mini rant for those of you who "binge"
Replies
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I think the trouble is that the medical term 'binge' when associated with an eating disorder is a certain number of calories in a specific time period, coupled with a feeling of a total lack of control over what is being eaten. Unfortunately the word 'binge' has now taken on a different, non-medical meaning of eating more than intended. The problems arise because that leaves people with a binge eating disorder no word left to describe what it is they experience as it has been taken by people who could also use words such as a mistake, or overeating, to describe what it is they do. Obviously it's aggravating to see a word that you would use to describe something that has such a hold over you used in a way that lessens that which you are struggling with.0
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I kind of agree with you, and I think part of it has to do with people just loosely using the term "binge" and not thinking about the actual meaning or clinical definition of it. And since you actually suffer from binge eating disorder, you are probably hyper-aware of people mentioning a word that describes something which has the power to control your life.
I think of like OCD...I suffer from OCD (and believe me, sometimes "suffer" is just the tip of the iceberg), so I really really hate it when people say things like "I'm really OCD about that" when they talk about cleaning their house or counting their calories or arranging their closet. Cleaning a lot or avoiding germs or thousands of other behaviors ranging from casual to a little over-the-top do NOT constitute having OCD, and it's pretty insulting to people who really have OCD when others just throw around the term like it's a common and casual thing. Some say I'm being oversenitive, but I think a lot of people in this world are UNDERsensitive. And you never know what silent problems people all around you are suffering from.
WONDERFUL comparison! SO very true.
Likewise, the term *OVERWEIGHT* and/or *FAT* can substituted in either scenario.
Some on this journey use those terms in referring to the # on the scale
One may call themselves OBESE ( perception? or biologically true ?)
Person A may say that @ 10 pounds over desired goal
Person B may say that @ 100 pounds over GW
Personally- among my MFP friends- they can see my diary.
I've been dealing with some pretty intense personal issues, that I'm *learning* how NOT to
turn to FOOD......but I still FALL sometimes........HARD......
AND
I log my binges as best I can- not as a badge of pride, but humility.
They can see for themselves how out of control someone else can get.
And I think they've begun to realize that others struggle even greater w/ a lack of self-control.....
and how out of control it can get.0 -
I don't think you are crazy; just more sensitive to the idea than others may be. A binge for you may be three-ten times more than it is for another person yet both of you feelbadly about going over. I guess we are just all on our own journeys here and need to support each other the best we can. Hugs:flowerforyou:
That is well said and I ditto the hugs to you. I think i understand what you're saying. I too shake my head and walk away when people "binge" on 200 or 300 calories that aren't preplanned in a strict regimented daily diary plan - same as I shake my head and RUN the other direction when I see the discussions about thigh gaps and 18 year old girls obsessing over 3 pounds. As much as I worry (for lack of a better word) about our obsessions with weight for health reasons vs. self-image I realize I'm clinically morbidly obese and I got there at the rate of LESS than a pound a month over a decade's time - so when IS the right time to obsess over three pounds? That line of thinking makes me doubt a lot of my preconceived notions. But I hear ya sister
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I do agree with you when I binge I get out of control. to me going a few hundred calories over is fine once in a while but when I binge (and don't log these) that is when I get off track and gain some weight back. I am working on this myself and trying to make a cheat MEAL not a cheat day that turnes in to 2 or 3!0
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Many of us on this site are dealing with some pretty screwed up relationships with food. Our individual issues may vary, but confronting our behavior is necessary for improvement. Since you can't possibly know anyone's full story, don't be so quick to write off their experiences. You might find that you're only alienating otherwise supportive people :flowerforyou:0
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I think it may actually be the other way around, where binge eating disorder is called that because sufferers binge frequently. That doesn't mean that someone who doesn't have the disorder can't go on a binge; it just means that someone binges doesn't necessarily have the disorder. It mostly shows a lot of personal pain if someone who has binge eating disorder is insulted by compulsive eaters complaining about giving into their compulsion, though probably the people who refer to planned indulgences as "binges" ought to stop.I think the trouble is that the medical term 'binge' when associated with an eating disorder is a certain number of calories in a specific time period, coupled with a feeling of a total lack of control over what is being eaten. Unfortunately the word 'binge' has now taken on a different, non-medical meaning of eating more than intended. The problems arise because that leaves people with a binge eating disorder no word left to describe what it is they experience as it has been taken by people who could also use words such as a mistake, or overeating, to describe what it is they do. Obviously it's aggravating to see a word that you would use to describe something that has such a hold over you used in a way that lessens that which you are struggling with.0 -
I think we honestly didn`t know that going 400 cal over our allotment was not a horrible terrible lapse of character. Food is so villified in the dieting community.
We think the war never ends. Our enemy is our friend and we can`t live without him.
No one means to minimalize the discomfort of a real disorder. We are just looking at it with the same gigantor glasses. 400 cal equals 4000.
We don`t know how to feed ourselves anymore when we start dieting.
Either way, it`s sad, and hard.
We`re sorry.
and sorry for ourselves too.0 -
I just want to say as someone with anorexia that everyone's binges are definitely different. Instead of trying to stop other people from calling things binges, maybe you should be working at preventing your own.
There's only a certain amount of food my body can handle, and on a daily basis I've been eating 600 calories. It's not much, but it's more than I used to eat. But because I've been eating so little, my body now can't take as much food. Yesterday I had around 1150 calories in the form of a sandwich, easy mac, oatmeal, hotdogs and marshmallows. That wasn't my entire day. My entire day ended up 1,913. That's a lot for me.
The 1,150 calories made me physically sick. Considering that i eat really low calorie things, I could eat A TON of those things adding up to around 300 calories, and I could definitely consider it a binge. And on the topic of "500 calorie snack". There is no such thing in my mind. A 500 calorie SNACK is appalling to me.
Point I'm trying to get at is that I eat past when I'm uncomfortably full. I eat past when I'm painfully full. I could still stay under 1,000 calories most of the times I do that though. I'd still consider that a binge.
600 cal a day? So this is what you will do for the rest of your life? I guess food really is the enemy!
do you think you want to stay this way, for like, uh, ever? do you ever wonder why the gov. recommends 2000 cal a day for most people.
The gov. must be completely bonkers huh?
It`s good that your working on yourself, and realize that it is a disorder. I think there are so many people on here that don`t realize they are anorexic.
Good for you for taking the bull by the horns.0 -
just putting this out there to set the record straight; it makes my skin crawl to see some people logging a 400 calorie snack attack as a an "OMG massive, disgusting, binge." there is a DIFFERENCE between someone who overeats a few hundred cals (usually because theyre depriving themselves) and someone who gorges themselves on a few THOUSAND calories because of emotional reasons. for someone like myself who's had 3k-5k emotional and horribly compulsive binges, its a slap in the face when i see people who call these ~under 1000 calorie meals~ "binges." its just overeating. i feel like theyre totally misinformed, saying they have a problem that is actually very serious for other people.
am i crazy or am i right? i see it time and time again.....
Why is it a slap in the face to you to let other people post their opinions and feelings? Should I be offended because you then turn around and post about people being misinformed? For some who tightly control their caloric intake, 400 calories is a lot. Everyone is different. If more people took care of their own problems before criticizing others for perceived slights, we'd all be better off.0 -
I have a friend on here who binges, but she's trying to eat nothing, so ANY food she eats is a "binge."
I keep telling her over and over that eating is okay, food is not the enemy, but she is just stuck in her mindset and can't seem to shake it. I don't know how big her binges are cuz she won't log it.
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just putting this out there to set the record straight; it makes my skin crawl to see some people logging a 400 calorie snack attack as a an "OMG massive, disgusting, binge." there is a DIFFERENCE between someone who overeats a few hundred cals (usually because theyre depriving themselves) and someone who gorges themselves on a few THOUSAND calories because of emotional reasons. for someone like myself who's had 3k-5k emotional and horribly compulsive binges, its a slap in the face when i see people who call these ~under 1000 calorie meals~ "binges." its just overeating. i feel like theyre totally misinformed, saying they have a problem that is actually very serious for other people.
am i crazy or am i right? i see it time and time again.....
I'm amazed how few people have actually grasped what you're saying. Yes this annoys me too, and sometimes upsets me. Not because what others do has an impact on *my* weightloss. But because in labelling it as they do, they're effectively minimising the horrible experience of genuine compulsion. Giving into temptation is simply not the same as 'bingeing'.
The experience of a 'proper' binge is akin to a serious alcoholic going on a bender. The 'oh I had a chocolate bar, what a binge' comment is a bit like someone going into a bar and ordering a beer, and describing it as an alcoholic excess.
OP, you're doing an amazing job of getting this experience under control. well done, and more power to you.0 -
I think we honestly didn`t know that going 400 cal over our allotment was not a horrible terrible lapse of character. Food is so villified in the dieting community.
We think the war never ends. Our enemy is our friend and we can`t live without him.
No one means to minimalize the discomfort of a real disorder. We are just looking at it with the same gigantor glasses. 400 cal equals 4000.
We don`t know how to feed ourselves anymore when we start dieting.
Either way, it`s sad, and hard.
We`re sorry.
and sorry for ourselves too.
This made me cry. I've never cried from reading a post here before...
:(:( 0 -
Many of us on this site are dealing with some pretty screwed up relationships with food. Our individual issues may vary, but confronting our behavior is necessary for improvement. Since you can't possibly know anyone's full story, don't be so quick to write off their experiences. You might find that you're only alienating otherwise supportive people :flowerforyou:
Yep0 -
I would classify most of the use of the word binge to be overeating. i do like the comparison to OCD and how that is overused.
I don't count it if I stay in my maintenance calorie level. To me that is a win but almost never happens.
To me, going off plan is not binging. Having something I truely enjoy in excess is over eating. This goes for eating 4 slices of pizza, half a batch of cookies or snacking on whatever treats someone brought into work. This is a problem but completely different from my definition of binging. I still can feel bad about my lack of will power and / or how much I ate.
For me, a binge usually lasts less than 2 hours and I forage for whatever I can find that is high fat or sugar. I eat whatever and have zero enjoyment in the taste and as I'm eating it all I'm thinking about is what I can eat when that is done. if there is no junk food in the house I like I eat the stuff I don't like. if there is no junk food in the house, I will go buy it. A binge is usually followed by 2+ days of poor eating while I struggle to regain control.
I hate when people say you can't gain weight overnight because if you have a high cal binge, you can.
Although I think most people don't use the word according to my definition, I also think most of the people here have some kind of issue with food.0 -
I'm amazed how few people have actually grasped what you're saying. Yes this annoys me too, and sometimes upsets me. Not because what others do has an impact on *my* weightloss. But because in labelling it as they do, they're effectively minimising the horrible experience of genuine compulsion. Giving into temptation is simply not the same as 'bingeing'.
The experience of a 'proper' binge is akin to a serious alcoholic going on a bender. The 'oh I had a chocolate bar, what a binge' comment is a bit like someone going into a bar and ordering a beer, and describing it as an alcoholic excess.
OP, you're doing an amazing job of getting this experience under control. well done, and more power to you.
Just because some people don't 'agree', doesn't mean they don't grasp OP's point. They just don't agree with it or have their own views. For me, it's about the mindset and loss of control - that is it really. The number of calories is irrelevant. Please don't turn this into a 'competition', it isn't one.
Nobody here can 'diagnose' another - and nobody has the right to try to define another person's relationship with food.0 -
600 cal a day? So this is what you will do for the rest of your life? I guess food really is the enemy!
do you think you want to stay this way, for like, uh, ever? do you ever wonder why the gov. recommends 2000 cal a day for most people.
The gov. must be completely bonkers huh?
It`s good that your working on yourself, and realize that it is a disorder. I think there are so many people on here that don`t realize they are anorexic.
Good for you for taking the bull by the horns.
I'm slowly increasing it every two weeks. I know I need to get out of this, but it's seriously difficult sometimes. But also, if I ate 2000 calories a day, MFP tells me I'll gain weight. I kinda do think that the gov. is crazy with 2000. My boyfriend has the metabolism of some strange animal I don't even know. He probably eats around 4,000 calories a day. He doesn't work out and HE'S STICK THIN.
But yeah, I KNOW this is a disorder. It's not a fun thing. It's not glamorous in any way shape or form. I admit I love the idea of "thigh gaps" "ribs" and "hip bones" as much as the next little "proana" lady. But I know it's a disordered way of thinking I need to get out of because that isn't healthy OR beautiful0 -
I've read many of these posts. For the most part, I neither agree or disagree. I can honestly say I've never binged by the true definition. I've definitely over ate, lost control, had no willpower, etc.I think people have misused the term which was offended many. I have a son with a severe learning disability. I am highly offended by people calling others retarded or saying "did you ride the short bus". Until you've walked in those shoes, you do not realize how offensive some words can be.0
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People always seem to think their problems are more serious than other people's. They spend a lot of energy trying to explain why their trials are more significant than other people's trials. What a waste of energy and stress! Words I would use to describe such behavior: self-righteous, arrogant, narcissistic, selfish, childish. Does the word "whining" work? Probably.
Ease up on your bad self. Go take a walk.0 -
Opinions on here hugely reflect on the personality of the individual
Of course they do - and I wanted to correct my earlier statement. I am no longer clinically morbidly obese. Now I am merely obese. If I was a foot taller I'd be still be overweight. It's all relative.0 -
Agreed.0
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Thank you! I completely agree... I struggle with binging and purging and it also irks me to see people who overeat saying that they "binge". There's a -hugeeee- difference between over-indulging in a few hundred calories and mindlessly plowing down thousands because your mind and body are too disconnected to prevent you from stopping. I will say that calorie count is variable among people though, so someone -can- "binge" by just a few hundred over their daily limit. What is the determining factor for compulsive eating, I feel, is the inability to feel control over what you're eating.0
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its the emotion and the compulsion that makes it a binge, not the quantity. its the loss of control. not the number of calories. i think a lot of people do mistake over eating and feeling guilty with a binge though. but i dont see how the amount of calories you eat determines weather its a binge or not.
Yes..this.. ^ for some just a few hundred calories can be all that it takes to put them into weight gain mode.. I'd also be willing to bet that those who have claimed to have binged more than likely decided.."why bother to log what I just stuffed into my body..I'm already over.." Every one on this site is here for one reason or another.. But more importantly..because they/we are learning and trying to lead a new lifestyle.. We all should remember that and be supportive to individual goals and setbacks.. Jmho.0 -
Don't be so judge mental...you don't know that persons life or what they deal with everyday...0
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its the emotion and the compulsion that makes it a binge, not the quantity. its the loss of control. not the number of calories. i think a lot of people do mistake over eating and feeling guilty with a binge though. but i dont see how the amount of calories you eat determines weather its a binge or not.
I work in mental health, currently working with addiction behaviors. You have it right. It is not the quantity that makes a binge, that is just the behavior, it is the emotional response of the patient both before and after. Quantity does have something to do with where a person rates for a psychiatrist or psychologist evaluating them but does not actually define "binge" these days. Some aruge this can lead to over-diagnosis of EDs but, for now, it is seen as preemtive because, without treatment, a person's health and safety is compromised.
I have a particular patient now who's family would not have admitted her into treatment for a binge ED if she had not mentioned suicide on a few occasions after a late night binge. The "binge" in question was a grilled cheese sandwich. Otherwise to them her eating habits were very normal. She was identified by her mother, who brought her to the ED specialized hospital, as a "picky eater" but not so much so she worried.
Herself, she claimed feeling "gross, worthless, and hopeless" after eating something that was not a "vegetable". I guess my point is, while some problems others claim to have may look insignificant to someone who has had a more extreme issue, in this case it is about self-perception.
I am glad you feel you were able to work though your binge eating and I understand why you needed to vent about this topic.0 -
Thank you, blairh10... so helpful.0
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Here's the section on Binge-eating disorder from the DSM IV, the official guide used by mental health professionals to diagnose disorders.
307.50 Eating Disorder Not Otherwise Specified
...
6. Binge-eating disorder: recurrent episodes of binge eating in the absence if [sic] regular
inappropriate compensatory behavior characteristic of Bulimia Nervosa.
Adapted from American Psychiatric Association: Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, 4th ed, text rev.
Washington, DC, American Psychiatric Association, 2000.
Listed in the DSM IV-TR appendix as a diagnosis for further study, Binge Eating
Disorder is defined as uncontrolled binge eating without emesis or laxative abuse. It is
often, but not always, associated with obesity symptoms. Night eating syndrome
includes morning anorexia, increased appetite in the evening, and insomnia. These
patients can have complete or partial amnesia for eating during the night.
http://casat.unr.edu/docs/eatingdisorders_criteria.pdf0 -
I'm amazed how few people have actually grasped what you're saying. Yes this annoys me too, and sometimes upsets me. Not because what others do has an impact on *my* weightloss. But because in labelling it as they do, they're effectively minimising the horrible experience of genuine compulsion. Giving into temptation is simply not the same as 'bingeing'.
The experience of a 'proper' binge is akin to a serious alcoholic going on a bender. The 'oh I had a chocolate bar, what a binge' comment is a bit like someone going into a bar and ordering a beer, and describing it as an alcoholic excess.
OP, you're doing an amazing job of getting this experience under control. well done, and more power to you.
Just because some people don't 'agree', doesn't mean they don't grasp OP's point. They just don't agree with it or have their own views. For me, it's about the mindset and loss of control - that is it really. The number of calories is irrelevant. Please don't turn this into a 'competition', it isn't one.
Nobody here can 'diagnose' another - and nobody has the right to try to define another person's relationship with food.
I think you just demonstrated you didn't grasp my point either. :-)
The issue is that giving in and have one chocolate bar isn't a 'loss of control' (and here, I think the other 'mental health professional' posting in the thread is also perhaps missing the OP's point - she's not dismissing the genuine experience of bingeing associated with various forms of ED - she's challenging trivialising labelling). In our therapeutised culture, the terms 'binge', 'trauma', 'depression' etc have all made their way into a very general vocabulary and are used in a manner that obfuscates their original meaning. Yes, loss of control is the key. But in a binge the experience of loss of control is really quite different from the temporary lapse associated with a little dietary cheat. the OP is clearly referring to the 'OMG, I just had a total binge, I totally ate a cookie, I can feel myself bloating' kind of nonsense that gets posted on this site. This simply isn't 'bingeing', and as I said, to describe it as such is to be quite dismissive of the genuine emotional experience of bingeing.0 -
I'm amazed how few people have actually grasped what you're saying. Yes this annoys me too, and sometimes upsets me. Not because what others do has an impact on *my* weightloss. But because in labelling it as they do, they're effectively minimising the horrible experience of genuine compulsion. Giving into temptation is simply not the same as 'bingeing'.
The experience of a 'proper' binge is akin to a serious alcoholic going on a bender. The 'oh I had a chocolate bar, what a binge' comment is a bit like someone going into a bar and ordering a beer, and describing it as an alcoholic excess.
OP, you're doing an amazing job of getting this experience under control. well done, and more power to you.
Just because some people don't 'agree', doesn't mean they don't grasp OP's point. They just don't agree with it or have their own views. For me, it's about the mindset and loss of control - that is it really. The number of calories is irrelevant. Please don't turn this into a 'competition', it isn't one.
Nobody here can 'diagnose' another - and nobody has the right to try to define another person's relationship with food.
I think you just demonstrated you didn't grasp my point either. :-)
The issue is that giving in and have one chocolate bar isn't a 'loss of control' (and here, I think the other 'mental health professional' posting in the thread is also perhaps missing the OP's point). In our therapeutised culture, the terms 'binge', 'trauma', 'depression' etc have all made their way into a very general vocabulary and are used in a manner that obfuscates their original meaning. Yes, loss of control is the key. But in a binge the experience of loss of control is really quite different from the temporary lapse associated with a little dietary cheat. the OP is clearly referring to the 'OMG, I just had a total binge, I totally ate a cookie, I can feel myself bloating' kind of nonsense that gets posted on this site. This simply isn't 'bingeing', and as I said, to describe it as such is to be quite dismissive of the genuine emotional experience of bingeing.
You have no idea how another person feels. Unless you are an alcoholic, you cannot make the parallel you did. This thread is very triggering for me and I don't have to explain my feelings on that, nor will I. If you like to interpret my post as my inability to grasp the points you and the OP made, which were really quite simple to understand, then feel free. The vocabulary used is a red herring and really quite irrelevant. Blairh10's post illustrates this perfectly.
Many of us have our individual 'crisis points' around emotional eating and, as you don't know what they are, with respect, kindly refer to your own experiences and stop extrapolating.0 -
Quite frankly what I hear in your "rant" is the significant pain and struggle you don't want to have minimized. I hear your pain and I'm so sorry for this experience for you. The fact that it bothers you that others use the word "binge" without really understanding a BAD SIGNIFICANT binge just makes me guess you are still struggling, still in pain and still working through it all. Hang in there... Keep working and healing and someday you will be so strong and filled with so much self confidence and self love that it won't ever bother you.
This is the perfect response to this entire thread. Spoken like a true therapist. 0 -
I'm amazed how few people have actually grasped what you're saying. Yes this annoys me too, and sometimes upsets me. Not because what others do has an impact on *my* weightloss. But because in labelling it as they do, they're effectively minimising the horrible experience of genuine compulsion. Giving into temptation is simply not the same as 'bingeing'.
The experience of a 'proper' binge is akin to a serious alcoholic going on a bender. The 'oh I had a chocolate bar, what a binge' comment is a bit like someone going into a bar and ordering a beer, and describing it as an alcoholic excess.
OP, you're doing an amazing job of getting this experience under control. well done, and more power to you.
Just because some people don't 'agree', doesn't mean they don't grasp OP's point. They just don't agree with it or have their own views. For me, it's about the mindset and loss of control - that is it really. The number of calories is irrelevant. Please don't turn this into a 'competition', it isn't one.
Nobody here can 'diagnose' another - and nobody has the right to try to define another person's relationship with food.
I think you just demonstrated you didn't grasp my point either. :-)
The issue is that giving in and have one chocolate bar isn't a 'loss of control' (and here, I think the other 'mental health professional' posting in the thread is also perhaps missing the OP's point). In our therapeutised culture, the terms 'binge', 'trauma', 'depression' etc have all made their way into a very general vocabulary and are used in a manner that obfuscates their original meaning. Yes, loss of control is the key. But in a binge the experience of loss of control is really quite different from the temporary lapse associated with a little dietary cheat. the OP is clearly referring to the 'OMG, I just had a total binge, I totally ate a cookie, I can feel myself bloating' kind of nonsense that gets posted on this site. This simply isn't 'bingeing', and as I said, to describe it as such is to be quite dismissive of the genuine emotional experience of bingeing.
You have no idea how another person feels. Unless you are an alcoholic, you cannot make the parallel you did. This thread is very triggering for me and I don't have to explain my feelings on that, nor will I. If you like to interpret my post as my inability to grasp the points you and the OP made, which were really quite simple to understand, then feel free. The vocabulary used is a red herring and really quite irrelevant. Blairh10's post illustrates this perfectly.
Many of us have our individual 'crisis points' around emotional eating and, as you don't know what they are, with respect, kindly refer to your own experiences and stop extrapolating.
My comments are based on rather more than personal experience.But as the valley girl would say, 'whatever'. You appear determined to miss my point, and if you're happy with that, more power to you. I'm not saying what you think I'm saying. Let's leave it at that, eh?0
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