1200 is really low
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Well, there are actual studies saying age does affect it. It's considered the conventional wisdom.
Unless you have a struggle-o-meter, there's no way of knowing that.They have the same struggles with weight loss as older women.
The same applies to your theories.
Even if you just look at the calculators, age affects it. Mostly, it seems, due to the effect on expected LBM at the same weight, but still.
For example, using the M-SJ calculation, a 25 year old of my height and weight has an estimated BMR of 1419. A 65 year old, of the same height and weight, has a BMR of 1219. Even without taking into account differences in activity, that's a 200/day difference. Thus, even assuming that you can keep activity equal (my guess is that the average 25 year old is going to be able to ramp up physical activity more easily than the average 65 year old, although obviously there are numerous individual differences having to do with such things as past history and fitness), that means that the 65 year old, unless she has significantly more LBM at the same weight than the average 65 year old (which is something I plan to aim for), will have to eat less--closer to 1200--to lose.
Is that an "effect"? Under any reasonable definition of the term, I think so. Does it mean the 65 year old cannot lose? Of course not, and no one has suggested otherwise.
But to relate it back to the topic of the thread, it's why a goal of 1200 might not be appropriate for lots of people, including our 25 year old, but our 65 year old, even if working out 3 times a week and still quite a ways from goal, could expect to lose less than 1 lb/week at that amount, making it a more reasonable choice.0 -
How much do you want to bet if those same participants work with the moderators of this forum, especially the personal trainers, authors of the "sticked" threads, and those older adults who lost a significant amount of weight that the age factor wouldn't be much of a factor at all? We'll see what happens to that "conventional wisdom".
Again, no one is saying that the older person cannot lose weight. Just that what worked for her to lose weight when she was 25 likely will not work as well or quickly, if at all, when she is 65. What was a deficit at 25, especially given likely changes in daily activity, won't be. Those are factors that "affect" weight loss, in that one has to adjust for them.
However great the advice of the moderators of this forum, etc., they can't change the fact that the average 65 year old, as assumed by the M-SJ calculate, has to eat less than the average 25 year old, at the same height and weight and activity level.
In fact, given how often there's a knee jerk "1200 is too low, I'm losing at 2400" kind of response, being aware that age can make a difference may well make it easier, as the person will understand why she does have to eat less.0 -
No, it doesn't. There is scientific evidence supporting the slowdown of metabolism due to age, which means it is a factor. Unlike for your view.
Unless you have a struggle-o-meter, there's no way of knowing that.They have the same struggles with weight loss as older women.
The same applies to your theories.
I don't know if you don't understand what "affect" means or you've just backed yourself so far into a corner there's no face-saving way out of your written ignorance or you don't understand logic or analogies or what, but you've made it to #2 behind Dances with WOW as the most ludicrous supposedly serious poster here.
ETA: And #1 on my ignore list because you don't have the LOL factor he does.0 -
Where do people get this belief that MFP moderators, posters or any personal trainers anywhere know secrets hidden from the entire worldwide fields of medicine, nutrition and fitness?How much do you want to bet if those same participants work with the moderators of this forum, especially the personal trainers, authors of the "sticked" threads, and those older adults who lost a significant amount of weight that the age factor wouldn't be much of a factor at all? We'll see what happens to that "conventional wisdom".0 -
How much do you want to bet if those same participants work with the moderators of this forum, especially the personal trainers, authors of the "sticked" threads, and those older adults who lost a significant amount of weight that the age factor wouldn't be much of a factor at all? We'll see what happens to that "conventional wisdom".
Again, no one is saying that the older person cannot lose weight. Just that what worked for her to lose weight when she was 25 likely will not work as well or quickly, if at all, when she is 65. What was a deficit at 25, especially given likely changes in daily activity, won't be. Those are factors that "affect" weight loss, in that one has to adjust for them.
However great the advice of the moderators of this forum, etc., they can't change the fact that the average 25 year old, as assumed by the M-SJ calculate, has to eat less than the average 65 year old, at the same height and weight and activity level.
I wasn't suggesting that the moderators could change how the amount a 25 versus 65 year old is required to eat. My point was having the correct tools and support system in place, age would not be that much of a factor in weight loss. Whether the 25 could or could not do as a 65 year old would depend of the overall health, diet, and lifestyles of both individuals because many old people are adhering to better weight management and healthy lifestyle than some young people.0 -
Where do people get this belief that MFP moderators, posters or any personal trainers anywhere know secrets hidden from the entire worldwide fields of medicine, nutrition and fitness?How much do you want to bet if those same participants work with the moderators of this forum, especially the personal trainers, authors of the "sticked" threads, and those older adults who lost a significant amount of weight that the age factor wouldn't be much of a factor at all? We'll see what happens to that "conventional wisdom".
Oh, please! This isn't about secrets hidden from the entire worldwide fields of medicine, nutrition and fitness. My post referred to those on this forum and not any place else. It is because they have more experience than a lot of us who are still dealing with weight loss. Therefore, they know a hell of a lot more than many people in this forum.0 -
And bone loss, and and and and and.
No, it doesn't. There is scientific evidence supporting the slowdown of metabolism due to age, which means it is a factor. Unlike for your view.
Unless you have a struggle-o-meter, there's no way of knowing that.They have the same struggles with weight loss as older women.
The same applies to your theories.
I don't know if you don't understand what "affect" means or you've just backed yourself so far into a corner there's no face-saving way out of your written ignorance or you don't understand logic or analogies or what, but you've made it to #2 behind Dances with WOW as the most ludicrous supposedly serious poster here.
ETA: And #1 on my ignore list because you don't have the LOL factor he does.0 -
Whisky, tango, foxtrot.
Well, there are actual studies saying age does affect it. It's considered the conventional wisdom.
Unless you have a struggle-o-meter, there's no way of knowing that.They have the same struggles with weight loss as older women.
The same applies to your theories.
How much do you want to bet if those same participants work with the moderators of this forum, especially the personal trainers, authors of the "sticked" threads, and those older adults who lost a significant amount of weight that the age factor wouldn't be much of a factor at all? We'll see what happens to that "conventional wisdom".0 -
No, it doesn't. There is scientific evidence supporting the slowdown of metabolism due to age, which means it is a factor. Unlike for your view.
Unless you have a struggle-o-meter, there's no way of knowing that.They have the same struggles with weight loss as older women.
The same applies to your theories.
I don't know if you don't understand what "affect" mean or you've just backed yourself so far into a corner there's no face-saving way out of your written ignorance or you don't understand logic or analogies or what, but you've made it to #2 behind Dances with WOW as the most ludicrous supposedly serious poster here.
ETA: And #1 on my ignore list because you don't have the LOL factor he does.
Yes, it does. There is also plenty of evidence from users' tickers in this forum supporting the fact that a slow metabolism and age do not necessarily mean big factors in weight loss. Furthermore, I have yet to see any serious support from you.
I understand the meaning of "affect" perfectly. I just don't agree with your position.
I have yet to back myself into a corner. Therefore, I do not need any face-saving moves like you with your nasty insults and name calling. You are the one who have resorted to insults and name calling because you can't support your views. If you continue with the insults, you will get reported to the moderators and they will deal with you. As far as you placing me on ignore, knock yourself out. I am sure your little action will cure the world of all of its problems now that you have placed me on your ignore list. Your age and juvenile name calling tactics are the very reasons I don't put much emphasis on age versus a person's actions. Your name calling and insults are more about you than your age. Thank you for proving my point.
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Folks: play with the calculators. Become a 30 year old of varying heights, and weights, vary your age. Then consider menopause at each age. Then consider hypothyroidism. No, it's not impossible... the challenges DO vary.
My sister is a great example. She's short. She's 60+ and she's over weight. Her BMR is about 1100. Her TDEE is about 1400. That's a tiny weight loss window. Then factor in menopause and hypothyroidism (half a thyroid even). Her window between loss and maintenance may be about 100 calories. Her margin of error is pretty small.
Consider me and my other sister. Same basic height. If we both walk 30 minutes she burns about half the calories I do. Because she's older. And has a slower metabolism, and less LBM...
If my friend who's my age and height but weighs about 100LBS more and I go for a 30 minute run, logic says she'll burn more, because she weighs more, but there may be other factors at play.
My point: we're all different. To jump in and say a priori: "I'm losing at 2300" means nothing.
Everyone needs to decide how to best fuel their body and create a deficit. And for each of us, it's going to be different.0 -
I didn't read all the replies but just felt compelled to chime in...I'm 51 and have no problem losing weight or maintaining.0
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Whisky, tango, foxtrot.
Well, there are actual studies saying age does affect it. It's considered the conventional wisdom.
Unless you have a struggle-o-meter, there's no way of knowing that.They have the same struggles with weight loss as older women.
The same applies to your theories.
How much do you want to bet if those same participants work with the moderators of this forum, especially the personal trainers, authors of the "sticked" threads, and those older adults who lost a significant amount of weight that the age factor wouldn't be much of a factor at all? We'll see what happens to that "conventional wisdom".
Vodka and Tweaking.0 -
Tweaking. I guess that could explain the paranoia in the post I quoted, yes.
Whisky, tango, foxtrot.
Well, there are actual studies saying age does affect it. It's considered the conventional wisdom.
Unless you have a struggle-o-meter, there's no way of knowing that.They have the same struggles with weight loss as older women.
The same applies to your theories.
How much do you want to bet if those same participants work with the moderators of this forum, especially the personal trainers, authors of the "sticked" threads, and those older adults who lost a significant amount of weight that the age factor wouldn't be much of a factor at all? We'll see what happens to that "conventional wisdom".
Vodka and Tweaking.0 -
Vodka and Tweaking.Tweaking. I guess that could explain the paranoia in the post I quoted, yes.
I was suggesting it for you.0 -
I know you were. lol.Vodka and Tweaking.Tweaking. I guess that could explain the paranoia in the post I quoted, yes.
I was suggesting it for you.
enjoy your short time on the boards.0 -
In fact, given how often there's a knee jerk "1200 is too low, I'm losing at 2400" kind of response, being aware that age can make a difference may well make it easier, as the person will understand why she does have to eat less.
I've found it quite amusing the argument here over age. I just wanted to add that understanding the way age affects the calorie count you can eat without gaining weight (or needed to loose weight) is something I never knew until a few weeks ago when I first started using calculators to work out how to loose weight. And I thought WOW... no wonder I've put on weight!
I've eaten and drank the same between teenage and now (approaching 40) and not really understood why I started steadily putting on weight from 25 when I was stick thin on the same diet as a teenager. I've not put on weight fast (with one few month exception), but it's got faster all the time.
So now I KNOW that I have to decrease calories slightly each year I can take that in to account and keep an eye on having the appropriate diet.
Will age stop me loosing weight... NO. Do I intend it to stop me as I actually start to get old... NO I don't. But does the knowledge that age affects the amount of calories I am meant to eat help me to loose that weight and then maintain it... you sure bet it does!0 -
I know you were. lol.Vodka and Tweaking.Tweaking. I guess that could explain the paranoia in the post I quoted, yes.
I was suggesting it for you.
enjoy your short time on the boards.
I am not going any place. I promise you. I know how to follow the forum rules and not resort to insults and name calling so I am good.0
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