Sugar = Poison

lodro

Nature doesn't put sugar in vegetables, fruit, and other foods for kicks. It's there for a reason

Fruits and other foods we started cultivating are higher in sugar content than the botanic varieties found in nature. And then, nature "put" sugar there to make the fruits and their seeds attractive to birds and other animals, so as to help the seeds spread. And to have something to induce fermentation so a seed would have its own source of nutrients when it needs to sprout.

Nature didn't "put" the sugar there to feed humans. But it put nutrients in fruits for the same reason we "put" nutrients into embryos: to procreate.

For some reason I just got the urge to sing "The Circle of Life" from the Lion King.

/joins chorus to sing

Ironically, in this respect, the cultivation of high sugar varieties of certain fruits is very successful from the tree's or plant's point of view because we help in its procreation.

But seriously, even 75 years ago, fruits were not so plentiful as to be available every day, in numerous servings per day. Most fruits were entirely seasonal and certain high sugar varieties we're not globally available, or only rarely so. So here too, our eating pattern has changed to such an extent that we don't even recognize it as unnatural anymore. We have increased the glycemic load of fruit considerably by eating it in huge quantities. That's the issue, not the sugar in fruit per se.

So, eat local, eat seasonal?

Yes, that's what I try to do, also because I belong to a local CSA, so I try to eat what it grows for me. It does mean that my summer eating pattern is very different from my winter eating pattern. I kind of like it to be waiting for the first strawberries in summer and not having them in other months unless I freeze them or preserve them.

Grokette

Personally I think this is a great debate to be having. As the beacon of scrutiny has focused on sugar and the various ways we consume it I've been wondering (after watching Sugar The Bitter Truth and reading the NYT's article Is Sugar Toxic) if we don't need to track sugar differently. Would it matter if we tracked fructose, glucose and sucrose? If the site designers even could fashion this, would the data be helpful to us?

My take on the fruit debate is that I will eat some fruit in moderation because I believe that in addition to fiber and some good basic nutrients, you also get some really good flavanoids and micro-nutrients you wouldn't otherwise. You can't take a pill or supplement for everything. Why not eat some frozen wild blueberries, a grapefruit and a banana once in a while?

be nice to each other, respectful debate is healthy and enjoy your food!

There are no nutrients in fruit that I can't get from eating a variety of vegetables at a much lower sugar level in my body.

My health, energy and well-being supercede weight loss any day, it is merely an added benefit for me.

kayemme

There are no nutrients in fruit that I can't get from eating a variety of vegetables at a much lower sugar level in my body.

That's not entirely true. In the lecture, Dr. Lustig even says fructose in fruits (& veg's) are paired with fiber, an absolute necessity (at 1h10m on the video)

"Eat your carbohydrate with fiber. Why? Because fiber is good. Fiber is supposed to be an essential nutrient. We can talk later ... as to why fiber is not an essential nutrient; because the government doesn't want it to be. Because then they couldn't sell food abroad."

carrots are quite sweet.. grapes, pears, sweet peppers... all of those are sweet and fibrous.

at 1h13m he says, "wherever there's fructose in nature, there's way more fiber." The fructose coming from carrots, apples or sweet peppers really isn't the problem.

fteale

Really interesting, thanks for posting. I always wondered why my son's paediatric nutritionist said he could eat normally, but absolutely was not to have coke EVER (he only has one kidney). It makes sense now. I will certainly be keeping all high fructose products out of my house.

lloydrt

thanks for the heads up- I know its rough giving it up, I ve been pretty good about it, just wished I DIDNT HAVE TO HAVE IT on my oatmeal........kinda comfort food, reminds me of when I was a kid and used to eat it all the time.........thanks, Lloyd

LeonaB17

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mowrynation

I just watched the whole presentation and all I can say is WOW!

skelly013

The simple answer here is that anything processed we eat is bad, including sugars. If you eat natural sugars they are not as bad for you. My basic concept is if I cannot pronounce the ingredients I do not put it in my mouth. (I know I can pronounce HFCS but I leave that out too)

Life_is_Good

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kayemme

The simple answer here is that anything processed we eat is bad, including sugars. If you eat natural sugars they are not as bad for you. My basic concept is if I cannot pronounce the ingredients I do not put it in my mouth. (I know I can pronounce HFCS but I leave that out too)

that's so simplified, though. I process a lot of food myself and many processed things actually are good for you (think: yogurt, beans, cooked meat, etc.) the key is whether or not something is processed for you. some things are okay, like you're getting at.. peanut butter, hulled grains, shelled peas, etc..

my rule is if it has a barcode, i probably don't want to eat it.

jrusso28

I think today is the first day my sugar is lower than what is allowed by MFP.
Will keep at it and post back my progress (or lack thereof) in 3 weeks.

Showed this to a few folks at work and seems everyone has the same reaction.
Its like a light bulb goes off in your head.. like wow he is onto something...

:drinker:

lodro

The simple answer here is that anything processed we eat is bad, including sugars. If you eat natural sugars they are not as bad for you. My basic concept is if I cannot pronounce the ingredients I do not put it in my mouth. (I know I can pronounce HFCS but I leave that out too)

our bodies really can't distinguish between natural and processed sugars. the fructose from HFCS is processed the same way as the fructose from a banana.

A glass of orange juice is just as high fructose as a glass of softdrink

kayemme

The simple answer here is that anything processed we eat is bad, including sugars. If you eat natural sugars they are not as bad for you. My basic concept is if I cannot pronounce the ingredients I do not put it in my mouth. (I know I can pronounce HFCS but I leave that out too)

our bodies really can't distinguish between natural and processed sugars. the fructose from HFCS is processed the same way as the fructose from a banana.

A glass of orange juice is just as high fructose as a glass of softdrink

... almost. maybe the fructose itself is, yes, but the sugar in the banana comes with fiber and the processed food typically does not. that's what this guy was talking about in the lecture. did you watch it? (not being sarcastic, just asking).

k

fteale

I am still not going to cut down on fruit. I really think that is missing the point massively.
You don't see fat fruitarians, do you?

963Nitro

that was a great vid, watched the whole thing. It's really going to change my eating and drinking style. If you do watch the whole thing he doesn't make a point to stop eating fruits even if they contain natural sugar. He is saying that even though they have the same amount of sugar, it's not HFCS so it isn't as likely to be stored as fat.

PLUS regardless of sugar content in fruit, they have tons of fiber? remember his cave man part where they would get hundreds of grams of fiber a day compared to our 15? and that if we ate everything natural out of the ground it would potentially fix our type 2 diabetes problem?

not a sermon, just a thought!
again great vid!

Painten

I watched just over 40 minutes of this video. I see the people posting here about fruit being bad. Well he didn't say that. He said fructose is bad, but when he was talking it was all about the added fructose, not an apple or an orange. It was the added fructose in burgers, processed foods, fast foods etc .Okay he did mention fruit juice when referencing a study in harlem. I'm pretty sure he wasn't sayign that we should ban fruit from our diets rather we should ban anything that has had fructose added to it.

lodro

The simple answer here is that anything processed we eat is bad, including sugars. If you eat natural sugars they are not as bad for you. My basic concept is if I cannot pronounce the ingredients I do not put it in my mouth. (I know I can pronounce HFCS but I leave that out too)

our bodies really can't distinguish between natural and processed sugars. the fructose from HFCS is processed the same way as the fructose from a banana.

A glass of orange juice is just as high fructose as a glass of softdrink

... almost. maybe the fructose itself is, yes, but the sugar in the banana comes with fiber and the processed food typically does not. that's what this guy was talking about in the lecture. did you watch it? (not being sarcastic, just asking).

k

Yes, actually, a month ago I posted a topic on this same video.

That being said, I don't think anyone is saying "you shouldn't eat any fruits". But it is perhaps good to remember that the access we have to fruit in our part of the world is unprecedented. That someone can eat any fruit, out of season, numerous times a day is a very recent thing. At least in Europe it is. So, strawberries in season, apples in season, a banana as a very rare treat, some oranges in winter. That was it. I don't think people should eat no fruit, I'm only saying that one can overeat on fruit, and that at the end of the day the sugar contained in it is fructose. If you heighten your glycemic load (related to quantities consumed) it will land you in the same place.

I once met someone who ate incredibly healthy: fresh fruit, fresh vegetables, everything organic, but she was obese, wanted to lose, but lost nothing. Turned out, every morning she ate a huge fruitsalad with lots of grapes and bananas and some honey, and drank a large glass of orange juice. Then as an afternoon snack she did the same, and then ate "regular", albeit very healthy meals. At the end of the day it is about portions and calories, and then fruit is just another food. And I do agree with a previous poster: if I want fiber and vitamins, vegetables are a better option, <emphasis> for me </emphasis>

But then, I do eat tomatoes a lot

funfitfoodie

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aimibean

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kayemme

That being said, I don't think anyone is saying "you shouldn't eat any fruits". But it is perhaps good to remember that the access we have to fruit in our part of the world is unprecedented. That someone can eat any fruit, out of season, numerous times a day is a very recent thing. At least in Europe it is. So, strawberries in season, apples in season, a banana as a very rare treat, some oranges in winter. That was it. I don't think people should eat no fruit, I'm only saying that one can overeat on fruit, and that at the end of the day the sugar contained in it is fructose. If you heighten your glycemic load (related to quantities consumed) it will land you in the same place.

I once met someone who ate incredibly healthy: fresh fruit, fresh vegetables, everything organic, but she was obese, wanted to lose, but lost nothing. Turned out, every morning she ate a huge fruitsalad with lots of grapes and bananas and some honey, and drank a large glass of orange juice. Then as an afternoon snack she did the same, and then ate "regular", albeit very healthy meals. At the end of the day it is about portions and calories, and then fruit is just another food. And I do agree with a previous poster: if I want fiber and vitamins, vegetables are a better option, <emphasis> for me </emphasis>

But then, I do eat tomatoes a lot

i eat only seasonal foods (except for my frozen booty from the summer). My only point is that many popular vegetables also have fructose in them. eaten out of season, in large quantities, is still a bad idea, even though it's not fruit.

and tomatoes are a fruit, btw and i never bother with grocery store tomatoes, mine are so much more delicious, even frozen.

i'll be the first to champion eating seasonally and sans barcode, though i'm not a "put your title here" dieter... i eat whole foods because that's what i prefer. my body wants it in the season it wants it, not because it's available. in the spring, i crave spinach. in the summer, i crave luscious watery tomatoes. in the fall, i look forward to soups and stews made from delicious, hardy squash. and like kale is always ready to grow, i'm always ready for kale. .

McHeather

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lodro

That being said, I don't think anyone is saying "you shouldn't eat any fruits". But it is perhaps good to remember that the access we have to fruit in our part of the world is unprecedented. That someone can eat any fruit, out of season, numerous times a day is a very recent thing. At least in Europe it is. So, strawberries in season, apples in season, a banana as a very rare treat, some oranges in winter. That was it. I don't think people should eat no fruit, I'm only saying that one can overeat on fruit, and that at the end of the day the sugar contained in it is fructose. If you heighten your glycemic load (related to quantities consumed) it will land you in the same place.

I once met someone who ate incredibly healthy: fresh fruit, fresh vegetables, everything organic, but she was obese, wanted to lose, but lost nothing. Turned out, every morning she ate a huge fruitsalad with lots of grapes and bananas and some honey, and drank a large glass of orange juice. Then as an afternoon snack she did the same, and then ate "regular", albeit very healthy meals. At the end of the day it is about portions and calories, and then fruit is just another food. And I do agree with a previous poster: if I want fiber and vitamins, vegetables are a better option, <emphasis> for me </emphasis>

But then, I do eat tomatoes a lot

i eat only seasonal foods (except for my frozen booty from the summer). My only point is that many popular vegetables also have fructose in them. eaten out of season, in large quantities, is still a bad idea, even though it's not fruit.

and tomatoes are a fruit, btw and i never bother with grocery store tomatoes, mine are so much more delicious, even frozen.

i'll be the first to champion eating seasonally and sans barcode, though i'm not a "put your title here" dieter... i eat whole foods because that's what i prefer. my body wants it in the season it wants it, not because it's available. in the spring, i crave spinach. in the summer, i crave luscious watery tomatoes. in the fall, i look forward to soups and stews made from delicious, hardy squash. and like kale is always ready to grow, i'm always ready for kale. .

yes, i know tomatoes are fruit, hence the wink. and yes kale! hmmmm

bettyboop573

Everyone has a strong opinion about the sugar in fruit but put a Peanut butter Cup or Muffin recipe on the blog and everyone loves it?

lol yes I noticed that too

jbug100

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bettyboop573

Well, if you look at it from that angle, why was the "fruit" on the forbidden tree? Maybe God was trying to tell us way back then that it is poisonous................

I don't believe in Everything in Moderation. There are many things the human body does not need in moderation.

hahah funny

lodro

I find the facepalm uncalled for, frankly, and not funny at all. Well into the middle ages cultivated fruit varieties were seen as something not entirely right, witness the huge number of medieval sagas and fairy tales that have people come to harm under grafted trees. The motif of the danger of grafted trees is found all over in European folklore. "Ympe Trees" are demon trees!. in "Sir Orfeo", the king of the underworld fetches Eurydice while she is sleeping under a grafted tree:

"Loke, dame, that tow be
to-morwe her vnder this ympe-tre,
and than thou schalt with ous go
and liue with ous euermo...."

of course

Grokette

I find the facepalm uncalled for, frankly, and not funny at all. Well into the middle ages cultivated fruit varieties were seen as something not entirely right, witness the huge number of medieval sagas and fairy tales that have people come to harm under grafted trees. The motif of the danger of grafted trees is found all over in European folklore. "Ympe Trees" are demon trees!. in "Sir Orfeo", the king of the underworld fetches Eurydice while she is sleeping under a grafted tree:

"Loke, dame, that tow be
to-morwe her vnder this ympe-tre,
and than thou schalt with ous go
and liue with ous euermo...."

of course

I found it uncalled for also and the reason I didn't post any more in this forum. People don't realize that there is a reason fruit is considered poison in a lot of cultures.

Westerners are mostly the only culture to say that fruit is a necessity when in reality it is not. There are no nutrients in fruits that can't be found in vegetables. And in most cases, the veggies are way higher in those nutrients too.

Grokette

Everyone has a strong opinion about the sugar in fruit but put a Peanut butter Cup or Muffin recipe on the blog and everyone loves it?

lol yes I noticed that too

Not me, you will not find me saying I love any such things. I no longer eat peanuts or peanut butter as they are legumes and I won't eat muffins anymore either unless I make them and they will be made with either almond or coconut flour.

bettyboop573

my apologies...didnt really think before i spoke....typed

Kjarlune

thank you for posting this