Starvation mode article that I found very VERY helpful....

kittenmitton · March 2012

Yes! Bravo! I love this article. I feel like I have to add, just because someone eats under a certain number of calories per day, it does not mean they're anorexic. Anorexia is defined as being at least 15% underweight, a failure to maintain a healthy weight, an intense fear of gaining weight or becoming fat, and amenorrhea. Nowhere on that list is the phrase "consuming less than 1200 calories per day." I eat less than 1200 calories per day because I eat low-calorie meals because I don't like the taste of fatty foods, I eat until I'm full, I don't eat after dinner because I'm not hungry, and I don't see the point of forcing myself to eat if I'm not hungry. Also, I've lost 9 pounds so far this way. And I believe I can manage to stay under 1200 for the rest of my life (unless something drastically changes about my body) because I am eating the foods I love when I'm hungry. I could get used to that.

LorinaLynn · March 2012

LOL at the "get a PhD" remarks. We do have PhD's on this site. And there is plenty of literature out there from people with PhD's. Maybe some of the PhD's on the site will chime in. Or maybe not as debating the same topic over and over again with people who live in fear of food and have allergies to logical reasoning becomes very tiresome.

and many of your post are either demeaning or for better of lack of words...have no meanings...

I know, right? How horrible of him to want people to be and eat healthy.

FWIW, Wikipedia, while not always a reliable source of information, includes this line in their description of anorexia: "The average caloric intake of a person with anorexia nervosa is 600–800 calories per day, but extreme cases of complete self-starvation are known."

I've known people who were anorexic and malnourished while still technically overweight. Anorexia is simply lack of eating and lack of appetite.

MissJay75 · March 2012

I don't disagree with the article, in fact I have thought exactly the same thing reading those kinds of forum posts. I do wonder though, how do you explain the anecdotal 'evidence'. By this I mean people who were eating very low net calories, who hit a plateau, upped their calories, and began losing again. Coincidence? Would they have lost anyway? Was it because they "confused" their bodies?

taso42 · March 2012

LOL at the "get a PhD" remarks. We do have PhD's on this site. And there is plenty of literature out there from people with PhD's. Maybe some of the PhD's on the site will chime in. Or maybe not as debating the same topic over and over again with people who live in fear of food and have allergies to logical reasoning becomes very tiresome.

and many of your post are either demeaning or for better of lack of words...have no meanings...

That doesn't make the bullshit I'm replying to any less bulls hitty.

lind3400 · March 2012

I dunno I would rather someone tells me "Wow you look so fit" "Look at those muscles" " I'm jealous of your abs" than " you look so skinny" " Wow, you've lost ALOT of weight" just sayin....and you dont get that with 750cals a day

BrianSharpe · March 2012

"Also about 4 years ago after I had my 3rd baby I weighed about 220 lb and went on a diet that was lower than 1200 calories per day and had absolutely no problem whatsoever losing the weight within 6 months time...I went from 205 (to be fair..baby weight) to about 150 in 6 months eating less than 1200 cal per day, lifting weights daily and eating whatever I wanted on a Saturday...And I was 37 years old 4 years ago so the age factor was against me as well! Why was I able to lose this weight so successfully when everywhere I read on here everyone says I must eat well over 1200 to lose...remember I lifted weights every single day and ate less than 1200 (some days probably 900) and still lost around 50 lb in 6 months..."

If eating less than 1200 calories a day worked out so well for you, then why are you here, needing to lose weight again? I am not saying that to be rude or mean. Just something for you to think about.

ETA sorry I haven't figured out the quote function yet.

Exactly the question I had in mind........if it worked you wouldn't be wearing XXL tops. Successful weight control programs centre around healthy habits and making changes that need to be kept up for a lifetime.

taso42 · March 2012

PlanetVelma · March 2012

LOL at the "get a PhD" remarks. We do have PhD's on this site. And there is plenty of literature out there from people with PhD's. Maybe some of the PhD's on the site will chime in. Or maybe not as debating the same topic over and over again with people who live in fear of food and have allergies to logical reasoning becomes very tiresome.

and many of your post are either demeaning or for better of lack of words...have no meanings...

That doesn't make the bullshit I'm replying to any less bulls hitty.

I'll drink to that! :drinker:

christibam · March 2012

:O

Bump to read drama later.

- Future PhD candidate

christibam · March 2012

so the argument is invalid, I guess?

You said the words. =X

k done.

hennyben · March 2012

bump for later

cmriverside · March 2012

Thinning the herd. Oh, wait, is that PC?

Elizabeth_C34 · March 2012

:O

Bump to read drama later.

- Future PhD candidate

LOL

- Another future Ph.D. (only about a year left on my doctoral studies)

suziecue66 · March 2012

I just find it sooooooo hard to believe that I weight 60 lb more than I need to and reducing my calories to 1200 calories a day or less will PREVENT me from losing weight? It just does not make sense to me! Also about 4 years ago after I had my 3rd baby I weighed about 220 lb and went on a diet that was lower than 1200 calories per day and had absolutely no problem whatsoever losing the weight within 6 months time...I went from 205 (to be fair..baby weight) to about 150 in 6 months eating less than 1200 cal per day, lifting weights daily and eating whatever I wanted on a Saturday...And I was 37 years old 4 years ago so the age factor was against me as well! Why was I able to lose this weight so successfully when everywhere I read on here everyone says I must eat well over 1200 to lose...remember I lifted weights every single day and ate less than 1200 (some days probably 900) and still lost around 50 lb in 6 months...I am interested your opinions on this...

It won't but you will BE hungry and its not the right way! I set my calories @ 1200 but I add all my workouts into them.. so I normally EAT 1500-1800 per day. Even on Days I skip a workout I never eat 1200 unless, I am sick.

I lost 35lbs in 2.5 months.. but when I did lose it I WAS hungry.. that is why I gained some back. That is why I always lose and gain weight. Eventually I got use to be being hungry and just ignored it.

All in all do what works best for you... eventually you will learn!

I don't think a lot of us can lose 35lbs in 2.5 months. Some just seem to lose slower.

BrianSharpe · March 2012

Here is the link

http://stunteating.com/2010/06/02/the-myth-of-starvation-mode/

Congratulations, you've found a completely unscientific blog that supports your beliefs, try reading something based on fact rather than opinion:

"Protein and amino acids are not stored in the body,
like fat and glucose are in adipocytes and as glycogen,
respectively. The largest reservoir of protein, however,
is skeletal muscle mass. Thus, muscle mass is the best
indicator of protein homeostasis. Inadequate dietary
intake of protein and energy due to anorexia or starvation,
and the altered metabolic and physiologic processes
resulting from increased catabolic stimuli and
reduced anabolic stimuli, results in muscle wasting."

C. Castaneda
Jean Mayer USDA Human Nutrition Research Center on Aging at Tufts University, Boston, MA 02111

http://www.asas.org/symposia/esupp2/jas2080.pdf

jeni636363 · March 2012

When you are eating that little of food, you are losing muscle as well as fat and slowing your metabolism because of it. Eating less slows metabolism and losing muscle has you burning less calories at rest. It won't preven you from losing pounds on the scale or even from losing fat, but you will lose muscle. You need food to gain muscle and you need muscle to burn more calories. You can eat 2000 a day lifting weights and not worry about it or you can eat under 1200 and struggle for a long time. For me , 2000 seems more reasonable for a lifestyle change. Under 1200 for me is a crash diet. But do what works for you. If you eat under 1200 and you are getting the results you want (not from the scale but from what you see) then do what you need to do!

lisakyle_11 · March 2012

another thing i see here is that you said you have 60 lbs to lose (again)? that weight came back? it might be helpful to take a look at how your metabolism is running.

will check out the article though.

suziecue66 · March 2012

But won't you lose muscle mass in addition to fat??

When I had mono and couldn't eat anything for 2 months and all I did was lay in bed (for 2 months - and had to be carried to the bathroom at 19 years old, and bathed by my Mother), I lost nearly all my muscle. Without nourishment, my body took from itself.

Sure, I lost 40 lbs in 2 months time - but it was all muscle. When all was said and done - I couldn't walk by myself most of the time. I was so exhausted, I couldn't stay awake. My friends had to carry my backpack for me to all my classes.

Just saying - you might lose that weight fast - but is that how you REALLY want to lose it??

You would if bed-bound. You need to use the muscle if you don't want to lose it - strength train. So your situation was different.

jasonr1442 · March 2012

I give the OP a ton of respect!! Not sure if she knew what she was gonna start. I absolutely agree with her though. You can lose weight consistantly at low calories.

You will lose muscle and all though. Starvation mode is BS. Everyone is different and what works for each individual is different.

Kick it one time booooy

pigwidgeon82 · March 2012

I usually eat under 750 calories BUT its not because im trying to have it help me lose weight.

I eat all throughout the day and im full to the max when i finish eating.

WHATS THE ISSUE?

People would rather me eat until im sick just so i can say im eating over 1000 calories?

No thank you.

^^^Thank-You for this comment... i hear this all the time that I am not eating enough so I ate till I was so sick to my stomach...never again. no thank . I'll take my chances of continuing to loose inches and a 1.5 a week than stuff my stomach beyond a busting point.. Exercise and cutting my meals in 1/2 or eating 5-6 small meals a day works for me.. love how the ones that say that I am doing it wrong, or I must me trying to starve myself I see no PHd. behind their screen name..

Im glad someone understands what im saying

NP... since 2/23 I have eaten less than 1k a day, have lost 3lbs, -1" chest; -2" stomach, -2.5" hips... due to daily exercises, including cardio and strength, I eat 5-6 small meals a day... This is what works for me, and trust I totally understand what you are saying..

you say that is what works for you. have you tried anything else? another way of doing things? probably not.

and yes, it is working for you, if by working you mean losing weight and getting smaller. on the inside, it is not "working" in the sense that you are not being healthy and not giving your body what it needs.

i've seen many friends lose weight this way. guess what happened? they lost muscle tone, hair, their skin looked gross, and many of them ended up in the hospital because they weren't giving their body the thing it needed.

if you want to continue harming yourself and your body just because it is "working" and giving you the outward result you want, go ahead. but it is a shame, as your body is an amazing thing that you are working pretty hard against.

RileeMarie · March 2012

Here, let me bust out my little list again. Here are sob stories from people on this site who have been chronically under eating. But I don't have a PhD, and neither do they, so the argument is invalid, I guess?

http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/419136-what-am-i-doing-wrong
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/419393-need-serious-help-please
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/420759-gaining-weight-on-a-low-carb-diet-please-help
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/421412-so-fed-up-there-has-to-be-an-easier-way
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/446248-why-am-i-gaining-weight
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/447513-disillusioned
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/448803-not-loosing-weight-or-inches
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/454374-gaining-with-scrict-diet-and-workouts
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/455392-no-results-at-all-despair
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/457566-why-cant-i-loose-weight-or-inches
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/457037-feeling-disheartened
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/467001-why-1200-c-a-day-and-still-no-weight-loss
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/480698-assistance-please-this-is-getting-ridiculous
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/480186-tiredness
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/487729-the-scale-wont-move
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/493331-i-need-some-straight-up-advice-on-this-dieting
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/503342-mfp-lied-help
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/509836-i-can-t-seem-to-lose-any-weight
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/517635-what-is-wrong-with-me

what is the argument? that i am not eating what you would consider the norm to loose weight? when in fact I have lost weight and inches> because I dont agree with you that everyone (including myself) can and should eat more than 1k calories a day. And then when i dont or cant because i fill full that i must be wanting to starve myself? No, I joined this site to start eating healthier not come here to be ridicule by others who think they know my life story and what is best for me. what is best for you to eat over 1k calories works for you...that is great. but what works for you and others is not the same for me (and others) doesnt make me right or wrong. it's a re-learning process for me to eat healthy and not have a fear of food. and not think because i eat this food i will gain a huge amount of weight. i came here for support not to be judged. and definitely not to belittled by you or the others that dont agree with my or someone elses feelings and thoughts.

Elizabeth_C34 · March 2012

But won't you lose muscle mass in addition to fat??

When I had mono and couldn't eat anything for 2 months and all I did was lay in bed (for 2 months - and had to be carried to the bathroom at 19 years old, and bathed by my Mother), I lost nearly all my muscle. Without nourishment, my body took from itself.

Sure, I lost 40 lbs in 2 months time - but it was all muscle. When all was said and done - I couldn't walk by myself most of the time. I was so exhausted, I couldn't stay awake. My friends had to carry my backpack for me to all my classes.

Just saying - you might lose that weight fast - but is that how you REALLY want to lose it??

You would if bed-bound. You need to use the muscle if you don't want to lose it - strength train. So your situation was different.

Um no.

I was eating between 1200-1300 calories per day when I started, lost 37 lbs total, 10 lbs of that was muscle, and I strength train (heavy) 3x per week. You need adequate calorie and protein intake to maintain your muscle.

Quasita · March 2012

I usually eat under 750 calories BUT its not because im trying to have it help me lose weight.

I eat all throughout the day and im full to the max when i finish eating.

WHATS THE ISSUE?

People would rather me eat until im sick just so i can say im eating over 1000 calories?

No thank you.

Wow....I don't even know what/how to respond to this.

under 1000 calories is not healthy at all, much less 750.

Not being rude, being honest.

Good luck to you.

That's right. Under 1200 calories is considered anorexia levels. I wrote a blog about starvation and starvation mode, and I am developing a followup article where I will be discussing where the real danger lies in these levels, which is when you try to eat more. It's a debate that goes on and on and people are always saying they can lose while eating less... Yes, you can. It's called anorexia/bulimia.

Think of it this way. If you are under 1200 by limiting food alone, this is on par with anorexia.
If you are under 1200 because you ate and then exercised until you were below 1200 NET, especially significantly so, it's on par with bulimia.

I hate how people set themselves at the bare minimum. Nutritional science states over and over that 1200 is the MINIMUM for healthy survival, and that someone who is starving should be started at 1200 and increased to a healthy BMR intake. Why would you actively do something that is considered a life-threatening situation?

The lack of weightloss occurs after you have been at this level long enough to deplete the fat stores that your body can use. Then it will start to shut down essential processes, stopping weight loss, and causing weight gain when you do eat over the minimum you set for yourself.

Anyway, I try to stress to people that whatever you set for yourself NOW during your weightloss, you have to make sure you can easily increase when you're done losing. Eating less than 1k means that not only do you have to halve all nutrition labels and suggestions, but if you ever decide to increase (or have to, like when getting preggers) you'll gain at an exponential rate.

To each their own, but I am a perfect case. I started here eating only what I felt like, which was around 1800, 800 less than my BMR. I would often work out till I was negative NET. I stopped losing. I then increased by a couple hundred a day so now I eat 2600-3600 at least, and I'm losing again.

twinkietigress · March 2012

A word of caution regarding this "article." i find it impossible to address its credibiliiy as it includes no references and/or credentials. This looks like a blog article written on a web site from some average Joe with no facts and/or figures to support it. i'm all for trusting your own body and finding your own way just be wary of charletons trying to sell you what you want to hear. no one really knwos what the safe limit is for you, go ask your own doctor or nutriionist, in my opinion MFP is offten an approximation, i think we all kinda get that, that sometimes we estimate calories both food and exercise calories but i'm very careful about changing my practices based on the latest thought especially when it's an article without basis in fact and theory.

TT

Silverkittycat · March 2012

Thinning the herd. Oh, wait, is that PC?

Not in my world.

lind3400 · March 2012

I usually eat under 750 calories BUT its not because im trying to have it help me lose weight.

I eat all throughout the day and im full to the max when i finish eating.

WHATS THE ISSUE?

People would rather me eat until im sick just so i can say im eating over 1000 calories?

No thank you.

^^^Thank-You for this comment... i hear this all the time that I am not eating enough so I ate till I was so sick to my stomach...never again. no thank . I'll take my chances of continuing to loose inches and a 1.5 a week than stuff my stomach beyond a busting point.. Exercise and cutting my meals in 1/2 or eating 5-6 small meals a day works for me.. love how the ones that say that I am doing it wrong, or I must me trying to starve myself I see no PHd. behind their screen name..

I find it hilarious that your on a weight loss site tracking 750 calories if you have such a hard time eating more, how did you gain weight in the first place to wind up here unless your already disordered in some way? The mind can be a powerful thing, working for you or against you, in most cases with ED's against.

Oh and I also find it hilarious that anyone would want to live the rest of their lives on less of a daily caloric intake that my growing toddler needs for good health/energy functions. In fact it is science that if you weigh a certain amount, your body will NEED a certain amount to sustain daily functions BEFORE activity for overall health, I find it very hard to believe many people need less than 1k per day unless they are already around 100 lbs and very petite as well as sedentary most of the day.

That works for my body so i will continue to do what i please.

You are a twit ! .... simple as that

AMEN

Silverkittycat · March 2012

Eat less, move more.

Where'd all the ponies go? *sad*

BaconMD · March 2012

I heard that an apple a day keeps the doctor away, and I want to be healthy so I am just going to eat only one apple a day. Who's with me?

incredimike · March 2012

I think "starvation mode" is becoming the new sensational thing to report about (or find old reports about).

This guy, Dr Gary Taubes, is suggesting a whole new way of thinking about how we gain weight. Its kinda long, but totally worth the time:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bTUspjZG-wc

This is the basis of the "Keto" diet that I recently dove into and absolutely love.

TL;DR: You aren't fat because you eat too much, you eat too much because you're fat. Change what you eat.

charcharbec · March 2012

In response to all those forum links... honestly I am not sure what they say... but I found that when I wasn't eating enough I lasted with GOOD energy for about 3-4 months just fine... this is eating at the 300 calorie level... I ate ALL day but it was very low calorie stuff like tofu and celery and spinach etc. I am vegan so it was easier to eat less cals bc I stayed away from carbs mostly (not out of fear). A lot of people who don't eat ENOUGH don't typically have healthy eating habits. While again I agree that I am much HAPPIER eating more, my body has responded in my workouts like CRAZY (in a good way)--- starvation mode REALLY does happen once you get to a certain body fat percentage.... also your metabolism really does slow down... and your body does lose a lot more muscle especially under the 35% Body Fat Range.....

I have done a LOT of research on this, and do NOT advocate for the unhealthy eating habits that can be formed by the anxiety of eating more than 1000 cals or 1200 cals... or 300 cals. I was a mental MESS at that low of food even though I ate all day... I fantasized about food... looked at food all day. And eventually started getting VERY weak in my workouts....

in just 2 week of eating 1000 cals and up... my strength is back and even GROWING exponentially... i am only 120 lbs and im 4'10 like I said... and work a desk job... so besides my 5-6 times a week of exercise I don't get much.... and I will probably increase my food when I am at a body fat percent that I am happy with, to about 1500-1700 calories a day.... but if I werent to work out my body would only really need about 1100-1200 cals a day at my weight and height....

At the same time... to get the amount of protein and fiber you need to stay healthy you really really really need to eat more. You cant GET the levels of that stuff that you need at such a low calorie goal. You just cant. I've tried. I know.

Anyway... the article is correct... but is it healthy? Nope not really. Not healthy because of energy and protein needed and essential vitamins etc. Just eat healthier... eat more veggies.... and work out..... thats all there is to it. Losing weight is easy.... we just make it harder on ourselves.

Starvation mode article that I found very VERY helpful....

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