks still away from my big weekend deadline in Sea Isle :smokin: - I have tracked my weight daily and in the past month I have been at my lowest weight (149.8) and peaked at (161.2) - my current weight is 159.4 lbs.

-What is amazing though is despite being told repeatedly it would not be possible - it is possible and I did it - my body fat percentage is basically consistent.

Just want to throw a word of encouragement out to the guys out there that want to stay cut, keep their six pack, but at the same time would like to gain weight.


-also 150lbs < 160lbs in sooo many regards - I feel healthier, I appear bigger, my BMR has increased, I had a goal of being able to squat 2X my body weight on the smith machine and just did it for the first time on the 4th, I am full of energy, my max has increased on EVERYTHING, my posture has improved - not being cocky just trying to encourage guys to take the leap...

I think after I'm done another 2 week cycle of cutting before my deadline - I want my beach photo's to be INSANE - I'm going to try to get up to 170lbs while keeping the six pack.


How I did it?

High Protein and high fat diet

On days where HIIT was being performed I had a MUCH higher then usual intake of carbs

very clean diet - not perfect but not anything the average guy would be able to handle

almost NO drinking - occasional bouts with wine if the Ms. I was with wanted me to have one with her but don't stumble here - after two glasses your DONE - because after three its hard to say no, and empty cals is a big NO.

INTENSITY - None of that sitting around after you do a set and then redo the same set - forget that - time is money when you are in the gym and you need to work with your heart rate as maxed out as it can be - intensity.

Dance music - you lift to the beat - Knife Party, Skrillex, Modestep, Deadmau5 should be blaring out of your ears.

Negative REPETITION - if you don't know what it is - then google it. If I wasn't getting gains on a machine within 2 weeks at the same weight then do TWO extra sets doing negative repetition counting to 5 5times on the last rep (that means that bar is in motion for 25secs- your mind should be MUSH in the gym.

I did circuit training, but I did it on a push/pull cycle - so on a push day I would knock out something upper body, immediately, knock out something in the abdominal region, then go back to something upper body, then abdominal

On Pull it would be circuit training of biceps, back, and legs.


MOST IMPORTANT Takeaway: Legs - I think your legs can be pushed the hardest and gains can be made the easiest, what this means is that in keeping my body fat percentage low while gaining weight - it is imperative destroy your legs - you can't spot reduce fat, but you can beat the crap out of your body that can take the most punishment.

On your days off - stay active, I knocked out at least 15mins of slow swimming

HIIT - don't be a wuss, the long distance endurance exercise is important for heart health as well - it will lower what you will need to get your max heart rate up to - both have a place in your workouts, HIIT was on the table twice a week while endurance running was likewise twice a week.

-after running at least 5 miles of endurance running - do one mile of HIIT - it is much easier to get to your max heart rate.

don't zone out of the pain - focus on it and grin. :laugh:

Don't beat yourself up when you mess up - I have not been keeping my journal over the holiday weekend - #noshameallgains

oh and supplements?


BCAA's - lots of 'em
Protein shakes - lots of 'em
Cottage Cheese - Lots of it
C4 - One scoop before strength training (and do the strength training PRIOR to CARDIO EVERY TIME - your robbing the max you can put up when you do it backwards - and running some measly mile before strength training aint no cardio.)
B6
MULTI for Him


Most important of all smile often and wink at the sexy ladies

Galatea_Stone

If your body fat percentage stayed consistent, you gained some fat. My body fat percentage went down slightly on my last bulk, and I gained some fat. My actual fat mass and lean mass went up, but my fat mass just went up less.

But you can wink at me. :flowerforyou:

MrTolerable

If your body fat percentage stayed consistent, you gained some fat. My body fat percentage went down slightly on my last bulk, and I gained some fat. My actual fat mass and lean mass went up, but my fat mass just went up less.

But you can wink at me. :flowerforyou:

I see what you mean, I did indeed technically gain 'fat'... so I guess there point was true - however they made it sound like it was fat fat- I kept the gains marginal and consistent with my body fay %. The six pack visual was what I was focused on and the fat percentage stayed consistent, so I kept the six pack - like in my most recent pic.

thanks for the helpful observation! It didn't even occur to me.

Cranquistador

LOL

I will be in Sea Isle in 9 days for 10 days.

SideSteel

What method are you using to assess bodyfat percentage and what were your before and after %s during that change in weight?

usmcmp

If your body fat percentage stayed consistent, you gained some fat. My body fat percentage went down slightly on my last bulk, and I gained some fat. My actual fat mass and lean mass went up, but my fat mass just went up less.

But you can wink at me. :flowerforyou:

I see what you mean, I did indeed technically gain 'fat'... so I guess there point was true - however they made it sound like it was fat fat- I kept the gains marginal and consistent with my body fay %. The six pack visual was what I was focused on and the fat percentage stayed consistent, so I kept the six pack - like in my most recent pic.

thanks for the helpful observation! It didn't even occur to me.

So you gained some fat and some lean mass while doing a lean bulk/recomposition in an unspecified amount of time. Sounds like you proved them right even if you were confused on what they meant by gaining fat. Also, I have visible abs at higher body fat because mine have lots of volume.

ETA: I would also like to know how composition was measured (body fat). If you were dieting when you started some of the gains could be water. That happens and could count for 5-8 pounds fairly easy. Not discrediting your efforts and gains.

Stoshew71

Good job man!

jimmmer

If your body fat percentage stayed consistent, you gained some fat. My body fat percentage went down slightly on my last bulk, and I gained some fat. My actual fat mass and lean mass went up, but my fat mass just went up less.

But you can wink at me. :flowerforyou:

I see what you mean, I did indeed technically gain 'fat'... so I guess there point was true - however they made it sound like it was fat fat- I kept the gains marginal and consistent with my body fay %. The six pack visual was what I was focused on and the fat percentage stayed consistent, so I kept the six pack - like in my most recent pic.

thanks for the helpful observation! It didn't even occur to me.

Yeah, most people don't seem to realise that if you could add muscle without any fat then your bf% would actually go down.

It's a relational quality, after all.

MrTolerable

LOL

I will be in Sea Isle in 9 days for 10 days.

small world! :laugh: if you bump into me please throw a high! :drinker:

BusyRaeNOTBusty

If your body fat percentage stayed consistent, you gained some fat. My body fat percentage went down slightly on my last bulk, and I gained some fat. My actual fat mass and lean mass went up, but my fat mass just went up less.

But you can wink at me. :flowerforyou:

I see what you mean, I did indeed technically gain 'fat'... so I guess there point was true - however they made it sound like it was fat fat- I kept the gains marginal and consistent with my body fay %. The six pack visual was what I was focused on and the fat percentage stayed consistent, so I kept the six pack - like in my most recent pic.

thanks for the helpful observation! It didn't even occur to me.

Exactly. So you gained 10lbs. I've read that most people gain a pound of fat per 3 pound of muscle when bulking. It's entirely possible you gained 6lbs of muscle (3lbs per month is pretty high but let's go with it), 2lbs of fat, and 2lbs of water/glycogen. Let's say you were 8% and 150lbs when you started,with that break down of your gain you are 8.7% and 160lbs.

Unknown

This content has been removed.

MrTolerable

What method are you using to assess bodyfat percentage and what were your before and after %s during that change in weight?

calipers, but surprisingly the scale wasn't far off - the actually body fat percentage was reported lower than the calipers, however the variance in body fat percentage stayed consistent

I know body fat percentage on calipers isn't all that great either, but if you see my pics it really has stayed consistent - I've been murdering my body for a month to make this happen.

MrTolerable

If your body fat percentage stayed consistent, you gained some fat. My body fat percentage went down slightly on my last bulk, and I gained some fat. My actual fat mass and lean mass went up, but my fat mass just went up less.

But you can wink at me. :flowerforyou:

I see what you mean, I did indeed technically gain 'fat'... so I guess there point was true - however they made it sound like it was fat fat- I kept the gains marginal and consistent with my body fay %. The six pack visual was what I was focused on and the fat percentage stayed consistent, so I kept the six pack - like in my most recent pic.

thanks for the helpful observation! It didn't even occur to me.

Exactly. So you gained 10lbs. I've read that most people gain a pound of fat per 3 pound of muscle when bulking. It's entirely possible you gained 6lbs of muscle (3lbs per month is pretty high but let's go with it), 2lbs of fat, and 2lbs of water/glycogen. Let's say you were 8% and 150lbs when you started,with that break down of your gain you are 8.7% and 160lbs.

def - and I forgot creatine concerning supplements - 1 teaspoon daily and I drank tons of water so yeah your math sounds correct.

usmcmp

What method are you using to assess bodyfat percentage and what were your before and after %s during that change in weight?

calipers, but surprisingly the scale wasn't far off - the actually body fat percentage was reported lower than the calipers, however the variance in body fat percentage stayed consistent

I know body fat percentage on calipers isn't all that great either, but if you see my pics it really has stayed consistent - I've been murdering my body for a month to make this happen.

You gained 10 pounds in a month? The average amount of muscle a man can gain in a month is 2 pounds. That's average. Coming off a deficit? Maybe 3-3.5, but 4 if you are really lucky (that's if you aren't using steroids). So, you gained about 3 pounds of lean mass, 3-4 pounds of water and 3-4 pounds of fat.

supratt

In any event - you set yourself a goal, worked damn hard, and are pleased with the result, so well done. What more could you want?

MrTolerable

What method are you using to assess bodyfat percentage and what were your before and after %s during that change in weight?

calipers, but surprisingly the scale wasn't far off - the actually body fat percentage was reported lower than the calipers, however the variance in body fat percentage stayed consistent

I know body fat percentage on calipers isn't all that great either, but if you see my pics it really has stayed consistent - I've been murdering my body for a month to make this happen.

You gained 10 pounds in a month? The average amount of muscle a man can gain in a month is 2 pounds. That's average. Coming off a deficit? Maybe 3-3.5, but 4 if you are really lucky (that's if you aren't using steroids). So, you gained about 3 pounds of lean mass, 3-4 pounds of water and 3-4 pounds of fat.

^certainly not using steroids and I am going to screenshot a 2 month look at my weight for you to see - I guess it is not as crazy pulling back the curtain because I was at 156 and dropped back down to 149 then climbed back up. - going out three months I was at a steady 148-152 lbs.


this was my first like bulk - however I was doing that comp/recomp thing, but it was my first sorta bulk so bear with me.

MrTolerable

In any event - you set yourself a goal, worked damn hard, and are pleased with the result, so well done. What more could you want?

170 lbs with a six pack

LolBroScience

You didn't gain 10 lbs of lean mass.

Account for fat gain, food volume, glycogen, water.

SideSteel

Did you go from not using creatine to using creatine over the course of the weight gain ?


Congrats either way btw.

I'm just curious.

shmerek

If your body fat percentage stayed consistent, you gained some fat. My body fat percentage went down slightly on my last bulk, and I gained some fat. My actual fat mass and lean mass went up, but my fat mass just went up less.

But you can wink at me. :flowerforyou:

I see what you mean, I did indeed technically gain 'fat'... so I guess there point was true - however they made it sound like it was fat fat- I kept the gains marginal and consistent with my body fay %. The six pack visual was what I was focused on and the fat percentage stayed consistent, so I kept the six pack - like in my most recent pic.

thanks for the helpful observation! It didn't even occur to me.

I think the title of this thread is a bit deceitful, wilfully ignorant and mingled with a bit of misinformation

Jacwhite22

I have repeatedly over two months inquired about if it would be possible to gain weight while keeping my body fat percentage consistent or ideally even lowering it. - I was told over and over and over again by almost everyone that the answer is NO - some fat must be acquired when gaining weight.

Obviously when you gain muscle and fat your bf percentage can stay the same.

I had a goal of being able to squat 2X my body weight on the smith machine and just did it for the first time on the 4th,

Congrats - Why make any goal involve a Smith machine......just curious




TL; DR anything after that.

usmcmp

I had a goal of being able to squat 2X my body weight on the smith machine and just did it for the first time on the 4th,

Congrats - Why make any goal involve a Smith machine......just curious

I missed that! How cute! It's like me bragging that I can leg press 3x my body weight.

http://www.liftbigeatbig.com/2012/09/squats-barbell-vs-smith-machine.html

sijomial

There is a bit of a tendency for people to talk in absolutes whereas real life is more like a bell curve - the majority have typical results but there are outliers (both ways).

Here's one:
http://stronglifts.com/how-to-build-muscle-while-losing-fat/

As Mehdi says the guy is an exception. Nothing wrong with setting people's expectation that they will have "typical" results of course but it would be nice if people weren't quite so black and white.

A word of caution on your great results though - lean mass increase doesn't necessarily mean it's all extra muscle mass.
And I'll skip the dance music thanks!

stickersticker

I read everything the OP posts here cause we it's better than most. Spark debate. I liked reading this. interesting stuff to take in.

usmcmp

I read everything the OP posts here cause we it's better than most. Spark debate. I liked reading this. interesting stuff to take in.

Really? This is the original post edited down to the important stuff.

I have repeatedly over two months inquired about if it would be possible to gain weight while keeping my body fat percentage consistent or ideally even lowering it. - I was told over and over and over again by almost everyone that the answer is NO - some fat must be acquired when gaining weight.

I am now two weeks still away from my big weekend deadline in Sea Isle smokin - I have tracked my weight daily and in the past month I have been at my lowest weight (149.8) my current weight is 159.4 lbs.

-What is amazing though is despite being told repeatedly it would not be possible - it is possible and I did it - my body fat percentage is basically consistent.

He then admitted:

I did indeed technically gain 'fat'... so I guess there point was true

In 6ish weeks he did not gain 10 pounds of muscle. As I pointed out earlier an average guy gains 2 pounds of muscle in a month. That means 3 pounds of muscle in 6 weeks, plus about 4 pounds of glycogen/water and 3 pounds of fat. He may have been mistaken thinking people were telling him he was going to gain tons of fat, but that was just a few weeks and he did gain fat (which wouldn't change his body fat % or visual composition significantly).

If you want to read some really good stuff follow SideSteel or LolBroScience or Acg67 (this is who I personally follow) or stroutman81.

MrTolerable

Did you go from not using creatine to using creatine over the course of the weight gain ?


Congrats either way btw.

I'm just curious.

Oh good question! It was my first time using creatine! First time using BCAA's as well - I'm not sure which worked better :P

MrTolerable

I have repeatedly over two months inquired about if it would be possible to gain weight while keeping my body fat percentage consistent or ideally even lowering it. - I was told over and over and over again by almost everyone that the answer is NO - some fat must be acquired when gaining weight.

Obviously when you gain muscle and fat your bf percentage can stay the same.

I had a goal of being able to squat 2X my body weight on the smith machine and just did it for the first time on the 4th,

Congrats - Why make any goal involve a Smith machine......just curious




TL; DR anything after that.

I guess I am very worried about getting an injury so I tend to stick to hardly any free weights if I'm lifting anything heavy.

And ppl give the smith a great deal of grief but it has helped my core soo much.

usmcmp

I guess I am very worried about getting an injury so I tend to stick to hardly any free weights if I'm lifting anything heavy.

And ppl give the smith a great deal of grief but it has helped my core soo much.

You are more likely to destroy your knees and hurt your back on a Smith Machine than in a squat rack with a barbell. Take your time to set the rack up and the risk of injury (other than to your pride) drops to almost nothing. If form is a worry then video tape your sessions and ask people for feedback.

http://www.liftbigeatbig.com/2012/09/squats-barbell-vs-smith-machine.html

MrTolerable

I read everything the OP posts here cause we it's better than most. Spark debate. I liked reading this. interesting stuff to take in.

Really? This is the original post edited down to the important stuff.

I have repeatedly over two months inquired about if it would be possible to gain weight while keeping my body fat percentage consistent or ideally even lowering it. - I was told over and over and over again by almost everyone that the answer is NO - some fat must be acquired when gaining weight.

I am now two weeks still away from my big weekend deadline in Sea Isle smokin - I have tracked my weight daily and in the past month I have been at my lowest weight (149.8) my current weight is 159.4 lbs.

-What is amazing though is despite being told repeatedly it would not be possible - it is possible and I did it - my body fat percentage is basically consistent.

He then admitted:

I did indeed technically gain 'fat'... so I guess there point was true

In 6ish weeks he did not gain 10 pounds of muscle. As I pointed out earlier an average guy gains 2 pounds of muscle in a month. That means 3 pounds of muscle in 6 weeks, plus about 4 pounds of glycogen/water and 3 pounds of fat. He may have been mistaken thinking people were telling him he was going to gain tons of fat, but that was just a few weeks and he did gain fat (which wouldn't change his body fat % or visual composition significantly).

If you want to read some really good stuff follow SideSteel or LolBroScience or Acg67 (this is who I personally follow) or stroutman81.

Woeee - In 6ish weeks I did indeed gain 10 lbs - I had been eating at a caloric deficit for a long time leading up to this while working my body fat percentage down. Constant HIIT and eating clean with supplements got me there - no need to be so harsh? I have tons of pictures over the past two months of this progression anyway.

I also never said I am an authority on this - I learned everything I did on how to do that from a few ppl in particular on MFP. I just was simply saying what worked for me.


The entire GYM life is relatively knew to me brah.

MrTolerable

.

usmcmp

I read everything the OP posts here cause we it's better than most. Spark debate. I liked reading this. interesting stuff to take in.

Really? This is the original post edited down to the important stuff.

I have repeatedly over two months inquired about if it would be possible to gain weight while keeping my body fat percentage consistent or ideally even lowering it. - I was told over and over and over again by almost everyone that the answer is NO - some fat must be acquired when gaining weight.

I am now two weeks still away from my big weekend deadline in Sea Isle smokin - I have tracked my weight daily and in the past month I have been at my lowest weight (149.8) my current weight is 159.4 lbs.

-What is amazing though is despite being told repeatedly it would not be possible - it is possible and I did it - my body fat percentage is basically consistent.

He then admitted:

I did indeed technically gain 'fat'... so I guess there point was true

In 6ish weeks he did not gain 10 pounds of muscle. As I pointed out earlier an average guy gains 2 pounds of muscle in a month. That means 3 pounds of muscle in 6 weeks, plus about 4 pounds of glycogen/water and 3 pounds of fat. He may have been mistaken thinking people were telling him he was going to gain tons of fat, but that was just a few weeks and he did gain fat (which wouldn't change his body fat % or visual composition significantly).

If you want to read some really good stuff follow SideSteel or LolBroScience or Acg67 (this is who I personally follow) or stroutman81.

Woeee - In 6ish weeks I did indeed gain 10 lbs - I had been eating at a caloric deficit for a long time leading up to this while working my body fat percentage down. Constant HIIT and eating clean with supplements got me there - no need to be so harsh? I have tons of pictures over the past two months of this progression anyway.

I also never said I am an authority on this - I learned everything I did on how to do that from a few ppl in particular on MFP. I just was simply saying what worked for me.


The entire GYM life is relatively knew to me brah.

I'm a woman.

All of that last post by me was for the guy saying you are better than most the people here.

I said you gained 10 pounds. I said there's no way it was all lean. Also, you started the thread saying you proved that you could gain weight (lean mass) without gaining fat mass. You then proved that you in fact gained fat mass. Congrats on the gains, but you didn't prove all those people wrong. You misunderstood what they were telling you. Increasing your body fat by a few pounds won't change your looks significantly.