Forgive my student loan!
Replies
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I think it is ridiculous that we call people with a 4 year degree "educated"... back in the early 1900's when school was hard I think that was a good use of the term. Now anyone who shows up and puts in 1/8 of the effort required can get a degree.
I believe that is an extremely unfair assessment on your part, and it legitimately offends me, and I don't even have my college degree yet. There are millions of people who are astoundingly intelligent that never stepped foot inside a university and would be considered educated. You don't need overpriced classes taught by lethargic professors on tenure to be considered "educated."0 -
I believe that is an extremely unfair assessment on your part, and it legitimately offends me, and I don't even have my college degree yet. There are millions of people who are astoundingly intelligent that never stepped foot inside a university and would be considered educated. You don't need overpriced classes taught by lethargic professors on tenure to be considered "educated."
No.
Educated means educated. The higher up the chain you go, the more educated you are. And whilst I agree this doesn't equate intelligence (I know more people without degrees who I would consider more intelligent than those with) they are not more educated.0 -
I support this 100%... Lots of people whining about not getting the same favor... think about the greater good!!!! Educational debt is unreal and it is stifling the American Dream!!0
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No.
Educated means educated. The higher up the chain you go, the more educated you are. And whilst I agree this doesn't equate intelligence (I know more people without degrees who I would consider more intelligent than those with) they are not more educated.
No, I must disagree. You don't have to go to school to be educated. You can self educate, you can be educated by someone else on a soul-searching journey or really anything. Being educated does not require you go to a high learning institution. This sort of mentality drives me crazy. Educated isn't defined solely as having and education, it can also be defined as being skilled with training and practice. You can be educated without going to college. Let's use Steve Jobs as an example for this. I would have never, ever, accused him of being uneducated.0 -
To me is like beig fat. You did it to yourself. You CHOSE to eat al the goodies just like you CHOSE to take out the loans. Eventually the bill is going to come due. You can take the easy way out (by pass, lap band, loan forgiveness) or you can work your butt off and accomplish great and wonderful things with the knowledge that YOU did it.
Cheating is cheating. I thought there was no "magic pill"? Then there shouldn't be a "magic bailout".0 -
Although my student loads are MY responsibility ... and I don't feel other's should have to contribute to that..; I have to ask.. what about MY taxes that are now going to young adults that have five kids and just keep having babies because we will hand feed them every drop they need and give them no reason to ever do things outside of the funding? .. If my taxes can go to that.. my taxes should be able to pay for MY student loands.. I've been working since I was 14.. have no kids but yet I still get taxed school tax etc! ..
If I can pay for a 19 year old with 5 kids to live in a 3 bedroom townhouse with no bills, and $900 worth of food stamps.. my tax can also pay for helping out student loans for those that better their life and go to school to better their future.0 -
As a former student who owes a TON of $$, in student loans, it would be in my interest to agree with this.
As a taxpayer, NO.
I knew what I was doing when I borrowed the money. My kids knew what they were doing when they took out student laons. We were smart enough to go to college, after all.
The folks who didn't go to college because they couldn't afford it or didn't want to shouldn't have to pay for my academic dreams.0 -
Dear god no I will not pay for other people's education. Other countries provide free college because they TAX their citizens more to pay for said colleges. It's not really free, it's just paid for by everyone. I paid for my own college by working. I didn't take full courses and live in a dorm and not have a job. I worked, paid what I could, took out smaller loans and paid them off.
How is it in any way fair for taxpayer dollars to go towards paying off student loans for OTHER people?0 -
And if you can not hold up your end of a contract then don't enter one.
Good point, but student loans are not as clear cut as that. The nature of student loans means that people who took out student loans and now cannot find a job to pay them back as a result of the economic crisis did not know that that would be the case until they graduated and tried to find a job. Student loans are awarded based on the premise that when you graduate, you then get a job and pay them back, which is why your account enters repayment after you leave school and/or become employed. This has not been an issue until now, because now a college education is not proving as valuable as it once was. Student loan debt is astronomical now because the economic crisis has meant that young grads are finding it even more difficult than the general population to land a job because they are being passed over for more experienced people who are also desperate for jobs. That is not their fault. Again, I don't think loan forgiveness is the answer, but I find a lot of the "boo hoo" posts here disturbing.
At the end of the day, this country needs college-educated people - we can't compete in the world without them - so when higher education becomes so inaccessible that people start to view it as a curse, that is a major issue that needs to be addressed. We think we have issues now; just wait till people stop going to college because it causes more problems for an individual than it solves.0 -
This lively discussion is interesting. Let's summarize:
Political- HR 4071 has nearly a zero chance of passage, will not become law. If it gets to the floor, it will be trotted out as help for a certain demographic from which the current administration has most definitely lost support. If it comes to a vote, it will be defeated along partisan lines and then brought out as the Evil Republicans not helping Americans. Almost every democratic proposal this year except for local earmarking will be campaign items.
Moral- You borrowed money. Pay it back.
Financial- There was a reason that the government took over the Student Loan Program when the Dem's had the house and senate. You are now finding out the reasons. The interest rate is being increased substantially at a time when the real cost of money is nearly zero. That is in my view, unethical. And it is the current administration that is doing it while they are telling you they are helping you. Now that they control the program, they will attempt to further foster the entitlement methodology they believe is the true path to greatness for America. I am pretty certain that most of our readers believe dear Leader is on the wrong path with this stuff. Time for his retirement.
Practical- I took a low wage job and paid back student loans. The economy was worse then than today. It got better. The job didn't stay low wage and so on and so forth. Fast forward to today. In the last 5 years my 4 sons have graduated from college. Two went to state schools where the tuition was dramatically reduced for people that maintained a certain GPA and worked on campus. I suppose a liberal could call that intellectual discrimination. The other two went to more expensive private schools that offered scholarships that they received. Again, certain standards and working hard while in school. Mom and Dad wrote checks for the rest of it because we were determined that our gift to them would be to graduate with no student loans , and that they would then have the flexibility to pursue their vocational dreams without the financial burden of loans, even if it meant we had to work longer or harder to accomplish this, which we did. Mission accomplished.
Summary- I will pay for my choices, you pay for yours. If I choose to help you and can, I will. I feel strongly that the closer we get to an entitlement state the weaker our country will be. HR 4071 is an entitlement and control bill. Why would anyone that doesn't absolutely have to want the government to take care of them?
Let's get back to weight loss and nutrition. More fun.0 -
This lively discussion is interesting. Let's summarize:
Political- HR 4071 has nearly a zero chance of passage, will not become law. If it gets to the floor, it will be trotted out as help for a certain demographic from which the current administration has most definitely lost support. If it comes to a vote, it will be defeated along partisan lines and then brought out as the Evil Republicans not helping Americans. Almost every democratic proposal this year except for local earmarking will be campaign items.
Moral- You borrowed money. Pay it back.
Financial- There was a reason that the government took over the Student Loan Program when the Dem's had the house and senate. You are now finding out the reasons. The interest rate is being increased substantially at a time when the real cost of money is nearly zero. That is in my view, unethical. And it is the current administration that is doing it while they are telling you they are helping you. Now that they control the program, they will attempt to further foster the entitlement methodology they believe is the true path to greatness for America. I am pretty certain that most of our readers believe dear Leader is on the wrong path with this stuff. Time for his retirement.
Practical- I took a low wage job and paid back student loans. The economy was worse then than today. It got better. The job didn't stay low wage and so on and so forth. Fast forward to today. In the last 5 years my 4 sons have graduated from college. Two went to state schools where the tuition was dramatically reduced for people that maintained a certain GPA and worked on campus. I suppose a liberal could call that intellectual discrimination. The other two went to more expensive private schools that offered scholarships that they received. Again, certain standards and working hard while in school. Mom and Dad wrote checks for the rest of it because we were determined that our gift to them would be to graduate with no student loans , and that they would then have the flexibility to pursue their vocational dreams without the financial burden of loans, even if it meant we had to work longer or harder to accomplish this, which we did. Mission accomplished.
Summary- I will pay for my choices, you pay for yours. If I choose to help you and can, I will. I feel strongly that the closer we get to an entitlement state the weaker our country will be. HR 4071 is an entitlement and control bill. Why would anyone that doesn't absolutely have to want the government to take care of them?
Let's get back to weight loss and nutrition. More fun.
Yes because "entitlement states" such as the majority of western European countries are such worse places to live?0 -
Student Loan Forgiveness...please. Why should my tax money go to pay for someone else's loans? Nobody forced them to take out big loans. I had loans while in college and for a few years after I graduated but I worked my *kitten* off to get them paid off.
I couldn't agree with you more. The same goes for everyone who purchased a home they couldn't afford hoping to flip it and then they walk away from it. We had three houses in foreclosure on our street, which in turn lowers the value of my home.
If you can't afford it, don't spend it.
^^^this
here's the thing though.... the reason so many people bought houses they thought they could afford but really couldn't was because they were mislead by the market and loaners. its not completely fair to place all the blame on someone that was getting... for lack of a better word... bamboozled
When I applied for a home loan, I was approved for $400k, did I go and buy a $400K home? NO, I had to think about all the "what ifs". i couldn't bear what would happen if I lost my job and couldn't afford mortgage payments on a $400K home, so I settled on a $200K home, I was being reasonable.
"If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is"
c'mon now, people really think "Wow, I can get a $400K house, have s#itty credit and only pay $900 a month?!?!" Something has to give somewhere, people AND the banks were being greedy and stupid.
i already got stuck with a huge debt that an ex left me in ($25K), I didn't file bankruptcy (even though I could have easily got it since he was threatening to murder me and my family) but I took the responsibility, and paid it off...every single cent.
Man-up people.
You need to realize that not everyone is as "wise" as you... and that DOES NOT give banks the right to take advantage of them. Maybe if we had a better education system in this country and there was a greater focus on ethical practices in business.... we wouldn't be in the mess we are in right now0 -
Post-secondary should be better funded, but one thing to remember is that continued education is a privilege, not a right. You need to work hard to qualify and pay for that privilege. There are scholarships, grants, loans, private funding and alternate means to paying for your education.
I did not qualify for OSAP (the Ontario Student Loan program) because my father earned too much money (less than the average family income but as a single wage earner) and I planned to live at home so his income was taken into account). So I have personally paid for my own education, with the help of scholarships and grants and my own hard work. It took me longer than 4 years, but I have worked and studied over that time - and I`ll beat you all to the punch, yes, I`ve been very lucky to find gainful employment in the meantime, but I took any and every job that I could find to meet my financial needs.
Education isn`t a level playing field - but then not much is in life.......I would resent having to forgive student loans for people who took more than the required time to complete their programs and racked up higher loans, or those who could fully afford to pay for their own loans (although note above, I fell into a grey area where I was deemed able to pay for my own education.) I know there are programs that will pay part of your tuition back if you submit service to their organizations (military, under-served/remote areas). Health Care Workers in Canada, as an example, if they work in the under-served areas in Northern Canada are eligible for up to $4-40K debt forgiveness for their student loans.
A better solution to the whole problem is better subsidies for educational establishments, qualifications on student loans, loan forgiveness based on performance, fixed interest rates at the start of the contract, the ability to defer based on inability to get ANY job after school with proof of attempting etc. These contracts were made with adults, not children - adults should be taking into account the worst case scenarios when agreeing to large sums of money (like job loss, disability potential, etc.). This will restrict some people from taking out loans, but if going to school is important to you, you'll make it happen regardless. I personally believe 18-19 is too young to be entering into these kinds of contracts....but that's just me, based on my personal experience and the experiences of my family and friends.
And as a side note to the Australia/US discussions: US may be bigger than Australia, but it's not bigger than Canada. We are paying almost comparable gas prices as the Australians and we produce oil that is used to make the gas! Toronto has 2.5M people and we're paying about $1.35/L (which is over $5 per gallon).....We used to be comparable, but our government is cutting back the subsidies that reduce the cost......0 -
Sovereign collapse is generally perceived as a bad thing, yes. There is no dispute that we don't have enough money to pay for every obligation we currently have. Fostering more obligations by promoting the notion that we, any of us, are somehow entitled to this or that material thing just because we walk and breathe I happen to think is bad for our country. It's just my opinion, you don't have to agree. Have a good day.0
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Student Loan Forgiveness...please. Why should my tax money go to pay for someone else's loans? Nobody forced them to take out big loans. I had loans while in college and for a few years after I graduated but I worked my *kitten* off to get them paid off.
THIS!0 -
My position remains the same, I took out the loans. I didn't have a choice, if I wanted to go to college I had to do that plus work. I'm not looking for tax payers to pay back my loans. However, as the loans are controlled by the government, the interest rate on them should be significantly reduced. What exactly is the government doing with this interest I am paying? And all the taxes I am paying?
Oh, right, paying off other people's mortgages and giving money to people who don't work.
While the government probably shouldn't simply forgive student loans, why are people with student loans being treated differently than those with under water mortgages? The student loans are, in fact, under water.
Why are people with student loans being treated differently than those who chose not to go to college, but instead to stay home and have a bunch of kids that they cannot afford. Those people with student loans have loans they cannot afford--if you're going to pay someone to have babies, you should pay others to go to school.0 -
I still owe so much. I would love to not have to pay it back; however, it's not fair to the taxpayers to pay for part of my education.
Why not? We have hundreds of inmates in this country that have killed someone and get to go to the hospital and have open heart surgery if they need it. As a taxpayer I would rather pay your student loans than pay for that hospital bill!0 -
Why doesn't the government try and work towards making education more affordable, instead of allowing the high cost of education force people into debt? A strong workforce is a healthy, educated one that doesn't have to worry about where they're going to get money to get an education to get a better job.0
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I love how the government complains about the fact that America is losing its standing in the world as far as education yet they won't spend money to fix that. Truth is... the whole system is broken, and without proper reform and funding it won't get better. This act, however much I would love to not have to pay that debt back, is not the right answer. Maybe college should be free to begin with.... at least to a certain level... or at least a lot cheaper. It's ridiculous to me, the priorities of a country where a movie star can make millions but members of the military and teachers struggle constantly because the pay is low. I know its a lot more complicated than that... but still.0
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Why doesn't the government try and work towards making education more affordable, instead of allowing the high cost of education force people into debt? A strong workforce is a healthy, educated one that doesn't have to worry about where they're going to get money to get an education to get a better job.
THIS0 -
I think it is ridiculous that we call people with a 4 year degree "educated"... back in the early 1900's when school was hard I think that was a good use of the term. Now anyone who shows up and puts in 1/8 of the effort required can get a degree.
I believe that is an extremely unfair assessment on your part, and it legitimately offends me, and I don't even have my college degree yet. There are millions of people who are astoundingly intelligent that never stepped foot inside a university and would be considered educated. You don't need overpriced classes taught by lethargic professors on tenure to be considered "educated."
I guess I'm not seeing what you disagree with?? The point I was making is basically all these people that consider themselves "educated" is ridiculous. I agree with you, I know a people without a degree that are smarter than some people I know with one. I guess I should have put, don't stroke your ego just cause you got some wishy-washy 4 year degree.0 -
By the time I finished college I only owed $550.00. I worked my butt off to not be in debt.ABSOLUTELY NOT!!!!
I worked my way through college to avoid taking on debt. You borrow money, you pay it back. You don't want that obligation, then don't take the money.0 -
I had big student loans. I paid them off. It was hard, and took years, but I had to forgo getting a nice house for a while, drove beater cars, etc. It would not have occurred to me to default on them. My belief is that you do not borrow money you can't or won't pay off. Period.0
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I think it is ridiculous that we call people with a 4 year degree "educated"... back in the early 1900's when school was hard I think that was a good use of the term. Now anyone who shows up and puts in 1/8 of the effort required can get a degree.
I believe that is an extremely unfair assessment on your part, and it legitimately offends me, and I don't even have my college degree yet. There are millions of people who are astoundingly intelligent that never stepped foot inside a university and would be considered educated. You don't need overpriced classes taught by lethargic professors on tenure to be considered "educated."
^^^^^^ THANK YOU! I have worked my *kitten* off in school for the past 6 years! But I wouldn't have traded it for anything. I am walking across that stage in May knowing that I am WELL educated from attending a reputable college. You can't assume that everyone just goes to college and half *kitten* it and earns a degree. If you did that at my college, you wouldn't pass.0 -
I think it is ridiculous that we call people with a 4 year degree "educated"... back in the early 1900's when school was hard I think that was a good use of the term. Now anyone who shows up and puts in 1/8 of the effort required can get a degree.
I believe that is an extremely unfair assessment on your part, and it legitimately offends me, and I don't even have my college degree yet. There are millions of people who are astoundingly intelligent that never stepped foot inside a university and would be considered educated. You don't need overpriced classes taught by lethargic professors on tenure to be considered "educated."
^^^^^^ THANK YOU! I have worked my *kitten* off in school for the past 6 years! But I wouldn't have traded it for anything. I am walking across that stage in May knowing that I am WELL educated from attending a reputable college. You can't assume that everyone just goes to college and half *kitten* it and earns a degree. If you did that at my college, you wouldn't pass.
Agreed. I work my *kitten* off in school.0 -
My husband and I are both about to graduate from college in like two weeks! Neither of us could get a job all throughout school and we do not have jobs lined up after we get out of school. We both went into demanding career fields, Automotives for me and Electronics Engineering for him. We went to a community college, I have no family to speak of and his family can't afford to help us due to his sister's mistakes. I am on welfare, I have medicaid, foodstamps, pell grants, and daycare assistance. We together have racked up $18,500 in debt. We have six months after we graduate to find jobs before we have to pay back our student loans. I came from a very poor, horrible childhood where I raised two kids while I was still a kid myself. He came from a broken home and a difficult childhood also. We have worked damn hard and very lived poorly throughout school, which yes our student loans and our pell grants paid for our 3 bedroom housing (which we had gotten with a roommate who is now gone), vehicle ($900 + gas and parts), books, school supplies and tuition.
DO I THINK MY LOANS SHOULD HAVE TO BE PAID BACK.
HELL NO!
I would rather somebody give my husband and I jobs but if that can't happen then yeah I would like them to at least be put on hold till I can get a job but if that can't happen and it won't (money grubbing companies) then I guess my only option is to have them forgiven.
P.S. Before you say that we haven't gotten jobs because we haven't worked hard enough to find one ( I check into monster.com and indeed.com everyday, I apply and so does my husband to every job we are qualified for including ones where I would have been qualified for in high school) it is because we are losing out to older people with experience and degrees and a bi-polar teacher who can not make up his mind whether I work my a** off or whether I let all the guys do work for me. So I don't want to hear that this is my fault or that I didn't work hard enough you don't know my situation so don't pretend you do.
RANT OVER!0 -
Since voting is so powerful, why can't we all vote to put caps on the cost of education at least in public colleges and universities. Why can't we do this for health care as well. You are telling me that if it can cost less in another country there is no way in can cost less here?? please...
I am new to the US politics, I am a US citizen but was raised with parents from over seas over seas. If voting was really that powerful then make it benefit you buy voting for things that will help you, not giving away money the government doesn't have or handouts.0 -
There is nothing about getting a college education that GUARANTEES you a job. It's an investment, and like all investments, they are risky and sometimes do not pay off, particularly if you didn't research the the demand for a particular degree.
Choosing to pursue a degree taking on loans to do so comes with responsibilities. You signed on that dotted line when you agreed to take on that "crushing debt", no one forced it upon you. You applied for it, and then signed for it when it was awarded to you.
I feel about this the same way I feel about people to choose to have kids and then whine and complain about how they can't afford child care, or to work or to put food on the table or pay for band, lessons, and diapers. If you can't afford them, don't have them.
Suck it up and pay back your loans like an adult.0 -
There are far too many generalization in this thread about people who borrow money. Mortgages and defaulting on them are not as simple as earlier posts have made them out to be. A LOT of people have lost their jobs in the past decade. Companies and governments have downsized their workforce...people lost incomes ....
And the jobs left the country for the developing world (which no one ever seems to talk about)
So people (like my mom) started out with a manageable mortgage and student loan payment and all of a sudden found themselves royally screwed. I come for a very hard working family...that has never made a dime in their entire lives. How is that fair?
I myself worked through HS and during my undergrad...and went to a state school with super low tuition....still ended up with way too much in loans. Joined the Peace Corps....got screwed on perkins loan forgiveness and came home to an extremely changed economy (thanks Bush).
Even with non-competitive eligibility for gov't jobs I put in somewhere around 200 applications for jobs all over the country and ended up with a mere 3 interviews...I drove Miami to New Jersey for interviews in hopes of finding a job....nada!
So for a year I worked 2 part time jobs, neither well paid, averaging around 60 hours per week with almost no days off and didn't even make enough to get an apartment of my own.
THIS is the economy we recent grads have been dealing with.
Don't tell me I don't work hard enough because I'm not currently paying off my loans.
I am currently finishing a masters program (which racked up a whole lot more debt) and really hoping I can find work (ANYWHERE in the world....not picky) that will let me pay off my loans.
I don't take issue with paying back my loans...but there should be better caps on percentage of your income that you're paying and percentage rate. Work with us people!0 -
I think it is ridiculous that we call people with a 4 year degree "educated"... back in the early 1900's when school was hard I think that was a good use of the term. Now anyone who shows up and puts in 1/8 of the effort required can get a degree.
I believe that is an extremely unfair assessment on your part, and it legitimately offends me, and I don't even have my college degree yet. There are millions of people who are astoundingly intelligent that never stepped foot inside a university and would be considered educated. You don't need overpriced classes taught by lethargic professors on tenure to be considered "educated."
^^^^^^ THANK YOU! I have worked my *kitten* off in school for the past 6 years! But I wouldn't have traded it for anything. I am walking across that stage in May knowing that I am WELL educated from attending a reputable college. You can't assume that everyone just goes to college and half *kitten* it and earns a degree. If you did that at my college, you wouldn't pass.
Agreed. I work my *kitten* off in school.
Wait till you get a job and half your co-workers with 4 year degrees and masters degrees don't know their head from their a** you learn really quick that it doesn't make someone educated!0
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