This person gain muscle or just lose weight?

lakersfan4life

So did he have a tummy tuck too? Look at the after on the belly button it looks like it's a little tight. Really he would have loose skin so where did it go?

its called airbrushing

mmuzzatti

So did he have a tummy tuck too? Look at the after on the belly button it looks like it's a little tight. Really he would have loose skin so where did it go?

its called airbrushing

^^^^^Agree

ninerbuff

So did he have a tummy tuck too? Look at the after on the belly button it looks like it's a little tight. Really he would have loose skin so where did it go?

its called airbrushing

^^^^^Agree

x2.:laugh:

Jeff92se

Why would necessarily be 28% give or take?

I can see how being on a deficit at 5% BF would hinder things. I also see how being 30% plus would help. But I don't see why someone at let's say 20% (male) wouldn't still gain. Just not as fast or efficently as someone purposely trying to bulk with exess calories/bodyfat.

MinnesotaManimal

Shake weight......

_David_

After dropping the weight I did, I ended up loosing most of my strenght and since I could see muscle under 400 lbs of flab I knew I lost muscle. Looks like the guy dropped a lot of weight and in the proccess was in the gym lifting, its hard to lose that much weight and maintain muscle mass unless you lose it really slow, but who wants to do that.

joejccva71

Why would necessarily be 28% give or take?

I can see how being on a deficit at 5% BF would hinder things. I also see how being 30% plus would help. But I don't see why someone at let's say 20% (male) wouldn't still gain. Just not as fast or efficently as someone purposely trying to bulk with exess calories/bodyfat.

The gains at 20% are probably so minimal that you wouldn't see that much of an increase in LBM to take much notice. The point is that the calories/energy that you obtain from excess fat stores isn't a nominal way to build muscle long term. The point is that alot of folks seem to be failing to grasp is that in order to truely gain lean mass and build is to eat food in excess of what you burn. Just eating protein by itself isnt enough to build new tissue.

Jeff92se

Why would necessarily be 28% give or take?

I can see how being on a deficit at 5% BF would hinder things. I also see how being 30% plus would help. But I don't see why someone at let's say 20% (male) wouldn't still gain. Just not as fast or efficently as someone purposely trying to bulk with exess calories/bodyfat.

The gains at 20% are probably so minimal that you wouldn't see that much of an increase in LBM to take much notice. The point is that the calories/energy that you obtain from excess fat stores isn't a nominal way to build muscle long term. The point is that alot of folks seem to be failing to grasp is that in order to truely gain lean mass and build is to eat food in excess of what you burn. Just eating protein by itself isnt enough to build new tissue.

Understood. but you implied that someone obese at 28%+ would be able to get gains (assume signficant enough to mention it possible). That's only a 8% difference from which you state it's possible to a point where you state the gains would be almost to small to mention.

bbbgamer

So those saying the muscle is already there under all the fat, suppose he just did cardio, would he see that muscle once he shed the fat?

Why wouldnt he? Why doesnt it work that way? Are you telling me because I look more or less like him on the heavier side that I have no muscle under there? This makes no sense, educate me.......Whats not to say he did training to maintain the muscles he already had while losing the fat?

thankyou4thevenom

I'm wondering if this is one of those reversed pictures. As in the first picture was taken after the second one.
It would seem to be a prime candidate for that kind of trickery.

Jeff92se

I'm wondering if this is one of those reversed pictures. As in the first picture was taken after the second one.
It would seem to be a prime candidate for that kind of trickery.

There's that too. We have to make a host of assumptions here to have the conversation.

joejccva71

Why would necessarily be 28% give or take?

I can see how being on a deficit at 5% BF would hinder things. I also see how being 30% plus would help. But I don't see why someone at let's say 20% (male) wouldn't still gain. Just not as fast or efficently as someone purposely trying to bulk with exess calories/bodyfat.

The gains at 20% are probably so minimal that you wouldn't see that much of an increase in LBM to take much notice. The point is that the calories/energy that you obtain from excess fat stores isn't a nominal way to build muscle long term. The point is that alot of folks seem to be failing to grasp is that in order to truely gain lean mass and build is to eat food in excess of what you burn. Just eating protein by itself isnt enough to build new tissue.

Understood. but you implied that someone obese at 28%+ would be able to get gains (assume signficant enough to mention it possible). That's only a 8% difference from which you state it's possible to a point where you state the gains would be almost to small to mention.

Jeff where are you trying to go with this exactly? It really doesn't matter whether I think someone obese is 28+% bodyfat or whether it's 27%, 42% or 631%. It doesn't matter.

The point is: You cannot gain muscle at an ACCEPTABLE rate unless you eat at a calorie surplus. Period. End of story.

If I REALLY have to go dig up Lyle McDonald, Alan Aragon and Martin Berkhan's articles..I will, but I don't really have the time right now. I'd rather eat. :P

Jeff92se

Well your definitions keep changing.

From you "can't" to you have to be obese at 28%+ to gain at a calorie deficit to at 20% the gains would be minimal. Why is only a 8% difference seperating being able to gain and gains be too minimal to mention?

I asked for a % to clarify the context. At 28% you seem to imply it's possible(so does other sites so I don't content this). But at 20% gains are almost no possible. That's a 8% spread. I'm not debating your definition of Obese. I'm asking why a 8% difference seems to be the difference inbetween gaining and almost not gaining at all.

Rae6503

Many bodybuilders don't look all that impressive until they're doing their cutting phase (if they bulk the traditional way).

This would be me.:laugh:

A.C.E. Certified Personal Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 28+ years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

Who else wants to see a picture of Niner in full on bulk phase?!

joejccva71

Well your definitions keep changing.

From you "can't" to you have to be obese at 28%+ to gain at a calorie deficit to at 20% the gains would be minimal. Why is only a 8% difference seperating being able to gain and gains be too minimal to mention?

I asked for a % to clarify the context. At 28% you seem to imply it's possible(so does other sites so I don't content this). But at 20% gains are almost no possible. That's a 8% spread. I'm not debating your definition of Obese. I'm asking why a 8% difference seems to be the difference inbetween gaining and almost not gaining at all.

Jeff an 8% difference in bf is HUGE. Bodyfat% from 28% to 20% is huge, and 20% to 12% is even more of a big deal. At 12% you practically have ab defintion. Also the higher your bf% the easier it is to lose. The lower it is, the harder. It's VERY difficult to go from let's say 14-15% down to 9-10% and takes a constant calorie deficit.

You will NOT build muscle on a calorie deficit at that low of a bf%. You might even LOSE some muscle.

Do you need further explanation?

Edit: And 8% is no magic number. I was simply stating that someone could be considered obese at 28% bf.

Jeff92se

I understand how to get down to those bf levels. I touches on this a bit already

joejccva71

I understand how to get down to those bf levels. I touches on this a bit already

So without further due, can I consider this discussion closed and direct you to read more from Lyle, Alan, and Martin to answer your questions?

engineman312

he was doing tae bo

gazerofthestars

he was doing tae bo

*snickers*
I am on MFP too much -.-

Jeff92se

I understand how to get down to those bf levels. I touches on this a bit already

So without further due, can I consider this discussion closed and direct you to read more from Lyle, Alan, and Martin to answer your questions?

Do they mention specific percents?