cardio- thoughts?

nurse_christieyne

I have heard that from 2 different trainers. They each said that any more than 30 minutes is a waste of time.

so if I burn 150 calories during minutes 31-45 they dount count? there is no exact number of minutes where exercise becomes overkill. You can do too much or too little. If you do 30 minutes a day thats good.

I have no idea, I am just stating what they said to me. I still do an hour of cardio.

heybales

Other things I have heard is at that point it starts to burn muscle and not fat. But I dont think that is necessarily true is it? That would be more based on what your diet is, correct? I think there are alot of myths out there, sometimes its hard to determine which ones are accurate! Thanks for the help guys! I'll keep up my cardio!

Who ever is spouting this stuff, don't use them as trainer.

if you run out of glycogen, required for burning fat, then your body will break down muscle to convert amino acids to glycogen, and it keeps burning fat. You are not likely to run out of fat energy, since it has 3500 calories per lb. Even then folks got an extra lb to spare for that.

How much glycogen you got stored ready for use? Avg 1500 to 2000 calories worth. More if you aerobically train.

That is the "wall" people hit when doing marathons and are not pro-athletes with correct training program. Sugar ran out, muscle is used, and fat still is used.

There are a lot of myths. You must use discernment as to where you hear things, and research.

Like, please research what I just said.

Dave198lbs

Don't think it apply's to cardio. Strength training is a waste after an hour... But I don't think that apply's to cardio and if it does it would be longer then 30 mins..

nonsense as to strength training being a waste after an arbitrary amount of time. it depends on intensity not time

angied80

Its all about context here. If you want to be a long-distance runner and see continued improvement, you must run more than 30 minutes at a time and you must do it frequently. However if you want to burn fat and improve physical fitness, then 30+ minutes of cardio is not the best use of your time. You are better off doing resistance training and high intensity intervals. But if cardio keeps your more motivated, better that than nothing!

Oh and I am in marathon training and have actually gotten stronger because I always lift weights before I run, and I have upped my protein intake to prevent muscle loss. I've definitely burned fat without losing muscle in recent weeks.

This is kinda what I was looking for. I am maintaining on Jamie Eason live fit trainer. I have gained a very nice amount of muscle I would say.. you just cant see it I am having a hard time loosing fat. I just started to up my cardio, if that was a bad idea then I did not want to dig myself into a hole. I definatly do not want to loose the muscle that I have gained. I usually do my strenght training, usually takes 30-45 mins, then I get on the treadmill and switch it up doing fast paced walking incline, HITT or the eylptical. Does this sound like a good routine, or should I change it up a bit to see some fat loss?

heybales

There is a difference between a waste of time, and time better spent.

Since you provided no context for the statement, it could be the discussion was around burning fat, and if you have an hour, better time spent doing just 30 min of cardio and then doing 30 min weights.

That has been shown in studies to burn more fat and have better effect than just 60 min of cardio.

But if you have time every day, then split the days, the total 60 min still beneficial. And can spend more time on weights the other day.

grinch031

Other things I have heard is at that point it starts to burn muscle and not fat. But I dont think that is necessarily true is it? That would be more based on what your diet is, correct? I think there are alot of myths out there, sometimes its hard to determine which ones are accurate! Thanks for the help guys! I'll keep up my cardio!

Who ever is spouting this stuff, don't use them as trainer.

if you run out of glycogen, required for burning fat, then your body will break down muscle to convert amino acids to glycogen, and it keeps burning fat. You are not likely to run out of fat energy, since it has 3500 calories per lb. Even then folks got an extra lb to spare for that.

How much glycogen you got stored ready for use? Avg 1500 to 2000 calories worth. More if you aerobically train.

That is the "wall" people hit when doing marathons and are not pro-athletes with correct training program. Sugar ran out, muscle is used, and fat still is used.

There are a lot of myths. You must use discernment as to where you hear things, and research.

Like, please research what I just said.

I do all my training runs (6+ miles) in a glycogen-depleted state due to a low-carb diet. I have found as long as I eat enough protein, any break down of muscles to fuel my brain is completely reversed by both lifting weights and eating adequate protein. The only proof I have of this is that I am just as strong as I was before, in fact I got stronger because I significantly increased my protein at the same time that I started my training plan. If anything when I used to lift weights prior to this, I was not eating enough protein because I was eating mostly carbs during that point in time.

angied80

Other things I have heard is at that point it starts to burn muscle and not fat. But I dont think that is necessarily true is it? That would be more based on what your diet is, correct? I think there are alot of myths out there, sometimes its hard to determine which ones are accurate! Thanks for the help guys! I'll keep up my cardio!

Who ever is spouting this stuff, don't use them as trainer.

if you run out of glycogen, required for burning fat, then your body will break down muscle to convert amino acids to glycogen, and it keeps burning fat. You are not likely to run out of fat energy, since it has 3500 calories per lb. Even then folks got an extra lb to spare for that.

How much glycogen you got stored ready for use? Avg 1500 to 2000 calories worth. More if you aerobically train.

That is the "wall" people hit when doing marathons and are not pro-athletes with correct training program. Sugar ran out, muscle is used, and fat still is used.

There are a lot of myths. You must use discernment as to where you hear things, and research.

Like, please research what I just said.

Thanks! I have a hard time calling bull**** on people! I researched a bit but never really found anything that supported those facts. I am a newbie so I am a little uneducated in the fitness world. Hoping to change that. I appreciate everyones feedback.

grinch031

Its all about context here. If you want to be a long-distance runner and see continued improvement, you must run more than 30 minutes at a time and you must do it frequently. However if you want to burn fat and improve physical fitness, then 30+ minutes of cardio is not the best use of your time. You are better off doing resistance training and high intensity intervals. But if cardio keeps your more motivated, better that than nothing!

Oh and I am in marathon training and have actually gotten stronger because I always lift weights before I run, and I have upped my protein intake to prevent muscle loss. I've definitely burned fat without losing muscle in recent weeks.

This is kinda what I was looking for. I am maintaining on Jamie Eason live fit trainer. I have gained a very nice amount of muscle I would say.. you just cant see it I am having a hard time loosing fat. I just started to up my cardio, if that was a bad idea then I did not want to dig myself into a hole. I definatly do not want to loose the muscle that I have gained. I usually do my strenght training, usually takes 30-45 mins, then I get on the treadmill and switch it up doing fast paced walking incline, HITT or the eylptical. Does this sound like a good routine, or should I change it up a bit to see some fat loss?

I think you have a good exercise plan. If you're not losing fat, that is probably because you aren't eating the optimal amount of calories. I know many here will say there is some magic number like 1200, 1500, etc. But I think exercise is the perfect litmus for the amount of calories your body needs. Its simple, if you are lethargic when exercising, you are eating too little calories. If you feel energized, then you are eating at least enough calories to fuel the workout, but at the same time you could also be over-eating. Keep in mind that the closer your diet is to a 'natural' diet, the better your body will regulate your calorie intake on its own.

heybales

I do all my training runs (6+ miles) in a glycogen-depleted state due to a low-carb diet. I have found as long as I eat enough protein, any break down of muscles to fuel my brain is completely reversed by both lifting weights and eating adequate protein. The only proof I have of this is that I am just as strong as I was before, in fact I got stronger because I significantly increased my protein at the same time that I started my training plan. If anything when I used to lift weights, I was not eating enough protein because I was eating mostly carbs during that point in time.

Low-carb does not mean by default glycogen-depleted - though it is easier to cause that.

If you are always eating enough protein, the body is just breaking that down for glucose first if not enough carbs.
And since that is harder on your system to get glucose from amino acids, you are just stressing different parts of your system.

So while you may indeed be in a low-glucose storage state, that just means that during extended periods of a exercise, your body turns to breaking down muscle quicker than it would otherwise.
And then you eat enough protein to build it back up.

But their is a difference between the muscle repair that occurs after weight lifting say, and the muscle re-building that occurs after it is torn down for energy. Former makes it stronger, latter just gets it back.

angied80

Its all about context here. If you want to be a long-distance runner and see continued improvement, you must run more than 30 minutes at a time and you must do it frequently. However if you want to burn fat and improve physical fitness, then 30+ minutes of cardio is not the best use of your time. You are better off doing resistance training and high intensity intervals. But if cardio keeps your more motivated, better that than nothing!

Oh and I am in marathon training and have actually gotten stronger because I always lift weights before I run, and I have upped my protein intake to prevent muscle loss. I've definitely burned fat without losing muscle in recent weeks.

This is kinda what I was looking for. I am maintaining on Jamie Eason live fit trainer. I have gained a very nice amount of muscle I would say.. you just cant see it I am having a hard time loosing fat. I just started to up my cardio, if that was a bad idea then I did not want to dig myself into a hole. I definatly do not want to loose the muscle that I have gained. I usually do my strenght training, usually takes 30-45 mins, then I get on the treadmill and switch it up doing fast paced walking incline, HITT or the eylptical. Does this sound like a good routine, or should I change it up a bit to see some fat loss?

I think you have a good exercise plan. If you're not losing fat, that is probably because you aren't eating the optimal amount of calories. I know many here will say there is some magic number like 1200, 1500, etc. But I think exercise is the perfect litmus for the amount of calories your body needs. Its simple, if you are lethargic when exercising, you are eating too little calories. If you feel energized, then you are eating at least enough calories to fuel the workout, but at the same time you could also be over-eating. Keep in mind that the closer your diet is to a 'natural' diet, the better your body will regulate your calorie intake on its own.

According to bodybuilding.com I should be taking in 1640 calories a day, I find that hard. Most days I usually get between 1300-1400 and I am stuffed and my energy is very good. I "think" I am eaSting healthy. That is something that I have really been working hard on. I am slowly mastering it. So are you saying since my energy levels are good, maybe I should try lowering my caloric intake and see what happens? By maybe just 100-200 cals or so?

whitymarie

I don't think it is a waste. But I think you can def maximize your cardio sessions so you don't have to spend hours upon hours doing it. I'm working with a trainer program that focuses on high intensity interval training. Sessions are always a little diff but the basic idea is a short warm up (2 mins) moderate intensity (and that has to be determined by the individual and what you can handle) then it;s rocketed up to high intensity going all out for 1 min. then backed down to moderate again for a 2 min rest period and then high intensity all out again but you bump up the resistance or speed or incline a little bit. Then a rest again for 2 mins.

Sorry if that was confusing but you really push yourself hard and you burn calories faster ergo you don't have to be on there for hours. I like it because I have to focus on what I'm doing rather than mindless steady state that I get bored doing.

Just an idea at the end of the day I don't think any cardio is a waste!!!

scottb81

This is kinda what I was looking for. I am maintaining on Jamie Eason live fit trainer. I have gained a very nice amount of muscle I would say.. you just cant see it I am having a hard time loosing fat. I just started to up my cardio, if that was a bad idea then I did not want to dig myself into a hole. I definatly do not want to loose the muscle that I have gained. I usually do my strenght training, usually takes 30-45 mins, then I get on the treadmill and switch it up doing fast paced walking incline, HITT or the eylptical. Does this sound like a good routine, or should I change it up a bit to see some fat loss?

To add some more context, you are not going to run out of glycogen doing cardio until at least 90 min to 2 hours of hard running. If you are running easy it will take a lot longer.

grinch031

I do all my training runs (6+ miles) in a glycogen-depleted state due to a low-carb diet. I have found as long as I eat enough protein, any break down of muscles to fuel my brain is completely reversed by both lifting weights and eating adequate protein. The only proof I have of this is that I am just as strong as I was before, in fact I got stronger because I significantly increased my protein at the same time that I started my training plan. If anything when I used to lift weights, I was not eating enough protein because I was eating mostly carbs during that point in time.

Low-carb does not mean by default glycogen-depleted - though it is easier to cause that.

If you are always eating enough protein, the body is just breaking that down for glucose first if not enough carbs.
And since that is harder on your system to get glucose from amino acids, you are just stressing different parts of your system.

So while you may indeed be in a low-glucose storage state, that just means that during extended periods of a exercise, your body turns to breaking down muscle quicker than it would otherwise.
And then you eat enough protein to build it back up.

But their is a difference between the muscle repair that occurs after weight lifting say, and the muscle re-building that occurs after it is torn down for energy. Former makes it stronger, latter just gets it back.

But still, by switching to my latest diet, I'm likely burning a much higher percentage of fat for fuel than ever before. So the amount of protein needed for glucose isn't even comparable to the amount of glucose I was using back when I was eating mostly carbs.

angied80

I don't think it is a waste. But I think you can def maximize your cardio sessions so you don't have to spend hours upon hours doing it. I'm working with a trainer program that focuses on high intensity interval training. Sessions are always a little diff but the basic idea is a short warm up (2 mins) moderate intensity (and that has to be determined by the individual and what you can handle) then it;s rocketed up to high intensity going all out for 1 min. then backed down to moderate again for a 2 min rest period and then high intensity all out again but you bump up the resistance or speed or incline a little bit. Then a rest again for 2 mins.

Sorry if that was confusing but you really push yourself hard and you burn calories faster ergo you don't have to be on there for hours. I like it because I have to focus on what I'm doing rather than mindless steady state that I get bored doing.

Just an idea at the end of the day I don't think any cardio is a waste!!!

Yea I try to incorporate HITT into my cardio, run at 9.0 for 30 seconds, off to rest for 30 sec, run at 9.0 for 30 secs. I have found that if I dont have much time thats the way to go. I enjoy it as well.

grinch031

According to bodybuilding.com I should be taking in 1640 calories a day, I find that hard. Most days I usually get between 1300-1400 and I am stuffed and my energy is very good. I "think" I am eaSting healthy. That is something that I have really been working hard on. I am slowly mastering it. So are you saying since my energy levels are good, maybe I should try lowering my caloric intake and see what happens? By maybe just 100-200 cals or so?

I'm not a fan of calorie counting, so I'll stay out of that one. I think energy levels matter in that if there is any truth to the idea that too low calorie intake leads to a starvation mode, then that would require the body to slowdown enough that it doesn't seem feasible that exercise performance could remain at a high level. In order to be consistent with the laws of thermodynamics, your body has no choice but to slow down your activity as well.

Azdak

Other things I have heard is at that point it starts to burn muscle and not fat. But I dont think that is necessarily true is it? That would be more based on what your diet is, correct? I think there are alot of myths out there, sometimes its hard to determine which ones are accurate! Thanks for the help guys! I'll keep up my cardio!

Who ever is spouting this stuff, don't use them as trainer.

if you run out of glycogen, required for burning fat, then your body will break down muscle to convert amino acids to glycogen, and it keeps burning fat. You are not likely to run out of fat energy, since it has 3500 calories per lb. Even then folks got an extra lb to spare for that.

How much glycogen you got stored ready for use? Avg 1500 to 2000 calories worth. More if you aerobically train.

That is the "wall" people hit when doing marathons and are not pro-athletes with correct training program. Sugar ran out, muscle is used, and fat still is used.

There are a lot of myths. You must use discernment as to where you hear things, and research.

Like, please research what I just said.

I do all my training runs (6+ miles) in a glycogen-depleted state due to a low-carb diet. I have found as long as I eat enough protein, any break down of muscles to fuel my brain is completely reversed by both lifting weights and eating adequate protein. The only proof I have of this is that I am just as strong as I was before, in fact I got stronger because I significantly increased my protein at the same time that I started my training plan. If anything when I used to lift weights prior to this, I was not eating enough protein because I was eating mostly carbs during that point in time.

You are doing fine, but "getting stronger" is not evidence that you are getting adequate protein. You can gain considerable amounts of strength with no increase in muscle mass at all. Increasing protein intake may have been coincidental with your strength increase, but it is likely not the cause. In any case, increasing protein intake is not going to hurt and can definitely help conserve lean mass, even in the case of high volumes of cardio, so you are doing the right thing.

nurse_christieyne

Its all about context here. If you want to be a long-distance runner and see continued improvement, you must run more than 30 minutes at a time and you must do it frequently. However if you want to burn fat and improve physical fitness, then 30+ minutes of cardio is not the best use of your time. You are better off doing resistance training and high intensity intervals. But if cardio keeps your more motivated, better that than nothing!

Oh and I am in marathon training and have actually gotten stronger because I always lift weights before I run, and I have upped my protein intake to prevent muscle loss. I've definitely burned fat without losing muscle in recent weeks.

Thanks.

grinch031

Other things I have heard is at that point it starts to burn muscle and not fat. But I dont think that is necessarily true is it? That would be more based on what your diet is, correct? I think there are alot of myths out there, sometimes its hard to determine which ones are accurate! Thanks for the help guys! I'll keep up my cardio!

Who ever is spouting this stuff, don't use them as trainer.

if you run out of glycogen, required for burning fat, then your body will break down muscle to convert amino acids to glycogen, and it keeps burning fat. You are not likely to run out of fat energy, since it has 3500 calories per lb. Even then folks got an extra lb to spare for that.

How much glycogen you got stored ready for use? Avg 1500 to 2000 calories worth. More if you aerobically train.

That is the "wall" people hit when doing marathons and are not pro-athletes with correct training program. Sugar ran out, muscle is used, and fat still is used.

There are a lot of myths. You must use discernment as to where you hear things, and research.

Like, please research what I just said.

I do all my training runs (6+ miles) in a glycogen-depleted state due to a low-carb diet. I have found as long as I eat enough protein, any break down of muscles to fuel my brain is completely reversed by both lifting weights and eating adequate protein. The only proof I have of this is that I am just as strong as I was before, in fact I got stronger because I significantly increased my protein at the same time that I started my training plan. If anything when I used to lift weights prior to this, I was not eating enough protein because I was eating mostly carbs during that point in time.

You are doing fine, but "getting stronger" is not evidence that you are getting adequate protein. You can gain considerable amounts of strength with no increase in muscle mass at all. Increasing protein intake may have been coincidental with your strength increase, but it is likely not the cause. In any case, increasing protein intake is not going to hurt and can definitely help conserve lean mass, even in the case of high volumes of cardio, so you are doing the right thing.

Well I have little doubt that I'm getting adequate protein now, just by mere fact that I eat a lot more leaner meats over fatty foods now, and severely restrict carbs. If anything I worry I'm eating too much protein.

But anyways I've done numerous long distance races over the last few years and lifted weights, and it seems I did lose muscle (or at least strength) while training for a race on my very high carb diet. So that's why I think the added protein made the difference.

Di3012

Ok so I have heard from multiple people that doing any cardio over 30 mins is basically a waste. They say that your body stops resisting after 30 mins. Anyone have any thoughts supporting this or against this? I would appreciat as much feedback as I can get. I mean... who wants to do more cardio than is necessary?! :bigsmile:

It's not a waste, you are burning calories, your heart is working and you will eventually get fitter.

The body does not resist after 30 minutes, if it did, all those track and field athletes, roadrunners, cross country runners, professional and amateur alike would not bother continuing.

It all depends on what a person would be training for. A person training to run a marathon or even a half marathon would not find it much use if they only trained for 30 minutes at a time for instance.

There are many, many rumours and myths that fly around all over the place. If a person only wants to do 30 minutes or under cardio per session, absolutely no problems whatsoever, but for some peopole 30 minutes just is not enough.

Do whatever you feel comfortable with, if you feel sick or ill during, say a run, then rethink your session.

Di3012

Its all about context here. If you want to be a long-distance runner and see continued improvement, you must run more than 30 minutes at a time and you must do it frequently. However if you want to burn fat and improve physical fitness, then 30+ minutes of cardio is not the best use of your time. You are better off doing resistance training and high intensity intervals. But if cardio keeps your more motivated, better that than nothing!

Oh and I am in marathon training and have actually gotten stronger because I always lift weights before I run, and I have upped my protein intake to prevent muscle loss. I've definitely burned fat without losing muscle in recent weeks.

What sort of weight exercises do you do for running training? I am seriously thinking of getting back into weights after years away. I run a lot, but never used weight training for my running.

What do you do, an overall body session or legs or what? Also, do you lift heavy or light.

Sorry for all the questions lol. :flowerforyou: