What's so horrible about carbs?

dls06

There is an abudance of information on the web about carbs. Just look for reputable sites such as hosptials or medical universities. But basically the rule is much like it is for fat. There are good (complex) carbs (whole grains, veggies, fruits) and bad (simple) carbs (sugar, processed or white grains, sugar). Just as there are good fats (veggie fats - polyunsaturated and monounsaturated) and bad fats (saturated fat from animals and man-made trans fats). Too much of any either good fats or good carbs will still make gain weight, but some of both are needed for proper organ and gut function.

Thank you!

dls06

DIdn't a famous run for your health guru die of a heart attack? Maybe folks are confusing the two.

In the God/guru/idiot/fraud debates, it should be pointed out that none of these diets have survived longitudinal studies. A few attempts have been made with Atkins, but the drop out rates invalidate the studies. On the other hand, there have been longitudinal studies showing that low fat/ high carb diets do not provide long term benefits to blood chemistry. A number of short term studies have shown much better blood chemistry results with any of the similar diets such as Sonoma/ Mediterranean/ South Beach.

One thing the science does show clearly: there are no health benefits to eating processed flours and sugars and it is not in anyone's best interest to build a diet around them. What is still up for debate is whether it is sufficient to limit them or they must be eliminated.

Thank YOU!

dls06

I agree 100%. I do eat carbs, but I'm careful about the type of carbs. Fruits & veggies have carbs - good carbs. I also eat brown rice, not white. I each steel cut oats, not quick oatmeal. I don't each much bread, but when I do it's wheat, not white. One little saying around our house is "The whiter the bread, the quicker you're dead!"

LOL Bump!

BryanAir

DIdn't a famous run for your health guru die of a heart attack? Maybe folks are confusing the two.

In the God/guru/idiot/fraud debates, it should be pointed out that none of these diets have survived longitudinal studies. A few attempts have been made with Atkins, but the drop out rates invalidate the studies. On the other hand, there have been longitudinal studies showing that low fat/ high carb diets do not provide long term benefits to blood chemistry. A number of short term studies have shown much better blood chemistry results with any of the similar diets such as Sonoma/ Mediterranean/ South Beach.

One thing the science does show clearly: there are no health benefits to eating processed flours and sugars and it is not in anyone's best interest to build a diet around them. What is still up for debate is whether it is sufficient to limit them or they must be eliminated.

Yes,. Jim Fixx died of a heart attack at the age of 52. He wrote "The Complete Book of Running". They do get confused, especially since Atkins had a heart attack the year before he died.

BR1986FB

Just as there are good fats (veggie fats - polyunsaturated and monounsaturated) and bad fats (saturated fat from animals

Incorrect

Grokette

For me, lowering carbs from sugars or grains to under 30g a day has led to 8 lbs of weight loss and several inches lose, a TOTAL remission of acne (I'm 41 and have had it since I was 12) and really good, stabilized moods. I am a little tired sometimes but that is the only complaint. I feel great and will not go back to any typical high carb way of eating. Since I am exercising regularly I do not limit fruits as diets like Atkins suggest and so far, my body has been able to handle that kind of carb. But I have all but elminated bread, pasta, rice, cereals, and most importantly, sugar in its many names and forms, and I am WAY healthier as a result. I think people are so anti-low carb because in our typical way of high-carb eating we crave carbs and when craving a food we think it will be "too hard" to give up and so we must "need it." For the longest period of human history - millions of years - our bodies have run on the kinds of foods eaten in a hunting and gathering lifestyle - namely, animal proteins, fats, and vegetables/berries/fruits that grow. Agriculture is what, 10,000 years old? Thinking about it this way made sense to me so I tried it. The theory of Atkins where you don't have carbs to burn (or be stored as fat) so you will switch over into burning fat for energy makes sense to me too. But the thing that made the most sense was when I started it and felt and looked fantastic. Just my perspective on it.

I am diabetic and even with a diabetic diet you need at least 30-40 brams of carbs per meal (more for men). Broken down to no more than 15 in a serving, not a meal. I have lost 30 lbs in 6 months. After Bloodwork all numbers were great. Just by watching what I eat. Cutting out junk food and eating a balance of Whole grains, Good fats, Fresh Fruits and Veggies, and low fat Cheese. Just saying what worked for me.

Is that what your Dietician told you????

My Diabetic Dietician told me no more than 20 grams of carbs PER DAY!!! I have not been on medication for Diabetes since 2004 either. And my numbers are back down to where I am considered to no longer have diabetes.

That is WAY to many carbs for a diabetic.

Grokette

Also Dr Akins died of a heart attack. I think he was right about carb control, but the high fat food? Not so much.
When I was pregnant back in 1978 Dr. Atkins had just came out with his diet plan. I was gaining a lot of weight and
my OB told me eat low carb. I picked up the book and ate Hot dogs and bacon most of the time. I'm lucky my son was born healthy.

Wow, way to go listening to the media.

He slipped on ice whilel walking to his office and suffered a brain injury.

And the Atkins books I read none of them say to live on Hot Dogs and processed bacon. They specifically state to purchase non-processed, fresh meats and organic vegetables if it is within your budget.

What do you mean way to go listening to the media? The media all reported that he died due to head trauma. Just do a search on google news for 2003 and you'll see all the stories reporting it as death due to head trauma. There is no media conspiracy to make his diet seem crazy. Now he did suffer a cardiac arrest in 2002, which is probably what a lot of people remember about him and associate it with is death.

I said that regarding the statement that the person I quoted said about him dying from a heart attack. The media is the one that spread the rumor that he died of a heart attack from his diet and his wife had to issue a state to the contrary.

I have taken classes from Registered Dieticians at Atkins Nutritionals and this was one of the first topics they covered and because low carb and specifically Atkins was very popular during that time the media tried to derail the low carb revolution that was taking place by saying he died from a heart attack and not the slip on the ice.

The media had to retract their original statement and go with the REAL and TRUE story.

I had just started Atkins around the time frame that he had his fall and I remember everyone clarifying.

Can you provide some links to any reputable source of information that shows the media spreading the story that he died of a heart attack and the subsequent retractions? I performed a LexisNexis search and all the results make a point of saying that he died of head trauma. It seems much more likely that people were misremembering what they read than a vast media cover-up where they said that he died of a heart attack and then hid those stories from LexisNexis and posted new stories.

Well here is the statement that his wife made after he passed. She clearly feels that people were out to slander all of his hard work also............

http://www.usatoday.com/news/health/2004-02-10-atkins-statements_x.htm

BR1986FB

My Diabetic Dietician told me no more than 20 grams of carbs PER DAY!!! I have not been on medication for Diabetes since 2004 either. And my numbers are back down to where I am considered to no longer have diabetes.

This ROCKS! I'm not diabetic but I try to keep my carbs under 50g's and usually fall in the 25g range. GOOD for you!

BryanAir

Also Dr Akins died of a heart attack. I think he was right about carb control, but the high fat food? Not so much.
When I was pregnant back in 1978 Dr. Atkins had just came out with his diet plan. I was gaining a lot of weight and
my OB told me eat low carb. I picked up the book and ate Hot dogs and bacon most of the time. I'm lucky my son was born healthy.

Wow, way to go listening to the media.

He slipped on ice whilel walking to his office and suffered a brain injury.

And the Atkins books I read none of them say to live on Hot Dogs and processed bacon. They specifically state to purchase non-processed, fresh meats and organic vegetables if it is within your budget.

What do you mean way to go listening to the media? The media all reported that he died due to head trauma. Just do a search on google news for 2003 and you'll see all the stories reporting it as death due to head trauma. There is no media conspiracy to make his diet seem crazy. Now he did suffer a cardiac arrest in 2002, which is probably what a lot of people remember about him and associate it with is death.

I said that regarding the statement that the person I quoted said about him dying from a heart attack. The media is the one that spread the rumor that he died of a heart attack from his diet and his wife had to issue a state to the contrary.

I have taken classes from Registered Dieticians at Atkins Nutritionals and this was one of the first topics they covered and because low carb and specifically Atkins was very popular during that time the media tried to derail the low carb revolution that was taking place by saying he died from a heart attack and not the slip on the ice.

The media had to retract their original statement and go with the REAL and TRUE story.

I had just started Atkins around the time frame that he had his fall and I remember everyone clarifying.

Can you provide some links to any reputable source of information that shows the media spreading the story that he died of a heart attack and the subsequent retractions? I performed a LexisNexis search and all the results make a point of saying that he died of head trauma. It seems much more likely that people were misremembering what they read than a vast media cover-up where they said that he died of a heart attack and then hid those stories from LexisNexis and posted new stories.

Well here is the statement that his wife made after he passed. She clearly feels that people were out to slander all of his hard work also............

http://www.usatoday.com/news/health/2004-02-10-atkins-statements_x.htm

That is from the next year when an individual doctor illegally got his medical records and released some of them. Is it really that hard to admit that the media actually released the actual cause of his death when all the evidence points to that?

dls06

For me, lowering carbs from sugars or grains to under 30g a day has led to 8 lbs of weight loss and several inches lose, a TOTAL remission of acne (I'm 41 and have had it since I was 12) and really good, stabilized moods. I am a little tired sometimes but that is the only complaint. I feel great and will not go back to any typical high carb way of eating. Since I am exercising regularly I do not limit fruits as diets like Atkins suggest and so far, my body has been able to handle that kind of carb. But I have all but elminated bread, pasta, rice, cereals, and most importantly, sugar in its many names and forms, and I am WAY healthier as a result. I think people are so anti-low carb because in our typical way of high-carb eating we crave carbs and when craving a food we think it will be "too hard" to give up and so we must "need it." For the longest period of human history - millions of years - our bodies have run on the kinds of foods eaten in a hunting and gathering lifestyle - namely, animal proteins, fats, and vegetables/berries/fruits that grow. Agriculture is what, 10,000 years old? Thinking about it this way made sense to me so I tried it. The theory of Atkins where you don't have carbs to burn (or be stored as fat) so you will switch over into burning fat for energy makes sense to me too. But the thing that made the most sense was when I started it and felt and looked fantastic. Just my perspective on it.

I am diabetic and even with a diabetic diet you need at least 30-40 brams of carbs per meal (more for men). Broken down to no more than 15 in a serving, not a meal. I have lost 30 lbs in 6 months. After Bloodwork all numbers were great. Just by watching what I eat. Cutting out junk food and eating a balance of Whole grains, Good fats, Fresh Fruits and Veggies, and low fat Cheese. Just saying what worked for me.

Is that what your Dietician told you????

That is WAY to many carbs for a diabetic.

20 grams of carbs a day? How do you even do that?
Yes, she was a Nurse, Dietician who specialized in diabetes. She teaches the Class for and was certified by the American Diabetic Association. Like I said since following the plan my bloodwork is perfect. To each his/her own. what ever works for you.

dls06

For me, lowering carbs from sugars or grains to under 30g a day has led to 8 lbs of weight loss and several inches lose, a TOTAL remission of acne (I'm 41 and have had it since I was 12) and really good, stabilized moods. I am a little tired sometimes but that is the only complaint. I feel great and will not go back to any typical high carb way of eating. Since I am exercising regularly I do not limit fruits as diets like Atkins suggest and so far, my body has been able to handle that kind of carb. But I have all but elminated bread, pasta, rice, cereals, and most importantly, sugar in its many names and forms, and I am WAY healthier as a result. I think people are so anti-low carb because in our typical way of high-carb eating we crave carbs and when craving a food we think it will be "too hard" to give up and so we must "need it." For the longest period of human history - millions of years - our bodies have run on the kinds of foods eaten in a hunting and gathering lifestyle - namely, animal proteins, fats, and vegetables/berries/fruits that grow. Agriculture is what, 10,000 years old? Thinking about it this way made sense to me so I tried it. The theory of Atkins where you don't have carbs to burn (or be stored as fat) so you will switch over into burning fat for energy makes sense to me too. But the thing that made the most sense was when I started it and felt and looked fantastic. Just my perspective on it.

I am diabetic and even with a diabetic diet you need at least 30-40 brams of carbs per meal (more for men). Broken down to no more than 15 in a serving, not a meal. I have lost 30 lbs in 6 months. After Bloodwork all numbers were great. Just by watching what I eat. Cutting out junk food and eating a balance of Whole grains, Good fats, Fresh Fruits and Veggies, and low fat Cheese. Just saying what worked for me.

Is that what your Dietician told you????

My Diabetic Dietician told me no more than 20 grams of carbs PER DAY!!! I have not been on medication for Diabetes since 2004 either. And my numbers are back down to where I am considered to no longer have diabetes.

That is WAY to many carbs for a diabetic.

Since you do a lot of reading. Try the "Complete Guide to Carb Counting" From the American Diabetes Association. It explains everything you need to know about the subject.

dls06

For me, lowering carbs from sugars or grains to under 30g a day has led to 8 lbs of weight loss and several inches lose, a TOTAL remission of acne (I'm 41 and have had it since I was 12) and really good, stabilized moods. I am a little tired sometimes but that is the only complaint. I feel great and will not go back to any typical high carb way of eating. Since I am exercising regularly I do not limit fruits as diets like Atkins suggest and so far, my body has been able to handle that kind of carb. But I have all but elminated bread, pasta, rice, cereals, and most importantly, sugar in its many names and forms, and I am WAY healthier as a result. I think people are so anti-low carb because in our typical way of high-carb eating we crave carbs and when craving a food we think it will be "too hard" to give up and so we must "need it." For the longest period of human history - millions of years - our bodies have run on the kinds of foods eaten in a hunting and gathering lifestyle - namely, animal proteins, fats, and vegetables/berries/fruits that grow. Agriculture is what, 10,000 years old? Thinking about it this way made sense to me so I tried it. The theory of Atkins where you don't have carbs to burn (or be stored as fat) so you will switch over into burning fat for energy makes sense to me too. But the thing that made the most sense was when I started it and felt and looked fantastic. Just my perspective on it.

I am diabetic and even with a diabetic diet you need at least 30-40 brams of carbs per meal (more for men). Broken down to no more than 15 in a serving, not a meal. I have lost 30 lbs in 6 months. After Bloodwork all numbers were great. Just by watching what I eat. Cutting out junk food and eating a balance of Whole grains, Good fats, Fresh Fruits and Veggies, and low fat Cheese. Just saying what worked for me.

Is that what your Dietician told you????

My Diabetic Dietician told me no more than 20 grams of carbs PER DAY!!! I have not been on medication for Diabetes since 2004 either. And my numbers are back down to where I am considered to no longer have diabetes.

That is WAY to many carbs for a diabetic.

Was your dietician certified in the subject. I find 20 grams of carbs very low for anyone.

Grokette

For me, lowering carbs from sugars or grains to under 30g a day has led to 8 lbs of weight loss and several inches lose, a TOTAL remission of acne (I'm 41 and have had it since I was 12) and really good, stabilized moods. I am a little tired sometimes but that is the only complaint. I feel great and will not go back to any typical high carb way of eating. Since I am exercising regularly I do not limit fruits as diets like Atkins suggest and so far, my body has been able to handle that kind of carb. But I have all but elminated bread, pasta, rice, cereals, and most importantly, sugar in its many names and forms, and I am WAY healthier as a result. I think people are so anti-low carb because in our typical way of high-carb eating we crave carbs and when craving a food we think it will be "too hard" to give up and so we must "need it." For the longest period of human history - millions of years - our bodies have run on the kinds of foods eaten in a hunting and gathering lifestyle - namely, animal proteins, fats, and vegetables/berries/fruits that grow. Agriculture is what, 10,000 years old? Thinking about it this way made sense to me so I tried it. The theory of Atkins where you don't have carbs to burn (or be stored as fat) so you will switch over into burning fat for energy makes sense to me too. But the thing that made the most sense was when I started it and felt and looked fantastic. Just my perspective on it.

I am diabetic and even with a diabetic diet you need at least 30-40 brams of carbs per meal (more for men). Broken down to no more than 15 in a serving, not a meal. I have lost 30 lbs in 6 months. After Bloodwork all numbers were great. Just by watching what I eat. Cutting out junk food and eating a balance of Whole grains, Good fats, Fresh Fruits and Veggies, and low fat Cheese. Just saying what worked for me.

Is that what your Dietician told you????

My Diabetic Dietician told me no more than 20 grams of carbs PER DAY!!! I have not been on medication for Diabetes since 2004 either. And my numbers are back down to where I am considered to no longer have diabetes.

That is WAY to many carbs for a diabetic.

Was your dietician certified in the subject. I find 20 grams of carbs very low for anyone.

Yes, my Dietician is in the same office as my Endocrinologist who is at the Strelitz Diabetes Center in Norfolk, VA, when I lived in Virginia. This was also backed up by new Endocrinologist at Washington University in St Louis, MO.

Grokette

For me, lowering carbs from sugars or grains to under 30g a day has led to 8 lbs of weight loss and several inches lose, a TOTAL remission of acne (I'm 41 and have had it since I was 12) and really good, stabilized moods. I am a little tired sometimes but that is the only complaint. I feel great and will not go back to any typical high carb way of eating. Since I am exercising regularly I do not limit fruits as diets like Atkins suggest and so far, my body has been able to handle that kind of carb. But I have all but elminated bread, pasta, rice, cereals, and most importantly, sugar in its many names and forms, and I am WAY healthier as a result. I think people are so anti-low carb because in our typical way of high-carb eating we crave carbs and when craving a food we think it will be "too hard" to give up and so we must "need it." For the longest period of human history - millions of years - our bodies have run on the kinds of foods eaten in a hunting and gathering lifestyle - namely, animal proteins, fats, and vegetables/berries/fruits that grow. Agriculture is what, 10,000 years old? Thinking about it this way made sense to me so I tried it. The theory of Atkins where you don't have carbs to burn (or be stored as fat) so you will switch over into burning fat for energy makes sense to me too. But the thing that made the most sense was when I started it and felt and looked fantastic. Just my perspective on it.

I am diabetic and even with a diabetic diet you need at least 30-40 brams of carbs per meal (more for men). Broken down to no more than 15 in a serving, not a meal. I have lost 30 lbs in 6 months. After Bloodwork all numbers were great. Just by watching what I eat. Cutting out junk food and eating a balance of Whole grains, Good fats, Fresh Fruits and Veggies, and low fat Cheese. Just saying what worked for me.

Is that what your Dietician told you????

My Diabetic Dietician told me no more than 20 grams of carbs PER DAY!!! I have not been on medication for Diabetes since 2004 either. And my numbers are back down to where I am considered to no longer have diabetes.

That is WAY to many carbs for a diabetic.

Since you do a lot of reading. Try the "Complete Guide to Carb Counting" From the American Diabetes Association. It explains everything you need to know about the subject.

I don't abide by anything that an American Association of ____________ has to say. I don't believe them and when I was abiding by the ADA standards, it almost landed me on insulin.

I listened to my doctor's and have been living medication free since 2004, I spent only 9 months on medications. I have worked the last 3 years to get my insulin levels in check to the point my last A1C was a mere 4.8%

dls06

Is your diabetes under control?

Grokette

Is your diabetes under control?

Yes, my last office visit I had an A1C of 4.8% and my morning readings are between 82 and 88. My doctor says 2 more visits like this one and he will write me a clean bill of health.

I eat mostly fats, moderate protein and lots of vegetables. I treat fruit as a dessert when I want to have some. Most of my snacks are nuts.

Grokette

Also Dr Akins died of a heart attack. I think he was right about carb control, but the high fat food? Not so much.
When I was pregnant back in 1978 Dr. Atkins had just came out with his diet plan. I was gaining a lot of weight and
my OB told me eat low carb. I picked up the book and ate Hot dogs and bacon most of the time. I'm lucky my son was born healthy.

Wow, way to go listening to the media.

He slipped on ice whilel walking to his office and suffered a brain injury.

And the Atkins books I read none of them say to live on Hot Dogs and processed bacon. They specifically state to purchase non-processed, fresh meats and organic vegetables if it is within your budget.

I was talking about when Atkins first came out. I am a lot older then you and when it first came out it was ok to eat bacon and hot dogs soooooooooooo........................................

I have the 1972 version and it doesn't say eat bacon and hot dogs either...............there are lists of veggies in that book also.

However, when I was living the Atkins Lifestyle, I went by the 2002 version.

Grokette

Also Dr Akins died of a heart attack. I think he was right about carb control, but the high fat food? Not so much.
When I was pregnant back in 1978 Dr. Atkins had just came out with his diet plan. I was gaining a lot of weight and
my OB told me eat low carb. I picked up the book and ate Hot dogs and bacon most of the time. I'm lucky my son was born healthy.

Wow, way to go listening to the media.

He slipped on ice whilel walking to his office and suffered a brain injury.

And the Atkins books I read none of them say to live on Hot Dogs and processed bacon. They specifically state to purchase non-processed, fresh meats and organic vegetables if it is within your budget.

I was talking about when Atkins first came out. I am a lot older then you and when it first came out it was ok to eat bacon and hot dogs soooooooooooo........................................

I have the 1972 version and it doesn't say eat bacon and hot dogs either...............there are lists of veggies in that book also.

However, when I was living the Atkins Lifestyle, I went by the 2002 version.

Grokette

Also Dr Akins died of a heart attack. I think he was right about carb control, but the high fat food? Not so much.
When I was pregnant back in 1978 Dr. Atkins had just came out with his diet plan. I was gaining a lot of weight and
my OB told me eat low carb. I picked up the book and ate Hot dogs and bacon most of the time. I'm lucky my son was born healthy.

Yes, you beat me to it: SOME of his research has since been confirmed. Dr. Agatston's nutritional research is often mocked because of the popularity, but I do believe that the principles of the South Beach Diet will hold up in the long term.

Despite the first food pyramid, it is looking like most people should not make grains the foundation of their diet, which, between breakfast cereal, sandwiches and pasta, most Americans have done.

It is also hard to compare ourselves to our ancestors, who did not have access to high fructose corn syrup and who, in most cases, were hunting, farming or working manual labor.

Dr Agaston is a FRAUD. He took the Atkins Diet and made a low-fat version and called it the South Beach Diet.

On a low carb board I frequent there are FAR more people that keep the weight off by doing the Atkins Plan versus South Beach and a lot of South Beachers end up converting over to Atkins.

The proof is out there as far as eating high fat and why it is healthier for us.

Did you ever hear of the American Heart Association? Or the MAYO Clinic? Do you know that Heart related diseases are the #1 cause of death in this country? American Diabetic Assoc. Children with adult onset diabetes? Some breast cancers could be linked to Obesity? I'm a Certified MAMMO Tech and have not only studied it, but seen it first hand. Just wondering? Is this all about the system? I grew up in the 60's and understand the passion. But as I get older reality kicks in.

Yes I have heard of them and would not adhere to anything any of these associations have to say.

Did you know that Heart Disease, arthritis, Diabetes and most other diseases and disorders are caused by inflammation?????

Saturated fat does not cause heart disease. there is plenty of research to show this.

My dietary intake is anti-inflammatory by nature so I am not worried about getting heart disease and I will never have to battle Diabetes ever again.

dls06

That is great. I hope you have continued good health.
It's been a fun debate.

lodro

Also Dr Akins died of a heart attack. I think he was right about carb control, but the high fat food? Not so much.

To my knowledge Atkins died from a nasty fall.

mrphil86

http://www.nejm.org/doi/pdf/10.1056/NEJM199711203372102

Each increase of 5 percent of energy intake
from saturated fat, as compared with equivalent
energy intake from carbohydrates, was associated
with a 17 percent increase in the risk of coronary disease
(relative risk, 1.17; 95 percent confidence interval,
0.97 to 1.41; P

0.10).

lodro

no delete button, sorry about that

Noctuary

I love carbs. But being diabetic I try to get them from mostly veggies and fruits to be honest. They work a bit slower on raising my bg levels. I pretty much have given up potatoes and sandwich bread. Other than two low carb slices for breakfast maybe twice a week that is. I stick to eating low carb tortillas or low carb pita breads and oatmeal. It's definitely helped lower my bg numbers for sure. I only eat a bit more of them on the weekends for long work shifts and oatmeal before working out. I've had problems of crashing after a workout and it's not fun sitting in the gym shower about to pass out.

virginiagomes

btt